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642982 Posts in 25678 Topics by 3650 Members - Latest Member: SmirkySmirk January 24, 2019, 05:21:54 AM
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1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Review: Beach Boys Plumb Vaults for Post-‘Pet Sounds’ Gems on: January 18, 2019, 02:23:41 PM
Wish they'd release physical copies of these albums.  

I'm grateful we even have these at all

Both of these are very true statements!

I'm surprised that there isn't an MOD (Manufacture On Demand) type of program for these, where people could order discs online to be burned and shipped (in packaging) to them directly. Admittedly it's gonna be a small market for physical product, but there ARE people who'd buy em! It's geezers who would be interested, and let's face it, this band does have a geezer fan contingent!

Warner Bros. does an MOD type of arrangement for all sorts of deep cut catalog movies, where DVDs are burned and sent via snail mail to people who order them; this way, there's no overstock or unsold discs sitting in warehouses or bargain bins.

The BBs should get on this! It seems like the most logical compromise for this issue.

That said... I'm certain there'd be a good chunk of hipsters who'd happily throw money at vinyl releases of these sets too. Seriously, the market is there! I truly believe it.
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1968 Copyright Extension Release Thread on: January 17, 2019, 10:58:52 AM

Off the top of my head, other than Transcendental Meditation I cannot think of another "BBs" track that has all Brian harmonies, other than the unreleased Don't Talk intro. (I'm excluding tracks like Caroline, No, since it's just a lead vocal with no harmonies).

Is there another example I'm missing?

The first one that pops in my head is "The Surfer Moon".

I did not realize that was a Wall of Brians, very cool, I'll have to relisten!
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1968 Copyright Extension Release Thread on: January 17, 2019, 10:39:50 AM


>>>>What was Brian’s level of involvement with these sessions originally?
Boyd: Brian was very much involved in Friends — he was still basically running the show. He even finished the album after the boys had left to go on tour.

I wonder if this would account for the reason Brian sings all the parts on Transcendental Meditation; there HAS to be some logical reason for that.

Was that song recorded last for the album, once The Boys had left for touring?

Yes, exactly - that was the next-to-last track to be recorded for the album, and it was cut on April 4th (the day MLK was gunned down). The following day, the Boys were scheduled to open their tour in Nashville (the gig was cancelled due to MLK's assassination in nearby Memphis). We don't know for sure when the vocals were added to the track, but it was likely when the Boys were out of town. Likewise, Brian finished "Busy Doin' Nothin'" and recorded "Diamond Head" while the Boys were away.

Utterly fascinating. Thanks, c-man!

Off the top of my head, other than Transcendental Meditation I cannot think of another "BBs" track that has all Brian harmonies, other than the unreleased Don't Talk intro. (I'm excluding tracks like Caroline, No, since it's just a lead vocal with no harmonies).

Is there another example I'm missing?
4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1968 Copyright Extension Release Thread on: January 17, 2019, 10:13:34 AM


>>>>What was Brian’s level of involvement with these sessions originally?
Boyd: Brian was very much involved in Friends — he was still basically running the show. He even finished the album after the boys had left to go on tour.

I wonder if this would account for the reason Brian sings all the parts on Transcendental Meditation; there HAS to be some logical reason for that.

Was that song recorded last for the album, once The Boys had left for touring?
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: \ on: January 15, 2019, 06:42:58 PM
Really rad stuff, thanks Adam (and David)!
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1968 Copyright Extension Release Thread on: January 15, 2019, 02:16:39 PM

Thanks Terry!

Quote
And the track “Oh Yeah” — what’s that about?
Linett: My understanding is that the Beach Boys were on tour — I think they just played the Fillmore East in New York — and because there was this sort of mad scramble to finish up the new album, they’d taken their tapes with them and were working on them every chance they got. I guess they did some work at Capitol Studios in New York, and one of the band members happened upon this kid on the street who was doing this kind of rap thing, and they thought, “Oh, man, this is great, we should get him on tape.” They brought him into the studio, gathered the guys around the mic, and had him lay it down. All it says on the tape box is “Oh Yeah.” No indication as to who he is.

That is such a cool story. Imagine being this kid throwing out some words on the street and next you're in a recording studio with one of America's most well loved bands. Would love to know if this kid is still around and if he remembers this.

