BB relationship with Van Dyke Parks

[Magic Transistor Radio]

I know mostly about Mike's negative response to Van Dyke's lyrics, but I was curious about how he got along with Mike, Al, Carl, Dennis and Bruce individually. I know that he worked with the BB in the early 70s a bit. Has he ever voiced his opinion on BB factions in the 70s or later at all? Or has he kept out of that?

[Alex]

I know he's said he doesn't like Mike Love. The ironic thing is that he played accordion on "Kokomo".

[c-man]

I know he's said he doesn't like Mike Love. The ironic thing is that he played accordion on "Kokomo".

As well as some cuts on the "Summer In Paradise" album.  Mike has always maintained that he likes Van (just doesn't understand some of his lyrics).  Van said once that when he did the session for the "Summer In Paradise" tracks, he and Mike shared a plane ride out, and he started to think that Mike wasn't such a bad guy, but then Mike was supposed to reimburse him the cost and never did. 

[Sheriff John Stone]

Van said once that when he did the session for the "Summer In Paradise" tracks, he and Mike shared a plane ride out, and he started to think that Mike wasn't such a bad guy...

That opinion apparently didn't last too long, because, just a few years later, during the BWPS promotions/interviews, Parks had a lot of negative things to say about Mike Love.

[c-man]

Van said once that when he did the session for the "Summer In Paradise" tracks, he and Mike shared a plane ride out, and he started to think that Mike wasn't such a bad guy...

That opinion apparently didn't last too long, because, just a few years later, during the BWPS promotions/interviews, Parks had a lot of negative things to say about Mike Love.

Yeah, I think it pretty much ended after that plane ride.

[c-man]

Carl and Dennis maintained aquaintence with Van in the '70s, occasionally collaborating with him.  Van played the organ at Carl's funeral.

[punkinhead]

was there any of carl's songs played at the funeral?

[Jon Stebbins]

In my conversations with him Van Dyke has projected a great fondness for Dennis in particular. He talked about Brian playing the Surf's Up piece for he and Dennis before it was recorded. Also how Dennis was supportive of his brothers.

[endofposts]

Van said once that when he did the session for the "Summer In Paradise" tracks, he and Mike shared a plane ride out, and he started to think that Mike wasn't such a bad guy...

That opinion apparently didn't last too long, because, just a few years later, during the BWPS promotions/interviews, Parks had a lot of negative things to say about Mike Love.

Yeah, I think it pretty much ended after that plane ride.

I think it ended when Van Dyke got the bill for the plane ride.  Mike made the offer to share a private plane,  which Van Dyke thought was a favor, then billed him a very high amount for his share.  That was discussed in an interview for one of the LA giveaway papers in the wake of the "American Family" film, which also upset Van Dyke.  I remember reading it while I was in LA to see Brian at the Roxy the first time, whenever that was.   The whole interview was mostly just Van Dyke trashing Mike.

[Sheriff John Stone]

Van said once that when he did the session for the "Summer In Paradise" tracks, he and Mike shared a plane ride out, and he started to think that Mike wasn't such a bad guy...

That opinion apparently didn't last too long, because, just a few years later, during the BWPS promotions/interviews, Parks had a lot of negative things to say about Mike Love.

Yeah, I think it pretty much ended after that plane ride.

I think it ended when Van Dyke got the bill for the plane ride.  Mike made the offer to share a private plane,  which Van Dyke thought was a favor, then billed him a very high amount for his share.  That was discussed in an interview for one of the LA giveaway papers in the wake of the "American Family" film, which also upset Van Dyke.  I remember reading it while I was in LA to see Brian at the Roxy the first time, whenever that was.   The whole interview was mostly just Van Dyke trashing Mike.

Not to defend Mike Love (believe it or not ), but I wonder why Parks felt it was necessary to make that story public? Of all the Beach Boys-related stories to discuss, it's interesting he would choose that one. 

