Brian's mental history

[adamghost]

I've been in the same room with Brian 3-4 times, but I  only met him once, in 1993-94, before we had any friends in common.  I happened to blunder into a restaurant where he and Melinda were playing pool.  I mustered the courage to go talk to him but was struck utterly dumb.  Brian took complete control of the conversation, shook my hand, and same some very warm and encouraging things to me.  It was every fanboy's dream of meeting Brian Wilson.  The guy did really come off like God in every respect.  No awkwardness, just kindness, quite pride, and compassion.

Point being, it was one on one, in a non-threatening environment that he felt comfortable in, and a situation he was in control of, so he could relax and be himself and more than that, be authoritative.  I've never seen him like that in any of the public situations I've encountered him in, but I've heard the same said of him from people that know him personally.

I don't doubt that he has good days and bad days from a chemical standpoint, but I also don't doubt that where he feels comfortable, he flourishes.  I totally get that.  And the more I learn about the life the guy's led the more I'm in awe of his survival skills.

[endofposts]

I've also wondered about the possibility of a stroke, but I usually end of doubting it for two reasons. First, after the possible stroke, Brian was running over 5 miles a day. That's not a walk in the park, even for non-stroke 45+ year old people. Now, that's still possible after a stroke, look at the New England Patriots Teddy Brusci. He returned to the NFL after a stroke. But Landy was on thin ice at the time, and for him to not find out and/or not disclose it - and, to be working Brian out like that -  well, that would've been crossing the line, even for Landy.

Second, and this is not a knock at Melinda, so don't attack me! I'm sure Melinda has had Brian checked out from head (and I repeat head) to toe - at least a couple of times. If Brian had a stroke, I believe that she would've disclosed it in an interview. She's been very forthcoming with her comments on Brian's condition. And, come to think about it, so has Brian. The stroke diagnosis would've come out.

Melinda also had a special press release when "Imagination" came out that Brian only suffers from depression, and was taking one drug, Luvox, for that condition.  Brian told TV Guide, of all magazines, that he takes not less than four drugs for his mental conditions, including at least one antipsychotic drug, as well as an anti-seizure medication.  I don't know if Melinda is the be-all, tell-all person for Brian's condition, whatever it is.  That's fine, though it might be better for her to say nothing at all than underplay the severity of Brian's problems. 

[MBE]

When I spoke to Brian in 1999 he was very nice, and answered all my questions without too much of a struggle. He was a little brief but his memory was pretty good. I think he felt comfortable with me, and I felt that way about him. Let's just say I was happily surprised by his lucidity.  Yet seeing Brian at the Kennedy honors was kind of scary. Perhaps he was nervous but I just thought in my mind how different he had been in 1976 at the Rock Awards and 1977 at the Grammy's. There his eyes were focused, he seemed in the moments, even exhibted humor and warmth. Then you go back even earlier to all the clips and home movies from 62-71 and he seems like such a normal fun loving guy. I can't help but be sad, even though I am happy he is here. I just feel bad because most people have no way of understanding why he acts like he does now at times. It just makes me sad that he lost so much of his personality.

[Doo Dah]

Beyond the music and its' majesty, I think that many of us could admit that the personal traumas and dramas in Brian's life play a role in our obsession with his career. I'm fortunate to have seen every US tour since the first, having even obtained an autograph (pictured) at the Cleveland Smile show, yet I've seen many instances where I've been both exhilarated and saddened by his fragile state. Such as the post-show autograph session; we were standing in a long line, and someone in his crew was instructing him to smile for photos whenever a fan handed someone a camera for a quick snap. It was almost reminiscent of a Landy-era commando instructing him how and when to react. For pete's sake, he just finished a show and now he's supposed to smile and play the genial host before a long line of fans. I was happy to get the autograph, but in a way I almost felt complicent in the charade when someone snapped the two of us together. I said a few words to him, but I didn't get the feeling that he heard me or was in the moment at all.

What was really telling was when I was fortunate to see the stripped down 6-piece version of the band at the very intimate Red Rock Casino outside of Vancouver this past August. Brian was reaaaly loose and into it - cracking wise with the audience and truly enjoying his stage time. Interestingly enough however, you could see and feel his energy drop when he returned for the Thursday night encore - he was almost another person, very down and kind of mailing it in (ala GIOMH). Having seen Thursday's show, I decided to return to Friday's show as well, and the energy level was back way up, and Brian remained that way throughout the evening, even clowning around a bit on stage during the curtain call. I'm glad I saw the Friday show, since it placed a fitting coda on my two day's worth of concerts.