Also, no live recordings from 1969 in the vaults. Pretty interesting. Really grateful for Alan and Mark's work, and that this set is getting some press. Looking forward to next year's release.

That is indeed truly fascinating. Especially since it is somewhat of a proto rap/spoken word type of thing. I'm trying to think of a parallel in rock history for such a famous band.

I wonder if any sort of search has ever been conducted to find this kid. This could/should be a scene in a movie or something. I feel like if this ever happened with say, The Beatles, there'd be entire TV special programs dedicated to finding the kid and getting his recollections.

Makes me wonder what stuff other bands did like this that never left the vaults.

I would love to have seen this on their 20/20 album, as some sort of hidden track at the tail end of the album.

Had that happened, The BBs would probably be legendary for breaking new ground in terms of genre. I'm still not quite sure how to classify the genre of “Oh Yeah”, but it's definitely doing something new for 1969, methinks.

I'd like to think that someone, somewhere, is gonna accidentally access this track in their iTunes when they are intending to select the song by the band Yello (made famous from Ferris Beuller's Day Off)  LOL

Bomp
Bomp
Chick
Chick-ee-Chick-awwww
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1968 Copyright Extension Release Thread on: January 15, 2019, 01:49:54 PM

Thanks Terry!

Quote
And the track “Oh Yeah” — what’s that about?
Linett: My understanding is that the Beach Boys were on tour — I think they just played the Fillmore East in New York — and because there was this sort of mad scramble to finish up the new album, they’d taken their tapes with them and were working on them every chance they got. I guess they did some work at Capitol Studios in New York, and one of the band members happened upon this kid on the street who was doing this kind of rap thing, and they thought, “Oh, man, this is great, we should get him on tape.” They brought him into the studio, gathered the guys around the mic, and had him lay it down. All it says on the tape box is “Oh Yeah.” No indication as to who he is.

That is such a cool story. Imagine being this kid throwing out some words on the street and next you're in a recording studio with one of America's most well loved bands. Would love to know if this kid is still around and if he remembers this.

Also, no live recordings from 1969 in the vaults. Pretty interesting. Really grateful for Alan and Mark's work, and that this set is getting some press. Looking forward to next year's release.

That is indeed truly fascinating. Especially since it is somewhat of a proto rap/spoken word type of thing. I'm trying to think of a parallel in rock history for such a famous band.

I wonder if any sort of search has ever been conducted to find this kid. This could/should be a scene in a movie or something. I feel like if this ever happened with say, The Beatles, there'd be entire TV special programs dedicated to finding the kid and getting his recollections.
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1968 Copyright Extension Release Thread on: January 15, 2019, 12:59:47 PM

Rad, thanks for sharing that!
9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Rocky Pamplin's THE BEACH BOYS' ENDLESS WAVE completed and published on: January 15, 2019, 12:38:26 PM
The unfortunate takeaway I have from this is that Mike Love wants people to be afraid of him. There are plenty of parallels to a certain person in today's world of politics too, and I think that some powerful people (who like to make less powerful people fear them) admire that trait in other powerful people too.  

Maybe this is just par for the course with some powerful celebs, but it really feels like a particularly strong case of people being (justifiably) afraid of him due to past litigiousness. I have to think that things like the ridiculous and laughed-out-of-court 2005 lawsuit were really an example of creating an atmosphere of fear to prevent people from publishing books like Rocky's apparent original draft. Guess it worked. It's unfortunate that Brian of all people had to go through grief in 2005 to help Mike add to his portfolio of scare tactics.
 
