Query re: SOT SMiLE Sessions (SOT # 17) Box

[The Heartical Don]

Um, not that I'd ever listen to it, much less purchase it, I'd rather go to jail for the rest of my life, but...

is it listenable? Or is it something you enjoy 1 time and then store away and forget about?

[A Million Units In Jan!]

It is worth it (so I've heard). It gives you an idea about how much of a perfectionist Brian was in the studio (thus negating the often held theory that he was starting to lose it in the studio during this time period), and it's pretty sweet to hear Brian running these sessions that are so legendary.

[The Shift]

Well worth it -  stuff came out on this box we might not otherwise have dreamed of.  Great if you like mixing your own versions of SMiLE classics; great for a few of Brian's own rough mixes.  Only downside is it only covers some of the tracks -  where are Cabinessence, Surf's Up and Our Prayer?  Nowhere else in this kind of quality.

Or so I've heard from someone who ought to be cast out of society for even mentioning it.

[bgas]

Darn!  I may have to actually sit down and listen to these, then. 
I'm fairly certain I bought all the SOT CDs, but after the first few, I could never find the time to sit and listen to take after take after take...

[grillo]

Don, I'm shocked! These sessions are some of the most insightful peeks into the mind of BW. They are well worth listening to many times over, as are the Pet Sounds sessions. Just to hear how the tag to the alt. H&V morphs from a slow, lazy clomp to the spritely little ditty we know and love makes it worth your time.

[The Heartical Don]

Don, I'm shocked! These sessions are some of the most insightful peeks into the mind of BW. They are well worth listening to many times over, as are the Pet Sounds sessions. Just to hear how the tag to the alt. H&V morphs from a slow, lazy clomp to the spritely little ditty we know and love makes it worth your time.

Thank you, son! Then I will, in my function as irreproachable Lt. of the LAPD force, arrest the culprit who has the set on offer, and land him in jail ASAP. I will surely find a fine moral destination for his counterfeit material; I happen to have a knowledgeable friend who loves to study criminal material in depth and for years on end to ensure that our capacities to discern the lawful from the illegal will continue to grow and grow. A true win-win situation for all righteous people!

[Jason]

A little back story on the SOT 17 thing and why it's missing a few things.

SOT 17, as we know, contains sessions for Heroes and Villains, Do You Like Worms, Wonderful (the second version), The Old Master Painter/You Are My Sunshine, He Gives Speeches, Child Is Father of the Man, Look, Vega-Tables, Wind Chimes, Mrs. O'Leary's Cow, Friday Night, Water, and the so-called "Vega-Tables argument". SOT 14, the second Pet Sounds box, ends with two 15 minute conversation reels that were actually from the Smile period. SOT 18, the Smiley Smile set, has sessions for the April 1967 Wonderful on it for some reason.

Regarding the "missing songs", those being Cabinessence, Our Prayer, Surf's Up, Barnyard, I Love To Say Da Da, I'm In Great Shape, All Day, With Me Tonight, Wonderful (first version), Vega-Tables "demo", Holidays, and Tones (a stretch, but we'll be nice and cover it) - in many cases, some sessions for these tunes were around on stockings before the SOTs came out in 1999 - the Vigotone 2 disc set had a five minute excerpt of an Our Prayer session (since booted in better quality), the "yodeling" version of Wonderful, as well as a Surf's Up percussion overdub session and the "George Fell Into His French Horn" session. The Prokopy tapes also included a few With Me Tonight sessions and the backing track to the first version of Wonderful. Secret Smile then filled in the rest of these gaps and included sessions for all of the above titles, except I'm In Great Shape and All Day, which found a way out on a fan-made compilation CD. Much of this stuff did not figure into the so-called "American Band" copying thing (yes, I know it's NOT the American Band thing, but it's since become a sort of code name, so...), as a lot of this material sounds like it was dubbed from cassette to cassette for 25 years.

Once you get past all the fluff and repeated stuff over countless stockings, you're left with about 11 discs of Smile material that swim around out there. Add another four or so if you count Good Vibrations with all of that.

