Smiley Smile Message Board Milestone - And General Words Of Thanks

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Yeah, but nothing's been done. Just like in the past. Thanks to spineless or incompetent moderators on PS Forum who openly lied and distorted to suit the needs of that place, this board is dragged through the mud, lies are allowed to stand, and it's swept under the carpet? No apologies, no comments about fixing things moving forward, taking future action to avoid this bullshit again...nothing.

Doesn't fly where I'm concerned. Sorry. If people are still posting lies and they're being believed, we just drop it and sing Kum-Bye-A together like nothing happened? Keep turning the other cheek and get cold-cocked until we have a jaw broken in multiple places? Nope. Not happenin'.

As far as the new sets of music, yeah they're great, terrific listening - Kudos especially to Mark and Alan. But I'm proud to say I didn't pay a dime for them and got them for free online. My principle is, if certain names are attached and others left off of any project related to the Beach Boys, I don't give them a dime or a penny of my money. Best money I never spent.

GF - I haven't commented much about this part of the thread, since I've never visited PS forum, nor will I. I don't have the stomach to deal with any of those people anymore.  What I can say is I truly appreciate your insistence on correcting lies wherever you see them. That's really admirable. Selfishly, some of the lies were probably more than once, about me, so that's appreciated too. So, thanks again.

I second this. While I don't think this topic should be dwelled upon constantly (edit: not saying that anyone is dwelling on it constantly, didn't mean to imply this), I also think that the events of the past should not be forgotten. Craig went to the PS Forum and acted like the civil adult he is and he ended up getting banned for no logical reason whatsoever. He comes out the bigger person in all of this. He has put up with a lot of nonsense for years and yet he is still here helping run a very successful forum about our favorite band. It really is commendable. And to the children lurking from the PS Forum: this isn't ass-kissing, just sharing some courtesy to a guy who has put up with too much of your bullshit for the past few years.

You're absolutely right rab, if by acting "like the civil adult he is and he ended up getting banned for no logical reason whatsoever," you meant going over there for seemingly the sole purpose of stirring the pot and only using his account to constantly argue with people he knows do not like him, and by "comes out the bigger person in all of this," you meant deciding to attack two posters by name on another board and creating an environment where they are seemingly not welcomed (which, by my understanding, is against the rules). If that's what you meant by those two statements, then you're 100% right!

I’m assuming you’re Dick Rising from the PS Forum? Apologies if I’m wrong about that. A mod or admin there made it impossible for guests to view the posting history of members there for some reason. So if what you say is even true then it is very hard to find the proof of this. Secondly, the only two cited examples for Guitarfool’s ban were Guitarfool defending himself from false and off-topic accusations started by people who are now temporarily banned for aiming the off-topic accusations and mean-spirited posts at Craig in the first place (which a mod there admits was the cause of all the drama in that thread). Thirdly, I lurked there and saw plenty of Craig’s posts that were very informative and non-disruptive. The times he was “disruptive” were when he was defending himself against people bringing up grudges against him (which the mods there admit was a problem).

You guys pride yourselves on how the PS Forum isn’t a place for negativity. Yet your very own badge “Super Moderator” is a jab straight at Guitarfool because of his status on the Brian Wilson forum...The first few moderators on the PS forum were mocking Guitarfool’s title and adopted it as their own as a joke back when the forum was starting. So when you guys try to take the moral high ground it doesn’t really come across as sincere for very obvious reasons.

More to that point, when you yourself have a jab aimed at Guitarfool stickied on every post you make and you’re not even aware of that, it makes me wonder how aware of other things relating to the problems of the forum you are. I don’t say that to offend, I just mean that this problem is complex enough to where what is obvious to others is hidden from some people who are relatively new to these problems.