Sucks for an author to be caught up in this drama. Not Ron's fault. I'm still curious to read the book, Ron, and I will at some point. I wonder if the original draft could have just been released if all the names were changed.
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: THE WILSON PROJECT - THE ILLUMINATED EDITION on: January 14, 2019, 09:28:48 AM


That being said, my impression once I went back and listened to the "Usher Sessions" material again was that the material was pretty bad. The one area where Usher is less relatable in the book is his clear confidence in his ability as a *writer*, as an A&R guy who can make a hit. Usher is absolutely correct in this book that, in 1986, Brian had no clear idea of how to make a "hit" in 1986. But Usher's stuff would never have been a hit either. I guess it was moderately more "1986-sounding" than some of the stuff Brian was writing without Usher. But the material overall, both compositionally and production-wise, was pretty bland at best, and sometimes just bad. Like, "Let's Go to Heaven in My Car" and "Walkin' the Line" and "The Spirit of Rock and Roll" was actually truly as *good* as it got. To Usher's credit, he points out that this is all "demos" and not building up finished masters (one of the more awkward subjects in the book is how Usher realizes that Brian thinks they're recording/building up to finished masters while Usher clearly views all of this as pre-production demo work), so I'm willing to cut the tracks more slack on the production/mix side of things. But the songs, the compositions, are clearly sub-par to what came out on BW '88 (the one other moment where Usher doesn't come off as sympathetic is that he eventually doesn't seem to have glowing things to say about the eventual BW '88 album; he understandably is bummed he didn't get the gig).
 

I'd vote for "Heavenly Bodies" to be considered among the better Brian songs from this time. I actually quite dig "Heavenly Bodies", even though it's got a rough-ish demo lead vocal. It does sound very much of its time (maybe that would have helped it find an audience in 1986?), and the very last notes of the song remind me of the very last notes of the Growing Pains theme song, a very popular show at the time.

"Heavenly Bodies" (end):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9G8CC5tGlA&t=3m09s

Growing Pains theme song (end):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=te2iIdrm_tk&t=0m55s

I wonder if that was intentional or not. Either way, I just got a flash of Brian Wilson in place of Alan Thicke, playing Jason Seaver.

Right around this same time, the ALF theme song sounded unbelievably similar to The Pet Shop Boys' "Suburbia" (too close to be just an accident, IMO), so who knows.



11  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1969-70 Copyright Extension Release Prediction Thread on: January 13, 2019, 01:10:49 AM

This. I remember the inclusion of the Pom Pom Playgirl vocal session track being a real irritant for me - knowing that there are some incredible tracks STILL in the vault and the vocal session for Pom Pom Playgirl made the cut. I still don't get that.
 

I think this must have been done because the song is notable for being Carl's 1st lead vocal, hence the historical significance. I feel confident in assuming that if it had been just another dime-a-dozen Mike lead from this era, that the vocal session would not have gotten its own place in this set.

I remember being blown away by hearing the tracking session for this song (was it on the 1964 Copyright Extension release?) because it had more nuance and complexity than it seemed on the surface, and I was especially surprised to hear Mike playing sax at this (for him) late date in the timeline. Kind of the last gasp of any instrument like that being played by a BBs band member prior to the Wrecking Crew taking over those types of instruments.

While it wasn't a complex sax part, I still feel that finding out that Mike played that part was a "wow" moment for me, somewhat dispelling a myth that he just played sax on a couple songs in the very early years.
12  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love of the Beach Boys Presents The Girls of Kokomo..... on: January 09, 2019, 06:34:31 PM
@B.E., though I think any chart success would've helped Brian's confidence, it's a pretty interesting road of thought to image how Murry would have behaved had it been a success...and to wonder if in the long run it would be a positive thing for Brian. Just my two cents. I hope others chime in on this topic too.

Considering Murry was involved, yes, I think it would have gone to his head. But that makes me wonder if he changes his mind about selling Sea Of Tunes in '69 and how that could have changed things for Brian and the group in a very positive way. Surely, Murry selling away all of Brian's songs (and "Breakaway" failing) had a worse effect on Brian than "Breakaway" being a hit would have, no? Yeah, maybe Murry might convince Brian that he still needed him, but if Brian's confidence is up, is that really so bad? Most of us love the results of Friends and "Breakaway", don't we? Point is, we know how things turned out, and it wasn't good for Brian.

It is interesting to think about. I just feel the need to pump the brakes is all...

Yeah, the one instance of Breakaway hypothetically being a hit is a better scenario than Murry selling the tunes and Breakaway failing. But I think CD was pointing out that had Breakaway become a hit then Murry would probably interject himself more in the recording process and things down the road would become really rocky for Brian, especially the abuse from Murry coupled with his drug abuse and fragile mindset during that time. Had failures happened after Breakaway became a hit and Murry been pushed away a second time he probably would have sold the Sea of Tunes stuff anyways.

