Fans and Unreleased Versions?!

[analogdemon]

Okay, sorry but I've got to rant about this.  Maybe since I'm a newer Beach Boys fan, I just don't get it.  But what is with so many fans swearing by unreleased versions of songs?  It seems like no matter what the song, if it came out on an album after 1970 and there's an alternate version of it, it's just automatically better by default.  I think I'm going to start calling this SS (SMiLE Syndrome).  Just because the Beach Boys had the greatest unreleased album of all time does NOT mean that everything they didn't release is automatically better than everything that was.  Just a few examples, all my opinions of course:

I don't know how anyone can say that the 15 Big Ones outtake of Come Go With Me is better than what came out on M.I.U.  The MIU version actually sounds produced and it sounds like they did something with it.  The 15 Big Ones version was obviously just a one-off and very raw.  Not my thing at all.

Can anyone really tell the difference between the original version of "When Girls Get Together" and what came out on KTSA?  The remix is so subtle, I don't see how you can make a distinction.  Maybe there was an overdub or two for KTSA, but does that really make the original any better?

I'll admit that I have never heard Adult/Child (what the hell kind of title is that anyway?), but judging from what I've heard from many people, I suspect that the only reason it gets any love at all is because it's...you guessed it...UNRELEASED!

It sounds like someone needs to come up with a cure for SMiLE Syndrome.  I don't get it.  I really don't.

[Old Rake]

If you've never heard Adult Child, I don't know how you could even begin to presume to pass a judgement on why people like it.

I've never heard this particular "syndrome" expressed. Most folks probably don't like either version of "Come Go With Me"...I know I don't. And "When Girls Get Together" is batshit crazy no matter which version you look at -- they're so close as to not even count.

The one unreleased version I hear expressed as being better frequently is "Big Sur," and that one's arguably true. Oh, and "Shortenin' Bread" is better on "Adult Child." But again -- both batshit crazy.

[donald]

I think people often engage in  hyperbole to stimulate discussion or express their keen interest in another alternate version of a piece of music.

For fans, it is often such a treat to discover an alternate, or possibly equally entertaining version of a tune, that it is tempting to rant obout it.

I like the alternate of Time to Get Alone but, is it better than the original release?  Probably not.  But I am tempted to say so.

And is this not the essence of the bullshit that constitutes the bulk of chat and message board dialogue?   

I think it is great fun and I wouldn't really have it otherwise. 

[Mitchell]

There are also several official alternate/earlier versions:

Time To Get Alone
Breakaway
Do It Again
Cottonfields
Don't Back Down
Little Honda
The Little Girl I Once Knew
Help Me R(h)onda (3 of these)
Let Him Run Wild
California Saga: California (single mix)
It's Ok (single mix)
Rock and Roll Music (single mix)

[analogdemon]

I certainly appreciate that there are alternate versions and it's tempting for fans and exciting at the same time.  Sometimes it just seems like some fans just instantly say that an alternate version is better and, in my opinion, that's rarely the case.  Even though I'm dealing with 1970 onward in this post, I really like the alternate version of Time to Get Alone and I like the alternate Big Sur, definitely.  I'd argue that the Big Sur alternate/released comparison ends up in a draw.  I don't really think one's better than the other.  My opinion though.  Thanks for the replies so far!

[Toby]

Well, "Adult/Child" is great because it's a great album, unreleased or not.

I was pitching it to Joe Foster a couple of years ago as a Poptones/Rev-Ola release but it fell through pretty quickly.

Nonetheless, the album needs to be released properly, and I might one day give it another go.

[Reverend Joshua Sloane]

I'd take "Lines" which if from Adult/Child over many Beach Boys - Released songs.

[Mitchell]

Oooh, Heroes and Villains is another one! There's the alternate cantina version vs. the single version.

[monkee knutz]

I'll admit that I have never heard Adult/Child (what the hell kind of title is that anyway?), but judging from what I've heard from many people, I suspect that the only reason it gets any love at all is because it's...you guessed it...UNRELEASED!

That's kinda it. Sort of. There's always a lot of hype behind unreleased material from any band although there seems to be a lot of 'hugging' of the Beach Boys unreleased material. Adult Child is certainly one of those examples. About half is interesting- half could be discarded. Then again, I'm not a fan of about 60% of the 70 material as a whole. It'd still be interesting to see a legit release just to hear it all in a nice fidelity. Especially the key tracks- Still I Dream Of It, Deep Purple, It's Over Now, et al.

[matt-zeus]

One of the craziest and most frustrating things about being a BB and BW fan is the amount of unreleased material, and the fact that some really great music was made and not released and yet some of the stuff that ended up on the albums is absolute horrid crap. This is more prevalent after 1970 mostly due to the politics of the band being ML&AJ verses DW&CW with Brian in the middle. If Brian still had total control over the band throughout the 70s then it would be very likely that the best of his songs would have been released (and probably Dennis' for that matter). For instance an album like Keepin the summer alive (which is horrible) would have been much better if songs that were from that time and a few years before were on it, eg: Stevie, That special feelin, Do ya, Lines, Its trying to say, Im begging you please etc.
I know that i'm going on more about unreleased songs rather than versions of already existing songs, but even in that case some of the alternate versions are so much
better, eg: Time to get alone, Big Sur, Back Home (1970). It seems that the Beach boys sometimes have had no clue about their own music, about what is good and what is not.

