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Author Topic: Brian on Carl and the Passions, Holland and the Light Album  (Read 7202 times)
Jim V.
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« on: January 08, 2011, 06:45:20 PM »

I've tried to find a thread talking about this but I can't. So here it is...is there for sure proof that Brian is on any of the songs on Carl and the Passions, Holland, or the Light Album? Vocally or instrumentally?

Here are the songs he is reportedly on.

Carl and the Passions "So Tough"
  • "You Need A Mess of Help To Stand Alone": Vocals, apparently doubles Carl's lead?; probably somewhere in the "she don't know" mix
  • "Marcella": Vocals, background?
  • "He Come Down": Vocals, background (apparently sounding like his late '70s self, is this undoubtably true though?)

Holland
  • "Funky Pretty": Vocals, somewhere in the mix

L.A. Light Album
  • "Good Timin'": Piano (apparently from '74), maybe harpsichord?
  • "Angel Come Home": Vocals, somewhere (somebody wanna point out where I can hear?)

Now if somebody could, please let me know the info on these albums? Maybe he IS more present. But those are my guesses thus far. Also, how involved was he on Surf's Up? I know he was on "Take A Load Off Your Feet", "Feel Flows", "A Day in the Life of a Tree", "Til I Die", and "Surf's Up", but was he involved in any of the rest?
« Last Edit: February 22, 2011, 08:18:23 PM by sweetdudejim » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2011, 06:58:01 PM »

He is indeed on those cuts from So Tough. He isn't doubling Carl's lead, but is extremely prominent, with the high part being most notable. He is the one doing "Marcella hey" off Marcella, and yes that is him on He Came Down (the piano and the EEEeeee part, where he does indeed sound like his 1976 self). On Holland, he's on Funky Pretty (drums and backup vocals "Pretty Funky Gone" being the most noticeable part). I thought he was on Steamboat for the longest time, also.
Some where on this board is a post I made where it had some of Brian's parts isolated, although I cannot find that thread right now.

LA Light? The piano from GT is indeed from 1974, although I didn't know that part was Brian. I swear I can hear him in the bg vox, but I could be wrong.  I think that's it, though.
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« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2011, 07:50:10 PM »

He sings lead on the intro to California Saga: California, and speaks as the voice of the pied piper on the Mount Vernon and Fairway!
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« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2011, 07:57:47 PM »

I've tried to find a thread talking about this but I can't. So here it is...is there for sure proof that Brian is on any of the songs on Carl and the Passions, Holland, or the Light Album? Vocally or instrumentally?

Here are the songs he is reportedly on.

Carl and the Passions
  • "You Need A Mess of Help To Stand Alone: Vocals, apparently doubles Carl's lead?; probably somewhere in the "she don't know" mix
  • "Marcella": Vocals, background?
  • "He Come Down": Vocals, background (apparently sounding like his late '70s self, is this undoubtably true though?)
[/b]
[/list]

Carl and the Passions "So Tough"
  • "Funky Pretty": Vocals, somewhere in the mix

L.A. Light Album
  • "Good Timin'": Piano (apparently from '74), maybe harpsichord?
  • "Angel Come Home": Vocals, somewhere (somebody wanna point out where I can hear?)

Now if somebody could, please let me know the info on these albums? Maybe he IS more present. But those are my guesses thus far. Also, how involved was he on Surf's Up? I know he was on "Take A Load Off Your Feet", "Feel Flows", "A Day in the Life of a Tree", "Til I Die", and "Surf's Up", but was he involved in any of the rest?