[phirnis]

This might be of interest:

Van Dyke Parks Remembers Carl Wilson:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1036118

[Amy B.]

I think it ended when Van Dyke got the bill for the plane ride.  Mike made the offer to share a private plane,  which Van Dyke thought was a favor, then billed him a very high amount for his share.  That was discussed in an interview for one of the LA giveaway papers in the wake of the "American Family" film, which also upset Van Dyke.  I remember reading it while I was in LA to see Brian at the Roxy the first time, whenever that was.   The whole interview was mostly just Van Dyke trashing Mike.

Not to defend Mike Love (believe it or not ), but I wonder why Parks felt it was necessary to make that story public? Of all the Beach Boys-related stories to discuss, it's interesting he would choose that one. 

I think it was because the American Family film had just been completed. I never saw that movie, but apparently (with Mike Love's approval, presumably) it portrayed both Brian and Van Dyke in a negative light. VDP probably wasn't feeling too charitable toward Mike at that time. Maybe he had been asked about his feelings toward Mike? I can't remember.

The way I remember the plane story was that Mike explicitely said to VDP, "You call me-- here's my number-- and I'll have someone reimburse you for the plane ticket." And then VDP called the number, and it had been disconnected, so he never got reimbursed.

[c-man]

The first part of the "American Family" movie was OK and pretty accurate from what I could tell. 
The second half was a farce...Brian was portrayed as a moronic fool everywhere except in the studio, while Van Dyke's own words (quoted from numerous interviews) were used to portray him as someone who talked like he was constantly being interviewed.  It was pathetic.  If it hadn't been for Stamos, I'm sure Dennis would've been savaged as well. 

[Rich E P]

I believe the reason Van Dyke shared this story was because he was asked about it but more importantly he wanted to defend Brian Wilson who was quite hurt about the TV movie and the one-dimensional and inaccurate portrayal of both Van Dyke and Brian.  Lets not forget that the first time the movie was aired was different than subsequent broadcasts.  I have no axe to grind with Mike Love, but it is no secret that his version of events are what you see in the TV movie.  I strongly believe that much of the Smile dvd documentary "Beautiful Dreamer" was to present another viewpoint.  It would be nice to read that interview again to see the context.  It had mostly to do with the TV movie.  Van Dyke also came out to defend Dennis Wilson and the inaccurate portrayal of him in the movie.  I enjoy Van Dyke's interviews as he always comes across as a very well spoken southern gentleman.  I do agree that in this particular interview he came across as harsh towards Mike Love but I believe he was only reacting to a very skewed poorly done movie and defending both himself and his good friend.

[Rich E P]

Ignore this post.  Sorry.

[Rich E P]

Ignore this post.  Sorry.

[Uncomfortable Seat]

he and Mike shared a plane ride out

I thought it was a helicopter

[the captain]

Here is the cost-sharing-flight story, discussed in this thread mostly from recollections, as told in the April 6, 2000, issue of the New York Times (copied and pasted from vandykeparks.com). I figured it's worth having on the record.
..............

"Many years later, when [producer] Terry Melcher wanted to take the song 'Kokomo' to the tropical islands, he called me and wanted to use my Rolodex, so to speak. So, I brought some great   musician friends -- people who'd played with Sinatra, Fitzgerald, Cecil Taylor -- to play with me on that session. I was paid well for my work, although it was a nonunion session -- no hospitalization, no dental, nothing extra if it went   commercial. The Beach Boys, after all, were Republicans -- unions weren't something to mention to them. We weren't dealing with Studs Terkel. We were dealing with Bruce Johnston and Mike Love, who'd become the entity known as the Beach Boys. Of course, the song went to number one, and Mike Love always made a very big deal out of the fact that it was made without Brian Wilson. And that was always very alarming to me because beyond the Beach Boys' beautiful music, my allegiance has always been to Brian Wilson, who hired me years ago and told me he'd give me 50 percent of anything we wrote together. He said that speaking from his throne at a time when I was nobody. Isn't that the sign of a marvelous person?"