Edit: just realized you’re not Dick Rising from the PS Forum. But my point still stands to DR and Watamushi, and frankly to anyone who thinks that the PS Forum is some mecca of morality.
______

Alan, I want to thank you for your decades of phenomenal and hard work. This soul has gotten so much joy and happiness listening to the last 20+ years of incredible releases. In defense of Guitarfool, I want to say that when someone threatens one’s family, when they try to find the general location of a poster here, when they spread lies about family of the person whose music you yourself work on, they cross a line. And I will admit, if I didn’t know better Guitarfool made it sound like he was pirating the music...but in this day and age, it is somewhat clear that you can listen to just about anything on YouTube for “free”. While he himself is not paying for it, he is still making this release money because YouTube and Spotify still send money to the record company each time a song from this release is played. Thanks again for all your hard and incredible work.

Well stated on all points

[Shady]

But I'm proud to say I didn't pay a dime for them and got them for free online. My principle is, if certain names are attached and others left off of any project related to the Beach Boys, I don't give them a dime or a penny of my money. Best money I never spent.

It is becoming so incredibly difficult to get the corporate support that enables these highly specialized niche oriented projects to happen at all. Proudly stating that you won't pay a dime for a project because I acknowledged AGD for historical research in the special thanks isn't just a matter of availing yourself of the YouTube option. It feels more like a sort of boycott.  And this time it hurts a little, because (as you may have noticed), there is no promotion for this year's stack of tracks. We're hoping and praying that people who appreciate the hard work that goes into these projects will support that work by buying copies/downloads and proving to Universal Music that there is a market for this kind of Beach Boys archival collection.

The attention and feedback you all have given over the years has been inspiring. As for the stuff between the message boards and whatever it is we stepped in that made you decide to not actually purchase our latest work.... I don't know what to say to that. I hope you'll change your mind, because we need all the help we can get out here.

If you have any problems getting support for future releases can you guys please start a go fund me or something like that

You will have no problem raising the funds

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

^ I sure as hell will contribute

[Don Malcolm]

This is the kinda stuff that made Brian think it was a good idea to hole up in his bedroom... 

GF, I think you should just tone down a few of the combative traits that emerge from what I've earlier called "the PTSD of dealing with AGD." Anything said that would potentially jeopardize a relationship with Alan Boyd should be re-considered before posting, really!

Other than that issue, however, you're to be commended for going into the lion's den and dealing with some folks who quickly turn proto-demonic as a result of the "bad vibrations" they've baked into their psyches.

May I suggest that one thing all SS members could do to help impact future releases--even if we might think it won't make any difference--is to write/email Capitol and urge them to create physical releases for products such as the 1968 CE sets? If everyone at both boards, and all of the other chat sites, etc., would do that, they just might change their minds--and then we'll have world peace! 

[guitarfool2002]

I understand where you're coming from, gf, but I'm a bit bemused that this is the moral line in the sand that you're drawing when we're talking about a collection that contains songs written by three different murderers.

And I have been listening to the Phil Spector Christmas album constantly for the past weeks, Jim Gordon is one of my top 3 favorite drummers and I love everything he played on, and the list of similar scenarios goes on and on. There is a separation between enjoying art and artists who created it and the activities they engaged in separate from the art itself.

In this case there were *personal* issues at play in my opinions and decisions, the subjects involved are in no way artists who create art from afar, and I'll address the consequences and reaction further. But in these cases these were people I know who were affected negatively, people I know and love from afar who got trashed and dragged through the mud of gossip, innuendo, and lies in the name of "insider" information, and ultimately and selfishly I just don't like being lied about, and I have no time for liars. I surely don't like to see the people behind all that garbage acknowledged after all that went down, but that's me. And I understand now that not everyone knows what happened - how could they - and are more than likely believing the same lies that have been spread and repeated enough for some to believe them.

I also understand how my choice of words had consequences, and I will address that in a later comment.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

As someone who has been directly affected by the person mentioned in question I definitely understand; if anyone should be salty it’s me. That said it’d be different if that person actually played on the music. That’s just my take, though. It didn’t affect me purchasing any of the SMiLE music even though Van Dyke Parks wrote it and he’s insulted me previously.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

As for the rest, I’ve made my feelings known many times. I don’t know if the schism in the fan community can ever truly be repaired. It’s hard when the same characters keep on with the same old same old and always point fingers at others rather than take a cold hard look in the mirror. It’s even harder when there’s agendas in play. But the truly difficult aspect is when it’s a small handful of people making everyone else look bad

[Wirestone]

This all sucks.

