Consider Barney's Gibson mandolin - He could play the WIBN intro arpeggios at the 2nd fret, basically open position, if he used that 12-string mandolin.

I absolutely have considered this mandolin - for years I was sure it was this instrument, but then you guys had me reconsider.  I agree that the instrument used on WIBN was tuned in the guitar register as you can hear some open E's and G's in the outtakes and they are not up an octave.  While I think Barney's mandolin might appear to be a bit larger than a standard mandolin scale, it's still considerably shorter than a guitar scale, which would lead to very slack strings if tuned in the guitar register (which could be pulled out of tune easily).  Also Barney has some trouble playing the higher notes cleanly which could also indicate a scale-length he wasn't used to.

Question for GF and H and C-man and anyone else: are you sure the mic stand in the foreground is meant for this instrument?  The lower portion we see could just be the elbow, as if the top of the stand is pointing somewhere high.  The mic stand is out of focus, maybe the photog used a large aperture (making the focal plane very narrow) or maybe it's considerably closer than we think.

Scott

C-man and Guitarfool = I remember the discussions from years ago about the intro to WIBN.  It might have been me that mentioned that guys used to detune their acoustic 12's to relieve the neck pressure.  I don't know or even think electric 12s needed to do that.  But the intro to WIBN sounds like it has very flexible strings, looser than what I would expect on an electric 12.  You can hear that in the outtakes where the left hand finger pressure easily pulls the guitar sharp.  So it could be a shorter-than-normal scale.  What is the scale of a bellzouki?  24.5 inches I believe, which is the same as a Gibson - not exactly short-scale.  Or maybe the guitar had high action.  I don't own one but I played one briefly at a vintage store and after doing so I thought it might be the guitar used.

The hybrid instrument theory was refuted by someone who noted that there doesn't seem to be a pickup on it in the picture from the PS box set.  OTOH, I don't know why Mr. Kessel would order a specially made instrument for session work that didn't have a pickup!  I've tried to find alternate pictures of him holding that mando but with no success.

I still don't know what guitar/instrument it was

Scott.

They released their 1st album, Surfing' Safari.

Scott

Well let history repeat itself - I need to correct something that Ang keeps saying over and over.

Mike Love did NOT refuse to do Surf's Up on the C50 tour.  No one asked to perform that song.

I, however, asked the band to play it when we had some time in Oslo.

Your source "who should know" is either misinformed, or....?

Scott

Yes! Just to clarify, I have that part transcribed and what I can do short of importing some kind of notation software here is list the notes of those harmonies, and how they're stacked. The surprising thing to realize is that there is one lead and only three harmony voices, and it was such an economical way to arrange and sing those harmonies that at times the three notes can sound like more notes than are actually sung. This is where doubling was such a crucial part of Brian's arranging style.

here is the stacking:

"west coast has the sunshine..." is a B chord, stacked low to high: D# F# B

"girls all get so tan..." is F#m/B, low to high: E A(natural) C#

"ooo waa ooo waaa" is an E chord, 1/4 notes stacked: G# B E

the "ahhh" under "palm tree" is an F# chord, stacked C# F# A#


Brian is using simple triads and inversions, and the only "jazzy" note is the b7 note E on the F#m7 chord.

Yet it sounds like a thicker harmony than what this part actually is. Otherwise it's simple triads of whatever chord the song is sitting on, and it is a great sounding part.

If I'm missing something in the transcription, please add corrections!

I don't know if you've had a chance to revisit this, guitarfool - but there are 4 parts to the backing vocals.  Looks like you are missing the low one in your transcription.

Scott

I love it!  I think it's brilliant and always brightens my day-

Scott

I'l never get back the 30 minutes I spent reading this thread.  That's my fault; it's my problem.  I should note that I was listening to NPP during this time, and I completely enjoyed it.  Some songs more than others; I'm entitled to like what I like and dislike what I don't.  I agree that Brian's singing is the best I've heard from him in a long time.  Any use of Autotune didn't detract from my enjoyment of the album, though I feel it's brave of Brian to point out that it was used - pretty much all pop albums use it or overuse it as the case may be.

If someone doesn't like some or all of the album, that's their prerogative, their right.  They don't need to justify it, and those of you who want to argue to the death about it come across as insecure in your assessment of the album.  I chuckle when I hear some of you talk about an "agenda".  Just because someone doesn't like the album?  Or poor the poor guy who wondered if BW was playing his piano on Conan took so much grief for a not unreasonable question - even what looked like not-so-veiled threats of punishment from Mods.  (PS Brian played his piano when I toured with him on the 50th).