Parks recalls he saw Love one final time when Melcher called him to Monterey to play synthesizer on the Beach Boys' final album, recorded without Brian, 1992's dreadful Summer in Paradise. A neighbor offered to fly the musician to Monterey in his one-engine plane if Parks agreed to cover gas and other expenses. When he got there, Love was meditating in Melcher's living room. "For the first time in 30 years, he was able to ask me directly, once again, 'What do those lyrics -- Over and over the crow flies, uncover the cornfield -- mean?'" Parks said about that meeting in '95. "And I was  able to tell him, once again, 'I don't know.' I have no idea what those words mean. I was perhaps thinking of Van Gogh's wheat field or an idealized agrarian environment. Maybe I meant nothing, but I was trying to follow Brian Wilson's vision at that time." Parks says Love asked if he could fly back to L.A. in the plane with him. "We had a nice chat and he insisted that he wanted to split the cost of the flight with me, so he gave me a card with his number on it. The next morning, I called to discover it was a disconnected number. And that was the last time I saw Mike Love."

[Magic Transistor Radio]

Maybe Van Dyke should sue Mike and give him a taste of his own medicine.

[Dancing Bear]

it is no secret that his version of events are what you see in the TV movie.

I've never read Mike admiting he was a wife beater in any interview. 

[Cam Mott]

Why did Melcher not handle these expenses for both of them?

I'll bet a donut that American Family is director Jeff Bleckner's and writer Kirk Ellis' version of the Beach Boys' story.

[MBE]

We had a thread about this about six months ago. I said then and I say now, Mike may have been shortsighted when it came to Van Dyke's lyrics, but he has always been very nice about him publically. I wouldn't usually say this but in this case Mike has been the gentleman. I haven't thought about Van Dyke the same since that 2000 interview. BTW this doesn't mean that Van Dyke wasn't mega talented, or that he doesn't hold some fondness for the group, but there must be a reason Brian drunkedly called him the words biggest butthole in public.. Read the 1971 Rolling Stone interview, in it he sounds fairly resentful and condesending towards Brian. Look how Brian makes fun of Heroes on the Leid tape.  In short they haven't always had an easy comradarie either  Going back to AAF, Mike himself said certain things in the movie bothered him. He didn't write or make it himself. Brian signed off on the thing too. Frankly the Van Dyke character in the movie was merely comedy relief, it didn't make him look like Brian's drug dealer. An American Family is old news anyhow. It's not on DVD and thankfully it  most likely won't be. Brian's career or good name certainly didn't suffer any long term damage. As far as that BD doc I found it went too far in the other direction. It had some pretty foolish comments that made me understand why some of Brian's Smile era friends were not readily accepted.  Alan Boyd's doc and perhaps the BBC Stebbins one are the only films that give equal time to all sides coming closer to the truth in the process.

[Andrew G. Doe]

BTW this doesn't mean that Van Dyke wasn't mega talented, or that he doesn't hold some fondness for the group, but there must be a reason Brian drunkedly called him the words biggest butthole in public..

There was - Brian was totally off his face. I gather that when he was told about it afterwards, he was mortified.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Going back to AAF, Mike himself said certain things in the movie bothered him. He didn't write or make it himself.

His name's not on it, granted, but that doesn't mean he didn't have a huge influence over what appeared onscreen.

[Dancing Bear]

I believe Mike was interviewed by the writers and told them his side of the history. You all know the plot: hangers on, most successful partnership, Mr. Positivity etc. How the writers took this info from him and from other sources and wrote THAT script is anyone's guess. I have a hard time visualizing Mike, late at night on the set, writing the dialogues on his computer. Maybe Mike is an evil genius and he inserted those parts in the script that made him look bad just to confuse us. Oh that Mike...

Meanwhile Mike's had his chance to tell his side to the world in that Mojo's interview circa 2004.