The Smiley Smile Message Board

I'm going to LA next week, so I'm finally accepting Alan Boyd's generous offer to meet and "compare notes," as he said last year.  Of course I have some discussion topics in mind already, but what are some specific questions I should ask him?  About working on TSS in particular?  (I'm not especially obsessed with SMILE so I don't know the details like some of you guys do.)

P.S. Are they any BB-related events or locations that you guys suggest I attend/visit?  Thanks in advance!

When oh when oh when can we expect a Wouldnt It Be Nice To Live Again official release? Why does it continue to languish in the vaults? Who can he speak too in relation to it getting a release? Please ask him all of the above.

Mostly, just pass on mine and others thanks! He does sterling work, and The Smile Sessions is a beautiful piece of work on his and Mark's part. Not that you'd know it from the way we carry on  :lol

Could you ask him why the Heroes & Villains backing vocals for the verse aren't in the montage? That has puzzled me, admittedly, seeing as they seem to  be available for the stereo mix.

Beach Boys historic landmark - West 119th Street, Hawthorne. I was there a month ago, it can be slightly hard to find if you follow google maps advice as they pinpoint it a block or two over from where it actually is! Turn down South Kornblum Ave off West 120th Street, go straight on then turn left at the end and bingo!

Me at the landmark.

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Landmark sans me.

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Ask him why tracks 1 - 19 on disc 1 are only in mono... :-D

Yeah, thank him for his work!  :)

These are all good ideas, thanks again.  I'm not leaving until Saturday, March 17th, and staying approx. 1 week, so if anyone else has input, please let me know.

I don't understand why that's funny.

Please ask him why the piano wasn't removed from Brian's vocal for Barnyard.  Others have done it with no noticeable artifact remaining.

As you are probably aware, there has been some whining about the main track sequence 'only' being in mono by people who don't understand that a true stereo mix is impossible. Therefore, I thought it would be funny to suggest such a stupid question. I'm sorry that my attempt at humour upset you so - here's a hug.  :hug

Please ask him about beachboyscentral.com

Ha!  I'm not upset.  I just didn't get the joke.  Yeah, I guess I do remember that mono/stereo thing now.  Thanks for the clarification.

Yes.

I'm taking notes, guys, thanks……...

Apart from a massive thanks, any info on further plans for Smile material would be great. And I don't just mean audio - it would be great to see some of the footage used in the Smile promo webisodes afforded some kind of official release.

Oh, you might also ask him if he's sick to *^$*£)in' death of anything Smile-related...   

Ask him to swing by this place real soon and answer some questions!

And add my thanks to the list of many - every time I play TSS I hear something new and wonderful. Looking forward to TSS Vol 2!

Don't bother speaking to Alan , just take and hand him over a shed load of blank CD's  :lol

Ask him to do his Jan Berry interviewing Brian Wilson routine for you. Its the single greatest thing ever.

I'll second, third and fourth that one ...  :3d

Yes of course pass on our thanks for Smile. Outstanding job done by him & mark on that and I still listen to it on a daily basis.

As for questions - any info on archival projects would be most welcome although maybe he'll be tight lipped about that stuff. Yes please ask about Wouldn't it be nice to live again and the likelihood that'll see a release soon!

Many thanks, Ponghit

Yeah, have him do his impersonations of various Beach Boy-related personages for you--he does them all!  Old movies are always a good topic of conversation too.

Right, he mentioned something to me about a sideline with old film footage.

Thanks.

^^^^^  This

Seriously, if there were ever a time for that site to launch, it is at some point this year with the 50th Celebration

Please ask where the "Child Is Father Of The Man" acetate came from.

I'd be curious about any more archival releases being released as well. I hope so early - mid 70s shows make the light of day.

"WIBNTLA" release.  New Box Set details.

You're assuming he's involved.

Ask for more details about "Surf's Up 1967". Why was "I'm In Great Shape" moved to track 5? Descriptions of some of his favorite vault tracks ("California Feelin'" 1974, "Where Is She", "Live Again"). Maybe ask why they didn't build a version of "Heroes And Villains" that included "I'm In Great Shape" and "Barnyard", as one could say there IS historical reasoning for doing so. And most of all, thank him for his hard work.

Pitch the 15 big ones remix or love you box idea

I'd suggest a meeting at the LA firehouse where the GV promo was shot - if I'm not mistaken, I think they actually book rooms for meetings and conferences, and how cool would it be to have Alan walk in and you slide down the fire pole with a red plastic firehat! Talk about getting the meeting off to a good start... ;D

I'm being serious too, I think that firehouse museum would be a pretty neat place to hang out for a bit. When I get to LA that is high on my list.

As a BB's film fanatic, I've been wondering if and when a comprehensive collection of Beach Boys short films and clips will be made available, on DVD or otherwise. Similar to what Alan had done for AMC's "AmPop" series, where he compiled an hour's worth of short BB's films for broadcast...some of those clips were revelatory and new for many fans. It would be nice to take a lot of the raw footage like the silent Hawaii films, the Dennis films from 66-67, the studio footage, etc. and put them together in one place. If the film originally had sound, include it unedited, and if it were silent footage, have a voiceover describing some details of the film rather than trying to sync up audio to the film that didn't belong there, as has happened before.

And I'd also love...*love*...some kind of a listening room type of thing, where a Brian or Mike would be filmed listening to certain session tapes and records and we'd get their initial gut reactions to hearing them. I'd love to play Brian some of the KHJ radio material, or even the Spector "Be My Baby" session tapes and see what his reactions and comments would be.

That's so far from the mainstream releases but I think fans would definitely buy or download items like the film DVD compilations or "listening room" features, and it's worth proposing to someone like Alan who could be involved in making it happen.

It would be interesting to find out what Brian & the rest of the Beach Boys nixed from the final SMiLE set.

These are questions I'd ask. 1. Is there a release planned for "WIBNTLA"?  2. What's the new box set going to look like?

But I imagine you probably know these answers AGD.  So, reading between the 'AGD lines', A B is not involved and that ain't a good sign. And if he isn't involved, it's the record company putting this thing together.

Er, pardon my ignorance.... but why wouldn't he be? Him and Mark have been the men involved in every BB's archival release of recent memory, right? If he was in on the Smile Sessions, why not whatever's going down this year...

Perhaps an update on releasing any complete live material...like the Carnegie Hall show?

Ditto these comments, please pass on thanks and gratitude to Alan for his hard work and passion in his BB endeavours of the past few years.

As a latecomer, I've been dutifully reading through the archives: Alan's threads are not only full of amazing facts, figures and astoundingly informed anecdotes BUT what shines through is that he is a true fan, a generous contributor to the broader fan community and sets a high standard in BB flag bearing - and it would be great to have him back here from time to time :)

Ask Boyd if there's an album/compilation/box set of live material that's in the works or at least being considered.

OK seriously, ask him if he thinks there was a conspiracy or if he subscribes to the lone gunman theory.

Pong!

Visit,

Tommy's Burgers, Rockaway Records, Holllywood and see the Capitol Records Tower and The Beach Boys Star on the Walk of Fame, Amoeba Records in Hollywood.  Beach Boys Landmark , Foster Freeze and Hawthorne High School in Hawthorne.  Head to Marina Del Rey , Venice and Royce Hall at UCLA(see the steps where the Beach Boys walked up the steps for the I Get Around picture sleeve) in the Westwood district of LA.

Hollywood Bowl.

and save 3  full days for Disneyland and California Adventure( just 45 minutes south of Hollywood).  Stay in Anaheim when visiting DIsneyland. Don'r even


bother fighting the traffic between Hollywood/LA and Anaheim.

Head over the The Grove shopping center to see people and the Farmer's Market for good inexpensive food choices .

Bring a lot of money to California and spend it here.  If you're driving, expect to pay about $4.25 a gallon for regular unleaded.  Have fun!

Q #1: Does Mike Love believe in ghosts?
Q #2: Has Mike Love ever changed a diaper?

Those were some of the weirdest threads I have ever read. If he had been lurking around here at the time he will either laugh or look at you funny. Seems like he hasn't posted here in a long time though. Hope he returns. Maybe I'll meet him on one of these West Coast shows. Who knows?

 ;)

Why not, indeed.

Would that be the farmers' market at Fairfax & Third?  I ate there back in 2000 on my trip to see BW at the Bowl. Worth the walk!

Agree with all of Les' highlights for you, no doubt (at Tommy's, DON'T SKIP the chili on your burger; at Disneyland, DO stay in Anaheim). In terms of questions...please ask if he is involved in any of the current archival or dvd projects with the 5oth.  If so, ask for whatever inside information he can provide.  Let him know that we sincerely hope he is involved in the video projects as his videos (starting with Nashville Sounds, continuing with Endless Harmony and onward) FAR AND AWAY oushine previous BB efforts.

and what was on it.  Was it just the chorus with an additional vocal overdub, or was it a mix of verse chorus and bridge - and what order were the sections in?

Reconfirm with Alan that no Heroes acetate or tape ever turned up with a longer mix than the single - I'm thinking about the 5 or 6 minute tape played by Mike to a reporter in June of 67. 

Ask him about the December 66 versions of Dada on the box set- what tape were these found on, and what was on the tape box?  I'd like to know if there is any evidence these were planned for Heroes or if these were sketches for the water element at that time.

Ask him if the Beach Boys would consider approaching Rhino Handmade to release the 5.1/quad Surf's Up that Mark has already prepared - they've released other old quad mixes on DVD-A such as Aretha Franklin.

And what was the general consensus on these topics?

Firstly, why 'reconfirm'? They said in the Icon Fetch interviews that many BB's who claimed to have acetates over the years couldn't find them. I presume that goes for a tape which one interviewer talks about 45 or whatever years ago.

Secondly - I believe the fact that the piano and rhodes tracks are called Dada and the full band tracks are called 'I Love To Say Dada' should be enough for you - there's no reason to change the names from the tapebox.

Thirdly, Rhino Handmade is owned by Warner Records, and I don't see why Capitol would ship out archival product to a rival.

Think of better questions!  ;D

Ask about wild honey stereo remix.

Just a thought but rather pitch in all flags flying with a barrage of questions, maybe just get to know the guy first ? He may not want to be grilled for several hours over something he did several months ago and which might, for all we know, have not been as much fun as we assume. Just sayin'.

Yes, Andrew, I see your point, and thought of that too — but our meeting was his idea, and he did specifically suggest that he and I "compare notes" — here's how he worded his invitation:

Hi Jeff,

I recently saw "Deconstructing Dad" and I'm a great admirer of your work with the Raymond Scott archives. Thank you for everything you're doing to keep that remarkable legacy alive! Do you ever find yourself in the Los Angeles area? If you do, consider this an invitation to get together to compare notes!

Maybe he's talking general preservation techniques.  :)

I would ask if he would ever will put some uncut rare Beach Boys footage out and also encourage him to do vinyl on some of the older nineties titles. 