I have tried to be on good terms with everyone in the fan community, and I still want to do that. As for Alan's point -- for goodness' sake, did no one notice the cover art for this year's releases reused the art template from last years'? Not a single press release or tiny bit of promotion.

We're skating on thin ice.

The music is worth talking about and fighting for. The rest of this is hot nonsense. We've already lost Desper. God only knows what else we could lose.

Here's some advice from an aging father who should be doing more constructive things. Delete this thread, don't play with people who don't want to play with you, and move on.

[wjcrerar]

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

[wjcrerar]

Here's some advice from an aging father who should be doing more constructive things. Delete this thread,

The smartest thing anyone's said yet.

[guitarfool2002]

To wjcrerar... My history of bickering with everyone else? Look, you came here with your mind made up that I'm the asshole and everything Dick, Watamushi, Filledeplage, and the others said is true.

But it's not. And if you either cannot see or don't want to accept what others who read through the whole episode have seen and posted about it, and how the impression being given by the mods and others is false, then consider checking out what they're saying rather than trying to take some swings at me for your friends. I knew what you were doing when you posted a plug for Discord and said how terrific of a job Dick is doing, then immediately two posters who haven't been active in a year show up out of nowhere and start hammering away too.

And all of it happened as Dick Rising seemed to be parked here in this thread last night, reading and watching it all unfold, at least every time I got notice there was a new post. Hey, the PM thing works both ways. I was accused of and held responsible for things others did that I did not do, and not a single word has been said by those two mods who did it, other than a ridiculous backpedaling and after-the-fact ban of Filledeplage who started all this sh*t in the first place...only after people here were calling out the bullshit decisions.

The burden isn't on me. How about Dick and Watamushi stand up and take responsibility for fucking this up and showing favorites when they said they would not.

And if this doesn't involve you  apart from being an observer who came here to plug Dick's Discord server and tell us how great of a job he does (and take some shots at me in the process)...why did you come here to further fan the flames? Leave that to the likes of "The Lovester" and the others.

[rab2591]

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

Yes, I already stated in the very post that I suggested DR was possibly the Lovester that I was wrong about that. And I didn't say he was "secretly" the loverster, I thought he had changed his name from Kane to that at some point, apologies for the confusion and no offense was meant towards DR. But my point definitely still stands toward him and the other mod there.

Second point, Dick Rising saying that Filledeplague needing to be banned the same time as the other two is completely beside the point. People were goading Guitarfool on from DAY ONE that he was there. Why weren't they banned then for EXACTLY what they were banned for a few days ago? It's the same charge, but yet it took the mods months to do anything about it. And by that point people had lobbed countless insults and attacks at Craig on that forum. It's just a complete breakdown of any consistent modding if you ask me.
____

As for the issue of the boxset: someone's name being on the credits shouldn't stop us from supporting such a great set. But again, there's a person on those credits that tried to make me look like a liar when I was not one. Who made some crass gossip comments regarding Brian and Melinda's adopted children. Who mocked a child of a fellow Beach Boys fan/writer. If people are cool with this behavior then I'm kinda at a loss for how much disgusting crap people are willing to look past. So though this person's name is on some credits, I still support the set, but NO ONE should be surprised at any backlash when such a person is on the credits. Seriously, those that put together these boxes may want to do some background on the people that "help" with these releases.

And Wirestone, you bring years and years of wonderful knowledge and insight to this forum, even after writing all the above perhaps it is best this thread be deep-sixed and we move on from the issue. Hope all is well on your end.

[guitarfool2002]

Here's some advice from an aging father who should be doing more constructive things. Delete this thread,

The smartest thing anyone's said yet.

The thread will not be deleted. Not as long as the lies are being cheered on and supported, not as long as the mods who got it wrong refuse to step up and either admit it or fix it (for real), and not as long as people want to post here. Maybe if someone starts posting lies and false claims about *you*, you'd see it differently.

