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So Tough question:
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Topic: So Tough question: (Read 15741 times)
Jay
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #50 on:
June 08, 2015, 12:33:12 AM »
Tits?
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #51 on:
June 08, 2015, 12:38:08 AM »
Yup...gotta love 'em
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #52 on:
June 08, 2015, 12:58:21 AM »
What part does Brian sing on Marcella?
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #53 on:
June 08, 2015, 01:35:37 AM »
The 'Marcella Hey' part in the tag, and also the high(-ish) part of the 'hey yeah Mar...
CELL...A
' (bolded the most audible part)
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adamghost
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #54 on:
June 08, 2015, 02:12:05 AM »
Quote from: ♩♬ Billy C ♯♫♩ on June 08, 2015, 12:38:08 AM
Yup...gotta love 'em
Alley oop...
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Re: So Tough question:
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Reply #55 on:
June 08, 2015, 02:13:16 AM »
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #56 on:
June 08, 2015, 02:18:50 AM »
Quote from: srealist on June 07, 2015, 07:06:15 PM
I always assumed it was packaged with Pet Sounds because it would have needed a mess of help to stand alone.
Bravo!
Yes, it needed something to Make It Good.
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Jay
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #57 on:
June 08, 2015, 02:37:02 AM »
Quote from: unreleased backgrounds on June 08, 2015, 02:18:50 AM
Quote from: srealist on June 07, 2015, 07:06:15 PM
I always assumed it was packaged with Pet Sounds because it would have needed a mess of help to stand alone.
Bravo!
Yes, it needed something to Make It Good.
I'm Leaving This Town for another one. I think I'll Cuddle Up in a cozy nook, with a warm drink and a book.
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #58 on:
June 08, 2015, 02:44:00 AM »
And we'll have Fun Fun Fun til I die on the Sloop John B.
Worst trip, indeed.
«
Last Edit: June 08, 2015, 02:53:05 AM by ♩♬ Billy C ♯♫♩
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SurferDownUnder
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #59 on:
June 08, 2015, 03:29:40 AM »
Quote from: ♩♬ Billy C ♯♫♩ on June 08, 2015, 02:44:00 AM
And we'll have Fun Fun Fun til I die on the Sloop John B.
Worst trip, indeed.
To be honest what these jokes need is some Good Timin'
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adamghost
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #60 on:
June 08, 2015, 01:35:08 PM »
Quote from: SurferDownUnder on June 08, 2015, 03:29:40 AM
Quote from: ♩♬ Billy C ♯♫♩ on June 08, 2015, 02:44:00 AM
And we'll have Fun Fun Fun til I die on the Sloop John B.
Worst trip, indeed.
To be honest what these jokes need is some Good Timin'
Still I Dream Of It.
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #61 on:
June 08, 2015, 02:29:29 PM »
Quote from: ♩♬ Billy C ♯♫♩ on June 08, 2015, 01:35:37 AM
The 'Marcella Hey' part in the tag, and also the high(-ish) part of the 'hey yeah
Mar...
CELL...A
[/b]' (bolded the most audible part)
I always assumed that was a combination of Al and Bruce. As noted, once you know what to look for, Brian is all over his 3 Carl & The Passions tracks.
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Alan Smith
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #62 on:
June 09, 2015, 04:03:03 AM »
Quote from: Custom Machine on June 07, 2015, 01:30:17 PM
Quote from: Andrew G. Doe on June 07, 2015, 12:07:35 AM
The Reprise contract called for a master for
Smile
to be delivered no later than May 1973. Another clause included the rights to all post-
Party !
Capitol albums, and seemingly someone had the bright idea of pairing them with new Reprise releases. It's an area I'd like to know more about...
I'd like to know more about this as well. For sure Capitol owned the rights to Pet Sounds, so what type of recompense were they given for the allowing Brother/Reprise to release that album? Smiley Smile was released on the Brother Record label, but the BBs went back to Capitol for Wild Honey, Friends, and 20/20. Since the rights for everything thru 20/20 reverted to Capitol many years ago, I'm assuming the rights for Brother/Reprise to release these albums either had a set end date or ended when the BBs were no longer signed to Warner Reprise.
It would have been interesting to see how the track listing for Endless Summer and Spirit of America would have changed if Capitol still had the rights to tracks such as Wouldn't It Be Nice, Sloop John B, God Only Knows, Darlin, and Do It Again. Personally, I liked it better the way it played out, with the earlier stuff appearing on Endless Summer and Spirit of America in 1974 and 75, and Pet Sounds (single LP by itself), Wild Honey & 20/20 (double LP), and Friends & Smiley Smile (double LP) all seeing re-release on Brother/Reprise during the BBs resurgence of 1974, followed by a "Best of" in 1975 featuring songs from every BB album from Pet Sounds thru Holland except for CATP-ST.