Could be.  But I wanted to have some good topics at ready, regardless.  Not really sure what to expect, but I'm looking forward to it.

Chill and enjoy your get-together. Let the the converstation take its own path.

Exactly!  Seriously this forum is unreal at times although granted he did ask for suggestion.

Ask and ye shall receive...so goes the old adage. :-D  This kind of thing reminds me of an ad placed in the local paper last year by a pet rescue group looking for newspapers to make bedding and whatnot for the animals. A few days after the initial ad they must have gotten bombarded with newspapers at their facility because they placed another ad asking that no more papers be dropped off...thanks for the donations but we're overwhelmed!

I knew it would be overwhelming with suggestions pouring in (my own included) but it's a chance for people here to voice some ideas and suggestions which otherwise would probably not reach the right ears.

Ask about what´s coming up! We´ve heard enough about SMiLE now from all the radioshows and other media.
What´s in the pipeline?
Deluxe editions of every album?
Smiley Smile stereo remix?
The boxset?

Suppose he says "I have no idea, I'm not involved" ?  Then what ?

Then we know he´s not invlved. :) On to the next question then.

To judge from the majority of the posts here, there will be no next question, just an increasingly awkward silence.  ;D

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I wouldn't try and ask anything until there is something worthy of being asked. If that makes sense?

I think AGD is telling us (and he would know), that  A.B. is not involved in these projects.

Give him a big thanks from all of us for The SMiLE Sessions

And if he drops a few hints about future releases that would be a bonus

You're right, but he should still be asked. I mean, we have literally zero information on upcoming releases (other than the new studio album), so spending three seconds to ask if he knows anything about a new boxed set or compilation or reissue is well worth it.

Go and get a bite to eat with Alan and see what comes up.  He's an easy going guy but I hear his time is very limited.   Treat him to the meal. 

Not exactly... just saying that 99% of folk here are taking it as a given that he is, and thus far I've seen no mention of it. Here's a hint - if you can talk silent movies beyond slapstick comedy, that'll help.

I'm a big silent movie buff. Especially early German Expressionism from people like F.W. Mernau and Fritz Lang. Perhaps I should contact Mr. Boyd.  ;D

No 'perhaps' about it.  ;D

I'm sorry to again get back to spelling things, but it is "Murnau", not "Mernau", and pronounced "Moorenow". :-\

Andrew:  Have you met Alan?

Let's say, hypothetically, you guys could hear some unreleased music from the vaults.....    which tunes would you request?

Wouldn't it be Nice? (To Live Again)

That was my first thought.  

California Feelin '74!

Cool.

"Where Is She"
"Burlesque"
"You're Riding High on the Music"
"Gimme Some Lovin'" 1972
"Flowers Come in the Spring" mid '70s Dennis solo remake

Those would be a good start  ;D

This thread embarrasssing. If I were the person being mentioned on a fanatic board, I would just invite the visitor to breakfast at Denny's on Sunsert and then get on with my day.

I would ask him where that "Good Vibrations" studio footage comes from that was used for the SMiLE podcast. Are these snippets that were used more or less all there is?

Sure, first time in 1983. Good friend, good person.

Alan is one of the nicest and easiest-going people in the world.  He has zero pretension and is rumored to keep a cold one in the fridge if you happen to be stopping by  ;D.  Haven't seen him in ages since I seldom venture south of Monterey (isn't there a song like that?) these days.  So relax and enjoy your visit.  He's super nice and easy to talk with.  Tell him Gilroy Dave says 'hey'.

Thanks guys.

Above all, have fun and just enjoy the 'moments' with A. B.

Yeah, hope you're having a nice trip anyway, don't worry about our obsessive tendencies  :lol

... That early version of Little Pad - always been curious about that one!

Ask Mr. Boyd to contact bgas about getting his original acetate of the rejected single LP "In Concert" transferred properly.  ;D

Shouldn´t there be an update by now?

Pong and Alan entered the Capitol tape vault last tuesday.

They were never seen again..........

How about an update on what transpired?  Questions answered and mysteries solved?

Sigh....


What we mean to say is, are you having a nice time in L.A, Ponghit?

Just got back to Philadelphia — it was an amazingly productive, hectic, and fun week in LA — and Alan is the greatest.

I think during a quiet moment I would have probably farted and then giggled. It might have made it slightly awkward but would have been a funny memory.

 
Edit: Needed more scrolling afros.

Ah, you jammy sod - I wish I could go to L.A! Glad you had a good one.

I'll try to summarize my BB-related experiences from my trip to LA last week:

Mr. Boyd had messaged me about the Al Jardine record release show at The Roxy on Tuesday night, so I first met Alan there, and was immediately struck by what a sweet, modest, and down-to-earth guy he is. I was with a friend of Alan's who also introduced me to Adam Marsland, Nelson Bragg, Domenic Priore, Mark London, and others.

Alan arranged for us to visit his house on Thursday evening, around 7pm. On the way, we stopped for Indian takeout for dinner. Alan has a cool pad, a cool cat — and there's a gecko living in his house! (Its surface looks like it's encrusted in coarse salt with pepper added.) We chatted while we ate, talked about our mutual interests and mutual friends. I gave him a stack of CDs I had brought for him, and he returned the favor (commercial releases, not CD-Rs).

My memory for details is inconsistent, partly due to flu medications, jet-lag, and lack o' sleep for 2 weeks (not sure I was a great conversationalist), but here are some tidbits I remember:

• Regarding the recently-uncovered GV footage — Alan arranged for it to be acquired when it was discovered — there are 2 silent reels — includes Dennis singing lead.

• Despite the seemingly complete/exhaustive nature of TSS, Alan believes a lot of master tapes have disappeared from the vaults over the years.

• Good news — the band currently seems to be getting along well, especially and notably Brian & Mike.

• Alan's impersonations are indeed hilarious, and eerily accurate! Not just the voices, but mannerisms too; the man is multi-talented.

Then he said had prepared an iTunes playlist for me, consisting of 86 tracks. After the paramedics arrived to resuscitate my ticker, I geeked-out with his headphones and iPad for... a couple hours, I guess. Here are some specifics from my memories:

I believe the dates ranged from circa 1963, the 'Audree tapes,' to 1996, the S&S sessions. Many tracks were familiar titles — things like "Little Bird" with BGV & track (no lead), vocal-only of "Time To Get Alone," and "We're Together Again" with strings — but also many completely unreleased titles. I think all eras were represented, including solo Mike.

"Live Again" is as great as rumored, but not a departure from Dennis's style of the period. "Cuddle Up"/"Old Movie" (2 different tracks/takes) is possibly even moodier and more dramatic/emotional than "Live Again." "Little Red Book" is very cool. "My Solution" is a funny oddity, experimental and interesting — but rough, and ultimately not a terribly important part of the canon; understandably unreleased. Dennis's "Ecology," however, while also experimental and rough, I thought it was of more consequence. Another very cool thing that I hadn't known about is Dennis & Carl's "Barnyard" (no connection to the SMILE tune?). I thought Brian's lead on the 1974 "California Feeling" sounded so odd that I wasn't even sure it was him — Carl's later retake sounds 'right' to my ears. There was an aborted "2,000 Years" string intro/overture for Dennis's "Friday Nights" that contained dated, sitar-sounding elements. Dennis's piano demo of "Be With Me" is a great fly-on-the wall moment. "All Day, All Night" was a highly-repetitive mediation that became "Whistle In." Alternate version of "Add Some Music" is very good, different lyrics. "Walkin'" and "Where Is She?" are SUNFLOWER outtakes. The "Caroline, No" BGV from S&S sessions were shockingly gorgeous, and have a "My Prayer" vibe. And I remember a few live tracks: "Please Let Me Wonder" (1965?), "All I Want To Do," and "Wild Honey" (1972-'73?).

Overall impression: this batch of material demonstrates, once again, the dynamic and diverse body of work our favorite band created. But it requires the painstaking efforts of people like Alan and Mark Linett to mine the archives for nuggets of gold — and I'm convinced they have the BB's integrity in mind; that's their motivation. (The ENDLESS HARMONY film and HAWTHORNE comp. being just 2 examples.)

More specifically, based on this collection, I'm guessing most of the best of the unreleased early/'golden era' material has already been tapped — of course, I'd love to be wrong about this presumption. Aficionados of the later periods (post-SMILE), however, have a lot to look forward to if/when these things see the light of day.

Apparently the music I heard is being potentially considered for a proposed archive compilation, because he asked me which of the tracks stand-out as things that should definitely be released. And Alan is aware of this forum, of course, and reads it occasionally, so our input might have an influence, to an extent.

By this point, Alan's friend was exhausted, and so was I, it was a long night, so we split at about 1am. Alan walked with us out to the car — invited me back next time I'm in LA — and, while in the street, 'performed' a snippet of Jan interviewing Brian; a sidesplitting and perfect ending to an unforgettable night.

Thanks for sharing.  :)

I remember his Bruce imitation at a convention I went to! :D

Thanks a lot of sharing!

Sounds like you had a fantastic time and I'm entirely jealous of it all!

Ah, he didn't do Bruce for me. I'd think that would be more challenging, more subtle.

Surely was a fantastic time, and I'm very appreciative.

Got to hear a lot of cool stuff... :hat

Yeah, mon — it was a lot to digest so quickly — like gorging yourself at a buffet. A lot of details have already escaped me, and it was just last week.

Fantastic post, PongHit!

Wow, thanks for all that info Ponghit. And if you don't mind, could you give us some more details on "Where is She" or the 1974 "California Feelin'"? How "complete sounding" is "Where Is She"? Releasable? How does Brian sound on it? And with "California Feelin'", I know the vocal overall seemed weird to you, but overall was it a good performance? Would you consider this release worthy either? How about "All Day, All Night"? Is it SMiLE era or Smiley Smile era? Any other late '70s or early '80s Brian songs?


And most importantly, did Alan seem to be hopeful about these archive releases? Or at least hopeful that we'd get a nice chunk of unreleased material on the box set? Once again thank you so much for all the info!

Wow, god bless guys like Alan

They make it all possible

Totally agree.

And guys like Ponghit for sharing the love - thanks, Ponghit!

I took some notes on my phone to help me remember things. All I wrote about "Where Is She?" is that it was 2 & a half minutes, and was marked as an 'edit.' I guess it didn't knock me out, I don't really remember much else about it.

The track of the 1974 "California Feelin'" sounded OK to me, but BW's vocal sounded…. 'jokey,' if you know what I mean, like he was just laying it down for the lyrics, not even trying to sing it normally, so I guess maybe I wouldn't consider it good for a proper release.
 
 

Guess it must be SMILEY or it would have been on TSS, right?
 
 

Yeah, several rough LOVE YOU era things. Others too, but I'm not sure if Brian wrote them or not.



Can't really say, sounded to me like all these decisions were in-progress — not much decided for sure yet — only 'possible,' 'hopefully,' and 'maybe.'

For the first time in my life, I wish this was Facebook so I could press the 'LIKE' button on the above comment.