[guitarfool2002]

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

Yes, I already stated in the very post that I suggested DR was possibly the Lovester that I was wrong about that. And I didn't say he was "secretly" the loverster, I thought he had changed his name from Kane to that at some point, apologies for the confusion and no offense was meant towards DR. But my point definitely still stands toward him and the other mod there.

Second point, Dick Rising saying that Filledeplague needing to be banned the same time as the other two is completely beside the point. People were goading Guitarfool on from DAY ONE that he was there. Why weren't they banned then for EXACTLY what they were banned for a few days ago? It's the same charge, but yet it took the mods months to do anything about it. And by that point people had lobbed countless insults and attacks at Craig on that forum. It's just a complete breakdown of any consistent modding if you ask me.
____

As for the issue of the boxset: someone's name being on the credits shouldn't stop us from supporting such a great set. But again, there's a person on those credits that tried to make me look like a liar when I was not one. Who made some crass gossip comments regarding Brian and Melinda's adopted children. Who mocked a child of a fellow Beach Boys fan/writer. If people are cool with this behavior then I'm kinda at a loss for how much disgusting crap people are willing to look past. So though this person's name is on some credits, I still support the set, but NO ONE should be surprised at any backlash when such a person is on the credits. Seriously, those that put together these boxes may want to do some background on the people that "help" with these releases.

And Wirestone, you bring years and years of wonderful knowledge and insight to this forum, even after writing all the above perhaps it is best this thread be deep-sixed and we move on from the issue. Hope all is well on your end.

That's it in a nutshell, as on-point as your other observations have been.

If people refuse to see the validity and truth in all of this, shame on them. For real.

Wjcarar...That's the truth, right there, whether you can deal with it or not.

I don't believe in deleting threads unless there are extreme circumstances.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

Was the bolded part directed at me?

[wjcrerar]

To wjcrerar... My history of bickering with everyone else? Look, you came here with your mind made up that I'm the asshole and everything Dick, Watamushi, Filledeplage, and the others said is true.

But it's not. And if you either cannot see or don't want to accept what others who read through the whole episode have seen and posted about it, and how the impression being given by the mods and others is false, then consider checking out what they're saying rather than trying to take some swings at me for your friends. I knew what you were doing when you posted a plug for Discord and said how terrific of a job Dick is doing, then immediately two posters who haven't been active in a year show up out of nowhere and start hammering away too.

And all of it happened as Dick Rising seemed to be parked here in this thread last night, reading and watching it all unfold, at least every time I got notice there was a new post. Hey, the PM thing works both ways. I was accused of and held responsible for things others did that I did not do, and not a single word has been said by those two mods who did it, other than a ridiculous backpedaling and after-the-fact ban of Filledeplage who started all this sh*t in the first place...only after people here were calling out the bullshit decisions.

The burden isn't on me. How about Dick and Watamushi stand up and take responsibility for fucking this up and showing favorites when they said they would not.

And if this doesn't involve you  apart from being an observer who came here to plug Dick's Discord server and tell us how great of a job he does (and take some shots at me in the process)...why did you come here to further fan the flames? Leave that to the likes of "The Lovester" and the others.

Alright guitarfool, there's a lot to unpack here. Do I (mostly) agree with Dick and Mushi? Yes, because they're good people who were trying to keep the peace by getting rid of someone who seemed to consistently derail threads into arguments whenever they posted. Filledeplage? No, because I think her and that whole cohort of people also responsible for starting the bickering and bringing up old grudges should've also been banned from the offshoot. But I'm not a mod, and that's not my decision. I'm glad it has been dealt with now and I think the level of vitriol against the mods for taking too long to get a difficult decision right is completely unnecessary. It's banning actual grown adults for arguing on a message forum about the Beach Boys, for god's sake.