I'm glad you're interjecting your point of view, and I think it's good to look at this from all angles....so hit the brakes all you want!

All of what you both said rings true, and yes that's essentially what I think too. Regardless of what would have played out, Murry would have behaved like a toxic person in an unhealthy way, because sadly that's just how he was. Give him an inch in terms of credit/praise, I'm sure he'd have taken a mile. Reject him and he'd fight back with psychological warfare in any way he could. We know the way Murry acted when he had a flop with Breakway; he soon after screwed over his sons (out of an attempt to "help" them), basically to interject himself businesswise where he wasn't wanted in order to placate his own ego's desire to MATTER to the situation.  To be the hero to his sons' careers.

Even if there had been a hit from Breakaway, there'd have doubtlessly been the start of more dysfunction of him trying to force his way back into a more prominent role (like the early days), or at least from an advice-giving standpoint, and at this timeframe Brian (even if he'd have been newly somewhat confident after having co-penned a hit) was not in a good space mentally to deal with Murry acting even more entitled (and this time Murry with a hit to claim how important he was to further hits).

Again, I compare what Murry's likely behavior would have been to Mike's post-Kokomo behavior, where he was reinvigorated to proudly strut that his contributions MATTER; that just led to an ocean of eyeroll-worthy Mike behavior and actions (like creating this Girls of Kokomo nonsense, and hijacking the brand in order to pose with half naked women), and I can't even imagine what type of psychological mindfuckery Murry would have dreamed up if he had a hit song with Brian in 1969. Basically, working with Murry again (post when they kicked him out as manager) in pretty much any capacity, let alone a capacity where he would have been a cowriter on a big single they were gonna push, was gonna lead to problems.

And... this doesn't even begin to take into account that Mike might have gotten jealous of Murry trying to interject himself further as Brian's collaborator, and how that could have played out. Such dysfunction :/
13  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BEACH BOYS PRODUCERS SHED LIGHT ON 1968 ARCHIVAL RELEASES on: January 09, 2019, 03:01:38 PM
Does anyone know if Murry's vocals on the album (was it just 1 song?) were sang with Murry and the Boys all around 1 mic? Since Mike would sing his parts separately at his own mic, I wonder if Murry did the same, and if so the possibility exists for Murry-only vocal stems on whatever song(s) he contributed to. Weird question, but a serious one!
14  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love of the Beach Boys Presents The Girls of Kokomo..... on: January 09, 2019, 02:30:58 PM

Didn't Mike Love and Stamos try to get a "Mama Mia" like show going in Vegas just a few years ago? I take it that crashed and burned too.

And I agree that the market just hasn't been viable for any Beach Boys ventures outside of the music...I don't think the tacky and outdated Beach Boys official logo typeface helps at all in the merch department,either. I take it as a blessing, the music stands on its own and doesn't need any marketing gimmicks tagging along or marring the music itself.  

Agreed completely. It's interesting, rab, between this failed venture and the Murry-cowritten Breakaway failing, maybe I should start a thread on BBs ventures/songs that were lucky in hindsight to have failed for all sorts of various reasons.
15  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brothers, Cousins, and Friends - possibility on: January 09, 2019, 11:01:44 AM
I heard some of this stuff, years ago. I remember "Bucks" was kind of cool in that it had an enthusiastic Mike vocal and sort of rocked in an early '80s kind of way, but it also didn't sound like a Beach Boys song at all. My memory is very very vague but I want to say it had a less fast-paced "The Heat Is On" kind of thing going on. (I know that song came later, just reaching for a comparison)

Don't forget that there was a whole bunch of unused stuff from KTSA too. "Smokey Places" had a decent Brian vocal and Carl's interpretation of "I'll Always Love You" could easily have been an MOR hit in '80-'81 - though like "Bucks" its commerciality is offset by the fact that it doesn't sound like a Beach Boys song, just a random commercial song from that era. The KTSA outtakes weren't amazing, but I think they were superior in quality (at least production-wise) to most of what came after.

Me, I'd open the album with "Drip Drop" and go from there. But I'm weird.