I was actually just listening for Brian's mid 70s gruff voice on He Come Down the other day on headphones. I think i found it...though it sounds kinda like Mike too...the buried vocals are so hard to listen for.
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« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2011, 08:10:41 PM »

... to me the most important thing is the essence of Brian Wilson bleeding through the speakers on those trax... I may not hear his voice as much as I'd like on Funky Pretty, (till the Funky Pretty demos are released by the powers that be), but I can swear to high heaven that his spirit is right there next to me rocking out.  Rock!
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« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2011, 08:25:04 PM »

Speaking of Funky Pretty, it seems like Brian is already in Love You form. Although, the lyrics are much better then they would be in 77. Even Mt Vernon has a Love You type production. I wonder if Brian actually did as much producing as Carl on those songs.
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« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2011, 09:00:52 PM »

I'm sure he's playing piano and maybe organ on He Come Down.  Probably on Mess Of Help and Marcella as well (he's on the AFM sheets, and for cryin' out loud, he WROTE the songs, so probably).  He's on Good Timin' (piano & probably harpsichord), from the '74 sessions.  And he's playing piano and I think Moog on Shortenin' Bread (backing track is from January '78).
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« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2011, 09:31:12 PM »

... to me the most important thing is the essence of Brian Wilson bleeding through the speakers on those trax... I may not hear his voice as much as I'd like on Funky Pretty, (till the Funky Pretty demos are released by the powers that be), but I can swear to high heaven that his spirit is right there next to me rocking out.  Rock!

I dig what you're saying there. When you hear a true Brian Wilson track, regardless of whether he's a lead vocalist or not, songs he produces or helps out on, it just has a special something that I don't hear as much on stuff like much of Imagination, Still Cruisin', his self-titled album or The Beach Boys self-titled album. It seems that the "feeling" in those songs isn't the same as a "committed" Brian work. Which isn't to say there isn't a song (or songs) from those albums that don't have those feeling, but its just not felt in the way you feel it on Pet Sounds or even lesser works like 15 Big Ones or Friends.


I'm sure he's playing piano and maybe organ on He Come Down.  Probably on Mess Of Help and Marcella as well (he's on the AFM sheets, and for cryin' out loud, he WROTE the songs, so probably).  He's on Good Timin' (piano & probably harpsichord), from the '74 sessions.  And he's playing piano and I think Moog on Shortenin' Bread (backing track is from January '78).

I thought I read that for the Light Album version of "Shortenin' Bread", he wasn't there, but they used his earlier version as a basis, hence the credit he got for arranging or whatever.
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« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2011, 11:35:22 PM »

And yes that is him on He Came Down (the piano and the EEEeeee part, where he does indeed sound like his 1976 self.

Huh? I don't get it. His voice didn't change drastically until 1975, when his vocal chords were thrashed. How could he sound like his 1976 voice in 1972? Please explain. Does he make his voice sound gruff and raspy on "He Come Down"? If so, when?
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« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2011, 11:41:13 PM »

"He Come Down". Vocals, background (apparently sounding like his late '70s self, is this undoubtably true though? I was actually just listening for Brian's mid 70s gruff voice on He Come Down the other day on headphones. I think i found it...though it sounds kinda like Mike too...the buried vocals are so hard to listen for.

Please help me out here. Is Brian trying to change his voice here. Give me minutes and seconds into the song please! First, I never knew Brian was on the song and second, this isn't the first time anybody suggested that he was trying to change his voice on purpose. I always wanted to start a thread on this issue and I will concerning his voice.

Hey C-Man, we need that Carl & The Passions sessions essay this year, OK?
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« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2011, 12:28:07 AM »

His voice didn't permanently  change until 1975, but he still had his moments. If I can find the thread where I posted those clips, I will repost. From what I've been told, he'd been on a bit of a bender lately. That also explains why his high part in Mess of Help sounds like his late 70s falsetto only dryer, and same thing with his part on Marcella...sounded like his MIU voice, brief as his part was.

If I can't find the link, I'll redo it in Adobe Audition in a few days.
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« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2011, 01:30:25 AM »

Brian also plays the drums on "Funky Pretty".

