Brian as a co-writer in the late 60s, 70s

[the captain]

Has anyone heard or read about what it was like to be a co-writer with Brian in the late 60s and early 70s? It seems to me that he and others have talked about co-writing up through Pet Sounds and Smile, but I don't remember having seen a lot afterward.

Specifically, I wonder whether it was really Brian and [Al, Carl, Mike or whoever] sitting down and writing, or (as I kind of suspect) one or the other doing something, then passing it along to be worked on by the other. I don't really have a solid reason for that suspicion, more just the vibe of what I've heard and read from those days. It seems more likely for Brian to say to Al (for example), "here's a chord progression and melody I was working on..." and for Al to finish it while Brian was off being Brian on his own. Or, conversely, for someone else to be doing something and for Brian to solve a musical problem or add a part here or there just because he heard it and felt like it.

Anyone who can add something based on an interview, etc., I'd really appreciate it.

[MBE]

Al has said in Goldmine that Friends was a good time for Brian that he was going through a good period and he and Al worked together a lot which was trerrific. David Sandler speaks of in an interview with Open Sky and in an interview for Catch A Wave that Brian seemed pretty normal to him and while he was erratic working with him, he when motivated., was amazing. Bruce said Brian didn't help enough on Deirdre, but I think Brian wrote all the lines he sang himself which is roughly a quarter of the song. Mike has spoke of the ease of writing Do It Again several times. Danny Hutton and Jack Rieley also have spoken about how lucid and creative Brian still was. I don't think things really dried up until after Holland, in other words Brian didn't radically change overnight but it was more a gradual slowing down. The only time I can think of the band having to take Brian's stuff and finish it was Surf's Up the song and Jack rewrting the songs on So Tough. Brian worked to finish  the two Smile tracks on 20.20, and Cool Cool Water. I don't know if he was doing all the mixes on his own but that could have to do with them begining to record in stereo.

[Amy B.]

I can't add anything, but I'm kind of fascinated with the Sail Plane Song/Loop de Loop progression, if you want to call it that. I kinda liked Sail Plane Song the way it was-- so spiritual and introspective... then it became this big in-your-face production.

[MBE]

Loop De Loop was long thought to be a Brian production but he had little to do with it. Al remembers him doing nothing, while Desper has said Brian may have (but he wasn't sure) played an instrument, sung harmony, or at least help arrange it. I forgot about that one.

[SG7]

Friends & Sunflower and Sweet Mountain take the cake in terms of his cowriting skills. Even I am like whoa at them 

[Amy B.]

Loop De Loop was long thought to be a Brian production but he had little to do with it. Al remembers him doing nothing, while Desper has said Brian may have (but he wasn't sure) played an instrument, sung harmony, or at least help arrange it. I forgot about that one.

Yup, that's what I mean. Wasn't it Al who sort of took it over? Well, whoever produced it took that hook that Brian wrote and completely changed what it all meant. I don't mind Loop de Loop, but I prefer Sail Plane.

[the captain]

Wasn't it Al who sort of took it over? Well, whoever produced it took that hook that Brian wrote and completely changed what it all meant.

That's the gut feeling I had about the music that Brian is co-credited with from the period, by the way. That's why I am so interested in what everyone more knowledgeable has to say. How many songs are just Brian melodies done by others, or others' songs with a part by Brian? While those sorts of things are technically co-compositions, they're not the same as two people sitting down and writing a song together. I find the differences interesting.

[tpesky]

Al did quite a bit of writing during the Friends and post Friends period with Brian or at least more than the other Beach Boys.  He would be one of the best sources I would guess

[MBE]

I think most of these songs were traditional songwriting things, but remember even Good Vibrations was a case of Mike finishing what Brian started

[RONDEMON]

Here's a great vid on Jellyfish member Roger Joseph Manning Jr on writing with BW
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXobHkfasdY

[RONDEMON]

Whoooops. Here is part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7IHWTZBh-4

[the captain]

Interesting, but not the era I'm curious about. I have to think Brian was different to work with in distinctly different periods of his life with different people.