Thanks for the update and asking the GV film question. :)

Dennis singing lead, what could that be?
A part of GV? Or something different?

And it's cool to read your 'sober impression' (hope that was English) of Brian's 1974 "California Feelin'" demo lead
after it was described as one of his best leads on this board, as a deeply soulful gospel rendition.

Really good post, gets me feeling excited about a new cd. Sounds like they're not going for a boxset, but probably more of a Hawthorne volume 2 or something. Which is a shame. Though we keep hearing that all of the major stuff has been released, there always seems to be another 100 tracks down the pipe. Was "I'm Going Your Way" on there? That's a must release for me. "Sound of Free" should be reissued. Al's earlier version of "Santa Ana Winds" should be shortlisted as well. A deluxe 15 Big Ones is a release I'm really hoping for though, with the regular mix, Brian's original mix, and all the unreleased tracks from those sessions. There are still some good things that haven't been put out from Adult/Child and the piano demos that Brian did for Love You are essential imo.

If Alan stumbles on this post: I'm not really thrilled about instrumental/vocal only tracks. I don't mind them, but I don't think we need a Time To Get Alone vocal only track. I love the song don't get me wrong, but if it's in competition with any of the stuff mentioned above, I'd rather it be left off considering the backing vox is already isolated on the Hawthorne version of the song. Just based on things that have been booted, there's a enough unreleased songs and demos to make a pretty substantial release, and that's not even counting the stuff that only you have access to. If you're going to do a commemorative release just go all out, pedal to the metal don't hold anything back.

Maybe I'm misreading the info in this thread, but it'll be a shame if there isn't a full on reissue of all the albums. It's been over 10 years since the twofers last got issued. Beach Boys fans have honestly been lucky up until this point that the releases have been so economical, but I'm ready for some deluxe editions. I've been suggesting this for a while, but I still think the best way to go would be something like they did for T.Rex, where alternate albums were made, given different covers and titles and styled as sort of alternate reality could have been albums. The Beach Boys are just begging for that treatment.  Fans here are constantly resequencing albums, and it's no secret that a good number of BB albums didn't utilize the best songs available. Surf's Up could have been an easy 10/10 LP with some tweaks. C&TP and Holland could have been a killed double album as well. I call my version "Leaving This Town" and utilize live versions of Marcella, Leaving This Town, and a couple of others, it's really epic when assembled this way. Holland's only flaw imo was that it wasn't a double album, it was just too sprawling and gigantic to be contained on a single disc. 15 Big Ones could go from being one of the worst (in some people's opinion, not mine) albums to one of the best with a new mix and an alternate tracklist ditching the original songs in favor of stuff like "Sea Cruise". I'd also love to hear the final three albums before Dennis died presented in a new light, the earlier "Santa Ana Winds" makes me hopeful that much better LPs could have been prepared, and Mark should be allowed to go back to the masters and mix the things from scratch.

I'd love for something really creative like that to be done. The problem with The Beach Boys is that lots of the best material isn't upfront in the band's catalog. It's really hard for the average listener to break into them because appreciating a lot of the regular albums as released is hard, and it's only when you start getting a sense of what could have been that you have an ah-ha moment and figure out how awesome they are.

So, now we know that silent fil Dennis singing Good Vibrations exists. Now if we could just find the audio recording of it.

So that all sounds fucking cool as the proverbial. Hopefully the best stuff comes out! I am also intrigued by the Carl/Dennis 'Barnyard'. Did you have any notes for that?

What a great experience ponghit…

I'm greedy  -  I have no opinion about what they should release, as long as they do release stuff.  I trust folk like Boyd to make the right choices on our behalf, as it were - they're astute fans, we share the same cravings.

I'd love to hear a vocal only version of Time To Get Alone.

I'm under the impression both reels were shot during GV sessions, no other songs.
 


It's only my opinion — maybe I'd feel differently if I heard it again? BTW, the 1974 demo was also marked 'edit,' and there were 2 other versions with Carl on lead: 'remix, no drums,' and 'a cappella.'

I don't think any details of this nature have been decided upon. He did NOT say, 'Here's a batch of material we're building a release from.' In fact, at first he had forgotten to include "Live Again," and added it later, as one of the last things I heard that night — so obviously he just threw together the playlist that day, with no particular purpose in mind (except to generously entertain my ears).
 
 

No, unless it's also known by another title(?) But, again, that doesn't mean it wouldn't be considered for release — only that he didn't include it in this particular playlist.
 
 

I see your point, but some of them are priceless to me, and deserve a legit release.

I guess it's possible there never was an audio recording of Dennis attempting it; somewhere in the studio chatter on TSS they say they need to shut off the camera while recording audio.

I remember being impressed by it. It may not have been 100% polished/finished-sounding, but definitely struck me as releasable, for sure. In parentheses after the title it said, "Dennis & Carl." I think it was from 1974, and I think Alan told me Ricky was also involved somehow. I also think it has a mellow, slightly psychedelic vibe, and lyrically there is a pastoral theme, obviously. But, like I said, I couldn't discern any connection to the SMILE song with the same title.

'LIKE'

It's excellent, even among all the unreleased titles, this was a highlight for me — TTGA is one of my favorites — not just BB songs, but from anyone.

"I'm Going Your Way" has also been listed on bootlegs as "California Slide" so maybe that's how Alan had it. That's a great song that definitely should be considered for an archival release. I'm also more in favor of never before heard material being released over instrumental/vocal only tracks, but some are okay, because they do have value and help you see things in a different light.

I have to say I am probably most interested in demos, though. The Love You demos are great and the ones you mention from your listening session with Alan sound amazing. What I would like to see for an archival release is a mix of unreleased songs, demos and live tracks with a few choice instrumental/vocals only or sessions. The only thing that I wouldn't want on a release like this are remixes of already released tracks. Keep the "from the vaults" type releases that way and save the remixes for compilations or album re-releases. From a business perspective that probably makes more sense anyway, since it would give completists like us incentive to buy a hits-type package we wouldn't purchase otherwise.

Nope, the only 'Californias' I heard were the 3 'Feelings.'
 
 

The following is probably not all of the LOVE YOU stuff on the playlist, but from my notes:

"Lazy Lizzle" (Edit)
"Love Is A Woman" (1976 ruff - Al Lead)
"Marilyn Rovell" (1976 Ruff)
"Sherry She Needs Me (1976 Ruff)
"Solar System" (Track Only)
"We Gotta Groove" (Remastered)
"You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling" (1976 mix…)

Of those I would probably say that "Sherry" and "You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling" should make the cut for a release. The demo for "Airplane" is also pretty good. I'm in favor of highlighting demos from all eras though, not just Love You, but there's a lot from that period, so it's probably a good place to start.

Neat information!

About that GV studio film, two reels of silent film equals what we've seen excerpted so far: One instrumental session at Western, one vocal session at Columbia. The tidbit about showing Dennis singing lead on film is a neat tease: I always thought this was a put-on or something, with a related story about him not being able to sing it because he had a cold the day of the session...but if there is film of him cutting a lead vocal, was that the day of his cold? :-D Interesting stuff.

I was hoping we'd hear the origins of that film, namely why was it shot in the first place and what was it going to be used in or for? Promo clips, like the "firehouse" film?

And will there be any efforts to release the full reels of film? Hell, I'd pay money to see the full silent reels just as they are! Maybe that will happen soon. :)

Seconded - You Lost That Lovin' Feelin' is one of my fave BB unreleased tunes, such a great production.

Ponghit, that track sounds like a dream tbh - A Dennis and Carl collab in '74! Mellow, pastoral, slightly psychedelic! Ricky! And I'd never heard of it before, so always a plus.  ;D

My impression of "Barnyard" was that it was a bit bland compared to Dennis' other material from that period. Knowing it was a DW/CW collaboration from '74 might have had my expectations too high, and I haven't heard it in a few years so maybe I'd have a different opinion now. But hearing it for the first time along with things like "Holy Man" and "C*cktails", it seemed to pale in comparison.

Compared to "Holy Man", most things seem pale.  :) Just to be 100% sure: Denny never actually recorded any vocals for "Holy Man", right? Taylor Hawkins did the vocals according Gregg Jakobson's memories of Dennis singing some of it?

Right-ish. There was a snippet of Carl humming the melody line on the session tape...nothing usable, but between that and Dennis' piano and synth lines i think the melody was inherent. Gregg isn't really a melody guy, so that was sorted without his help...he did write the new lyrics. BTW...thinking back to "Barnyard"...I was hoping for something like the other 1974/75 period DW/CW collaborations "River Song", "Rainbows"...and yes "Holy Man" (there are those of us who feel Carl had a hand in that one too). When I heard "Barnyard" it didn't seem to come close to the dynamic quality of the others...and unreleased seemed like a logical place for it to be. I'm sure others might feel differently as music is so dang subjective...right board?

I feel exactly the same way.  This material is "gold" and I'm glad to see that it's being treated as the musical treasure that it is.

What a terrific experience for Ponghit!  Outstanding!

On the subject of Dennis, and if anyone is reading this who has influence on these things (as Alan has suggested), pleasepleaseplease just release Wouldnt It Be NIce To Live Again. Just let us hear it. Surely there's not a person here who wouldn't rush out immediately and buy ANY BB release that included it? I'm sure numerous casual BB fans/music fans would also once the WIBNTLA reviews appeared.  

It just has to be on one of those "commemorative releases" this year.... has to. I'll just go ahead and proclaim that by July/August each one of us has listened to it a few times.  :)

You say that, but then they chose to leave it off The Warmth Of The Sun didn't they! Why? Literally no-one can even begin to comprehend. The Beach Boys are a very exasperating group to be obsessed with - has there been another popular group in history who have so relentlessly kept such exceptional music hidden away from their fans in the vaults? It's madness! (After all, don't forget we've just had to wait 44 years for an (official) SMiLE release.

I completely feel the same way. One of my favorite songs period. I'd love to hear those backing vocals without music. Hopefully it will see release one day.

Totally random thing I just remembered: I was surprised that Alan didn't seem to know anything about the WALK HARD movie, and that Van Dyke had written a song for it, so I described the BW swipes in the flick, and the song, etc.

I would have taken him to Tommy's on Beverly/Rampart and asked for extra chili!

 :hat

Great movie. Just remembered that I still have to get it on DVD.  :3d

(http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lhx9sffa4O1qck446o1_400.jpg)

I really hope some of this stuff gets released before more fans literally die off. A good two-disc “Rarities” set would be a great start. I’m all for getting unreleased stuff any way we can, whether it’s scattered tracks on a new “boxed set”, or a nice rarities set, or bonus tracks on album reissues, or maybe even finally getting the “BB Central” potential downloads site up and running. I really hope we get a nice concentration on 70’s and 80’s (and even 90’s) stuff. There is just so much available, just in terms of what we know about. When you factor in potential stuff we don’t even know about, then the prospects are even more exciting.