Not being a physician nor playing one on tv, I could only guess that he experiences peaks and valleys and his medication while helpful is still an inexact science. When he's into it, he's INTO it but when you throw in lights, cameras and presidents he's liable to shut down and withdraw. I too was so proud of his honor, but saddened at the same time since I would have loved to see him joking with Martin and 'reacting' to the show.

Such a puzzle. Like a rubik's cube, you can't solve it!

[MBE]

It is such a puzzle and you know the "truth" we are told about Brian today isn't the whole story. Yet in some respects this doesn't matter. He is still making some very good music and I just hope his moments of personal happiness aren't few and far between.

[Fun Is In]

I had the opportunity to ask someone who has been a practicing audilogist for 30+ years and has met a lot of hearing impaired or deaf people if they were familiar with people compensating for one sided hearing loss by talking out of the side of their mouth. They said "no, never" and thought the concept rather amusing. That doesn't disprove the theory, but it does cast some doubt on it.

[Amy B.]

Point being, it was one on one, in a non-threatening environment that he felt comfortable in, and a situation he was in control of, so he could relax and be himself and more than that, be authoritative.  I've never seen him like that in any of the public situations I've encountered him in, but I've heard the same said of him from people that know him personally.

I don't doubt that he has good days and bad days from a chemical standpoint, but I also don't doubt that where he feels comfortable, he flourishes.  I totally get that.  And the more I learn about the life the guy's led the more I'm in awe of his survival skills.

Yes, this is the point I was trying to make. I have never met Brian, but I got a Katrina phone call from him. His call came early and I wasn't ready with a question.  I was also very nervous. I asked him a fairly bad question on the spot that elicited a five-word answer. He was so, so kind and gracious about it and must have sensed that I didn't have my act together, because he asked if I had another question.  This was not a person who was afraid to have a conversation or was being forced into talking. On the other hand, I think Brian was decidedly uncomfortable at the KC Honors. Maybe he was having a bad day, or maybe the situation was just too much for him. I will again point out that he cracked a smile a couple of times and did seem moved at times (look at his reaction to the Libera performance again.) Hopefully he was able to enjoy it and what it meant in retrospect.

Another thing: Brian has been to awards shows in recent years, and we don't know how he acts during awards shows in general because the camera is not constantly on him. This could just be the way he is at long shows that require a good attention span and put the spotlight on him.

[southbay]

As many suspect, Brian quite possibly did suffer a stroke.  However, don't forget that there are instances of him talking out of the side of his mouth in a VERY pronounced manner as early as '76 or '77.  All you have to do is go back to the American Band video (which is possibly incorporating the It's OK footage) for clear evidence.  Then, for whatever reason, he seemed to stop this tick for some time.  It seems to appear again rather noticeably at least by 1983, then maybe disappears again in the mid 80's only to resurface yet again.

[Andrew G. Doe]

When I spoke to Brian in 1999 he was very nice, and answered all my questions without too much of a struggle. He was a little brief but his memory was pretty good. I think he felt comfortable with me, and I felt that way about him. Let's just say I was happily surprised by his lucidity.  Yet seeing Brian at the Kennedy honors was kind of scary. Perhaps he was nervous but I just thought in my mind how different he had been in 1976 at the Rock Awards and 1977 at the Grammy's. There his eyes were focused, he seemed in the moments, even exhibted humor and warmth. Then you go back even earlier to all the clips and home movies from 62-71 and he seems like such a normal fun loving guy. I can't help but be sad, even though I am happy he is here. I just feel bad because most people have no way of understanding why he acts like he does now at times. It just makes me sad that he lost so much of his personality.

I've met Brian several times over the last 20-odd years, in varying situations, ranging from the social, through 'work' (i.e studio) to the post-gig meet & greets, and in that time I've seen all facets of him from regualr (and hugely funny) guy to near-zombie. Hard as this may seem, Brian is usually at his worst in the meets - he's just done a gig, he's tired and the last thing he really wants to do is shake hands with XX strangers. But he does it, because he knows it's expected of him. Only once have I personally seen him come alive during these ordeals, and that was when someone with evident physical and neurological problems came up to him. In an instant he opened up and was compassion itself. It was very touching.

In the studio, I've seen a man immersed in his music and thus freed from socialising - many would say this is the 'real' Brian Wilson. It's something everyone should see.

And finally, in a social, or semi-social setting, surrounded by family and trusted friends, I've experienced the Brian we all wish he could be all the time - relaxed, chatty, funny and possessed of an incredible memory. It was at once both heartening and chastening. But mostly it was just plain wonderful to see.

[the captain]

Go to any high school or college speech class and see how people look when they're asked to simply stand in front of a dozen to two dozen people and speak. Being noticed in public scares most people. It's an unnatural situation to be so conspicuous.