[The Shift]

Don, I'm shocked! These sessions are some of the most insightful peeks into the mind of BW. They are well worth listening to many times over, as are the Pet Sounds sessions. Just to hear how the tag to the alt. H&V morphs from a slow, lazy clomp to the spritely little ditty we know and love makes it worth your time.

That slow, lazy clomp you describe has always - well, since I first heard it when the box set was released - conjured up an image in my mind of chickens in boots having a hoedown a barnyard.  I much prefer that slow version to the "False Barnyard" (as we know it) that it evolved into.

Then I read this very recent post:
http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,8427.0.html

Heh!

[The Shift]

A little back story on the SOT 17 thing and why it's missing a few things.

SOT 17, as we know, contains sessions for Heroes and Villains, Do You Like Worms, Wonderful (the second version), The Old Master Painter/You Are My Sunshine, He Gives Speeches, Child Is Father of the Man, Look, Vega-Tables, Wind Chimes, Mrs. O'Leary's Cow, Friday Night, Water, and the so-called "Vega-Tables argument". SOT 14, the second Pet Sounds box, ends with two 15 minute conversation reels that were actually from the Smile period. SOT 18, the Smiley Smile set, has sessions for the April 1967 Wonderful on it for some reason.

Regarding the "missing songs", those being Cabinessence, Our Prayer, Surf's Up, Barnyard, I Love To Say Da Da, I'm In Great Shape, All Day, With Me Tonight, Wonderful (first version), Vega-Tables "demo", Holidays, and Tones (a stretch, but we'll be nice and cover it) - in many cases, some sessions for these tunes were around on stockings before the SOTs came out in 1999 - the Vigotone 2 disc set had a five minute excerpt of an Our Prayer session (since booted in better quality), the "yodeling" version of Wonderful, as well as a Surf's Up percussion overdub session and the "George Fell Into His French Horn" session. The Prokopy tapes also included a few With Me Tonight sessions and the backing track to the first version of Wonderful. Secret Smile then filled in the rest of these gaps and included sessions for all of the above titles, except I'm In Great Shape and All Day, which found a way out on a fan-made compilation CD. Much of this stuff did not figure into the so-called "American Band" copying thing (yes, I know it's NOT the American Band thing, but it's since become a sort of code name, so...), as a lot of this material sounds like it was dubbed from cassette to cassette for 25 years.

Once you get past all the fluff and repeated stuff over countless stockings, you're left with about 11 discs of Smile material that swim around out there. Add another four or so if you count Good Vibrations with all of that.

Many thanks Mr Moore

I guess the implication is that the non-SOT SMiLE slipper material does exist in the vault, in much better quality than has ever been slippered?

I've (not) heard most of the material you refer to, usually in quality that leaves a lot to be desired.

This must be some incentive to those within BRI wanting to release some of the stuff – the knowledge that the slippered material can't even hold a candle, sonically, to what could be put out officially?   The rest of the material would easily piggyback on the back of that, even to those of us who have(n't) heard it all in good quality already.

Which raises another question.

Before VigoTone was shutdown, they'd reportedly prepared their own SMiLE sessions box set.

Anyone know what would have been on that? And whether anything was pressed up before the bust?

(Just so I know what to steer clear of...)

[A Million Units In Jan!]

My biggest complaint about it is the amount of Vegetables sessions. Almost a full disc's worth (or so I've heard), and a lot of it  not all that interesting-just a lot of vocal overdubs (and a vocal take by Marilyn).  Although there is a nice, crisp 'Fade to Vegetables' (or, at least I've heard that's on there) , which is one of the best pieces of SMiLE music recorded. I think.

[The Shift]

My biggest complaint about it is the amount of Vegetables sessions. Almost a full disc's worth (or so I've heard), and a lot of it  not all that interesting-just a lot of vocal overdubs (and a vocal take by Marilyn).  Although there is a nice, crisp 'Fade to Vegetables' (or, at least I've heard that's on there) , which is one of the best pieces of SMiLE music recorded. I think.

