Dennis Wilson as an artist in the 1970's

[Jay]

I  just listened to the song Companion for the first time last night. Holy sh*t what a great song! I am convinced that if the song had been released to radio as done by a "mystery artist", it would have gone to number one. I was listening to that song, and Moonlight, It's Not To Late, Wild Situation, and I came to a somewhat startling conclusion. This might land me in hot water, but I'll say it anyway. Dennis in 1977-78 was what his brother Brian was in 1966-67. A musical genius. In fact, I'll go as far as to say that Dennis's work in the 1970's was superior to his brother's work from the same time period. Let's all discuss this for a minute or two. Give me your take on it. Am I crazy?

[Alex]

I think I agree that Dennis' stuff from that period was better than anything Brian was writing...but I still love Love You!!!

[Mr. Cohen]

I think from an artistic standpoint, as well as just in overall quality, Dennis's music surpasses what Brian was doing in '77.  However, I'd still say that Brian had more pop sensibilities in '77 than Dennis did, at least when it came to melodies (lyrics, on the other hand...). I still don't think POB quite matches up with Pet Sounds, but that's not really a put down. Of course, I'll admit that only like about half of Dennis's ballads, so take that into account...

[Ed Roach]

I  just listened to the song Companion for the first time last night. Holy merda what a great song! I am convinced that if the song had been released to radio as done by a "mystery artist", it would have gone to number one.

I've often told the story of having said the same thing to Dennis as soon as he cut his vocal; except I told him just to rush it out as himself, as a one-off single.  You have to remember, P.O.B. sold significantly well enough, without the support a tour would have given to it, and he did have a contract that would have allowed him to keep releasing.  And I was totally convinced that song was occurring at just the right time, too, and felt it could have made serious waves.
I wasn't the only one to tell him that, but for some reason, he felt absolutely inadequate singing that song...  Said that was just a scratch vocal he cut, instantly buried it in the mix, and insisted that Carly needed to sing that one!  (No offense to Carly, especially with all he felt when writing it, but he knew that Dennis had nailed it, too!)  Dennis went so far as to have Carly sing it on-stage a few times, when the backup band was opening for Charles Lloyd, and for a very brief time did a Dennis-ish set, before playing with Lloyd, then went on to their set with The Boys!  Those were some shows during that period...
However, my payback for being so adamant about him singing/releasing it was that it was something I never got to hear the same way again until recently.  My cassette of his mix isn't that different from the bootlegs that have been around.  The 'new' version gives me chills, whenever I listen to it...

[Jon Stebbins]

This might land me in hot water, but I'll say it anyway. Dennis in 1977-78 was what his brother Brian was in 1966-67. A musical genius. In fact, I'll go as far as to say that Dennis's work in the 1970's was superior to his brother's work from the same time period.

  Why would that land you in hot water? Its not exactly a controversial or rarely stated opinion. Practically every major rock publication and a slew of international newspapers repeated that type of thing over and over  last year when the Pacific Ocean Blue/Bambu Legacy edition was released by Sony.  It was without a doubt the best reviewed reissue of 2008, and most critics pointed out without hesitation that Dennis had progressed beyond what the BB's and Brian were doing at the same time, and had done in quite a while. There are also a lot of fans who have been saying this for many many years. There were also a slew of them that said the same thing about POB back in '77. I don't think you'd even be in hot water saying that over on the Blue board, its kind of a mainstream point of view these days.

[grillo]

I  just listened to the song Companion for the first time last night. Holy merda what a great song! I am convinced that if the song had been released to radio as done by a "mystery artist", it would have gone to number one. I was listening to that song, and Moonlight, It's Not To Late, Wild Situation, and I came to a somewhat startling conclusion. This might land me in hot water, but I'll say it anyway. Dennis in 1977-78 was what his brother Brian was in 1966-67. A musical genius. In fact, I'll go as far as to say that Dennis's work in the 1970's was superior to his brother's work from the same time period. Let's all discuss this for a minute or two. Give me your take on it. Am I crazy?

Apples vs. Oranges

[Jay]

This might land me in hot water, but I'll say it anyway. Dennis in 1977-78 was what his brother Brian was in 1966-67. A musical genius. In fact, I'll go as far as to say that Dennis's work in the 1970's was superior to his brother's work from the same time period.

  Why would that land you in hot water? Its not exactly a controversial or rarely stated opinion. Practically every major rock publication and a slew of international newspapers repeated that type of thing over and over  last year when the Pacific Ocean Blue/Bambu Legacy edition was released by Sony.  It was without a doubt the best reviewed reissue of 2008, and most critics pointed out without hesitation that Dennis had progressed beyond what the BB's and Brian were doing at the same time, and had done in quite a while. There are also a lot of fans who have been saying this for many many years. There were also a slew of them that said the same thing about POB back in '77. I don't think you'd even be in hot water saying that over on the Blue board, its kind of a mainstream point of view these days.