I've never heard anyone say anything truly malicious about Brian here or anywhere; he is loved and adored.  The perceived slights against Brian are blown way out of proportion here.

Just the other day someone listed Mike's instrument as "skin flute" and no one said a word against that.  Mike gets slandered and trashed on a regular basis and many of you think that is equal to wondering whether Brian played his piano.  I don't find those two examples to be of equal value.  I really feel that some of you are bullies.

And let me say for the record, I don't have a bias - Brian is my hero and I consider myself a Brianista - proudly so.  I just don't need to put everyone else down to justify it.

Scott

Scott-

  Before I get to the meat of my response, I do want to point something out...my issue with the aforementioned debate on whether or not Brian was playing the keyboard stemmed mainly from said poster claiming that Brian wasn't even touching the keyboard, and the inability to acknowledge the visual evidence. I admit I did go on too long with it, but in all honesty I felt I was being punked. In any case, we both dropped it.

As for the rest...I did miss the comment made about Mike's 'instrument', mainly because I haven't been online much over the past month or so  due to health issues...I certainly would've responded had I seen it. That said, I've spent an obscene amount of time here actually defending Mike, as my post history shows. I agree with you that there is no need to tear the 'other side' down in other to boost one's 'chosen side', and have stated as such many times. And to be perfectly frank, the only 'side' I myself am on is the music's, because at the end of the day, that's all I really care about.

Hey Billy - Sorry, I didn't mean to single any one out.  I know you well enough to know that you are a fan of the music, and unbiased when it comes to the band members.  I appreciate that about you.

Scott

Speaking for myself:

I'm happy to see this posted. I was going to post something in support of Billy in a different way than this, because it really didn't sit well to see even a passive suggestion that he was being labeled a "bully".

For the record, and this is pretty common knowledge among the membership, Billy is a genuine asset to this board. He is one of the reasons why it keeps on running year after year. A fair guy, a reasonable guy, and above all a truly great guy whom I'm happy to consider a friend. We talk things out, we sometimes disagree, but above all Billy is a genuinely good person. As there are and have been legitimate cases of "bullying" on the board among members, including through PM's and otherwise which we won't go into publicly, to see this situation somehow lead to Billy being even suggested as a bully was wrong, and I'm glad to see it's being set right.

That's in response to that issue. More to follow.

You are totally right about all that.  I wasn't referring to Billy when I mentioned bullying.

Scott

I'l never get back the 30 minutes I spent reading this thread.  That's my fault; it's my problem.  I should note that I was listening to NPP during this time, and I completely enjoyed it.  Some songs more than others; I'm entitled to like what I like and dislike what I don't.  I agree that Brian's singing is the best I've heard from him in a long time.  Any use of Autotune didn't detract from my enjoyment of the album, though I feel it's brave of Brian to point out that it was used - pretty much all pop albums use it or overuse it as the case may be.

If someone doesn't like some or all of the album, that's their prerogative, their right.  They don't need to justify it, and those of you who want to argue to the death about it come across as insecure in your assessment of the album.  I chuckle when I hear some of you talk about an "agenda".  Just because someone doesn't like the album?  Or poor the poor guy who wondered if BW was playing his piano on Conan took so much grief for a not unreasonable question - even what looked like not-so-veiled threats of punishment from Mods.  (PS Brian played his piano when I toured with him on the 50th).

I've never heard anyone say anything truly malicious about Brian here or anywhere; he is loved and adored.  The perceived slights against Brian are blown way out of proportion here.

Just the other day someone listed Mike's instrument as "skin flute" and no one said a word against that.  Mike gets slandered and trashed on a regular basis and many of you think that is equal to wondering whether Brian played his piano.  I don't find those two examples to be of equal value.  I really feel that some of you are bullies.

And let me say for the record, I don't have a bias - Brian is my hero and I consider myself a Brianista - proudly so.  I just don't need to put everyone else down to justify it.

Scott

Scott-

  Before I get to the meat of my response, I do want to point something out...my issue with the aforementioned debate on whether or not Brian was playing the keyboard stemmed mainly from said poster claiming that Brian wasn't even touching the keyboard, and the inability to acknowledge the visual evidence. I admit I did go on too long with it, but in all honesty I felt I was being punked. In any case, we both dropped it.