No, I did not come here with my mind already made up that you were the asshole, thank you very much. I formed my own opinion from observing comments on both boards over a long period of time, including watching the meltdown that happened when you first joined, and from watching all of this unfold I don't think you were the sole cause of the problem. But you were a very significant part of it. The others who instigated those fights were equally in the wrong but after everything I've seen I think it's just dishonest to claim you had no part whatsoever in fuelling that fire. The pettiness of, again, GROWN ADULTS ON FORUMS ABOUT THE BEACH BOYS squabbling over whatever personal issues you've had makes both here and PSF a toxic environment every time it happens, which is a sentiment alluded to several times on this thread and one that I don't think anyone would disagree with. Nor do I blame anyone for not wanting the sites they run to be the battlegrounds for this rubbish. Or for them finding it challenging to find a solution to that problem when many of the people involved have been active in the fan circle significantly longer than they have (reply 'tough sh*t' if you want, but have some empathy, yeah? again, Beach Boys forum).

And yes, jumping in the thread like I did yesterday was unnecessary, so I apologise for that. But in the same way you ask what it would be like if I were in your shoes and defend comparing Dick Rising and Watamushi to ROCKY PAMPLIN (you have to laugh so you don't cry), don't you think it's a little understandable that I'd want to bite back and defend people who I like and respect? For transparency, I'm one of three admins on the Discord (although Dick is the original server owner), and yes, I think we do a perfectly competent job. Case in point, nothing of this (I'm not even sure what word you could use other than this) sort has happened. You can understand why that'd sting a little and that would be something I'd choose to bring up when annoyed, right?

I'm appealing to you as a human being who I think is redeemable and hasn't fully gone off the deep end (despite the Boydening). You clearly have excellent musical knowledge and I've enjoyed reading a lot of the things you've written. Just...do some critical reflection. Think about how all this comes off.

If you disagree, that's fair. We'll leave it at that. I didn't want to get dragged into this but I felt it was worth defending my friends. That's all I have to say.

[wjcrerar]

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

Was the bolded part directed at me?

It was broadly directed at the mods for letting the comments against Dick and Watamushi slide. You may disagree, I just don't think it's right.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I don’t think this thread should be deleted...erasing history or acting like it didn’t exist just leads to it being repeated, or something like that. I do think we’ve gone in back and forth enough and nothing is going to change. The hypocrisy will continue and no amount of defending ourselves will change that.  This constant lying and nonsense will continue until both boards are dead. Thanks guys. Careful what you wish for.

[Robbie Mac]

“People were goading Guitarfool on from DAY ONE that he was there. Why weren't they banned then for EXACTLY what they were banned for a few days ago?”

Not even 24 hours. The goading and baiting happened within the day.


Maybe it was naive to expect PSF to be at least civil. I still feel the banned SS-ers were deliberately baiting GF in hopes of either driving him away or getting him banned. The slaps on the wrist they received, I’m sure, was a price they didn’t mind paying.  It reeks of extreme pettiness and should not be tolerated.

[Pretty Funky]

Not going to comment on the politics of the issue but the lesson seems to be if you want to post on another board, rightly or wrongly, use another name. Sad but true.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

Was the bolded part directed at me?

It was broadly directed at the mods for letting the comments against Dick and Watamushi slide. You may disagree, I just don't think it's right.

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

Was the bolded part directed at me?

It was broadly directed at the mods for letting the comments against Dick and Watamushi slide. You may disagree, I just don't think it's right.

Where was the harrasment? Honest question because I am trying to get up to speed. Just made it home and reading the last few pages is giving me a hell of a headache

“Yes, again I stand by what I said about Watamushi and his activity here, but he was completely full of sh*t in regards to my wanting to come there strictly to cause problems, and my confrontational posts.”
“Watamushi, if that's the kind of crap you'll use to moderate over there, I hope the reasons why you're giving Filledeplage and Manning free passes are worth it. Because your credibility just went down considerably.”
“Wondering who the mods think she is, unless there is another reason why they never take any action if she's involved or why it feels she can break any rules she chooses and gets a free pass.”
“Yes, of course my posts were pulled out of context and distorted to fit what Watamushi and Dick/Kane needed it to fit. That's how they justified their bullshit actions and bullshit in general, but it obviously isn't true as even observers reading through it are noticing.