Do you recall if the lyric "Bucks" was in reference to money? That's what I would assume.
16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love of the Beach Boys Presents The Girls of Kokomo..... on: January 09, 2019, 10:51:33 AM
Mike has been trying to "brand" Kokomo since the early 90's, more or less...and before these recent comments on the subject, I was going to jokingly ask is there any project Mike has undertaken under his own name or company that has NOT somehow branded Kokomo as either a concept, trademark, or lifestyle...and beyond that, seriously ask if any of Mike's Kokomo-branded ventures have been successful.

Then I read that his recent "Kokomo Brands" venture website seems to have disappeared from the web? I guess they couldn't get enough investors on board? So the streak continues, I suppose, and I wonder how many crates of unused new-old-stock "Club Kokomo" pint glasses and tableware from 1997 are spread around various fans' homes from Nevada to the UK at this point.  Grin

And, seriously though...Can anyone even try to explain the connection between a program promoting teachers and educational programs and Mike's troupe of bikini models?

I'm sure this is all based on Mike wanting to duplicate the success that Jimmy Buffet has had with Margaritaville, right? It seems almost an exact attempt at aping the very idea, much like la Bruce & Terry soundalike clone of a BBs song.

But I am also trying to understand the connection between a program promoting teachers and educational programs and Mike's troupe of bikini models. It's simultaneously hilarious (and I mean this is next level hilarious, up there with the Lifestyles of the Rich & Famous clip) and cringe inducing, and sometimes it feels like the amount of previously unknown cringey Mike projects like this which seemingly surface only bit by bit, in dribs and drabs, is almost like Mike's version of SMiLE, where fans can piece together and roll their own... joints to toke on, while they laugh their asses of at the ridiculousness of the totality of it all  LOL
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BEACH BOYS PRODUCERS SHED LIGHT ON 1968 ARCHIVAL RELEASES on: January 09, 2019, 10:36:46 AM
I think the CE releases give us a much more precise sense of how Brian finally hit the wall. He began replacing himself with Carl as the lead vocalist on SS and WH, and got Dennis underway on Friends. It's also not a coincidence that his last lengthy spurt of creativity in '68 stemmed (at least in part) from Mike's absence.  

This is a topic I don't think gets talked about much (if ever). I find it interesting to think about the Mike-less era during the Friends sessions, as this was basically the only era in the history of the band (during the Brian-as-the-primary-songwriter years) where Mike was literally MIA. Much as Mike did contribute some great things to the band, no doubt (nobody frustrated with Mike on various topics should deny this is the case), I nevertheless don't miss Mike in the vocal blend, nor do I miss his songwriting contributions on this album.

I wonder if Mike was concerned of his power dynamic within the band being at stake when he went to India (although a chance to hang with The Beatles and a promise of spiritual enlightenment was clearly irresistible). I suppose that since Mike just recently reattained his throne as being Brian's main lyricist on Wild Honey, that perhaps he felt somewhat secure to leave the country, even if it would cost him potential songwriting contributions on one album.

And I really do wonder if absent Mike, Brian felt free to do what he wanted, and how that affected his outlook/songwriting (as the album certainly has a happy "I'll do what I want to do" vibe to it), because seemingly this was the 1st album in a long time (2+ years) that Mike wasn't trying to guilt...encourage Brian into making Mike the main lyricist.

I also find it weird that absent Mike, that Murry was brought in (might Murry not have made a return otherwise?) almost as thought there had to be a swap of a domineering family member lurking in the background, one way or another. I'm sure that was not the intent (wasn't the pretense that Murry was brought in to sub for Mike's bass vocals?), but I also think the irony wouldn't have been lost on every participant there.

One must wonder what the dynamic would have been had a big hit come out of a Friends song that Mike neither contributed lyrics nor vocals/any presence whatsoever. Of course in actuality, we know that once Do It Again became a hit, it re-cemented Mike's outlook and planted the seeds for the future direction of the band a half decade later.