If Alan Boyd is reading this by any chance, can you tell me anything more about the new footage of the 7/4/80 Washington DC show seen in the 50th Anniversary tour TV ads? That bit of “California Girls” is tantalizing. An uncut version of this show, or even any additional footage, is, as I mentioned in another thread, my weird idiosyncratic holy grail for BB unreleased material! I realize few other fans have this type of fervor for this particular show.

Don't think Alan nor the others know the answer to that.

Don't forget to pay.......  ;D

As part of an album, agreed about it being unreleased, at the time. But I think it's cool enough for an archival, 'oddities'-type collection. Maybe it's not as dynamic as some other things, but it sounded like there was a lot of work done on it — something 'solid' about it — not just a quick, rough demo/sketch of an idea.

I didn't pay the first few times I saw it.  :-D That's why I want to get the DVD and make it right.  :angel:

Reminds me, I still haven't ordered/watched the Brian Wilson: Songwriter 1962 - 1969-DVD...   :-\ Jeez, Brian...

I love that DVD — it's all about music, no drama.

First, thanks for your report !

Regarding "Barnyard", is that what is called "Barnyard blues" (iirc) in the article featured in "Back to the Beach" by Kingsley Abott ?




Never paid for it ? Not once.....?

Ha, beachboyscentral - the day that becomes active the internet will explode...

Well, once. I should've studied for an exam but instead had a few and watched Walk Hard. I paid the day after.

hahaha !!
Still i wonder if you noticed what I was trying to refer to..... "Never paid for the drugs....not once"

Got ya.  ;D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6DXj_7ae0Y

"Learn to play the f*ckin' theremin!"

You mean there's more footage than what was broadcast on HBO back in '80?  Wheresthatat?

I can almost hear WIBNTLA in my head...at least the vocals, not the track...I can hear Denny singing it...is there any backing vocals to it? It'd be great if Blondie/Ricky were on it? The vocal I have in my head is much like his sensitive vocals in Be Still, A Time to Live in Dreams, and Cuddle Up.

Carl and Brian sing backgrounds. The lead vocal is the best one Dennis ever did IMO...including some soulful runs that will make you think its Carl for a second, but its Dennis.

Yep, there’s a brief discussion of it on another thread, I think the one about a TV commercial that is up on YouTube. It’s literally a few seconds of footage from 7/4/80. It’s synched up to the 60’s recording, but it’s definitely the band singing “California Girls.” I had asked, I believe, Alan Boyd probably a decade ago if the uncut footage of the show still existed in the BB vaults, but back then it apparently wasn’t there; they only had the 60-minute edit of the show. But they found something, and it’s in that TV commercial. It’s the same pro-shot angles as seen in the rest of the extant footage.

My weird BB footage holy grail is the whole show, but I know that even if they found some or all of the missing footage, I’ll likely never see it.

Sounds amazing!!!

Hmm. About them both being marked "edit"....were they both basically "complete" songs? How about "Little Red Book"? Was that the same one that's been circulating? Apparently from the Friends era? And the Carl sung "California Feelin'", that was the same version from the L.A. (Light Album) sessions? Same speed as the one that's circulating? And what about "Old Movie"? I know that was supposedly a catch-all title for a few of Dennis' songs from the early '70s era. Is it a totally different song from "Cuddle Up"?

I feel so thankful that you are being so cool about sharing what you remember. It's really cool of you. And hopefully we get to hear some of this stuff soon.

I heard a later version of "California Feeling" once with a Brian vocal that I believe was from '78.  i don't think I had heard the one from '74...very cool!  The '78 one had a hysterical moment where he's singing "it was such a beautiful day" and he interjects quickly in spoken voice..."like most days!"  Clearly, not that interested in delivering a releasable vocal...

Wasn't some of this stuff played at Boyd's "listening party" at his house after the Carl Wilson Walk in L.A.? The one where some Effwad absconded with some of the tapes? I recognize a few things that have been booted......

I know a few were played at a Connecticut Beach Boys fan convention, such as "Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again".

I wasn't at that one but I went to a few of the other ones later ( 05 and 07). Those were great. A shame that they stopped.

Time for one in California again.

Sounded complete to me, yes.  Sorry I can't really answer your other questions; I'm not up to speed on what's circulating, and I'm not an expert on these things.

Alan told me about a cassette being stolen from a party, then turned into a bootleg.

Brian singing "California Feelin'" in 1978....hmmm. Was that line as far as he got with it? Or did he sing the complete song? How did he sound? Assuming he was disinterested, he probably didn't sound too great.

See, if WIBNTLA was an unreleased Brian song/vocal everyone here would be going nuts - yet instead the whole discussion seems to have just been dropped and we've moved on to something else... Maybe this is why some of his stuff, no matter how good, still isn't seeing the light of day. Makes me think of that Jon Stebbins comment in the BBC Dennis doc: 'If River Song had been a Brian production people would've been going crazy!'

Actually you're misquoting him, and normally I wouldn't give a fig but I find what he actually said really funny...


'If River Song had come out with a 'produced by Brian Wilson' credit, people would have died!'

Stebbins = OnTheeMoney  ;D

There has been no mention of this in all the publicity. Only a new boxed set and some other, unspecified commemorative releases.

I don't want to be a Phil Cohen here, but it really doesn't look like what you're proposing is in the cards. I agree it would be a great project, but I think the CD market is basically dead, and the demand for BB catalog albums (as opposed to the hits and the singular exception of Pet Sounds) has always been pretty weak.

I wasn't aware that River Song or POB were lacking in critical or fan acclaim.

But I thought, er, the way he put it was quite... well... at least I thought it was... y'know, funny, and... I'll get me coat.


Plus, critical/fan acclaim aside, you weren't able to buy the damn thing for 25+ years!

I believe that is incorrect. If you've been around Beach Boys message boards long enough, you would have seen many, many threads concerning unreleased and alternate versions of Beach Boys and solo tracks in the archives. Brian, Dennis, whomever. And "Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again" has always been at the top or near the top of those wish lists for many years. So has Bambu. So has Smile. So has a Beach Boys live box. Dennis Wilson music is still as popular as ever in the Beach Boys fan community. The Sony Legacy POB/Bambu sales was pretty good, huh?

Extremely puzzled as to why "WIBNTLA?" has taken so long to release, sounds spectacular. Was it just a matter of waiting for the right time? Hopefully that time being an archiving release for the 50th anniversary? ^_^


This has to be heard. It sounds too good. And for those in power paying attention, no editing/trickery as with a lot of recent releases - with the "like most days!" ad-lib, please :)

Same goes for the '74 demo, as well as the Carl-sung late 70s take. There are so many versions of this song, and it sounds like they were all a bit compromised in one way or another - shame, as it's a pretty decent song. The Carl take is the best I've heard and, from the sounds of it, the best out there.

I really hope the version of Little Bird with track + BGV gets released this year along with any other unbooted late 60's rarities.  If we can't get stereo versions of Smiley Smile/Wild Honey it would be nice to hear some more outtakes from that period.

And there's a demo of Be With Me?  Maddening how many of these things are sitting in the vault unheard.  They really should make a collection of just demos.  Release them on iTunes or something.

He sang the whole thing.  Disinterested would be a good way to be put it.

Record companies would rather not waste the time releasing stuff there wouldn't be a big market for. Beachboyscentral would be the place. Let people have the option of what songs, file types, bit rates, etc of all the "unmarketable" stuff.

I'm sure if we yell loud enough we can get some demos released but in the same vein as Hawthorne, CA, where there's different versions of songs we've already heard, sprinkled with the good stuff like A Time To Live In Dreams.

PROVE ME WRONG, BROTHER, CAPITOL, CARIBOU, BRIMEL, WHOEVER ELSE IS LURKING HERE READING MY WORDS.

Jon - I'd be interested to hear your opinion of Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again. Does it stand up against Dennis' best work? Worth all the hype?

Was WIBNTLA prepared for release when the Surf's Up DVD-A was being readied? I know it didnt really materialize, but just wondering how far it went.




Also, I think WIBNTLA would be a fantastic ending to the Surf's Up album rather than SU, ( I know I'm gonna get linched for that.) But it works so well...just as well as a Day in the  Life of a Tree is a great predecessor to Til' I Die through a life/death through nature, WIBNTLA would be such a good follow up to Til I Die, it just makes since...and to me, it's like a response song to Brian and Til' I Die...just like Long Promised Road is meant for Brian (from Carl). I do see how Surf's Up is a great follow up song to Til I Die as well, but perhaps it coulda had a different place in the scattered Smile history.

I'm not Jon, but I can say without a shadow of a doubt that it stacks up with Dennis best work and is one of the most awesome unreleased BB tracks I've ever heard. Forget the "Golden Slumbers" comparison, that's misleading. It is staggeringly, majestically wonderful. IMHYEO.  ;D

Well the hype started many years ago after a few of us got to hear it, and then started hyping it. So I'm one of the initial hypers. My take has always been that its a beautiful song, great lyric, great production, cool arrangement etc... Too good to be unreleased considering  the material that made BB's LPs in 71/72...this blows many of them (not all) out of the water. But that said, the one thing that REALLY sets WIBNTLA apart from the herd...the lead vocal is simply the best one Dennis ever sang. Yes he's great on Slip On Through, Forever, Barbara...there are some great Dennis leads that are out there...but WIBNTLA is the best of them all in my opinion. He just sings the crap out of it, and upon hearing it you really understand that he had a voice that (for a brief period and in its own way) was as good as his brothers.

Reading this thread was a bad idea. I am getting an itch that ain't gonna be scratched anytime soon.  :'(

Quite a few years before "Barbara" was released on the Endless Harmony CD, the song was circulating amongst collectors, albeit in inferior sound quality compared to the released version. Another one that I always wished could be released was "I've Got A Friend", which was on the first live bootleg album I ever picked up in the 70's, BB Madison Sq. Garden '72 (which was actually Princeton University). Anyway, the studio instrumental track supposedly exists to the song, but unfortunately Dennis never put down a vocal for it. Not sure if more than one live version exists, but it would be nice to have it cleaned up and included on a live comp.

Dunno if it was ever considered to pull a "Taylor Hawkins" and have him (or someone else) do a vocal for that, but I'd hate to see that track go to waste. Song reminds me a lot of "Barbara" and I think Dennis even wrote it for Barbara, didn't he?

The first time I ever heard WIBNTLA my reaction was "now the SURF'S UP album makes sense."  It really is kind of the missing link for that whole project, to my ears. 

Indeed it does, and it's a killer track.

Plus 4th of July and Lady, minus a couple like Student Demonstration Time, Take Good Care of Your Feet, and Don't Go Near the Water. Could've easily been a classic.  Real shame.

The group were in the habit of recording their shows at this point - does anyone know if a live recording of I've Got A Friend is in the vaults? I know it was done on Radio Luxembourg (the boot is awful quality, though), so there's a potential SBD source that I know of...

Hasn't this been booted? I have it somewhere. It's the alternate take vocals, though.