I guess with all the stories of the group dismissing Dennis's work on POB, and the group cancelling the tour, I figured it would be to much of a "hot topic". Plus, Brian is so overwhelmingly loved no matter what he does, I kind of expected to get a few arguments from the hardcore Brian/Beach Boy fans.

[Jay]

I  just listened to the song Companion for the first time last night. Holy merda what a great song! I am convinced that if the song had been released to radio as done by a "mystery artist", it would have gone to number one.

I've often told the story of having said the same thing to Dennis as soon as he cut his vocal; except I told him just to rush it out as himself, as a one-off single.  You have to remember, P.O.B. sold significantly well enough, without the support a tour would have given to it, and he did have a contract that would have allowed him to keep releasing.  And I was totally convinced that song was occurring at just the right time, too, and felt it could have made serious waves.
I wasn't the only one to tell him that, but for some reason, he felt absolutely inadequate singing that song...  Said that was just a scratch vocal he cut, instantly buried it in the mix, and insisted that Carly needed to sing that one!  (No offense to Carly, especially with all he felt when writing it, but he knew that Dennis had nailed it, too!)  Dennis went so far as to have Carly sing it on-stage a few times, when the backup band was opening for Charles Lloyd, and for a very brief time did a Dennis-ish set, before playing with Lloyd, then went on to their set with The Boys!  Those were some shows during that period...
However, my payback for being so adamant about him singing/releasing it was that it was something I never got to hear the same way again until recently.  My cassette of his mix isn't that different from the bootlegs that have been around.  The 'new' version gives me chills, whenever I listen to it...

I couldn't stop listening to that song last night. I must have played it ten times in a row. It boggles my mind that Dennis didn't see the potential in it. No...there was no potential. That song IS a hit, no ifs ands or butts about it. It has the words "commercial" and "radio-friendly" written all over it. This backed with Moonlight for the b-side would have gone into history as one of the great singles of the 1970's.

[Ed Roach]

You've really touched upon one of the saddest "what ifs" in my memories of Dennis'...
At least as far as his creative output is concerned.   Thank you for sharing my feelings about this track,
and for taking me down this path once again!

[LittleSurferGirl]

I can agree with this, Dennis is totally under-rated. Especially among the music critics & people that just dont know much about the band or Denny.

[Sciencefriction]

Constant Companion right?  Yes, I agree with the previously stated sentiments that it could have been a hit for Dennis.  I think it had the potential to cross barriers because of it's funk/latin/rock blend.  That should sound bad but Carly wrote an amazing song and Dennis took to another level.

I know this isn't exactly new thinking or anything, but I wonder what kind of things would have happened had Dennis taken over creative control of the BB after Sunflower.  I think they could have eventually become successful again and maybe Brian would have seen Dennis as competition and worked harder.  I don't know.  I think it's clear from the thoughts contained in this thread that Dennis had the potential to become very successful in the late 70's if things had been different.  When I first heard the reissue last year I felt that Bamboo was a better album, and I still feel it has some incredibly beautiful songs on it that outshine a lot of POB.  The great thing about Dennis' solo work for me is that it's great from an artistic standpoint but also could have been very popular without try to be.  Oh well, at least we have it now in wonderful clarity to enjoy. 

[Sam_BFC]

As a lot of the Bambu era songs were written by Carli, why does Dennis all the praise for it?

Incidently, I had always though that All Alone was 'so Dennis' and was suprised to find it was not actually a Dennis composition last summer with the re-issue.

[Jay]

You've really touched upon one of the saddest "what ifs" in my memories of Dennis'...
At least as far as his creative output is concerned.   Thank you for sharing my feelings about this track,
and for taking me down this path once again!

I'm not quite sure how or what I did but, you're welcome.  It's funky, pseudo-disco....it's everything that the 1979 version of Here Comes The Night wasn't. 

[jeremylr]

I agree with you, Jay.  "Constant Companion" would have turned many a critic's head if it had been released by Dennis or even the Beach Boys.  It's such a shame that it stayed unreleased for 30 years.  It's a song like this that should have seen release after "Holland" in 1973.  "Companion" looked to the future, unlike most Beach Boys' singles from the mid '70s onward.  I'd love to hear this song in a live setting.

[Jay]

I have always thought that The Beach Boys name was somewhat of a curse for the group after a certain time. Would songs from MIU have been hits if they had been released to radio as an "unknown mystery group"? That's what I think should have happened with Companion. I'm not so sure that it would have been a hit with the Dennis Wilson name. Or more specifically, the Brian Wilson/"Wilson family" association.

[MBE]

Jay your posts on this thread are your best to date. I always wonder if they had become Beach in the seventies would they have been able to build up a new fan base from scratch. By the MIU-Bambu era they weren't up to it but in 1970 they had unlimited potential with Brian and Dennis writing and singing at their best.

