SMiLE Sessions box set!

[earcandy]

The album is in Italian!! Part of the riddle that is SMiLE. Refered to as the "Venice sessions"!!

"Over and over the pigeon cries uncover the gondola..."

[The Heartical Don]

Fast forward to 2017: All that remains of Capitol's failed promise to release the Smile Sessions box set in 2011 are a number of painted advertisements around LA.  However, Capitol NOW promises the release on the January 2017 anniversary!

Also coming out then: my groundbreaking study, which will shake the world of psychology. Its name?

50 Years Of Delayed Gratification - Drug and Alcohol Abuse, Depression, and Suicide Cases in a Population of Disenchanted Potential Record Buyers.

[Aegir]

The album is in Italian!! Part of the riddle that is SMiLE. Refered to as the "Venice sessions"!!

"Over and over the pigeon cries uncover the gondola..."

Venice Beach is poppin', like live shrimp dropped on a hot wok.

[The Heartical Don]

The album is in Italian!! Part of the riddle that is SMiLE. Refered to as the "Venice sessions"!!

"Over and over the pigeon cries uncover the gondola..."

Wrong, pal. It should read: Over And Over The Pigeon Sh*ts All Over The Gondola

...because that's real, and people understand.

[Shady]

Do NOT buy anything from Italy! Their postal service is notoriously bad. Odds that you'll receive anything are roughly 50/50.

Yeah, on second thought it's a chance I'm not willing to take

[SMiLE Brian]

Would the 1993 boxset with the smile material be a good sampler of the SMiLE Box? Amazon is selling it cheap and i have become a beach boys material completionist now...

[Shady]

Would the 1993 boxset with the smile material be a good sampler of the SMiLE Box? Amazon is selling it cheap and i have become a beach boys material completionist now...

You don't have the GV box?

wow, get on that. Not only is the smile material essential but so many classic rare songs too. "Still I dream of it" etc

I got mine cheap too, well worth the purchase. Booklet is useless though

[SMiLE Brian]

Would the 1993 boxset with the smile material be a good sampler of the SMiLE Box? Amazon is selling it cheap and i have become a beach boys material completionist now...

You don't have the GV box?

wow, get on that. Not only is the smile material essential but so many classic rare songs too. "Still I dream of it" etc

I got mine cheap too, well worth the purchase. Booklet is useless though

I got all the two-fers, i was just worried for the longest time the box was full of music i already had, which isn't true after a detailed look on amazon of the track listening.

[hypehat]

Completely worth it!

[Shady]

Would the 1993 boxset with the smile material be a good sampler of the SMiLE Box? Amazon is selling it cheap and i have become a beach boys material completionist now...

You don't have the GV box?

wow, get on that. Not only is the smile material essential but so many classic rare songs too. "Still I dream of it" etc

I got mine cheap too, well worth the purchase. Booklet is useless though

I got all the two-fers, i was just worried for the longest time the box was full of music i already had, which isn't true after a detailed look on amazon of the track listening.

Was worried about that too initially but was glad to find out that's not the case.

Perfect balance of hits and rare stuff  

[SMiLE Brian]

Would the 1993 boxset with the smile material be a good sampler of the SMiLE Box? Amazon is selling it cheap and i have become a beach boys material completionist now...

You don't have the GV box?

wow, get on that. Not only is the smile material essential but so many classic rare songs too. "Still I dream of it" etc

I got mine cheap too, well worth the purchase. Booklet is useless though

I got all the two-fers, i was just worried for the longest time the box was full of music i already had, which isn't true after a detailed look on amazon of the track listening.

Was worried about that too initially but was glad to find out that's not the case.

Perfect balance of hits and rare stuff  

Well I guess its time to buy it for its awesomeness and have my friends and family think I am crazy to own so much music by a band they think is cheesey

[hypehat]

It is our cross to bear 

[Shady]

Would the 1993 boxset with the smile material be a good sampler of the SMiLE Box? Amazon is selling it cheap and i have become a beach boys material completionist now...

You don't have the GV box?

wow, get on that. Not only is the smile material essential but so many classic rare songs too. "Still I dream of it" etc

I got mine cheap too, well worth the purchase. Booklet is useless though

I got all the two-fers, i was just worried for the longest time the box was full of music i already had, which isn't true after a detailed look on amazon of the track listening.

Was worried about that too initially but was glad to find out that's not the case.

