Dennis Wilson - WIBNTLA Grammy Discussion

[Jonas]

AL GOMES, who is campaigning to get Dennis Wilson on the 2008 Grammy Ballot for the first time ever as a composer for Dennis' song 'Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again.'

Doesn't the song have to be released first?

[Andrew G. Doe]

It has.

[Jonas]

I don't consider a covered version of an unreleased song to be an official release. But I guess the grammy is for composition and not recording.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I don't consider a covered version of an unreleased song to be an official release. But I guess the grammy is for composition and not recording.

I wasn't aware that amazon.com had a policy of selling bootlegs or pirated recordings. I guess you feel the same way about Manfred Mann's "The Mighty Quinn"... or Brian's version of "Soul Searchin'".

[Jonas]

Not following...

[Andrew G. Doe]

Manfred Mann's hit version of "Quinn" was taken from the then-unreleased basement tapes. Brian's version of "SS" is a cover of the unreleased original.

[Susan]

Manfred Mann's hit version of "Quinn" was taken from the then-unreleased basement tapes. Brian's version of "SS" is a cover of the unreleased original.

Did Solomon Burke's version of SS come out before Brian's?

Al *is* a full voting and nominating member of the Academy, so he would know if the song is eligible or not.  He believes it is...and you'll have to come along to the convention to hear the whole story!
:-)

[Andrew G. Doe]

Seems totally black & white to me. Song's been released. Dennis & Stan wrote it. End of.

[Emdeeh]

I don't consider a covered version of an unreleased song to be an official release. But I guess the grammy is for composition and not recording.

Sure it is. The Chaos Band's version constitutes an official release of the song, as far as I'm concerned.

[Jonas]

Agree to disagree.

[Andrew G. Doe]

OK, so explain to me why Adam's cover of an unreleased song released on a legitimate CD is 'unofficial', or for that matter why Manfred Mann's cover of the equally-then-unreleased "Mighty Quinn" on an equally legitimate 45 is also, according to your Olympian pronouncement, 'unofficial ?

You talking nonsense, and you know it.

[Jonas]

No, because in my opinion to release an official recording of a song, you'd release the original that was played and sung by the original members/artist/writer. Yes, the cover version is an official release, in terms that its not a bootleg but a "legitimate" record label release. But its not the official release of the actual song which Dennis had nothing to do with it. Remember this is my opinion.

Therefore, I don't see how Dennis Wilson can win a Grammy for a RECORDING because its not his, its someone else. Thats why in my initial post I pointed out that I guess it doesn't matter what I'm saying because they want to nominate him for COMPOSITION and not RECORDING.

So to go over what I just said...yes the Chaos Band's cover is a legitimate release, however I don't think its an official release that should be considered for a Grammy. If Dennis Wilson's estate wants to win a grammy, they should release the actual recording.

I would say the same thing if Brian had nothing to do with BWPS, but because he's around to work on it, and it's his voice on there, I consider it an official release. If the Wondermints would've played the whole thing with no Brian participation, it would just be a cover album to me.

[Alan Boyd]

If the Chaos Band release of that song wasn't official, then why did I go to the trouble of getting permission and paying a mechanical royalty to the publisher?

Hmmm.... silly me.   

AB

[Andrew G. Doe]

No, because in my opinion to release an official recording of a song, you'd release the original that was played and sung by the original members/artist/writer. Yes, the cover version is an official release, in terms that its not a bootleg but a "legitimate" record label release. But its not the official release of the actual song which Dennis had nothing to do with it. Remember this is my opinion.

Therefore, I don't see how Dennis Wilson can win a Grammy for a RECORDING because its not his, its someone else. Thats why in my initial post I pointed out that I guess it doesn't matter what I'm saying because they want to nominate him for COMPOSITION and not RECORDING.

So to go over what I just said...yes the Chaos Band's cover is a legitimate release, however I don't think its an official release that should be considered for a Grammy. If Dennis Wilson's estate wants to win a grammy, they should release the actual recording.

I would say the same thing if Brian had nothing to do with BWPS, but because he's around to work on it, and it's his voice on there, I consider it an official release. If the Wondermints would've played the whole thing with no Brian participation, it would just be a cover album to me.

Congratulations on not only talking yourself into a corner, but also doing it in fluent drivel. The post that started all this stated quite clearly that the hoped-for grammy nomination would be for Dennis as a composer.

What about all the classical Grammys - no way any of those can be, in your ludicrous definition, 'official' recordings as Beethoven/Mozart/Elgar/[insert your classical composer of choice here] patently had nothing to do with them.

Your ability to demonstarate that black is indeed white, coupled with a total lack of commonsense would seem to indicate a career in politics.

And yes, I've never been able to pass up the chance of shooting a fish in a barrel. Especially one that hands me the shells.

[Jonas]

I don't consider a covered version of an unreleased song to be an official release. But I guess the grammy is for composition and not recording.

This was my second post in the thread, you just wanted to show your pretentious smug self again by starting a ridiculous argument of "black and white" as if everything is said here is fact even though I've indicated that its all in MY OWN OPINION which you obviously cannot comprehend. Don't you have scripture to read?

[Wilsonista]

Joe, with all due respect, by your logic, Bruce Johnston  should not have won his Grammy for I Write The Songs because Barry's hit version predated Bruce's own version.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I don't consider a covered version of an unreleased song to be an official release. But I guess the grammy is for composition and not recording.

This was my second post in the thread, you just wanted to show your pretentious smug self again by starting a ridiculous argument of "black and white" as if everything is said here is fact even though I've indicated that its all in MY OWN OPINION which you obviously cannot comprehend. Don't you have scripture to read?

Nope - not my bag. Anyway, I'm too ignorant to comprehend it - you say so, thus it must be true. 

[Jonas]

Although you're correct, I think we're talking about two different things. Bruce Johnston did win the composition Grammy for the song that he wrote for someone else. My original post was a mistake on my part thinking the Grammy was going for a recording of the song. I then clarified myself when I wrote that it's different of what I was thinking because they want to nominate him for composition. I stated this twice already.

AGD started going off tangent talking about how the Chaos version is official because it was legitimately released. And I agree, that it is a legitimate release, however to ME (Joe), I would give the title OFFICIAL recording to the one Dennis did however long ago.

So when I said, how can you give an award to an unreleased song, I was specifically talking about Dennis' version...because since that recording exists, to me, its the official one, and you can release as many covers as you want, but none of them are going to be the official one. I feel like I'm saying official a lot.

Yes, Dennis can win composition Grammy for the Chaos' cover of the song, but lets be honest, thats somewhat of a flake. Release the freakin song already and let him get nominated for his recording, the version he put his heart and soul into. Not to discredit the Chaos' effort...just sayin.

And in the end, as I've stated over and over and over and over again...this is all my opinion.

[Jonas]

Yeah, sorry about going off tangent Susan...I can move these posts to another thread if you wish. Just PM me and let me know.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Can't we all just get along?

[SG7]

We should have a 3 page thread on why they are so special 

[Andrew G. Doe]

Can't we all just get along?

'Course not. This is a Beach Boys forum, dammit ! 

[Val]

Sigh....

[MBE]

 

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

'Course not. This is a Beach Boys forum, dammit !