At what point after the Warner Reprise contract was signed did the guys start lobbying Brian to finish Smile? Had he agreed to the original deadline of May 1973, or was he initially unaware of it's presence in the Warner Reprise contract? And at what point did it become very apparent that Brian had no desire to revisit the Smile tracks and it's release at that time wasn't gonna happen? Being a huge fan back then, I don't recall any PR saying that a release of Smile was forthcoming, or even being considered.
I remember hearing two theories as to why Pet Sounds was coupled with CATP-ST in the US back in 1972. The first was the claim, as Andrew mentioned, that each of the five albums from Pet Sounds thru 20/20 would be paired with a new BB release, which seems like an idiotic idea, but it did in fact happen with CATP in the US (but not elsewhere where EMI still owned the rights to the five albums in question), and I do recall reading somewhere in print back then that that was why Pet Sounds was coupled with CATP. The second was the claim that Warner Reprise found CATP to be such a weak album that they felt compelled to add Pet Sounds to CATP-ST to either (1) offer the consumer more for their money, or (2) show Brian and the BBs what they were once capable of, or (3) a combination of both.
Here's a quote from Mike from the NME as featured in John Tobler's book. Doesn't answer your questions or add anything new, but thought you might like the read:
"We've bought the rights of five old albums to distribute them for seven years plus Smile, the album that was never released.
The thing we want to do is a combination of bringing everyone up to date and giving everyone a chance to get an old collectors' item that has been discontinued by the record company.
Americans have to write to England if they want copies of albums like Smiley Smile. So we are going to issue the new Beach Boys album (CATP) and one of the old classics in a double set but won't charge any more money for the old album. In England, it's coming out as a single album because we couldn't get the rights to the old albums over here."
John T then talks about the pairing of CATP with PS as a bit of a strange move.
The Byron Preiss book says the specific pairing was a label decision. Both tomes quite old.
«
Last Edit: June 09, 2015, 04:12:18 AM by Alan Smith
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punkinhead
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #63 on:
June 09, 2015, 04:30:24 AM »
Thank you to all acknowledging So Tough as an album by the Beach Boys and NOT a side project!! I'd been arguing on Facebook with a few fans who keep referring to it as a side project. There's no side project about it, title or no title! It's the album before Holland and after Surfs Up.
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #64 on:
June 09, 2015, 06:00:42 AM »
Quote from: punkinhead on June 09, 2015, 04:30:24 AM
Thank you to all acknowledging So Tough as an album by the Beach Boys and NOT a side project!! I'd been arguing on Facebook with a few fans who keep referring to it as a side project. There's no side project about it, title or no title! It's the album before Holland and after Surfs Up.
100% agreed!
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Joel Goldenberg
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #65 on:
June 09, 2015, 07:07:10 AM »
Quote from: Custom Machine on June 07, 2015, 01:30:17 PM
At what point after the Warner Reprise contract was signed did the guys start lobbying Brian to finish Smile? Had he agreed to the original deadline of May 1973, or was he initially unaware of it's presence in the Warner Reprise contract? And at what point did it become very apparent that Brian had no desire to revisit the Smile tracks and it's release at that time wasn't gonna happen? Being a huge fan back then, I don't recall any PR saying that a release of Smile was forthcoming, or even being considered.
Mike Love announces that Smile is coming out "this year" in a 1972 live recording of Wonderful, as heard on Endless Harmony.
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LostArt
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #66 on:
June 09, 2015, 08:49:30 AM »
Quote from: Joel Goldenberg on June 09, 2015, 07:07:10 AM
Quote from: Custom Machine on June 07, 2015, 01:30:17 PM
At what point after the Warner Reprise contract was signed did the guys start lobbying Brian to finish Smile? Had he agreed to the original deadline of May 1973, or was he initially unaware of it's presence in the Warner Reprise contract? And at what point did it become very apparent that Brian had no desire to revisit the Smile tracks and it's release at that time wasn't gonna happen? Being a huge fan back then, I don't recall any PR saying that a release of Smile was forthcoming, or even being considered.
Mike Love announces that Smile is coming out "this year" in a 1972 live recording of Wonderful, as heard on Endless Harmony.
On a computer at home, I've got a scan of a 1972 article by Richard Williams (I don't know what magazine it's from, maybe Melody Maker?), titled "SMILE! It's Carl and the Passions". It's very hard to read, but I'll see if I can transcribe the relevant bits and post them later.
«
Last Edit: June 09, 2015, 10:26:44 AM by LostArt
»
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LostArt
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #67 on:
June 09, 2015, 09:57:24 AM »
Quote from: LostArt on June 09, 2015, 08:49:30 AM
Quote from: Joel Goldenberg on June 09, 2015, 07:07:10 AM
Quote from: Custom Machine on June 07, 2015, 01:30:17 PM
At what point after the Warner Reprise contract was signed did the guys start lobbying Brian to finish Smile? Had he agreed to the original deadline of May 1973, or was he initially unaware of it's presence in the Warner Reprise contract? And at what point did it become very apparent that Brian had no desire to revisit the Smile tracks and it's release at that time wasn't gonna happen? Being a huge fan back then, I don't recall any PR saying that a release of Smile was forthcoming, or even being considered.