His contribution to "Angle Come Home" is in the bvs - certainly the chorus, not convinced about the verses.
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« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2011, 01:50:18 AM »

We never did find him anywhere else on L.A., did we?  I don't think we can say for sure that he wasn't on "Lady Lynda," can we?  Some of the vocals I believe were from the MIU time period and if you listen carefully, a few are a bit on the pitchy side.  Or did we cover this and C-Man confirmed he wasn't there?  I forgot.  I know we talked about this.
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« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2011, 03:57:38 AM »

Does Brian turn up on either of the Celebration albums from the 1978 - 79 period ? After all he is playing bass on the clips of Almost Summer and Cruisin on Youtube
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« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2011, 03:59:53 AM »

Does Brian turn up on either of the Celebration albums from the 1978 - 79 period ? After all he is playing bass on the clips of Almost Summer and Cruisin on Youtube

There's reasonable cause to believe he's on "Almost Summer" vocally.
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« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2011, 04:02:44 AM »

Isn't Brian singing background vox near the end of "Love Surrounds Me"? Sounds quite a bit like what his shouty 80's vocals would be like.
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« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2011, 08:52:14 AM »

Isn't Brian singing background vox near the end of "Love Surrounds Me"? Sounds quite a bit like what his shouty 80's vocals would be like.

I think that's Dennis.
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« Reply #17 on: January 09, 2011, 08:54:36 AM »

Does Brian turn up on either of the Celebration albums from the 1978 - 79 period ? After all he is playing bass on the clips of Almost Summer and Cruisin on Youtube

There's reasonable cause to believe he's on "Almost Summer" vocally.

I love the demo for this song, which has Brian singing most or all of the verses that were later sung by Mike...what a kick to listen to!
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« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2011, 09:18:46 AM »

We never did find him anywhere else on L.A., did we?  I don't think we can say for sure that he wasn't on "Lady Lynda," can we?  Some of the vocals I believe were from the MIU time period and if you listen carefully, a few are a bit on the pitchy side.  Or did we cover this and C-Man confirmed he wasn't there?  I forgot.  I know we talked about this.

Well, the trick to determining if Brian is on the L.A. version of "Lady Lynda" may be determining for sure the dates he was staying at Brotman hospital (he was there for several months in late '78/early '79).  If the vocals were recorded while he was hospitalized, then no.  I've scoured the Gaines book (the recounting of the incident leading to Brian's hospitalization at Brotman starts on pg. 321 of the first edition), but can't find the actual date, or even the month.  There were three versions of "Lady Lynda"...the Ron Altbach-produced original from the second half of '77...this one can be heard playing in the background during one scene of the "Almost Summer" movie.  Then Bruce produced a version at Western on Sept. 19, 1978 (along with a remake of "Calendar Girl"), but I have no idea if there are vocals on that.  The track for the final Al-produced version was cut at Western on Oct. 11, 1978, with some overdubs added five days later.  The harpsichord & orchestra were added at Britannia on Nov. 27th, but the background vocals were done inbetween.  In a radio interview, Carl mentioned that some of the vocals for "Lady Lynda" were done up in Monterey (at a studio called Super Sound).  I know from AGD's research that the BBs also worked on "Santa Ana Winds" at Super Sound Nov. 16-17, so I would say it's likely that they also worked on "Lady Lynda" at the same time.  Brian cut "Drip Drop" at Western on Oct. 19, so his committment to Brotman would have to be sometime after that date.  Since Carl had said "some" of the background vocals were done in Monterey, even if we can prove that Brian was already in Brotman by mid-November, there's still a chance he participated in the earlier vocal sessions, if they were held in L.A. sometime between Oct. 11 (when the basic track was cut) and Oct. 19 (when Brian cut "Drip Drop").  Either way, I'd say there's a good chance he is on there...some of the low-mid vocals sound like they could be him.
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« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2011, 09:29:11 AM »

I thought I read that for the Light Album version of "Shortenin' Bread", he wasn't there, but they used his earlier version as a basis, hence the credit he got for arranging or whatever.