That's a complaint? Give me a box full of veggies sessions!

This stuff is ambrosia!

[Dove Nested Towers]

A little back story on the SOT 17 thing and why it's missing a few things.

SOT 17, as we know, contains sessions for Heroes and Villains, Do You Like Worms, Wonderful (the second version), The Old Master Painter/You Are My Sunshine, He Gives Speeches, Child Is Father of the Man, Look, Vega-Tables, Wind Chimes, Mrs. O'Leary's Cow, Friday Night, Water, and the so-called "Vega-Tables argument". SOT 14, the second Pet Sounds box, ends with two 15 minute conversation reels that were actually from the Smile period. SOT 18, the Smiley Smile set, has sessions for the April 1967 Wonderful on it for some reason.

Regarding the "missing songs", those being Cabinessence, Our Prayer, Surf's Up, Barnyard, I Love To Say Da Da, I'm In Great Shape, All Day, With Me Tonight, Wonderful (first version), Vega-Tables "demo", Holidays, and Tones (a stretch, but we'll be nice and cover it) - in many cases, some sessions for these tunes were around on stockings before the SOTs came out in 1999 - the Vigotone 2 disc set had a five minute excerpt of an Our Prayer session (since booted in better quality), the "yodeling" version of Wonderful, as well as a Surf's Up percussion overdub session and the "George Fell Into His French Horn" session. The Prokopy tapes also included a few With Me Tonight sessions and the backing track to the first version of Wonderful. Secret Smile then filled in the rest of these gaps and included sessions for all of the above titles, except I'm In Great Shape and All Day, which found a way out on a fan-made compilation CD. Much of this stuff did not figure into the so-called "American Band" copying thing (yes, I know it's NOT the American Band thing, but it's since become a sort of code name, so...), as a lot of this material sounds like it was dubbed from cassette to cassette for 25 years.

Once you get past all the fluff and repeated stuff over countless stockings, you're left with about 11 discs of Smile material that swim around out there. Add another four or so if you count Good Vibrations with all of that.

Many thanks Mr Moore

I guess the implication is that the non-SOT SMiLE slipper material does exist in the vault, in much better quality than has ever been slippered?

I've (not) heard most of the material you refer to, usually in quality that leaves a lot to be desired.

This must be some incentive to those within BRI wanting to release some of the stuff – the knowledge that the slippered material can't even hold a candle, sonically, to what could be put out officially?   The rest of the material would easily piggyback on the back of that, even to those of us who have(n't) heard it all in good quality already.

Which raises another question.

Before VigoTone was shutdown, they'd reportedly prepared their own SMiLE sessions box set.

Anyone know what would have been on that? And whether anything was pressed up before the bust?

(Just so I know what to steer clear of...)

I have heard that a disc of "Cabinessence" sessions was pressed just before Vigotone's demise.

[Jason]

The alleged Vigotone Smile box set was apparently a hoax but at the same time it was effectively what killed the label, as The Man raided them and shut them down soon after. I have heard the rumor that the disc of Cabinessence sessions, which has since found its way onto Secret Smile, was intended as either one disc of the box set or a separate release that was never announced.

The Smile stuff spread out on the SOTs is the rarity as far as sound quality is concerned. Much of the stuff that goes around is either dubbed from acetates or has been dubbed to death from reel to cassette to cassette to cassette to cassette, and so on for about eight million generations. The apparent rumor was that a good portion of Smile stuff that was booted after all the 1980s vinyl boots, the Vigotone set, and the SOTs, supposedly was going around in the late 1970s within a VERY close group of folks, which could certainly explain why the copies that made it into general circulation have a layer of hiss on them that might as well have been a member of the band by that point.

[Zander]

For a good descriptive insight into each Sea of  Tunes release and track listing see www.beachboys.com (under Rarities). The  Secret Smile release would have been perfect as an additional disc in the SOT box...