I'm fond of replacing SDT with the live version of Riot from Big Sur Folk Festival 1970.

Not sure, but I've heard a track-only recording.

I'm not sure if Dennis wrote I've Got A Friend for Barbara, but I would assume he did. I have one version(I'm not sure where it's from) where near the end, Dennis starts saying "I love Barbara" over and over again, almost like a chant. He also refers to the song as being about his best friend.

I can't believe that 40 years after it was recorded we're still waiting for a release of WIBNTLA!! If it really is as good as those lucky enough to have heard it say it is, I just can't get my head around how it could have sat on the shelf for all this time. I dare not think just how great a song that apparently blows much of the "Surf's Up" material outta the water could possibly be.

Get The Boot I bet!

Regarding Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again, didn't somebody on this board once say that the "final" version is missing lead guitar?

I remember reading that there was a very simple two or three note "place holder" guitar solo which was probably intended to be replaced.

Correct.  We dropped that in our version.  Bend on a minor 3rd to the root, 3 notes, 3-2-1, over and over again, for about 16 bars.  Classic Carl.

Well thanks for hyping the hype, Jon. Now I really want to hear it!

Don't get overly excited about Live Again...I mean, yes, it's Dennis's best vocal and features a superb arrangement and production, but it's not a universal panacea for all human diseases or a source of free energy.

Nevertheless, there is much to like.  I think the vocal is the big draw--completely agree with Jon there.  It shows a range and sensitivity that is hinted at but always slightly cloaked elsewhere.

The production and arrangement is sort of a synthesis of everything that is great about the Desper Home Studio era.  It's just a deep production, with shimmering pianos, gurgling synths, subtle guitar work, and yes--jazz flute.  If you were sitting around boasting about your engineer or your arranging chops, this is the track you'd bring out to prove you're the best in town.

Geez, can one of you collectors out there please put together a nice Dennis collection of whatever hasn't turned up on POB/Bambu? All this foreplay is killing me...

How would it compare to, say, Brian's vocal on the early version of Oh Darlin'? I'm not saying that Brian's vocal is necessarily a bad one. He just phrases the words in an odd way. Long *a-GO* a *DREAM* kept *re-aCURR-ING*, *feel-INGS* deep *with-IN* my *HEART* were *stirr-ING*, etc.

He's right - I've reconsidered. It's nothing much really. Can't think what possessed me to think it was so incredible. Duh.

A random P.S. to this — I visited Alan's house again several months later, and while chatting I asked if he'd seen this — he hadn't:

http://youtu.be/GYBjOywJwLI?t=5m19s (http://youtu.be/GYBjOywJwLI?t=5m19s)

Whew, Grade A course in pot calling kettle black!

Many thanks, hadn't seen that either.

That video has been posted maybe a dozen times in the last year

Yeah John. How dare you miss something!

I for one feel that my faith in Mr Manning has been utterly destroyed.

I'm not even sure how John could show his face here again.

Oh boy… see me blush… I must have been changing a nappy, or WORKING or somethin'…  :lol

But here, by way of sorry, and making up – I bet this is new on everyone, yeah, I just came across it tomorrow but thought I'd share it early:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-0CS-T1HUQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-0CS-T1HUQ)

Did anyone mention the tracklist for the 6CD box btw, or that it's being released on August 27? I found it here exclusively:

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,15498.msg363268.html#msg363268 (http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,15498.msg363268.html#msg363268)

Did anyone mention striped shirts?

Me n' Boyd hadn't seen it. I must keep good company.



;D

Apparently, Spector will have one last shot at appealing his murder conviction: http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2013/03/18/phil-spector-s-last-chance.html (http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2013/03/18/phil-spector-s-last-chance.html)  Also, the entire Spector documentary can be seen here: http://youtu.be/90zip4w_ICU (http://youtu.be/90zip4w_ICU)

But anyway, to bring this thread back on-topic: yes I listened to more music slated for MIC when I returned to Alan's house in November — by then the project was in-progress, and had been structured into five iTunes playlists on his computer. Some of it struck me as mediocre and forgettable, like a song that was used in a movie soundtrack (it was song #1 on a playlist, and I commented to Alan that it didn't seem like a strong way to open a CD). Of course lots of very cool material too — I won't ruin your day with spoilers, but there were some great surprises, including one very memorable tune from the FRIENDS sessions.

It's a Beautiful Day or Chasin' the Sky?

Can't be either of them because anyone with a brain knows they don't belong on a career retrospective

I dunno, they are both good songs (IMO) that are currently unavailable to purchase and one of them has never been on any official Beach Boys album. Of course it could actually be Happy Endings...

I don't think they're terrible songs or anything, but with only 6 discs available to fill with the best hits and rarities by the Beach Boys I don't think those songs fit into either category.

Well I presume he wasn't referring to Girls on the Beach so how many options are there?

Almost Summer (a Beach Boys version?)
It's a Beautiful Day
Chasing the Sky
Happy Endings
Make it Big (movie mix)
Still Cruisin'
Problem Child

I think you should start praying it was It's a Beautiful Day or Chasing the Sky!  :-D

Actually I love "Still Cruisin", song and the album.

I have no problem with that being on the box set  ;D

I don't remember much about the song that was in a movie, but I think it was 1980s, maybe.

I like both Chasing the Sky and Beautiful Day. So win-win for me.

As that is a moderately famous song (and was a late release and so wouldn't be first song an any disc) it's a long shot though.

It's a Beautiful Day should be on the album as it is pretty rare, an original and better than most of the album tracks of that time.

As Chasing the Sky was written by someone else it wouldn't bother me if it were left off the album but that all depends on what other material is available. It's better than crappy covers like Da Doo Ron Ron and At The Hop for example.

So Ponghit, good fellow, can you say is the MIC project more a "career retrospective" or rather a "deep cuts anthology w/ some hits".
I, of course, am hoping for the LATTER!

This one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8YGsoG-12g

Or this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DI-Lway3bdM

Sound is a little too slow on the second one.

See, I disagree. First off, the long version of It's A Beautiful Day has never been on any official CD and Chasin' The Sky has never been on a released CD at all, AFAIK. To me, both are rare and should be included. Both songs are part of their career, so how you figure different is beyond me.

Of course it is possible that Mike recorded a lead vocal for his Bop Bop on the Beach from Karate Kid...  :-D

They're both rare, and both part of their career, but neither are actually much good. Personally, I'd far rather the decisions for the box set were made on artistic quality rather than just representativeness. Unlike Shady, however, I don't think it's reasonable to disagree with me.

It really depends what this box set is about.

If it's a best of retrospective with some deep cuts thrown in then they shouldn't be included simply because they're not good enough.

If the box set's about getting all possible rarities on CD, quality not withstanding then I guess they should be. My point is those songs are bearable but IMO have no business being on the box set. Ok they are rare but are also pretty awful, again just my opinion.

That's fair enough but I wonder how many rare songs there are in the vaults that are better than these 2. When people were nominating their favourite songs from the wilderness era recently It's a Beautiful Day was regularly mentioned and it is often suggested when the topic of what should have been on LA (despite being recorded later) comes up. I just don't know how many better original unreleased songs there will be from the wilderness era.

Not sure what you mean by 'the wilderness era' -- what you're counting -- but just off the top of my head, unreleased 1975-1996 tracks that deserve inclusion ahead of those:
Sherry She Needs Me
Life Is For The Living
Looking Down The Coast
Lines
It's Trying To Say
Santa Ana Winds (early version)
Soul Searchin'
You're Still A Mystery
Everybody Wants To Live
Marilyn Rovell

And that's not counting things like live versions, alternative versions, covers, demos, unbooted tracks, solo tracks...

Don't like "It's a beautiful day" very much. But it seems Mike likes it and that's why he used part of it for "Beaches in mind"

Are Soul Searchin' or You're Still a Mystery available for this collection though? Obviously if they are they should be included.

Those early lyrics to Santa Ana Winds are atrocious unfortunately.

Al has said in interviews in the past how unhappy he was with the BBs version of Looking Down the Coast. Who knows whether he would veto it.

Sherry She Needs Me, Marilyn Rovell (would Brian want that included?) and Everybody Wants to Live are all desperately mediocre.

It's Trying to Say and Lines I would like to see included though.

Why does Carl's "Where we are" never get attention.

That song is criminally underrated even among hardcore fans

"Sherry She Needs Me" is great!

"Soul Searchin'" and "You're Still A Mystery" are very good too.

And I've always really liked "It's Trying To Say" (Baseball). Especially this time of year.

I'd just like better quality recordings of both. The boots sound terrible to my ears. My best versions of each are my own needle drops.

I'd also add "Go and Get That Girl" to that list.

Was this only recorded as a Christmas song by the song by the BBs? It's a nice pop song on the Celebration album but as it was written by Ron Altbach rather than the group it wouldn't bother me if it wasn't included.

If they completed the recording of Sad, Sad, Christmas then that might be interesting but possibly it was omitted from the expanded Christmas CD for a reason.

Maybe both? It's safe to assume the big hits will be represented, no? And there will be a 'bonus' disc, comparable to the 1993 box that MIC is apparently destined to 'replace.'

Might have been this one, I wasn't paying close attention to it — tended to spend more brain-power on 1960s/70s material.  Gotta say: I'm surprised you guys seem so interested in a lackluster '80s track instead of a FRIENDS outtake.

I WANT THAT FRIENDS OUTTAKE.

The 1980s outtakes can be ignored for the box. The released stuff was already bad enough.

Not at all. It will be great to have a Friends outtake.

It's just easier to do a Sherlock job on the movie themes as there are so few of them.

Mark London posted a link to "It's a Beautiful Day" on his FB page within the last day or two. I'd wager that's the track being discussed.

Except Stevie! I feel like this would be a perfect place to get it released (and maybe the last?), deserves to be heard in master-tape quality, has a pretty good Brian lead, catchy melody that BB fans could identify with....,

Damn, I forgot about that one. I want that one on the box set! ;D

I wonder how much of oh lord was finished for the 1985 album.

I wonder what And I Always Will sounded like in 1985 too.

If so then presumably disc 5 would stretch from this song through to TWGMTR (with disc 6 being the aforementioned 'bonus' disc). If that's the case, then probably half of the songs on this disc would have to be unreleased (or live recordings) as there can't be more than 12-14 singles or album tracks from this era that merit being included on the box set. Sounds promising.

Wasn't there a version of "Go and Get That Girl" floating around that was stripped down (no horns) and had Carl singing lead? Almost like a demo? Maybe for MIU? I know I had it on a bootleg cassette I picked up at a record convention back in the 90's. Maybe it was just an outfake? Anyone else know about this?       

The version with Carl on lead I have does have the horns. It sounds like a scratch vocal though, rather than a proper vocal take.

Hmm, a Friends outtake? Sounds interesting. How about anything Brian related from Sunflower through 1974? That's what I'm hoping for. Any goodies you know of?