So Watamushi and Dick, in your new capacity as the two mods running the place, are you happy that your first action is based on bullshit that outside observers are noticing and calling out as bullshit? Not to mention your complete avoidance of those like Filledeplage and Manning who publicly took a sh*t on your orders and posts and did what they wanted, and got away with it.”
“They could also answer why Watamushi posted comments of mine to justify a ban, comments taken out of context  that someone who isn't even a member there read, analyzed the context perfectly,  and called out as the bullshit it is? ”

“What do you call ignoring certain members' breaking of the board rules and constant shitting on your actions as a mod while calling out and scapegoating others if not playing favorites? For f**k's sake, it's not like no one is noticing this hypocrisy”

“So guys, Dick and Watmushi, if you're going to publicly try to pin this on me and assign things to me that did not happen, your credibility exists somewhere on the level of Rocky Pamplin, the topic of the thread where all this went down. Enjoy that with the 10 or so posters who get coddled and given free reign to disrespect you as moderators regularly.”


“When it reaches a point where the most recent moderators over there have to invent reasons to post why someone was banned, and make sh*t up based on their needs versus what actually played out (and can be readily seen in public posts) it's all but a lost cause.”

“Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.”

“Clusterfuck of the highest order.“

“Dick/Kane and Watamushi were either afraid of upsetting certain favored posters there, or they had marching orders to follow from other sources, or they're simply not good at moderating a board that averages between 20-30 readers and hasn't grown beyond that in over two years. That may say it all.

If they're going to run that place based on lies and allowing lies to stand (and liars to do whatever the f*** they want...), they'll have no credibility. They're on the level of Stan and Rocky, or even more pathetic, on the level of original admin Dirk/drBeachBoy who ran the board from Doe's back pocket until he flipped out on the mods he chose as the original admin and got banned from his own board for not following the rules.”


This wasn’t even all of it.

Ok I understand where you’re coming from, but also understand that he was responding to actions taken in an official capacity as mods that he can’t respond to over there due to his ban

My two cents: there's a PM function and both are users over here. There's no need to repeatedly slander them in public for just trying to make what they felt was the correct decision. Dick's told me he feels the situation could've been handled better, because others in the wrong also should've been dealt with at the same time, but I think it was the right call in the long term considering the nauseating history of bickering (between GF and...everyone else? doesn't that suggest something?) and exactly what's currently happening here on this thread. This is an incredibly weak and disappointing position to see the other mods take, and that's coming from someone who joined both forums at around the same time long after the original schism happened. And I have been made aware (in detail) of exactly how ugly it got. Doesn't change my opinion at all. I don't get involved in the forum squabbles, and I post at both places, but the mess of this thread and downright nastiness prompted me to jump in and say something for the first time.

And no, Dick Rising is not secretly The Lovester for anyone believing that for some reason.

Was the bolded part directed at me?

It was broadly directed at the mods for letting the comments against Dick and Watamushi slide. You may disagree, I just don't think it's right.

Considering it was stated as “other mods” and I’m the only one besides Craig, I wouldn’t call it “broadly directed “. So in the same spirit of the insult  directed at me, I will ensure this reply will not be  incredibly weak. What WAS incredibly weak of me was  letting sh*t get to this point  which wouldn’t have happened had I seen Doe for what he was. What  was incredibly weak was me continuously trying to keep the peace to the point where my wording was used in a mocking manner in a troll account. What’s NOT incredibly weak is the question I’m asking right now...if the names were reversed and GF had proactively banned one of the PSF mods here and the same thing happened over there, would you have a pro with it? Honest question.

If people just fucking knew what I’ve tried to do behind the scenes to straighten things out... nah, that was incredibly weak of me


Speaking of incredibly weak, WTF just happened to the quote function?

[wjcrerar]

Was the bolded part directed at me?

It was broadly directed at the mods for letting the comments against Dick and Watamushi slide. You may disagree, I just don't think it's right.
[/quote]


Considering it was stated as “other mods” and I’m the only one besides Craig, I wouldn’t call it “broadly directed “. So in the same spirit of the insult  directed at me, I will ensure this reply will not be  incredibly weak. What WAS incredibly weak of me was  letting sh*t get to this point  which wouldn’t have happened had I seen Doe for what he was. What  was incredibly weak was me continuously trying to keep the peace to the point where my wording was used in a mocking manner in a troll account. What’s NOT incredibly weak is the question I’m asking right now...if the names were reversed and GF had proactively banned one of the PSF mods here and the same thing happened over there, would you have a pro with it? Honest question.