[Jon Stebbins]

As a lot of the Bambu era songs were written by Carli, why does Dennis all the praise for it?

Incidently, I had always though that All Alone was 'so Dennis' and was suprised to find it was not actually a Dennis composition last summer with the re-issue.

DW not only sang, but co-produced and co-arranged those songs, they have a lot of his input...and its only 4 songs...that's probably why he gets the praise, that and he was the artist.

[the captain]

Yeah ... I'm not really a Dennis guy, but while it may be a legit question to ask 'why doesn't Carly get more credit?', asking why Dennis gets so much credit is a little like asking why Elvis gets credit for his recordings.

[Jay]

Jay your posts on this thread are your best to date. I always wonder if they had become Beach in the seventies would they have been able to build up a new fan base from scratch. By the MIU-Bambu era they weren't up to it but in 1970 they had unlimited potential with Brian and Dennis writing and singing at their best.

Ha! I got a good chuckle out of that. I had another thought last night. If Holy Man with Taylor Hawkins(I think that's his name) singing lead had been released as a Foo Fighters song, would it have been a hit? I think it would have either been a big hit, or it would have become a "cult classic" with the die-hards.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I have always thought that The Beach Boys name was somewhat of a curse for the group after a certain time. Would songs from MIU have been hits if they had been released to radio as an "unknown mystery group"? That's what I think should have happened with Companion. I'm not so sure that it would have been a hit with the Dennis Wilson name. Or more specifically, the Brian Wilson/"Wilson family" association.

Valid point, and proven in the UK a few years ago when there was a UK club release by someone called Black Knight that was causing quite a stir.

I'll leave you to imagine the reaction when the artist in question was revealed to be... Sir Cliff Richard. 

[The Heartical Don]

I have always thought that The Beach Boys name was somewhat of a curse for the group after a certain time. Would songs from MIU have been hits if they had been released to radio as an "unknown mystery group"? That's what I think should have happened with Companion. I'm not so sure that it would have been a hit with the Dennis Wilson name. Or more specifically, the Brian Wilson/"Wilson family" association.

Valid point, and proven in the UK a few years ago when there was a UK club release by someone called Black Knight that was causing quite a stir.

I'll leave you to imagine the reaction when the artist in question was revealed to be... Sir Cliff Richard. 

Ah...Sir Cliff! I pity him, because after the roof, the Wimbledon grounds won't be a singing stage for him and Martina anymore... I have fond memories of the double entendre inherent in 'Bachelor Boy'...

[the captain]

That idea of identity as a trap is certainly real, not just for the Beach Boys (who had the doubly problematic issue of not just being tied to a name, but that name, which had so many built-in connotations. But the same applies to some extent to any really famous artist. Think of Sir Paul and his "Fireman." Granted, this second time around it was common knowledge who that was, but the moniker seems to have freed him from the usual trappings of ex-Beatledom.

[Shady]

I think POB and Bambu is the most tragic albums ever released, with a few moments of joy it's jut a truly sad album.

Dennis really knew how to convey his pain into music, much like Brian.

Anyway to do with the whole mystery artist thing, I got no idea, was POB mainstream in the 70s, it's not exactly pop music.

[Alf64]

POB was not mainstream at all in 1977. It was a solo venture by Denny. People now are trying to make him out to be on the caliber of Brian, Bob Dylan, etc.. This is out of context with the time. I think Denny was wanting to stretch his creative legs. After being behind the drums for so long. But I doubt he had any idea of pursuing it permanently. I can be corrected on this by ones MUCH more knowledgeable than I though. Another note, the other guys felt intimidated by this act and Mike released his "Looking back With Love", and 2 others, Carl and his 2 solo LPs as well. A ripple effect. 

[Jon Stebbins]

POB was not mainstream at all in 1977. It was a solo venture by Denny. People now are trying to make him out to be on the caliber of Brian, Bob Dylan, etc.. This is out of context with the time. I think Denny was wanting to stretch his creative legs. After being behind the drums for so long. But I doubt he had any idea of pursuing it permanently. I can be corrected on this by ones MUCH more knowledgeable than I though. Another note, the other guys felt intimidated by this act and Mike released his "Looking back With Love", and 2 others, Carl and his 2 solo LPs as well. A ripple effect. 

Depends on your idea of mainstream. The music wasn't mainstream. But it was released on a major label, with major promotion, and was reviewed in all the high profile rock press, Rolling Stone gave it two great reviews in '77, and it outsold the BB's releases that followed in '78/79. The comparisons to Brian aren't out of context, in '77 the reviews compared him to Brian and Lennon and Bowie and Springsteen. Most said what he was doing was way better than what the BB's were doing. So, mainstream, definitely not as far as content, but it was at least as mainstream in profile as anything by the BB's during that period.