Perfect balance of hits and rare stuff  

Well I guess its time to buy it for its awesomeness and have my friends and family think I am crazy to own so much music by a band they think is cheesey

Once you play those "Love You" songs the opinions shall change  

It is our cross to bear 

 

[SMiLE Brian]

Would the 1993 boxset with the smile material be a good sampler of the SMiLE Box? Amazon is selling it cheap and i have become a beach boys material completionist now...

You don't have the GV box?

wow, get on that. Not only is the smile material essential but so many classic rare songs too. "Still I dream of it" etc

I got mine cheap too, well worth the purchase. Booklet is useless though

I got all the two-fers, i was just worried for the longest time the box was full of music i already had, which isn't true after a detailed look on amazon of the track listening.

Was worried about that too initially but was glad to find out that's not the case.

Perfect balance of hits and rare stuff  

Well I guess its time to buy it for its awesomeness and have my friends and family think I am crazy to own so much music by a band they think is cheesy

Once you play those "Love You" songs the opinions shall change  

It is our cross to bear  

 

I already played the the 15 big ones/love you two-fer, my dad and sister were yelling at me to turn the music off by the time i got to "solar system" on "love you".   Those albums definitely weren't surfin safari or surfer girl by a long shot.

[Dove Nested Towers]

I've been thinking lately. I'd take Mike Love over Van Dyke Parks. It seems like Parks had too much control over the project, it was more of an open collaboration. With Tony Asher it sounded like Brian kept artistic control over the project, but it seems Van Dyke influenced the album quite a bit. Especially upon listening to Song Cycle. Recently, as I've listened to that album, I get the feeling more and more that SMiLE sounds more like Van Dyke Parks than it does Brian Wilson...

Also what's with Van Dyke walking off the project? I feel as if that story is only a small part of the big picture. Was Van Dyke really such a primadona that he wasn't willing to entertain questions? Think about it from Mike Love's perspective. Didn't he have a say in the material the band was putting out? It was his band just as much as it was Brian's wasn't it? Of course Brian's overall contributions outshine Mike's, Mike did contribute his fair share to the songs that made the band famous in the first place. He also was the onstage charisma that kept the BB touring up through the massive 4th of July shows over a decade later. I think in all fairness Mike Love deserved a say, he was a contributing member of the group, he deserved to have creative input. I think Mike gave Brian a lot of creative leeway and recognized his talents as a composer and producer, but when it came to SMiLE he had his right to be skeptical, he had his right to ask questions.

Was he really that obnoxious during the Cabinessence sessions? I can understand if Van Dyke Parks doesn't want to run around for the rest of his life and explain SMiLE to every tom dick and harry, but Mike Love was a member of the band, he was a contributer, he had a legal and creative say in what the band did. I don't think it was right for Van Dyke to just waltz off the project simply because he didn't like to entertain questions. If anybody had any right to question what Brian and Van Dyke were doing it was the other members of the group. I really don't buy that Van Dyke just walked away because Mike Love asked a couple of condescending questions.

Now I don't really like Mike Love that much as a musician, I don't like a lot of what he's done with the band, and I'm not particularly blown away by Mike Love as an artist. I don't agree with his opinion in regards to SMiLE, but I do think he was right in voicing it, I think he was right in being concerned, and I think he was within his rights to do what he did. He thought he was doing what was best for the group, and you can't fault him for that.

We'll never really know, but the above works for me, and in spades. 

This is an overreaction in the other direction to Mike's historical demonization as the main force behind the collapse of Smile. VDP now says that he regrets walking away from the project, but he's being awfully hard on himself. It would have been difficult for any outsider to endure the stifling hostility and overbearing family dynamics that came into play whan the band members (esp. Mike) returned from Europe and began expressing reservations about his lyrics, and amply justifies his departure out of self-preservation. I'm sure he was quite obnoxious about it. He supposedly sabotaged the "Inside Pop" sessions that were videotaped, etc., athough that is not known for certain. It probably wasn't merely the questions themselves but the defensive posture he was forced to adopt, without Brian being able to support him in the face of Mike's withering contempt, that made the atmosphere unbearable for him. He's a sensitive fellow, not a prima donna. Melodically, the album is Brian;s baby, as Van has said in interviews, and Parks didn't have inordinate control, it was a true collaboration of equals in their respective domains, music and verbal imagery.

