TLOS DVD

[Loaf]

That's why boot traders will always exist, because there are fans who want the unedited version. The version that maybe has more wrong-notes but more feeling.

I don't give a crud about post-dubbed live songs, but my hundreds (perhaps tens, not hundreds) of live boots of my favourite bands keeps me happy.

[shelter]

On a John Fogerty "live" DVD, he flubbed a line and said, "Oh that's ok, they'll fix that in the studio."

I have a live DVD by Reel Big Fish and one of the bonus features on it is a short documentary about how they overdubbed and fixed the live recordings in the studio! I thought that was cool, at least they're honest...

[the captain]

One of Queen's live albums - I think the first one - has no overdubs whatsoever.

And it sucks.

It's suckiness has more to do with the unnecessary--but oh-so-70s--inclusion of the guitar-with-echo solo. So boring ... Brian May is a great guitarist, but he's much more interesting in context than "ooh, going up a scale and the echo harmonizes!" Snnnnooooooorrrrrre. (I like some parts of that album, though. "Don't Stop Me Now" and the fast "We Will Rock You" are energetic.)

[Mahalo]

The perfomance on the DVD was kind of lame...not the band or the music but the editing and overdubs...I respect vocal overdubs, but seems that they overdid it here. Some of it sounded EXACTLY like the CD vox...

The performance I saw at Westbury, the last show of the tour, was lightyears better than this performance. Even if Brian sounded winded his vox were more passionate in their honesty. Darian was playing a cool fuzz sounding synthesizer for parts of the show, and the audience was much more into the music. IT rocked.

For the DVD it seems Brian was playing for a bunch of Record Industry and Wilson insider shlubs who were indifferent, and the energy comes out in a watered down show on the official DVD with vox lifted directly from the CD.

Still, as true fans we should be thankful for any new Wilson recordings. Now let us pray for Pleasure Island- A Rock Fantasy!!

[Sam_BFC]

What of live TV performances, in that they can sound ok and of course can not undergo any post editing?

[Mahalo]

I don't mind, rather encourage a little post editing where necessary, but this performance seemed to have overdone it, vocally speaking, IMO.

[the captain]

What of live TV performances, in that they can sound ok and of course can not undergo any post editing?

Many aren't live and either are part live, part pre-recorded track, or are fixed after the fact. But of course nobody with half a brain would say that it isn't possible to play live, have it recorded, and sound good. It's just that most artists, TV and record execs and their respective hordes of evildoers have long-since gone the way of touching things up. Not a lot different than photoshopping a gorgeous woman on a magazine cover. Why? She's beautiful! But hey, that's life. It's how it's done.

[Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll]

DVD is well worth getting overall i reckon...

The doc felt a bit staged to me. Feel like I'm being conned a lot of the time.

Really liked the behind the scenes studio footage even if again a lot of it seems for the camera.

Don't know why Brian's people feel the need to keep pushing him as the "pet sound brian" ie. contantly shouting directions and running about. "oh look, brian's back and he is loving every moment".  He looks like he doesn't want to be there most of the time.

I also liked Zooey Deschanel 

[Amy B.]

Billy Hinsche is the one who said (in the doc) that Brian is acting like his 24-year-old self again. I don't think anyone else made that claim. I thought he looked very excited and happy to be there, particularly compared to the BWPS footage (where he didn't look miserable, but he didn't look too enthusiastic either). It would be interesting to have film of Brian in the studio in the 60s (I know there's audio), just to see how the body language compares. I believe the whole thing about him being excited to do TLOS.

I don't think it's too easy to stage things with Brian. That would be a lot of staging.

[Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll]

Its not that they are saying it but they are trying to make it look that way.

I think that Brian has probably been more excited by TLOS than he has by anything else he has done since the Paley sessions. I just think think they try exaggerate it when they really don't need to. Sometimes it seems like band members are saying "hey bri, what will I play here" when id imagine they get on with it themselves when the camera is not there.

Just my opinion (i'm usually wrong)

Billy Hinsche is the one who said (in the doc) that Brian is acting like his 24-year-old self again. I don't think anyone else made that claim. I thought he looked very excited and happy to be there, particularly compared to the BWPS footage (where he didn't look miserable, but he didn't look too enthusiastic either). It would be interesting to have film of Brian in the studio in the 60s (I know there's audio), just to see how the body language compares. I believe the whole thing about him being excited to do TLOS.

I don't think it's too easy to stage things with Brian. That would be a lot of staging.

[Amy B.]

Sometimes it seems like band members are saying "hey bri, what will I play here" when id imagine they get on with it themselves when the camera is not there.

Just my opinion (i'm usually wrong)

If I were in Brian's band, I would ask Brian what to play. It's his record and his music. If he said , "Whatever you think," then I'd play whatever I thought. If he had an idea, I'd go with it. He's still Brian Wilson, and he's still able to come up with better ideas than non-Brian Wilsons when he's inspired. Scott may have written the intro to MAD, but that's not where the best chords in the song are, is it?

I think if a lot of that were staged, you wouldn't have band members saying in interviews that Brian came up with this "money chords" or that they all stood around the piano while Brian worked out harmonies. I don't think they'd lie about that. I'm not saying Brian came up with everything, but I don't think the doc claimed that. People want to see Brian at work, and that's what it showed.

[Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll]

I don't think you are getting what I'm trying to say. I'm not talking about the writing process at all. Anyway I'm sticking with my point of view so there 

Sometimes it seems like band members are saying "hey bri, what will I play here" when id imagine they get on with it themselves when the camera is not there.

Just my opinion (i'm usually wrong)

If I were in Brian's band, I would ask Brian what to play. It's his record and his music. If he said , "Whatever you think," then I'd play whatever I thought. If he had an idea, I'd go with it. He's still Brian Wilson, and he's still able to come up with better ideas than non-Brian Wilsons when he's inspired. Scott may have written the intro to MAD, but that's not where the best chords in the song are, is it?

I think if a lot of that were staged, you wouldn't have band members saying in interviews that Brian came up with this "money chords" or that they all stood around the piano while Brian worked out harmonies. I don't think they'd lie about that. I'm not saying Brian came up with everything, but I don't think the doc claimed that. People want to see Brian at work, and that's what it showed.

[Amy B.]

I thought you were talking about the arranging ("what should I play here). Well anyway, the creative process.
It doesn't really matter. We can speculate all we want to. The only people who really know are the people who were there.

[Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll]

I'd guess its a bipolar thing too. Someday's he would probably come in and be really up for it and others he wouldn't give a foda.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I haven't seen this DVD yet, so I cannot comment, but the documentary footage from BWPS and (especially) Imagination certainly was staged.

[Roger Ryan]

The TLOS documentary footage looks very real to me. Given that there's probably at least an hour's worth of compiled footage, there's no way you could try and stage that much and get a "performance" out of Brian if he didn't want to be there. I think the doc is very representative of what goes on in the studio. Brian is told when and how the strings will be used (no attempt to try and show him in charge of this) and the musicians bring a lot of their own suggestions to the recording. At the same time, Brian has very specific things he wants to hear and get down on tape. When Darian or Scott or whoever ask him how something should be played, Brian has a definite opinion. And you better believe it's real when Brian tells various band members to "shut up" so he can hear the details in a playback.

The difference these days, apart from the obvious mental illness aspects, is that I think Brian is simply doing a job (albeit one he enjoys) as opposed to bursting with passion to record like he did in the early to mid-60s. That happens to everyone, folks.

[the captain]

Brian is simply doing a job (albeit one he enjoys) as opposed to bursting with passion to record like he did in the early to mid-60s. That happens to everyone, folks.

I agree. But that's an unacceptable position to most fans, who demand of Brian either sheer brilliance or enslavement to evil captors. There can be no admittedly uninspired (although solid, professional) product. That usually isn't an option here.

[variable2]

There was even a scene in the doc that had 2 of his band members trying something with the piano strings on Oxygen (if I remember correctly), and after a while they stop because "Brian didn't like it".  "Wilson Veto"

[Bean Bag]

I just picked this up yesterday.  Thought I'd dig it, after really getting into TLOS these past few weeks.  It's good.  Much digging.  I've already watched the concert twice.  It's nice to have a different version/performance of the album.  It's funny how I like certain songs more on the DVD and certain songs more on the CD.  It's nice to have different recordings and different perspectives on things you like -- you get to hear things in one, not noticeable in the other.  I wish every album had two versions.  Great sound quality on this DVD, too. 

I was really enjoying Pet Sounds Live, yesterday as well.  It's so awesome to have a live, energetic, updated and contemporary version of PS.  A nice variation on an old cozy slipper.

I haven't watched any of the bonus goodies on the TLOS DVD yet.  QUESTION:  Is there any need to pick up the CD/DVD version?

[TdHabib]

I haven't watched any of the bonus goodies on the TLOS DVD yet.  QUESTION:  Is there any need to pick up the CD/DVD version?

No, the bonus features on the CD/DVD version are just snippets from the documentary stuff on the TLOS DVD you have....

[c-man]

I haven't watched any of the bonus goodies on the TLOS DVD yet.  QUESTION:  Is there any need to pick up the CD/DVD version?

No, the bonus features on the CD/DVD version are just snippets from the documentary stuff on the TLOS DVD you have....

There's actually a couple of little things on the CD/DVD version DVD that are not on the full-length DVD version.  For instatnce, some of the footage that's apparently from the first days' session, where Brian and the guys are in a little huddle. 

[sofonanm]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure nearly every concert DVD or live album is post-dubbed and fixed up...

Yep--and they have been since the dawn of live pop/rock records. Anyone who feels betrayed probably better just get used to it, because that's how it is, was and ever shall be. Every now and again you'll see one that makes a point of saying "No overdubs" or something, but those are the exception rather than the rule.

First notable exception that came to mind was Nirvana's Unplugged concert and (if it applies to this discussion) their electric live album which was a compilation - From the Muddy Banks of the Wishkah. On Unplugged, I think there's one flub which they edited out (Kurt hitting a wrong note on his guitar in Pennyroyal Tea) and maybe lowered some of his vocals in the mix on two Meat Puppets' songs. Other than that, and splicing out bullshit between songs, there doesn't seem to be any overdubbing or excessive editing. On the electric live album, some of the worst performances they ever did are included in all their disgusting glory.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Queen's first live album was warts-n-all... and it sucks.