While I have no problem speaking, personally, I'm willing to bet I'd look like an absolute idiot* if I were dressed up, placed in a seat of honor, forced to watch a show in tribute to me and knew I was being watched the entire time. It's not hard to see why Brian Wilson might have looked uncomfortable during the show.


*Some people might want to note that I'm prone to this anyway.

[Sheriff John Stone]

This post is all over the place. I apologize in advance.

It's possible (likely?) that Brian had taken some medication - perfectly legal, medically sound, appropriate - before the Kennedy Honors show to calm him down and/or keep him at an even keel for three hours. Thus, the lack of expressions.

Of course we are speculating; not being doctors or having examined Brian we couldn't possibly know for sure. But, some COMMON SENSE can be applied here. For me, it goes all the way back to the Mike Douglas Show in 1976, the first time I saw Brian on TV (unless it was the NBC TV special). What I saw was a very troubled and damaged man. How troubled and how damaged I had no way of knowing. And, it basically NEVER CHANGED. There have been periods/instances that have been better than others. But, the damage was pretty much done by 1976. The rest are just spurts of more damage and some recovery. But there was no cure.

I've also always believed that Brian's music - or the lack of quality of the music post 1976 -is a DIRECT consequence of his illness/damage. I don't subscribe to the lack of interest/not caring/sabotaging the group/boredom theories. As always - including the 1962-1966 period - what you hear is a real reflection of Brian the person. Something's wrong.

And, finally, again, if Brian had a stroke, somehow, IT WOULD'VE GOTTEN OUT. We would know about it. Somehow.

[pixletwin]

In the Sawyer interview with Landy and Brian, did anyone else pick up on the mystery person being interviewed in shadows as Melinda?

This has been a very interesting thread. I especially appreciated AGD's comments about different aspects of Brian's personality in different situations.

[The Goat]

While I have no problem speaking, personally, I'm willing to bet I'd look like an absolute idiot* if I were dressed up, placed in a seat of honor, forced to watch a show in tribute to me and knew I was being watched the entire time. It's not hard to see why Brian Wilson might have looked uncomfortable during the show.


*Some people might want to note that I'm prone to this anyway.

Love the disclaimer (Bwaa-haaa!)...and totally agree with it's accompanying paragraph.  Brian's mercifully modest and not accustomed to long praisefests.  Remember his brief, cut-to-the-chase acceptance speech at the Musicares Tribute?

[endofposts]

As for the stroke speculation:  hasn't even Brian himself said publicly that he suffers from brain damage related to long-term drug and alcohol abuse?   Since the damage from a stroke is brain damage, maybe his non-stroke-caused brain damage manifests itself in some ways as if he had had a stroke.  (I hope that makes sense.) 

[Sheriff John Stone]

As for the stroke speculation:  hasn't even Brian himself said publicly that he suffers from brain damage related to long-term drug and alcohol abuse?   Since the damage from a stroke is brain damage, maybe his non-stroke-caused brain damage manifests itself in some ways as if he had had a stroke.  (I hope that makes sense.) 

That I will agree with. Even though brain damage from drug use is different from an actual stoke, it does LOOK like he had a stroke.

Signed, Dr. John Stone

[endofposts]

As for the stroke speculation:  hasn't even Brian himself said publicly that he suffers from brain damage related to long-term drug and alcohol abuse?   Since the damage from a stroke is brain damage, maybe his non-stroke-caused brain damage manifests itself in some ways as if he had had a stroke.  (I hope that makes sense.) 

That I will agree with. Even though brain damage from drug use is different from an actual stoke, it does LOOK like he had a stroke.

Signed, Dr. John Stone

LOL, I'm also not really a doctor, and I don't even play one on TV!   If Brian's drug use was anywhere near where it was hinted at in bios, he might be in uncharted territory, so new rules might apply.  Also, posters here have said he suffers from tardive dyskinesia from using old-type psych meds.  The newer types of psych meds also have side effects that mimic some symptoms of Parkinson's disease, including having a shuffling walk and having a face that can look like an inexpressive mask (sound familiar?).  I'm sure Brian has been on all types of different medications over the years,  and the side effects can stay after the medications are stopped.   It's just lucky he's alive; I'm sure he and his family can live with any relatively minor side effects. 

[Chris Brown]

I had the opportunity to ask someone who has been a practicing audilogist for 30+ years and has met a lot of hearing impaired or deaf people if they were familiar with people compensating for one sided hearing loss by talking out of the side of their mouth. They said "no, never" and thought the concept rather amusing. That doesn't disprove the theory, but it does cast some doubt on it.