As for the rest...I did miss the comment made about Mike's 'instrument', mainly because I haven't been online much over the past month or so  due to health issues...I certainly would've responded had I seen it. That said, I've spent an obscene amount of time here actually defending Mike, as my post history shows. I agree with you that there is no need to tear the 'other side' down in other to boost one's 'chosen side', and have stated as such many times. And to be perfectly frank, the only 'side' I myself am on is the music's, because at the end of the day, that's all I really care about.

Hey Billy - Sorry, I didn't mean to single any one out.  I know you well enough to know that you are a fan of the music, and unbiased when it comes to the band members.  I appreciate that about you.

Scott

I'l never get back the 30 minutes I spent reading this thread.  That's my fault; it's my problem.  I should note that I was listening to NPP during this time, and I completely enjoyed it.  Some songs more than others; I'm entitled to like what I like and dislike what I don't.  I agree that Brian's singing is the best I've heard from him in a long time.  Any use of Autotune didn't detract from my enjoyment of the album, though I feel it's brave of Brian to point out that it was used - pretty much all pop albums use it or overuse it as the case may be.

If someone doesn't like some or all of the album, that's their prerogative, their right.  They don't need to justify it, and those of you who want to argue to the death about it come across as insecure in your assessment of the album.  I chuckle when I hear some of you talk about an "agenda".  Just because someone doesn't like the album?  Or poor the poor guy who wondered if BW was playing his piano on Conan took so much grief for a not unreasonable question - even what looked like not-so-veiled threats of punishment from Mods.  (PS Brian played his piano when I toured with him on the 50th).

I've never heard anyone say anything truly malicious about Brian here or anywhere; he is loved and adored.  The perceived slights against Brian are blown way out of proportion here.

Just the other day someone listed Mike's instrument as "skin flute" and no one said a word against that.  Mike gets slandered and trashed on a regular basis and many of you think that is equal to wondering whether Brian played his piano.  I don't find those two examples to be of equal value.  I really feel that some of you are bullies.

And let me say for the record, I don't have a bias - Brian is my hero and I consider myself a Brianista - proudly so.  I just don't need to put everyone else down to justify it.

Scott

I'm honestly shocked they had the after-party event at 10050 Cielo Drive...Of all places, even if there were no Beach Boys connection which there obviously is, that is just plain bizarre on all levels.

Did someone think it would be fun or ironic to host a music event there? I don't get it. 

That house has been knocked down, and a new house has been built on the lot or lots.  The property address has been changed.  The new house is owned by a friend of Mike and John Stamos.  We have performed there many times, including just last month.  There is no fun or irony involved nor intended, GF.

Scott

Glad to know that you're considering 'adding some' surprises into the mix Scott...and I appreciate you taking the time to respond...BUT...how does the process go?  When it's decided to add in a song or two...How do you collectively rehearse...and when/where?  What's the process in terms of the video included behind you?

I'll bet that it's FUN to collectively work together to prep a new 'something' for the show.

Well, either Mike or Bruce suggest a song or I might try throwing out a few titles to them and see what they say.  Once I get the go ahead, then I dig through my archives for all the audio I can find.  I prepare a chord chart for the band, and then I pick out all the vocals.  I make a demo where I sing all the parts and then I send each singer an mp3 with his vocal part louder.  I give everyone some time to get used to that, then we start rehearsing at soundcheck as time allows.  Maybe try it out at VIP soundcheck.  We don't all live in the same area, and as we are pretty much always touring, there's no time to have a separate rehearsal.  As for the video, that's Mike Czaszwicz, he puts all that stuff together and then he tweaks it as we rehearse and start performing it at shows.

Does that answer your question?

Scott

So let's say that Mike and the Boys want to add in a song like 'All I Wanna Do'.  It will likely need some type of inclusional video material to roll on the BIG screen behind them...so that would have to be prepared and editted into the 'program' right?

AND...they would collectively have to sit down and figure out how they want to do it and then practice, Practice, PRACTICE 'til they get it...'just so'..  When and where do they do that?  At sound checks?  In a hotel room?  [voices only?]  At some room set aside for workin' on stuff during the tour...like on a day off?  Back home at pre-determined practice sessions during down time?

Those of you who know?  How do they work in new tunes when they're playing somewhere as often as they do?  Huh?  Please?  Do tell!!!