If people just fucking knew what I’ve tried to do behind the scenes to straighten things out... nah, that was incredibly weak of me
[/quote] 

That wasn't an insult, dude. No need to take it that way. This is just going round in a circle. I thought Rab was also a mod, which was a dumb mistake so sorry for that. It wasn't meant to be directed exclusively at you but my point still stands.

If the roles were reversed, yes, I would act in exactly the same way. I don't give the remotest of shats (you can't say sh*t here without it being censored and looking funny) which forum it's coming from, and I couldn't care less about your personal beef with Andrew Doe which I have nothing to do with. Watamushi and Dick Rising being insulted like that have nothing to do with AGD and neither do my opinions.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

^In that case, I apologize. There’s a running joke with some of those people basically saying that GF is the moderator and I’m just a lackey, or Melinda’s employee, or whatever other sh*t is being tossed at me that week, and I thought you were joining in on that. Withdrawn

As for the other thing, well look at my posts in this thread and others.  I’ve warned people publicly and privately for trying to start up something between the boards. And yeah much of it has been private so you don’t know exactly everything that’s going on, but don’t assume dude. Seriously. And to tell the truth  I was very disappointed at how Craig’s banning went down and how it was ok for him to be jumped on but not for him to respond. That spoke volumes. So am I going to tell him “nah brother, you don’t have the right to be angry “? Hell no.  I have no issues with Dick nor Watamushi on a personal level. I mean, hell, I participate in the voting threads and I’m the guy who pinned the discord link to begin with! I myself am ready to call it a day and say ok f*** it, it happened so let’s move on. But if I’m the type of guy I keep getting accused of being we wouldn’t even by having this discussion. Please don’t confuse kindness for weakness . Without fail though no matter what I do I’m invariably going to piss someone off just by my very job...if I stay neutral and impartial both sides end up getting pissed off

I’m glad you at least can state that you would feel the same way if the roles were reversed. Sadly you’re one of the few then, and that issue is the crux of the problem here

[wjcrerar]

^In that case, I apologize. There’s a running joke with some of those people basically saying that GF is the moderator and I’m just a lackey, or Melinda’s employee, or whatever other sh*t is being tossed at me that week, and I thought you were joining in on that. Withdrawn

As for the other thing, well look at my posts in this thread and others.  I’ve warned people publicly and privately for trying to start up something between the boards. And yeah much of it has been private so you don’t know exactly everything that’s going on, but don’t assume dude. Seriously. And to tell the truth  I was very disappointed at how Craig’s banning went down and how it was ok for him to be jumped on but not for him to respond. That spoke volumes. So am I going to tell him “nah brother, you don’t have the right to be angry “? Hell no.  I have no issues with Dick nor Watamushi on a personal level. I mean, hell, I participate in the voting threads and I’m the guy who pinned the discord link to begin with! I myself am ready to call it a day and say ok f*** it, it happened so let’s move on. But if I’m the type of guy I keep getting accused of being we wouldn’t even by having this discussion. Please don’t confuse kindness for weakness . Without fail though no matter what I do I’m invariably going to piss someone off just by my very job...if I stay neutral and impartial both sides end up getting pissed off

I’m glad you at least can state that you would feel the same way if the roles were reversed. Sadly you’re one of the few then, and that issue is the crux of the problem here

That's all fair, sorry it came off as a jab. Like I said, I joined both forums around the same time after all that drama happened and I have no personal allegiance to any of it, or issues with any individuals beyond what's gone down since I've been at both places. Wasn't even aware of the running joke. I'm relatively neutral on Craig's banning from PSF because I think everyone there involved in flaming the squabbles should've been removed, and long before they were, but I understand where you're coming from. Thank you for a reasonable response.

"I myself am ready to call it a day and say ok f*** it, it happened so let’s move on."

Yes, please

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Works for me!

And for something infinitely more pleasant...
https://www.instagram.com/p/BrtKBHKngbD/