The question of whether Mike had earned the right to be a major factor in thwarting Brian's avant-garde musical direction (not the only factor of course) is a complex one. BTW for him to now claim that he thought at the time that the music was "pretty cool" is contemptible revisionist B.S. He was a major part of the band's success from the beginning, and had earned some say-so in the musical output. But Brian was undeniably the driving force, on the creative end of course especially, and also deserved some latitude in pursuing his creative goals within the band framework, which Mike did not provide, even if Capitol was playing ball on Smile (Carl and Al were lukewarm also). His freedom with GV had paid huge dividends, Pet Sounds was a success overseas and suffered from lack of promotion in the U.S., so can't exactly be called a failure, which might justify a "don't f with the formula" attitude. Mike could have also encouraged Brian and Van to release Smile as a side project, although admittedly that would have been almost unheard of in the climate of those times. Mike's jealousy and possessiveness are well documented though, and he would have undoubtedly been more loathe than most to sanction such solo efforts.

To put everything in the context of "Mike had the right to dictate the content of Brian's music" while justifiable in conventional ways of thinking, is reductionism IMO. And to downplay the degree to which his aggressive behavior and sense of entitlement made Van Dyke's continuing participate in the project untenable, again without Brian being emotionally strong enough to back him up in the face of the withering pressure to conform, seems naive.

[Sam_BFC]

Very good post...yet Fishmonk's also has much credibility!

The safest thing to say is the truth probably lies somewhere in between, right?

It is rather amusing hows attitudes on this subject have really shifted in favour of Mike over the last few years though.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Very good post...yet Fishmonk's also has much credibility!

The safest thing to say is the truth probably lies somewhere in between, right?

It is rather amusing hows attitudes on this subject have really shifted in favour of Mike over the last few years though.

I'd say not so much in favour of Mike as back towards a middle ground.

[Micha]

'Xactly - I open a thread called, ooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhh, let's say "Smile sessions box set !" and I don't expect to see pointless feces about soccer and Germany for half a page. The Beach Boys are American and they never played soccer. I think in this instance I'm entitled to get pissy(er).

Don't get upset, Andrew. It's already over. 

[The Heartical Don]

'Xactly - I open a thread called, ooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhh, let's say "Smile sessions box set !" and I don't expect to see pointless feces about soccer and Germany for half a page. The Beach Boys are American and they never played soccer. I think in this instance I'm entitled to get pissy(er).

Don't get upset, Andrew. It's already over. 

Hey Micha, what did you think about the Japanese ladies' soccer triumph?

Token BBs reference: SIP.

[Shady]

*waits for AGD to chime in with a cut-throat "back on topic" comment*

 

[guitarfool2002]

Interesting news on the photos of Brian and Tony Asher - I saw these as well glancing through SOT looking for the shot of Brian, Asher, and the tape machine.

With all the evidence we have been putting out there, I guess the question becomes what era do you *feel* the photos are from? The film of Brian at Columbia playing piano, the photo of him outside Bloome Tires on the Strip...do they feel like Pet Sounds era photos or do they strike you on first glance as Smile era, specifically late 1966?

I can't explain exactly why but when I see period photos I can get a feeling by the atmosphere and clothing/appearance as to what year it could be. Not just Beach Boys, but look at a photo from 1975 versus 1978 for one example, or 1985 versus 1988 and you'll see what I'm going on about.


One question: Did Tony Asher cut off all contact with Brian after Pet Sounds? They were friends to a degree, I don't see a reason why Tony and Brian may not have met in social gatherings after Pet Sounds was released. I've never heard either of an event where either Brian or Tony decided to no longer associate as friends for a specific reason or even a feud of some kind between them.

[bgas]

One question: Did Tony Asher cut off all contact with Brian after Pet Sounds? They were friends to a degree, I don't see a reason why Tony and Brian may not have met in social gatherings after Pet Sounds was released. I've never heard either of an event where either Brian or Tony decided to no longer associate as friends for a specific reason or even a feud of some kind between them.

 I've not seen anything to suggest a falling out or feud, either; but given Brian's known jumping from one thing to another, I propose it's more likely that Asher was simply left behind, as someone Brian just didn't think about any longer.  here today, gone tomorrow.

[guitarfool2002]

One question: Did Tony Asher cut off all contact with Brian after Pet Sounds? They were friends to a degree, I don't see a reason why Tony and Brian may not have met in social gatherings after Pet Sounds was released. I've never heard either of an event where either Brian or Tony decided to no longer associate as friends for a specific reason or even a feud of some kind between them.

 I've not seen anything to suggest a falling out or feud, either; but given Brian's known jumping from one thing to another, I propose it's more likely that Asher was simply left behind, as someone Brian just didn't think about any longer.  here today, gone tomorrow.