[monkee knutz]

It seems that the Beach boys sometimes have had no clue about their own music, about what is good and what is not.

The greatest understatement that's ever been documented on this board! 

[Reverend Joshua Sloane]

I think it's often like that in a band. You get too close to the music and making it that they no longer have the view of a fan for it but only themselves.

[Jason]

Maybe the people who listen to these unreleased tracks like them more than some of the stuff they released. Is that a crime? It's all personal taste. There's plenty of unreleased stuff by them that's complete sh*t (Battle Hymn of the Republic anyone?) but it all comes down to personal taste.

[shelter]

Well, sometimes there are different versions of a song, and it's the band's/record label's opinion that one version is better and sometimes you just don't agree with them. It's as simple as that.

For instance, I like the Hawthorne, CA version of Time To Get Alone better than the 20/20 version because the raw vocals sound much more intense, and I like the Smile version of Wonderful better than the Smiley Smile version because I love the harpsychord part. It has nothing to do with trying to be interesting by prefering obscure versions.

[the captain]

I believe in this Smile Syndrome, to an extent, and have commented on it on this board before. There is no doubt that many people shoot off on any comment with "Oh, but have you heard the [demo][earlier version]? It's WAY better!"

The bulk of this is just showing off. There's no better way to set yourself above newer fans or more casual fans than boasting about your endless collection of boots, and how if the uninitiated knew what you knew, the world would be so much a better place. You hear this with the California Feelin, Santa Ana Winds, Big Sur, and many others that had multiple lives over the years. 

However, as was mentioned above, the Beach Boys certainly must be among the all-time leaders in recording and then not releasing, material, and it is the opinion of many people that the unreleased material from the mid-70s on (at least) is probably better than the released. I, myself, subscribe to that line of thinking. I do prefer most of the unreleased stuff from Adult/Child to what came out on actual Beach Boys releases of the time. I do like Bamboo material more than Beach Boys releases of the time. I do prefer Stevie...and so on.  Again, as someone--mattzeus, maybe?--said, the Beach Boys clearly were a confused band, not sure what they were doing from a marketing and album-release standpoint, and whatever it was they did, it didn't work. Those points above about trying to show off one's knowledge or insider status have nothing to do with that part of it -- the Beach Boys have a lot of recorded material, and that later stuff is just a lot better than what came out. Go figure...

One thing to remember: It wasn't long ago -- what, 12 years? -- when we heard the same things about Wonderful, Wind Chimes and Heroes and Villains. That time, it was true.

[Toby]

"There is no doubt that many people shoot off on any comment with "Oh, but have you heard the [demo][earlier version]? It's WAY better!""

Sadly, this is often true, especially when we're getting into the late Seventies and the BB studio sound is getting more and more sterile (post-Love You) and the home demos just feel better.

[I. Spaceman]

This is possibly the lamest, most reactionary thread I've ever had the displeasure of reading.

[Toby]

This is possibly the lamest, most reactionary thread I've ever had the displeasure of reading.

Well, that goes without saying.

[the captain]

This is possibly the lamest, most reactionary thread I've ever had the displeasure of reading.

You didn't have to read it -- the title certainly makes clear what's coming. But I, for one, believe there's truth in it. Maybe it was started for reactionary reasons (I have no idea what started it), but it's a valid point.

[Jason]

This is possibly the lamest, most reactionary thread I've ever had the displeasure of reading.

I have to agree. I'm all about good discussions, but this thread is composed mostly of counterproductive comments that go totally against what being a fan is all about.

[the captain]

This is possibly the lamest, most reactionary thread I've ever had the displeasure of reading.

I have to agree. I'm all about good discussions, but this thread is composed mostly of counterproductive comments that go totally against what being a fan is all about.

How so? Is being a fan really all about the unending dedication and devotion to music that the bands you're allegedly a fan of chose not to release? Is that really being a fan? Seriously?

[I. Spaceman]

It's about devotion to all music officially sanctioned or not, and honest statement of your feelings about it.
But I ain't having someone who worships frickin' Stars And Stripes and Still Cruisin' try to patronise me and others because he envies the collections of others.

[Jason]

How so? Is being a fan really all about the unending dedication and devotion to music that the bands you're allegedly a fan of chose not to release? Is that really being a fan? Seriously?

That's not all of what being a fan is about. It just comes down to the music, it's either released or not. If it comes out through less-than-legal means, well, that's regrettable for the artist (wonderful for us collectors), but that's what you deal with when the wrong people go into your tape vaults and copy everything they can find.

[the captain]

It's about devotion to all music officially sanctioned or not, and honest statement of your feelings about it.
But I ain't having someone who worships frickin' Stars And Stripes and Still Cruisin' try to patronise me and others because he envies the collections of others.

I'm not about the latter, either. And I'm not aware of it--as I said, I don't know the genesis of the thread. But I do know that a ridiculous number of posters do tend to favor unreleased over released, and it does seem to eventually boil down to no other criteria--but just that. Unreleased over released.

[Jason]

I'm not about the latter, either. And I'm not aware of it--as I said, I don't know the genesis of the thread. But I do know that a ridiculous number of posters do tend to favor unreleased over released, and it does seem to eventually boil down to no other criteria--but just that. Unreleased over released.

Maybe it's just personal taste and the unreleased stuff just happens to take precedent for that fan.