And geez, what would the dynamic have been if Breakaway had been a hit? The way that Mike got comically egocentric after Kokomo was a huge hit... can anyone imagine how Murry would behaved? Frankly as bad as things were for Brian and his mental health around 1969, with Murry selling the catalog, etc... I can think of an equally - or even worse - scenario if Murry had been strutting around like a rooster, mindfucking Brian into thinking that Brian really needed Murry all along to make hits, and would need Murry to have future hits. The stuff of nightmares.
18  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Golden Globes Shout Out to Brian's Long-time Manager on: January 08, 2019, 09:42:58 PM
Thanks for posting this Debbie, with the video too! A much-deserved shout-out for Jean...and great to see some camera time too. I was going to post something about this too, because I stayed tuned in to NBC after the Eagles game (E A G L E S!), and I never watch awards shows unless someone I really like or respect is going to get a feature. In this case, after hearing Jeff Bridges was getting a lifetime honor, I had to watch. It was really, really cool to see him (and the cameras) acknowledge his manager Jean during his speech. Again, a well-deserved nod and kudos to Jeff, Jean, and the rest of his team who helped bring us fans a lot of joy through his work. Same goes for Brian Wilson.

And since I'm one to not resist things like this...It's only more fuel to expose how foolish that peanut gallery of online naysayers really is, those "fans" who for how many years at this point have kept it up with the critiquing the "wife-and-managers" line of bullcrap.  Smiley  So much for that.

Great for Jean getting some recognition. Is Jean the only female manager ever associated with this group or any of its members?
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BEACH BOYS PRODUCERS SHED LIGHT ON 1968 ARCHIVAL RELEASES on: January 08, 2019, 02:47:21 PM
Thank you Howie for this cool interview. I hope everyone buys this digital set to support further releases!
20  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love of the Beach Boys Presents The Girls of Kokomo..... on: January 08, 2019, 02:46:16 PM
Sleazy as this all sure seems to be, I guess at least it's a good picture of Mike. I just can't connect the dots of how something marketed as a "teaching" program is somehow supposed to incorporate or be associated with hot Kokomo babes.

Like, was the intent for the person who received this kit to pop a boner, and then decide to open their wallets? I truly, truly am at a loss and don't get it. At first glance, the association of the these things (teaching, half naked ladies, pseudo religious/philosophical quotes/Mike seemingly having a harem in the photos) makes me have a flash of the whole current NXIVM/Vanguard/Allison Mack situation. Alison Mike?
21  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BEACH BOYS PRODUCERS SHED LIGHT ON 1968 ARCHIVAL RELEASES on: January 08, 2019, 02:40:13 PM

Mark Linett explained that following the early-'68 sessions for Friends, Brian Wilson's role in the Beach Boys changed significantly: "Everybody had to step up, because Brian -- either consciously or unconsciously -- was not going to assume the same role that he had all the way up through Friends. I think this set tends to dispel the myth that after Smile, y'know, Brian wasn't really producing and then the band stepped up. He's clearly working much more like he used to, but by the time of 20/20, both songwriting-wise and production-wise and out of necessity, y'know, everybody else had to get more involved. And Dennis -- more than anybody -- seemed ready as a writer and a performer to do that."


This quote stands out, and asks the questions how and why were the myths and outright falsehoods allowed to be written and stand for so long regarding Brian "dropping out" entirely after Smile to the point where it was suggested he basically did nothing but lay in bed after Smile was scrapped, or had such major addiction issues he was incapable of cutting a record after Smile. It sounds absurd, but those were the suggestions being offered for many years.

It's validation on several fronts to actually have the tapes to reference and for all to hear what actually went down, and to not only debunk the myths but effectively slam dunk them into the garbage bin of bad research and bad info for good. The same thing happened with the Sunshine Tomorrow set, once people could hear the audio, all the nonsense went down the drain.

Although I would add when the transition happened from the Friends album to what became 20/20, an element became more strong within the band's personal dynamics to where Brian's ideas were dismissed if not outright shot down, where that had existed in some forms previously but was not quite as prominent as it became over things like "Old Man River" and the like.

Initially was it because the story was more interesting that way? The media has a tendency to either distort or sensationalize reality for the benefit of getting more readers/viewers to buy their paper or watch their TV program. Brian laying in bed for years right after he abandoned his masterpiece makes for a juicy read or documentary.

And over the years this viewpoint became adopted by at least one member of the band (I guess to help the odds of financial gain in a lawsuit)...which is utterly absurd given that anyone with a decent knowledge of Beach Boys history can see right through this myth.