I don't recall any breaking points ever being mentioned either, and I do think we should consider that friendships may have remained in place well after Brian stopped working with a particular individual in a business sense. Sometimes I incorrectly assume these men like Brian and Tony or Brian and Van Dyke or Brian and Roger Christian stopped being friends when they stopped working with each other, and I'm re-assessing a lot of those timelines.

There are stories about Hal Blaine and Brian remaining close and going to each others' houses in a personal friendship kind of way well after Brian stopped using Hal regularly on sessions in early 1967. The most obvious was when Brian carried his case of gold records to give to Hal after the spats with Murry around selling Sea Of Tunes.

So let's assume a photo turns up of Hal at Brian's house in 1968 - much like the shots of Tony Asher with Brian, does such a photo rule out a certain time period because Brian wasn't working with them at that time, or was it simply a social call or a time when a friendly visit was being paid outside of regular business?

I say that with the caveat that I do not know what those photos of Brian and Tony are or when they were shot beyond the Sept. 1966 Dutch magazine where others were published from that day at Brian's house.

[Dunderhead]

Honestly, Van Dyke Parks kind of rubs me the wrong way. I just don't like the cut of his jib. I really dislike all that stuff about not being able to explain anything and everything not having any meaning. It seems like an exaggeration to just act like all of it was just absurd nonsense that could never be explained.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tB6JwCmTIEw
Like in this video, he says he doesn't know what any of the lyrics mean. But just before that he says it was "an American Gothic trip". Well which is it? He clearly had something in mind. We'll never know exactly what happened, but it seems like an understanding could have been reached and an explanation could have been offered. In my opinion I think Van Dyke realized the project wasn't going anywhere and he used Mike Love as an excuse to be on his way.

I'm of the opinion that Mike wanted SMiLE to come out. The band had invested quite a bit into the project and as much as Mike didn't like the music I think his overriding concern was simply that Brian do *something*. You can't tell me that after his "victory" in getting SMiLE canned Mike turned around and said "I got it guys! You know all that music I hated and tried to destroy? Let's go rerecord all that for our next album!" For all the talk of "phucking with the formula", it seems they ended up releasing an even stranger album. That alone really makes me wonder.

And all this stuff about "stifling hostility and overbearing family dynamics that came into play whan the band members" seems like an exaggeration. I was under the impression that Carl really admired what Brian was doing. I thought Carl went into the studio for SMiLE sessions whenever he was in town. Certainly Carl was a major advocate of the music in the years after the project's collapse. And what about Dennis? Something tells me he was more concerned with living his rock and roll lifestyle than he was playing mind games with Van Dyke. And then you have Al, who was always tactful, and never seemed to have really upset anybody during the entire run of the band. "overbearing family dynamics" wouldn't be how I'd describe all that.

[pixletwin]

Honestly, Van Dyke Parks kind of rubs me the wrong way. I just don't like the cut of his jib. I really dislike all that stuff about not being able to explain anything and everything not having any meaning. It seems like an exaggeration to just act like all of it was just absurd nonsense that could never be explained.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tB6JwCmTIEw
Like in this video, he says he doesn't know what any of the lyrics mean. But just before that he says it was "an American Gothic trip". Well which is it? He clearly had something in mind. We'll never know exactly what happened, but it seems like an understanding could have been reached and an explanation could have been offered. In my opinion I think Van Dyke realized the project wasn't going anywhere and he used Mike Love as an excuse to be on his way.

I'm of the opinion that Mike wanted SMiLE to come out. The band had invested quite a bit into the project and as much as Mike didn't like the music I think his overriding concern was simply that Brian do *something*. You can't tell me that after his "victory" in getting SMiLE canned Mike turned around and said "I got it guys! You know all that music I hated and tried to destroy? Let's go rerecord all that for our next album!" For all the talk of "phucking with the formula", it seems they ended up releasing an even stranger album. That alone really makes me wonder.

And all this stuff about "stifling hostility and overbearing family dynamics that came into play whan the band members" seems like an exaggeration. I was under the impression that Carl really admired what Brian was doing. I thought Carl went into the studio for SMiLE sessions whenever he was in town. Certainly Carl has been a major advocate of the music ever since. And what about Dennis? Something tells me he was more concerned with living his rock and roll lifestyle than he was playing mind games with Van Dyke. And then you have Al, who was always tactful, and never seemed to have really upset anybody during the entire run of the band. "overbearing family dynamics" wouldn't be the word I'd use to describe all that.

Agreed. Smiley Smile is far weirder and "fringe" than SMiLE ever would have been and that doesn't sit with the accepted version of Mike naysaing SMiLE and shaming Brian into a corner.