Bonghit, what's the story with Back Home '63? They can't find a better copy than what's been booted or they can't fix the existing one to be presentable enough for release?

Or even the unfinished Back Home '70 session would be neat to have released.

just to be clear, the Friends outtake is an alternate mix of Little Bird sans lead vocs ...correct?

BRING IT.

I was about to say exactly this. I have a hard time comprehending how much interest there is in the '80s era around here. I mean, really? I guess these things come and go in waves and things fall in and out of vogue, the pendulum swings back and forth, but gosh, i can't even sit through the entirety of any of the songs mentioned in the last page of this thread.

I love "Go and Get That Girl" and "Where We Are" ... and "Stevie" is a stone-cold classic. If they find anything from Brian and/or Dennis from 81-83, that would be great to include, even if the quality isn't great ... it's history, and a strange, under-documented period for the group.

This one?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjh0gVc3urQ

If this were all they had then I wouldn't really see the point of including it on the box set as it is essentially Carl singing somebody else's song and not singing it terribly well.

It's A Beautiful Day is pretty damn good. However, It's A New Day is friggin' brilliant!! An absolutely cracking Dennis song, and a tremendous Blondie lead. Definately worthy of an official release.

Each to their own like, but I'm kind of bemused why they kept returning to this song...it's just 'meh'. Bottom of the '15 big ones' pile for me, and would have sucked SOOO badly on Sunflower.

Is the Friends outtake a different version of a track already released, or a new track altogether? Based on a previous post you'd made, I'd assumed the Friends outtake is My Little Red Book.

I would take ANYTHING new from the Friends period.

Vocally it's my favorite Beach Boys era

Perhaps the soundtrack tune is Skatetown USA?    ;)

Or maybe California Beach will make it onto the box set...

Well... don't forget the band did use the intro for "Skatetown/California Beach" to begin "It's OK" on the C50 tour...   maybe they were dropping a not-so-subtle hint??

Oh really? I didn't realize that. I'd only heard em live once and not heard anything live since!

I'd like to hear that

Yeah that little intro riff led into "It's OK" last year.  I knew I heard the riff before but it took me a while to place it where it was from.

Don't know what is Brian-related, nor what's being considered for release, but I listened to these:

"This Whole World" - track only - 1970 Sunflower
"This Whole World" - vocals only - 1970 Sunflower
"Walkin'" (edit) - 1970 Sunflower
"Where Is She?" (edit) - 1970 Sunflower
"Trader part 2" track w/ bgs - 1972 Holland
"Lucy Jones" - 1974

Not sure, but I listened to these:

"Back Home" AL 1 REMASTER
"Back Home" AL 2 REMASTER
"Back Home" (lead 4 - Al & Mike)

Not correct, although I did hear the track/bgs "Little Bird" and loved it.

That's not what I was referring to, but I heard "Red Book."

They've been using that intro, which I love, since at least 2004.  I really miss the faster-paced tempo this used to have when performed live just a few years ago.  For some reason, the tempo was slowed down, perhaps to match the album version's tempo.  But to my taste, it kind of makes it drag.  And I'm talking about one of my favorite BB songs here.

It's something I didn't know existed until I heard it — it was a very pleasant surprise — and don't wanna ruin it for you guys.

You realize that everyone reading this thread WANTS you to ruin it for us, right?

Nothing perks my day up more than a good old fashioned surprise ruining  ;D

Phrasing!

What were your thoughts on Where Is She?

First of all, thank you for your posts in this thread. Secondly, c'mon, man!!! Just put a spoiler alert on it and then let the people who want to be spoiled....be spoiled!

Ponghit, are you talking about the '63 or '70 (or '76) version of the song?  I'm assuming by Al, you're talking about the '70 version. Brian sang the '63 version. Sure would like to hear a higher quality clean copy of that one.

Mmm. That's what I'm talkin' about! I can't wait to hear "Where Is She?" and I know "Lucy Jones" isn't supposed to be great, but whatever, I really hope it's on there. What were your thoughts on these?

Sounds promising.

Is it "Our Happy Home?"

If we get most of the stuff that PongHit has heard, I am totally fine with the box set. As long as I get to hear "Where Is She?", the 1974 version of "California Feelin'", and "(Wouldn't It Be Nice To) Live Again" I will be totally happy. Anything else will be a bonus.

Anyways, I don't know about the rest of you guys, but it seems like PongHit has a decently detailed list of what he listened to. I know I wouldn't mind if he told us more about what he listened to. I don't think it would ruin anything for me. If anything, it would make me even more excited to hear this stuff.

seriously. tell us more about this Friends outtake. WE'RE BEGGIN' YA!!!

Yes please! We'll see the tracklist long before we have the box, so its not like you're spoiling anything. Just a title.

For those of us thirsting for boxset news, you're the one clutching a bottle of the old metaphorical.

Now i'm excited! Is it a cover or an original?

I like this delayed gratification thing. :)

Oh my now we can make alternative-Friends track lists.
"What if the Beach Boys had released their vibraphone version of Surfin' Bird on Friends on place of Be Still or Anna Lee? I bet you it would've been a smash I tell you :old!"

Hopefully we see something which is not Little Red Book. Could it be Mona Kani? :p

I'm guessing a cover…

me too...a Beatles cover.

I hope the Friends outtake is this one:

http://youtu.be/7Wu6QLpaJsI (http://youtu.be/7Wu6QLpaJsI)

Oh god. I hope not

By the way, what does "Lucy Jones" sound like anyways? Is it mostly Kalinich singing, or does Brian have a substantial part? Also, is it just backed by a piano, or is the more to the track? And lastly, how would you rate the song? Worthwhile at all?

It's gonna be their version of the Love - McCartney classic "Back in the U.S.S.R." which was just freshly written in India

 ;D

Since we're talking what rarities should or should not be put on the box set, "what if" they asked you which rarities you'd want but you can only have one rarity or outtake per album? What would you'd pick from Surfin Safari all the way to That's why God made the Radio? I'm making my list right now!

Apparently it's terrible, with Brian in full-on guttural voice.

Mostly Kalinich singing, mostly piano.  It's a nice enough song.

I'm not sure there are unreleased songs from each album but...

1962 - Gonna Hustle You, Beginning of the End, Visions
1963 - Thank Him, Back Home
1965 - I Can't Get No Satisfaction
1967 - Game of Love
1968 - Mona Kanau,
1969 - Walkin', Where is She
1970 - My Solution
1971 - It's a New Day, Wouldn't it be Nice to Live Again
1972 - Burlesque???, Carry Me Home, Out in the Country
1973 - Dr. Tom???
1974 - California Feeling, Earthquake Time???
1976 - Glow Crescent Glow, Gold Rush???, 10,000 Years???, That Special Feeling
1977 - How's About a Little Bit, It's Trying to Say, Lines, Sad Sad Christmas???
1978 - Viggie
1979 - California Beach, Goin to the Beach???,
1981 - Bucks???, Stevie, Sweetie???
1985 - Oh Lord???, And I Always Will???
1994 - Wish???
1995 - Soul Searchin', You're Still a Mystery
1996 - California Saga
2012 - The unfinished stuff, She Believes in Love Again

How disappointed am I going to be when the tracklisting is announced?  :-D

You'd choose Viggie over I'm Begging You Please, Where We Are or the BBs  version of Looking Down The Coast ?

Viggie is a classic.  :-D

Being serious though, Viggie sounds like a proper, completed song. Professionally produced and sung. Some people may hate it but it does sound at least finished. Where We Are would be ok to include as well if they are considering solo stuff for the same reason.

I'm Beggin you Please would be fine if they are including demos but some of Brian's vocals are...eccentric.  :)

I think I said before that in an interview Al stated how unimpressed he was with the original version of Looking Down the Coast and I can see why. A good song let down by wheezing production and Brian's vocals.

I think, from looking at AGD's site, there was some work done on a studio version. How complete that is I have no idea...

I'm not gonna do every album, but anyways.....

Surfer Girl: "Back Home"
Summer Days (And Summer Nights!!): "Sandy, She Needs Me"
Pet Sounds: "Trombone Dixie"
Smiley Smile: "Good News" (??)
Wild Honey: "Surf's Up"
Friends: "Our Happy Home" (??)
20/20: "Old Folks At Home/Old Man River"
Sunflower: "Where Is She?"
Surf's Up: "H.E.L.P. Is On The Way"
Carl and the Passions "So Tough": "Rooftop Harry"
15 Big Ones: "Come To The Sunshine"
L.A. (Light Album): "California Feelin'"
Keepin' The Summer Alive: "Boys And Girls"
The Beach Boys: "Water Builds Up"
That's Why God Made The Radio: "I'd Go Anywhere"

You'd rather hear the 1978 version of California Feelin' than the 1978 version?! The latter is nothing special. I actually prefer Brian's 2002 version.

No, no. I'd much rather have the 1974 version. But I don't really feel that the 1974 sessions really correlated with an album period, so I didn't include it. I suppose I coulda put "California Feelin'" '74 as my pick for 15 Big Ones, but I kinda feel that those are really different eras.

Yeah, good point....got what you meant now.

They wouldn't listen to me because the stuff I desire the most is mostly Blondie, Ricky, or Dennis related and none of those guys have a horse in this race.
:(

Most of all I want decent quality releases of "Hard Times", "It's A New Day", "Wouldn't It Be Nice (To Live Again)", "We Got Love", etc.

Beyond that, I'd love for them to include the stuff everyone always brings up like the later day "In The Back Of My Mind", "California Feelin'", etc.

"Hard Times" could never make the box set....for obvious reasons  >:D

I'm pretty sure he means the Blondie/Ricky tune "Hard Times" and not Brian's 1974 song "Brian's Tune" aka "Rollin' Up To Heaven" aka dirty "Ding Dang".

"Alley oop, f*** her. Big tits" indeed...

Ahh..

Well let's hope dirty ding dang makes the cut

Indeed.

I remember talk of a more complete Walk on By a number of years ago - hopefully that will make it in the set.

No - I wanna hear the 1978 version !  ;D

Agreed. I'd rather see Viggie make the box then any of the songs mentioned above. Viggie is one of the very best things Mike has ever done - it's up there with Big Sur in terms of his solo songwriting.

Looking Down The Coast is... meh. I'm Begging You Please equally so (i hate this way Brian's unreleased songs are taken as being more worthy of release than anyone else's, regardless of quality or whether they were recorded during a period in which Brian's mojo was largely absent.) Where We Are is pretty good, but not a patch on Viggie. And Carl sounds constipated on the chorus backing vocals.

no more than Had To Phone Ya and It's OK making the cut despit being mostly recorded in 1974 along with Cal Feelin'

In my case, I genuinely like that song (though I've no idea how a completed studio version would sound). I've always had a soft spot for Brian in girl-group mode -- I love stuff like I Sleep Alone, as well, even though that's not very good by any reasonable standards.

 :o :o

This just jumped to the top of my dreams for MIC

Brian's demo for "Almost summer" is absolute magic to me. I'd love if they included that.