You are very right, there is a process and it takes some time!  But I will say that I've had a couple of conversations with Mike and Bruce about our upcoming UK tour and what chestnuts we might add.  Stay tuned...

Scott

Scott, please run the idea of doing "all I wanna do" live past Mike, he seems pretty oblivious to the fact it's one of his, if not his great composition.

Such a beautiful song.

Great idea Shady!  I will...

Scott

"Here Today" is very high on my list of songs I've yet to hear live!!!

I wish they would do it more...it fits right in with their show too...and it would involve Mike in the "pet sounds" portion of the show.


I don't want to jump to conclusions...but with a smaller band like this, I worry about the quality of "Heroes and Villains".

Don't worry RS13!  We do the live BB version that they played all through the 70's not the record version we did on C50.  I normally like to stick to the record versions, but I think the 70's live version rocks.  And Cowsill sings the lead very well.  It's a fun song to do and another one that amazes me at the genius of Brian Wilson.

Scott

Eric,

Pretty sure Bruce sang lead on "YSGTM", with Jeff on the la la las.

One more "new" one I remembered; although this was just in the soundcheck, it sounded great... "Keep An Eye On Summer".  When it was over, Bruce said something like "Bet you've never heard that one live before".

Sorry, but we did not do YSGTM.  We added HERE TODAY and HEROES AND VILLAINS.

Scott

Hey!  Thanks for the on-topic posts.  One reason why I like to check in to this thread is to see what fans like you (and me) think of our show.  That's why it's been so frustrating to see all the off topic stuff that's been going on.

As for CAL GIRLS, Andrew Hickey pointed out earlier this year that it was too slow.  So I started picking it up.  I think if you look at where the organ comes in you can see me conducting and that seems to be close to the right tempo, but it ends up settling down a few bpm.  I'll run it today at soundcheck.  On the record, the band plays the choruses a tad slower than the verses, while the vocals seem to be ahead of the beat most of the song.

As for Sloop, Bruce wants me to double him at the top, and from this youtube I think that sounds ok.  I note that Mike has made up a counter melody that isn't on the record.

As for WIBN, the melody is doubled on the record, that's what we were going for.  Maybe we'll try it with just Jeff.

Thanks for your thoughts!

Scott

This used to be a great board, with knowledgeable people posting and sharing their info.  I've made some friends here.

Now, every thread I read becomes "Mike ruined SMILE, Mike ruined C50, Mike shouldn't have the license".

Anyone else notice that? ;-)

Scott

Ron gets my vote for post of ALL TIME

Thanks for that, guys. OK, so that means, as far as I know, that was his last gig of the tour. Anyone know different ?

Yes, I can say that Nick played June 3 in Irvine CA as well as June 6 the Jay Leno show.  The first show he missed was June 8 in Houston.

Scott

Hi Everyone-

We had a great time at the Jones Beach show.  I, too regret that it was restricted to 90 minutes.  We were given a strict 10:30 curfew and we ended at 10:29.  We did our best to cover all the bases we could in that time schedule.  SJS, Disney Girls IS a staple of our normal-length shows, and is one of my favorites, but at nearly 5 minutes in length, we just couldn't squeeze it in this time.

Despite all that, it was a blast to play there and have David with us.

Scott

Don't trust what you find on Lyricsfreak.com.

"Then marvelous baby, will have seen the last of me…"

If you do a search you will find a post of mine from 2-3 years ago in which I explained that the show length is 100 per cent of the time dictated by the house or promoter, not by Mike.  Mike ALWAYS wants to put on a full-length show and always goes over the requested amount, because he wants to give the audience as much of a show as possible.  IF the house tells Mike "play as long as you want" then it will be a 2-hour or longer show.  I know because I type up the setlist every show.

When you are faced with a 75 minute time limit, it's hard to add rarities at the expense of the more well-known songs.

A minor point - but as long as we are setting the record straight, I played the solo on the Do It Again remake.  David was added later to the video, and Mr. Stebbins says the track as well, but the guitar solo remains the same.

Nevertheless, I am glad that David was invited to be part of the tour and all the events of the band's 50th anniversary, he deserved to be there.

Scott

My last post here said that we did not use any pre-recorded background vocals during the tour.  We did use the footstomps and hand claps from Isn't It Time but played and sang live to it. 

I have not seen the Chiba footage.

Scott