That is true as far as the vocals go.  However, we know from various sources (like the AFM contract and Chuck "Crane" Kirkpatrick's testimony) that the instrumental track Brian cut in January '78 included Billy Hinsche and Kirkpatrick on guitars.  The track sheet or console strip from the version of "Shortenin' Bread" used on the Light Album has track assignments for Billy's guitar and Chuck's guitar, as well as elements that would definitely be from the final overdubs the group did later in Brian's absence (Jimmy Lyon's screaming lead guitar, plus chorus vocals done by Bruce, Carl and Alan, and Dennis' bass vocal).
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« Reply #20 on: January 09, 2011, 09:55:46 AM »

We never did find him anywhere else on L.A., did we?  I don't think we can say for sure that he wasn't on "Lady Lynda," can we?  Some of the vocals I believe were from the MIU time period and if you listen carefully, a few are a bit on the pitchy side.  Or did we cover this and C-Man confirmed he wasn't there?  I forgot.  I know we talked about this.

Well, the trick to determining if Brian is on the L.A. version of "Lady Lynda" may be determining for sure the dates he was staying at Brotman hospital (he was there for several months in late '78/early '79). 

Brian was out of Brotman by March 1st 1979 for sure, as he showed up at Radio City Music Hall, so unless he winged it for the whole four days of the engagement, I'd say he was released maybe early February - he was certainly out by the 21st as he (reportedly) produced an American Spring session. As for when he went in, well, there was the "Beggin' Yoy Please" session at Shangri-La on 10/6/78, and "Drip Drop" at Western 13 days later. He also played at least one show of the 4-date midwest mini-tour later the same month (27th-29th).
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« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2011, 09:58:10 AM »

This just in - on "He Come Down", Brian wrote most of it, arranged it, took the top vocal line and played piano & organ.  Film at eleven.
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« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2011, 10:37:55 AM »

This just in - on "He Come Down", Brian wrote most of it, arranged it, took the top vocal line and played piano & organ.  Film at eleven.
Andrew, do you mean he took the top vocal line throughout the song? I ask because after reading this I listened a couple times and my ears--which have been wrong before, but I'm just saying it's my impression--tell me that it could well be Brian on the top line in the big "yes, I believe it" beginning around 3:27, but it doesn't much sound like him in the primary "I believe it" backgrounds of the refrains throughout the rest of the song. Not doubting what you were told, just curious.
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« Reply #23 on: January 09, 2011, 11:05:02 AM »

This just in - on "He Come Down", Brian wrote most of it, arranged it, took the top vocal line and played piano & organ.  Film at eleven.
Andrew, do you mean he took the top vocal line throughout the song? I ask because after reading this I listened a couple times and my ears--which have been wrong before, but I'm just saying it's my impression--tell me that it could well be Brian on the top line in the big "yes, I believe it" beginning around 3:27, but it doesn't much sound like him in the primary "I believe it" backgrounds of the refrains throughout the rest of the song. Not doubting what you were told, just curious.

Luther, the part you're referring to sounds like Blondie Chaplin, imo. Gee, when listening through headphones, there's so much going on in those choruses vocal-wise. I can single out Carl, Alan, Mike and Blondie easily, but the rest...? There are several high parts though, which could be Alan, Brian and Blondie.

Edit: From 3:44 on in the right channel there are swelling high voices and organ. Especially when the voices turn to screams Brian's shrill voice is audible.

p.s. now listening to Marcella. Did any else notice the vocoder-like vocal during the chorus? Very cool.
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« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2011, 11:06:08 AM »

Also, Brian would be doing at least most (if not all) of the playing on the Holland Fairytale.  And all the instruments on "Funky Pretty" were reportedly played by Brian, Carl, and Ricky (since Brian played the drums in Ricky's absence, my guess is Ricky added percussion later...is there flute on there? can't remember, but if so, that would be Ricky as well).
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