There are quite some songs that were officially released but never got on an album and are not available anymore. Single mixes/versions but also songs like the studio version of "We got love" (even if that was just an accident) and songs from soundtracks etc. I'd like to have those on the set. A few years ago we did a 2 disc compilation with that concept for Brian's solo career on the german Beach Boys board and it's a nice listen.

If "Celebrate the News" isn't on the tracklist I'm going to be pissed. That song is monstrous!

"Had To Phone Ya" is from 1973 I'm pretty sure, where it was originally recorded for American Spring.

It's a nice song but I'm not sure there would be 'that' much point in it being on the box set. It's already available on CD and there are several unreleased Dennis songs I am sure we would all much rather have.

Aside from the obscure and long out-of-print Rarities CD, where else is this song available? I don't think anywhere, and it is the very definition of a criminally underrated deep cut that deserves its place on the box set with its less thrilling A-side.

IIRC the Spring version is a different track than the 15 Big Ones version. I think the latter was recorded during the 15BO-sessions







On the easily available Friends/20/20 twofer

Totally agree. Unreleased stuff please.
Modify:
Thought it was on Amazon for download but is not.

Oh right! Derp.

Less thrillinng A side. You think Break Away is less thrilling that Celebrate The News? I've always really liked CTN, but I definitely don't think it's "more thrilling than Break Away".  That's why Break Away was released as the "A side" of the single back in '69.

I wonder with MIC how many songs they can pick form the 1960s to make it significantly different to the 1993 box set. I guess there will be less Smile stuff this time and there probably should be fewer Pet Sounds songs (as we all have them). From the other albums Lonely Sea, Hawaii, Let Him Run Wild, Kiss Me Baby etc. could be used this time I guess. And maybe Bluebirds Over the Mountain (including this and other 'foreign' hits would save them from having to make another bonus disc for the U.K. market as they did in 1993). But as there can't be 'that' many unreleased songs, could this be the first compilation (apart from Best of the Brother Years) where less than half of the material comes from the 1960s?

I hope so, Nicko. Gah...I'm just hoping CF74 makes the cut!

Please lawds, juss CF74 and WIBNTL, and I'll die a heppy man.

I do think so, yes. If even only the coda to "Celebrate The News" existed, I'd still prefer that -- and I do very much like "Breakaway" (though truth be told, I prefer the solo Brian demo or the alt. version where Brian sings the first verse to the single version).

I'm hoping they'll include the Beach Boy portion of SeventyTwoVote in Full Dimensional Stereo. I only have the mono one. Is there a disco version available? ;)

Yup - recorded during the 1972/3 Iowa sessions.

Still astounds me. Those synths sound so much closer to Love You than anything else before or since the record. I was convinced it was part of the 1977 American Spring sessions for quite a while.

You're not alone, Dr. I think Celebrate The News is unbelievably awesome - i adore it, especially the absolutely incredible fade - and i think it royally pisses all over Breakaway, great as that song is. Breakaway just sort of trickles away at the end, whereas Celebrate The News only builds and builds and gets more and more amazing as it goes on. Very, very under-rated song indeed.

Yeah, I think the Almost Summer demo wouldn't be a bad choice or maybe the live Almost Summer/Cruisin' medley if they have a soundboard recording.

Some of the single mixes (Cuddle Up) would be decent choices as would the soundtracks (It's a Beautiful Day). But not things like Livin' With a Heartache, Happy Endings or Problem Child.

I'd like to hear a version of Happy Endings that doesn't have Little Richard singing on it. He ruins that one for me....
 :P

That's really funny!  ;D  The song was one of Dennis' first and Jackobson wrote the lyrics. It not only had a non-conventional structure to it but also sheer sonic power. I don't deny that it's an underated song, but to say it "pisses all over Breakaway" is just waaaaaay off the mark. Sorry.

Bad luck, no more, no bad luck, no more, no bad luck, no more!

Thanks to Eder for cleaning up this video, recorded on the Mike Douglas Show in '69.  Check out Carl on drums!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5sSULyviSE

I think it's on a par with Breakaway and so different as to be incomparable. Play it loud and tune out!

I also think it's on par with Breakway up until the last minute where it then proceeds to stomp all over the a-side's hurried ending.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHZZ0QjPL2o (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHZZ0QjPL2o)

The two opposed yet (at that time) conjoined musical impulses of the band are embodied in the "Break Away"/"Celebrate The News" 45. When we get past worrying about which is "better," we can see the reason why we are all still here talking about this stuff  40+ years after the single was released. No other band has such a wide range of music that all somehow works under the collective rubric of a "band name."

I hope both tracks will be on MIC; they both deserve to make the cut.

This version is infinitely superior to The Beach Boys version imo.

Thanks.. never heard this version before...
surprisingly good, didn't think Terry had that good a voice till now.

oh oh!, Booklets go back to the printers again, looks like a June '14 release now  ::) ;)

Yes, I think it's 1970.

Nothing in my notes, so I'd guess it wasn't terribly exciting to me at the time.

Sorry, I can't remember.

No, what's that? An early version of "When A Man Loves A Woman"?

It's not a cover.



Yes, it's more fun this way.

I dunno, that's what I thought.

Remember one titled "Your Son," from somewhere, maybe it's the same?

This box set can only disappoint because I want everything

This is how it will proceed as the release date rapidly approaches:

PHASE 1: Much anticipation and online bickering about what will constitute the final tracklist will develop. Several tracks will emerge as the race favourites, but uncertainty will rule the day until a tracklist makes it to Capitol's website or Amazon's.
PHASE 1A: The box contents, artwork and tracklist are released, the board goes into meltdown over which songs have or haven't been included, Phil still refuses to accept that it will be released

PHASE 2: The release happens with certain countries getting a sooner than planned release date than others. Much jealousy will transpire.

PHASE 3: Release. Initial rapture and festive mood breaks out the world over. Much rejoicing is given to the never-before-heard tracks. Many fans describe highly emotional religious experiences when hearing certain tracks for the first time.

PHASE 4A: The first negative appraisals appear in the tracklist selection. No matter how absurd the complaint, each thread attracts a devoted following.
PHASE 4B: The first negative appraisals via tachyon particle accelerator tests on the audio mastering appear. Any chance of any of the parties involved in the CD set appearing here are swiftly extinguished following the vitriol and claims of "I could have done it better than this slopfest".
PHASE 4C: Someone brings up why they hate hate hate vomit BWPS.

PHASE 5: A new set of whinging appears stating how the hyped up tracks didnt live up to the hype.

PHASE 6: The whole procedure is reset upon rumours of a new CD release.

… with phases 2–6 occurring within 23 minutes of the release.

Sounds about right

There should a 'PHASE 1A: The box contents, artwork and tracklist are released, the board goes into meltdown over which songs have or haven't been included, Phil still refuses to accept that it will be released'.

The first Smiley Smiler here on the board to discover a link and post the track list will be a hero of sorts. Who will it be???  :hug :huh :beer :woot

He/she will only be a hero if the right tracks are on the track list...otherwise it could be a "shoot the messenger" scenario...  :o

Good suggestion - list is updated.

Maybe Phil Cohen's one shot at redemption...

I found the smile sessions one so the best bet is me  ;D

Then get looking and stop wasting time posting here until you've found it!

:ahh

I'm looking  ;D

Big difference though, I was unemployed back when the smile sessions was coming out so I had a little more time on my hands  :lol

Been in similar circs… the advantages are outweighed by the inconveniences!

If they have the wisdom and good taste and, yes, mercy, and any sense of propriety and dignity, Barbara Ann will not be on this set.   

Please bury her, perhaps  in Kokomo. 

deleted

Barabara Ann is a fun song. I love it!!! If they know what's good, they'll put the LONG version on the box!

Please bury donald's sense of propriety and dignity at sea, near the spot where Bill and Sue disappeared! ;D

(Obviously we have different opinions on Barbara Ann, and I claim MY taste is good! So there!)

Sorry, the notion to not put one of The Beach Boys' biggest hits on a career-spanning box set, at least in some form, is downright stupid.
If you don't like a song, there's a skip button! But, just because you're tired of an overplayed oldie doesn't mean it doesn't have it's deserved place.

Wooooa…

Easiest solution is to use a version with which we're not familiar. A rarity. A live version. Perhaps there's a studio version without a Dean Torrance lead vocal (we can hope).

I see little point using a version that had at least three fresh outings last year.

Well, I did say, "in at least some form", which could be an alternate, live, or differently mixed version. But it should obviously be there.

Yeah, a live version would probably be the best possible solution. But then the same would go for *all* the hits, which pretty much everyone buying this box must have.
Every indication is that this will be closer to the Good Vibrations box than to, say, the Beatles Anthology series or the Monkees Missing Links. Given that, I can't imagine that any of the hits will be left off, or that they'll be anything other than the versions the general public knows. We might (probably will) get some new stereo mixes, but I can't imagine for a second that this will have anything other than the familiar version of Barbara Ann we all know and 'love', Dean Torrence, forgotten lyrics, famous ashtray and all.

This box will only be bought by fans, hardly anyone else will touch it or know of its existance. Hence no reason to include Barbara Ann.

Or any other previously released recording.

Except that if it is, as everything indicates, meant to be a replacement for the Good Vibrations box, then it'll be aimed at the same kind of market as, say, the Guilty: Thirty Years Of Randy Newman, Kinks Picture Book or Monkees Music Box sets -- people who want more than just the hits but don't want to own every single album.
Whether that is a market that exists in any real sense any more, that's the market that the little we know about this suggests it's aimed at.
And in fact that is a perfectly reasonable thing for it to be doing -- the Beach Boys are one of the patchiest bands in history, and you probably could fit every essential recording they ever did onto six CDs, and then tell people "just buy this, you don't need anything else."

Be lovely if they had this kind of scope to play with…

http://theseconddisc.com/2013/04/30/every-good-box-deserves-favour-moody-blues-planning-exhaustive-cddvd-set/

I know, never satisfied…

At first it seems impressive, but then you realize that they could fit a lot more on each disc.  On other labels something like The SMiLE Sessions would have been 7 or 8 discs where they didn't cram the discs with material.  So I think we are lucky in that respect.  But including a couple of DVDs of concert footage and promo videos and TV appearances would really make Made In California something incredible.  5.1 surround sound I don't care for, although I'd LOVE to have a Stephen Desper 2 track stereo mix of Sunflower with the technology he proposed in 1970 that was rejected.  Anyway, nice to see these boxsets getting more elaboate, although as I said, I think they are taking advantage of the fans (what a shock) by adding extra discs that are not necessary.

I think you have a misconception of what this box set will be.

Desper's mixes of Sunflower and Surf's Up should've been the bonus tracks on those releases, at least that way they'd be widely available and, if for whatever reason someone didn't end up preferring them (though based on what I've read by others who have said mixes and heard myself in the "Cool, Cool Water" study video this seems highly unlikely!), the standard stereo mixes would still be there.