That's really interesting DoveNest...I can't remember where Brian gave this explanation (maybe his "autobiography"), but I've seen a few pictures of him when he was younger talking out of the side of his mouth.  One comes to mind where he is in the studio wearing a blue hawaiian shirt, you can see his mouth leaning to one side.  Might have been from the Lei'd sessions in '67.

Maybe I'm just seeing things, who knows?  I certainly defer to what the guy you asked said, but I wonder why else Brian might have been talking like this at such a young age?

[sherryluvsbrian]

In the Sawyer interview with Landy and Brian, did anyone else pick up on the mystery person being interviewed in shadows as Melinda?



I sure did. I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed It was melinda. Didn't they say the woman in the shadows worked for landy or a company of some sort. Melinda was not around at that time of brians life. Very strange

[MBE]

This post is all over the place. I apologize in advance.

It's possible (likely?) that Brian had taken some medication - perfectly legal, medically sound, appropriate - before the Kennedy Honors show to calm him down and/or keep him at an even keel for three hours. Thus, the lack of expressions.

Of course we are speculating; not being doctors or having examined Brian we couldn't possibly know for sure. But, some COMMON SENSE can be applied here. For me, it goes all the way back to the Mike Douglas Show in 1976, the first time I saw Brian on TV (unless it was the NBC TV special). What I saw was a very troubled and damaged man. How troubled and how damaged I had no way of knowing. And, it basically NEVER CHANGED. There have been periods/instances that have been better than others. But, the damage was pretty much done by 1976. The rest are just spurts of more damage and some recovery. But there was no cure.

I've also always believed that Brian's music - or the lack of quality of the music post 1976 -is a DIRECT consequence of his illness/damage. I don't subscribe to the lack of interest/not caring/sabotaging the group/boredom theories. As always - including the 1962-1966 period - what you hear is a real reflection of Brian the person. Something's wrong.

And, finally, again, if Brian had a stroke, somehow, IT WOULD'VE GOTTEN OUT. We would know about it. Somehow.

Very good points made here about Brian from 1976 on. It's just sad that he was so much better on Mike Douglas then now even though there was already noticable damage then.


Btw look at the Jack Benny sketch from 1965 Brian talks out of the side of his mouth even then. The difference is his vocal intonations and reactions to what's going on around him are normal.

[carl r]

I find this thread very interesting. I note that Brian's friends from the 60s, who shared their drugs in the first place with him, don't appear to have had the same obvious behavioral problems. Same goes for most of the other rock stars from the period. The ones who physically survived can now afford the various therapies to keep themselves going. So from what I can tell it was Landy that did much of the damage to Brian.

The problems that Brian's experienced has to be placed in the context of how society deals with any kind of mental illness - being from the UK, I can say this treatment is pretty appalling. People are generally left to wander around most of the day, until something bad happens.   As drug use has increased since the 60s the issues raised by Brian Wilson's condition may become much more widespread. Therefore, Brian's comeback in the last few years has positive implications for a lot of people!

[Fun Is In]

You can see Brian singing out of the side of his mouth in black-and-white video of concerts from 65 or earlier (maybe the TAMI show?)......so it does go back a long way. There's probably a long list of things that can lead to this. The ones that come to mind for me (from what I've seen inn people I know) are personal quirk or weakness of the facial muscles (on the side that doesn't go up when smiling or singing) due to nerve or brain fault.

You'd really have to study him closely in old video to see how early, how much, how often and in what circumstances there is facial assymetry to get a better picture of things.

[Quincy]

In Paul Williams book...Paul and David A. say he always talked out of the side of his mouth in the sixties

[37!ws]

Sorry to add to this already-long and already-old thread, but...CARNIE talks out of the side of her mouth sometimes, too, so it's probably some kind of hereditary habit...

Now...the clincher...do we have evidence of Carl or Dennis ever doing that?? You see, we notice it from Brian because we EXPECT him to be quirky!

[Aegir]

I never noticed that from Carnie, and I do expect her to be quirky. I mean, she has a sexual addiction to chocolate. I'm sure if she took drugs she'd be just as weird as her pop.

[Amy B.]

I never noticed that from Carnie, and I do expect her to be quirky. I mean, she has a sexual addiction to chocolate. I'm sure if she took drugs she'd be just as weird as her pop.

She _did_ take drugs, at least marijuana, for years, according to her. If you believe everything she says, she also has an addition to food (pretty obvious) and alcohol. And she suffered from post-partem depression and possibly depression at other times in her life. I'm kind of inclined to believe her, given her family history. She doesn't seem to be as weird as Brian, but she does seem to share a few personality traits with him. I never noticed her talking out of the side of her mouth, though. I thought I read somewhere that Audree used to do it.