I think it just makes for a really interesting myth to tell people, and people with a vendetta against Brian seemed to run with it and also people who want to juice up their story/book (Rocky's recent book claims this myth too) aren't afraid to put this myth in.

It reminds me of the longtime myths surrounding the early years with band member changes of Al Jardine and David Marks. Too complex a situation (not that it's really *that* complex of course) for simpleton magazines/news media to spell out even a brief summary of, and instead a rewriting of history takes place.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 20/20 Strings on: January 07, 2019, 10:17:53 PM
Who cooked up the idea to wear the white suits they wore during friends and 2020? Sometimes they looked nice and sometimes they looked awful

 Those white suits must have stained ridiculously easily too.  I wonder if they had a standby dry cleaner on the payroll
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 20/20 Strings on: January 07, 2019, 05:26:18 PM
Is it known exactly when Brian was institutionalized in 1968 and for how long? Was it between the Friends and 20/20 sessions? For the Friends sessions, is it known if Murry volunteered his services or it Brian specifically asked him to assist. If Murry produced WTA, how involved was he in the 20/20 sessions?

I believe it was in the summer of '68, but I've never been able to track down the dates or even months. And there doesn't seem to be any indication that Murry was involved with 20/20.

It's so odd that with all of Murry's involvement around this time, on what now appears to be a significant amount of songs, he never once got an actual credit as Murry Wilson, and the one credit he was afforded (Breakaway) had a pseudonym.

I wonder if that was due to Murry not wanting (?) a credit, the band being embarrassed to put Murry's name on there considering the public falling out they had with him a few years prior (which also begs the question, how publicly known was Murry's firing, etc during this time? I'm Bugged at My Old Man could give people a clue, but I feel like few people had more knowledge than what the lyrics might have made them think was just a funny goof of a song), or some other reason(s).

And I wonder what Mike thought of all this as he silently grumbled about being denied credits himself for years. Really weird.

24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 20/20 Strings on: January 07, 2019, 10:06:12 AM
Speaking of Brian, do we know which 20/20 sessions (post-CWTL in July) he was actually there for?


I really think just "Cotton Fields" and vocals on "Time To Get Alone" and "Never Learn Not To Love".  Capitol paperwork also indicated that vocals weren't added to "I Went To Sleep" until the fall - not sure if I believe that, but it's possible.

Is it safe to assume that there may have been some uncredited Brian co-producing/vocal arranging on "Never Learn Not To Love", similar to the Denny songs on Friends?
25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 20/20 Strings on: January 06, 2019, 07:29:05 PM
Not sure if this has ever been discussed before, but I've been noticing while listening to songs off of 20/20 lately that a few of them have ominous sounding strings (swelling?) a good example of this being the end of bluebirds over the mountain. Be With Me has them as well and so does Time To Get Alone, was this being used as a link between he tracks on the album or was it just strictly because they liked how they sounded?

Well, the "Time To Get Alone" strings were recorded in '67, along with the rest of the backing track, but the strings for "Bluebirds", "Be With Me", and "Nearest Faraway Place" were added in New York City during the 20/20, sessions, and were arranged and conducted by Van McCoy (later famous for "The Hustle"), based on concepts from the band members themselves. So perhaps Bruce and Dennis picked up on Brian's use of the "swell" in "TTGA" and decided to have McCoy include that in the string arrangements for those other three songs, so that the album would have some kind of textural consistency.


Interesting.  Being as they were added in New York City, is the presumption that no BBs band members were present, including the writers of these songs, at the time that the strings were recorded and arranged?   i'm picturing a scenario where Dennis gets the version with strings back a week later  and has a "wow" moment when he first hears them, having been recorded without him present. That would seem a bit weird, but maybe that was not atypical for the time?

The Beach Boys (except for Brian) WERE all present for the NYC sessions in the fall of '68 - as a matter of fact, that's where they did the vocals for "Bluebirds". It was a four-day stop in the midst of an east coast tour.

Thanks, c-man! Makes more sense.  Under the mistaken scenario I was thinking about, it would've had Denny sort of "sending away for" strings across the country, as though it was an item in some mail order catalog  LOL
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