Let's face it. This will probably be the last big box set in the Beach Boys lifetime as well as ours. It better be special.  :o ;D

Ten years from now everything will probably be digital download or what ever new technology exists. In ten years we'll all be living in Bio-Domes (see 'Keepin' the Summer Alive' lp cover) and box sets won't even exist!  :old

I may be wrong about this being the last Beach Boys box set.

Pet Sounds 50, anyone?  ;)

That's perhaps ONE set I WOULD pass on.  Having already bought a few dozen official PS releases, and almost as many unofficial, I can't think of anything there can possibly left to unearth…  Except perhaps for the Remember the Zoo acetate that AGD has locked away in his bank vault…

:lol

This is what really bothers me about the whole situation, is that The Beach Boys, more than anyone i can think of, deserve a rarities-only box set, yet it'll never happen because, from a financial standpoint, "The Beach Boys" are trapped inside this America's band/hit machine box that is unrelenting. The lone exception, of course, is The Smile Sessions with its unconventional music for the hardcore fans, but i really wonder if it would have been able to exist in its released form without the built-in mythology ($) that had been working in its favor for more than four decades. There was a lot of easy money and accolades to be made with that release in the high brow end of the rock world. Everyone knew the Smile myth, even those who have/had no interest in The Beach Boys.

What is one good reason why MiC (or any other potential BB box) cannot be a rarities-only set, while other lesser bands have gotten those kinds of releases? Why is it so inconceivable that the Beach Boys would ever get this kind of release? Why is it that it's completely reasonable to keep stating, thread after thread, that that sort of release would never happen? Why do the BB always get sold short in this respect? Maybe this is why we're so cranky.

All true but I think that is an indication of how kind of mixed up the idea of this release might be.

The Good Vibrations box could make a decent claim that it did represent the best of the group as even most of the rarities were there on merit (Punchline and one or two others apart perhaps).

But if this box is truly going to be an attempt to include all of the group's essential recordings then how many unreleased songs would be included? Very few spread across the five discs (the 6th disc supposedly being the 'bonus' disc). And how much repetition would there be from the Good Vibrations box set?

I really do hope that the couple of Smile new discoveries since October, 2011 appear on MiC. Plus the Brian mix of Child is Father as well.

They've had rarities only releases - Endless Harmony and Hawthorne, CA. They might not have had the tracks you wanted, but that doesn't stop them from being rarities-only. Plus, you mentioned the expansive SMiLE box, so throw in the Pet Sounds Sessions as well - I can't imagine the casual fan going through the sessions and vocal/track only portions, plus all the alternate mixes...

We haven't seen the track listing yet, let's not complain until we do! Ha. Honestly, an update of the GV box is a good way to go. We do have all of the hits and album tracks already, but it's important for the band to have a career-spanning set that isn't 20+ years old.

Rarities-only releases where a third of the tracklisting is stupid sh*t like stereo remixes or unnecessary dialogue rather than more previously unreleased material -- which this group has a lot of, as we know -- is a cruel joke. There's a reason bootlegs exist, after all.

So can we all agree anymore than three discs devoted to hits is a total waste, or am I being generous

I think you’ve missed my point. First of all, i’m talking specifically about box sets, not single LP releases. My argument is that if other bands get box set rarities, the BB should too. Like i said, i can’t think of anyone more deserving. I do acknowledge that the Pet Sounds box set is pretty unprecedented, and i think that’s the most fortunate treatment the band has received in regards to archival releases. Second of all, i’m not complaining about the contents of MiC (which none of us know yet), nor am i leveling any criticisms at the MiC compilers or the function of a career spanning box set, nor does this have anything to do with my song preferences. It’s a much broader issue than that. I’m simply bemoaning this reality in which we live where the mere thought of a BB rarities box set is a laughable pipe dream. The hardcore BB fan base is one of the most obsessive, dedicated, knowledgeable, and loyal, and the band themselves are one of the most influential, innovative, diverse, and prolific, with one of the largest troves of unreleased music. It’s a no brainer. There is a market for this. Again, i know it won’t happen but what gets me is the why not. 

I went through my Beach Boys playlist and came up with about four hours' worth of unreleased Beach Boys stuff. The lion's share are actual songs, with a few alternate/early versions. These are all commonly found on bootlegs. Thing is, I don't know how many folks would be clamoring for a release of The Battle Hymn of the Republic, At the Hop, Goin' to the Beach, Skatetown USA, Marilyn Rovell, Calendar Girl and such...

Of course, we've heard great things about unbooted stuff like (Wouldn't It Be Nice To) Live Again, Where Is She?, Behold the Night, Surfer Suzie, Stranded in the Jungle, Boys and Girls, I'll Always Love You, Come to the Sunshine (assuming it still exists), Lucy Jones, and the California Feelin' piano/vocal track. There's also alleged dreck like Rubles, TM Siddhi Program (no bullshit; that's a real title), Basketball Rock, and the Dennis/Karen Lamm version of Here Comes the Sun.

Realistically, sticking with the MIC six-disc plan, could we actually FILL six CDs with usable stuff? I could definitely see a case for a GREAT triple disc set, but six discs? Not so sure. We may have our little favorites and all, but it all comes down to the band. For all we know, the band might actually approve Rubles for release and say no to Where Is She?.

They couldn't fill three discs devoted to hits.

Hits is the wrong word. Non-rarities I guess.

Fair enough. What's a non-rarity? Is This Whole World a non-rarity? Farmer's Daughter? Surf's Up? Trader? The Night was So Young?

Well, that's the thing, it seems that with TSS and MiC a new standard is being set. Admittedly, 6 CDs is a lot, a whole lot (i don't think anyone is complaining in that department). But it doesn't have to be a quantity over quality thing. Imagine a 3 or 4 disc set of rarities (previously unreleased stuff from boots that have been cleaned up + never before booted stuff). As you said, that would probably be a GREAT collection. And it would have a totally different function than a career spanning collection. They can press less copies than stuff like the GV or TSS box, and maybe keep costs down by not having as many frills as the TSS box. Is there not a market for something like this, in addition to a career spanning box? I'm not suggesting it should be this year or close to an MiC release, but just the fact that it's never happened in all these years, that it's such a long shot, such a ludicrous notion, is very frustrating, and, i think, another way in which this band doesn't get taken as seriously as their contemporaries.

The man speaks sense!

Well, this was basically going to be the modus operandi with the Beach Boys Central website...and look how far that went. Don't get me wrong; I'd definitely buy dreck like Rubles if they released it, but at the same time, they also have their own costs to deal with.

That's a good point and you got me thinking..

I guess I'm personally not interested in buying another Good Vibrations box set. We have that.

I'm starting to really wonder about MIC. If they plan on updating the 30 years box set and just throwing in WIBNTLA for good measure well it's not really what I'm looking for. This year alone we already had a 50!! song greatest hits with some relativity deep cuts on that. The Barbara Ann horse has been flogged enough.

Just like TSS box set I hope this is being geared towards the hardcore fan with a substantial amount of room being given to unreleased songs, live tracks and rarities.

I realize that i'm running the risk here of being asked to come up with an example track list, which i don’t have the time to do, but i think that citing stuff like Rubles is going way back into the dark and absurd recesses of the vaults when no such thing is necessary. I think if it spanned their career, from Hite Morgan all the way to TWGMTR (with more emphasis on what is generally considered to be their peak years (’60s and ’70s), that 3 or 4 discs of really great stuff sans dreck could very feasibly be compiled. No?

Again, i want to emphasize that this is not a complaint about MiC or about the fact that a dream rarities box set is not on the horizon. This is not about entitlement or not being satisfied with what we do have. It’s more abstract than that. I’m just lamenting the reality of the Beach Boys situation, that the mere idea of something like this is, without hesitation, met with ridicule because the sad truth is that it's such a far-fetched idea, when it's not for other groups. 

I think the box will be mostly hits, albums tracks and alternate/live versions with a number of repeated tracks. I suspect there will be fewer legit unreleased songs than maybe we'd hope for ... it's cheaper for the label to include multiple versions of the same songs. I wouldn't be surprised to see a 4-disc retrospective (with some unreleased tracks mixed in), with 'live' and 'alt mixes' (vocals-only, track-only, new stereo mixes, etc) discs to round out the set.

I know.  Let's speculate!

I don't know why you guys are getting so nervous about the set. I have faith that the compilers and The Beach Boys have picked most of the very best unreleased material for the set, including the ones a lot of us have been wishing to hear for a long time now. I'm not sure the guys truly have four discs of awesome unreleased material. But I wouldn't be surprised if we get like 25 to 30 tracks that are brand new to us.

Maybe individual members of those other groups are better able to put aside egos, differences of opinion, decades-old feuds, and other assorted nonsense in the spirit of celebrating their own past and giving their most loyal and dedicated fans something they actually want and have asked for instead of watered down versions of greatest hits packages which have fans repurchasing the same handful of tunes every decade.

In 1993 we got the GV box set, a terrific set. In 2012 we got the incredible Smile box, where the above scenario in and around the band members putting aside their quirks actually happened and the fans got what they wanted, and then some.

Maybe the Smile set is a good sign that this set will be different. Or maybe the BB's will lapse back into their unique brand of self-destruction and trade a genuinely good outtake's inclusion on this box for a new remix of Kokomo and a soundboard mix of the car medley from some live show in the 80's... :)

If it hasn't been said already, I want the alternate version of Big Sur.

I think there could easily be a three-disc set. If we're including Dennis stuff in the fold (since Brother has rights to his 1967-74 stuff), it could easily be four. But some grey areas exist. There are numerous unreleased tracks that exist only as backing tracks (Honey Get Home, from 1967, and Our Happy Home, from 1968, come to mind). Would they be against releasing tracks that only exist as backing tracks? That's where we hit a potential wall. Keep in mind, the bootlegged stuff only paints part of a picture. For all we know, there could be six discs of quality stuff.

Me too.

I agree with you on the GV set. Few people want a new careerspanning set. Instead it should be a revamped GV set. Something like

Good Vibrations: The completed anthology of The Beach Boys.

- Spanning 4-5 disc done more or less exactly like the original GV set with the removal of a few oddities like Our Team
- Removal of the live versions (or alternatively put the best live cuts on a seperate final disc).
- All mixes in stereo (because if you're into the mono thing you most likely will get the albums anyway).
- No radio promos.
- No 'tracks only' or 'vocals only' (unless acapella song).
- NO BINAURAL mixes.
- Otherwise very little studio chatter and or more sessions with big daddy.


So basically the same as original GV, for the future sometime. Simply a replacement for GV which is now out of print.

I doubt it will be an expanded version of the non-selling Hawthorne CD though. I imagine that it will lean way more towards something like the Good Vibrations box set.

Wow, it doesn't seem that long but it has been 20 years since the GV box set, and marketing strategies would probably suggest an "updated" multi-disc collection along those lines after that much time has passed.