Mike Love announces that Smile is coming out "this year" in a 1972 live recording of Wonderful, as heard on Endless Harmony.
On a computer at home, I've got a scan of a 1972 article by Richard Williams (I don't know what magazine it's from, maybe Melody Maker?), titled "SMILE! It's Carl and the Passions". It's very hard to read, but I'll see if I can transcribe the relevant bits and post them later.
Okay...I've transcribed the part of the article about Smile '72:
You thought “Surf’s Up” was a nice surprise, maybe? Well listen, kids: If you can steer clear of the grim reaper ‘til next Fall, “Smile” is coming your way.
And, yes, it’s the real “Smile” – the original tapes, made in 1967 by Brian Wilson and never released because . . . well, I guess you know the story about the “Fire” track, and how it caused a rash of conflagrations within the immediate vicinity of the studio.
But didn’t we all think Brian had destroyed those tapes? Sure we did. He said so, didn’t he? A million times.
He must have been putting us on, though. All the tapes have now been found, pieced together, new vocals overdubbed where necessary, and the whole album will be out
[unreadable…I’m guessing ‘before’]
long.
The complete list of tracks is: “The Child Is Father To The Man”, “Surf’s Up”, “Sunshine”, “The Old Master Painter”, “Barnyard”, “Cabin-essence” (incorporating “Iron Horse”), “Mrs. O’Leary’s Cow”, “I Love To Say Dada” (incorporating “Cool Cool Water”), and the different original versions of “Vege-tables”, “Wind Chimes”, and “Wonderful”. Most of them seem to come under the overall sub-title of “Heroes and Villains”.
Carl Wilson tells a story about the day he was working on the tape of “Master Painter”. “Somebody put the tape out with the garbage, by mistake. It got shredded, into a thousand pieces. I had to go out, find it, and put it back together again. It’s okay now, but we’ve made safety copies of everything, just in case. Those old things were done on four-track tape, and they’re very fragile.”
Carl is making his revelations by candlelight in a conference room at London’s Royal Garden Hotel.
I don't have time to do the rest of the article. It goes on talking about Blondie and Ricky joining the group, the resolution of the legal battle with Capitol, the new album (Carl and the Passions - So Tough), and upcoming shows.
«
Last Edit: June 09, 2015, 10:27:27 AM by LostArt
»
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adamghost
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #68 on:
June 09, 2015, 11:58:27 AM »
I always forget about the '72 SMiLE. Do we know definitively, if it was that close, why it didn't happen?
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Custom Machine
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #69 on:
June 09, 2015, 02:49:37 PM »
Quote from: Alan Smith on June 09, 2015, 04:03:03 AM
Here's a quote from Mike from the NME as featured in John Tobler's book. Doesn't answer your questions or add anything new, but thought you might like the read:
"We've bought the rights of five old albums to distribute them for seven years plus Smile, the album that was never released.
The thing we want to do is a combination of bringing everyone up to date and giving everyone a chance to get an old collectors' item that has been discontinued by the record company.
Americans have to write to England if they want copies of albums like Smiley Smile. So we are going to issue the new Beach Boys album (CATP) and one of the old classics in a double set but won't charge any more money for the old album. In England, it's coming out as a single album because we couldn't get the rights to the old albums over here."
John T then talks about the pairing of CATP with PS as a bit of a strange move.
The Byron Preiss book says the specific pairing was a label decision. Both tomes quite old.
Quote from: Joel Goldenberg on June 09, 2015, 07:07:10 AM
Mike Love announces that Smile is coming out "this year" in a 1972 live recording of Wonderful, as heard on Endless Harmony.
Quote from: LostArt on June 09, 2015, 09:57:24 AM
Okay...I've transcribed the part of the article about Smile '72:
You thought “Surf’s Up” was a nice surprise, maybe? Well listen, kids: If you can steer clear of the grim reaper ‘til next Fall, “Smile” is coming your way.
And, yes, it’s the real “Smile” – the original tapes, made in 1967 by Brian Wilson and never released because . . . well, I guess you know the story about the “Fire” track, and how it caused a rash of conflagrations within the immediate vicinity of the studio.
But didn’t we all think Brian had destroyed those tapes? Sure we did. He said so, didn’t he? A million times.
He must have been putting us on, though. All the tapes have now been found, pieced together, new vocals overdubbed where necessary, and the whole album will be out
[unreadable…I’m guessing ‘before’]
long.
The complete list of tracks is: “The Child Is Father To The Man”, “Surf’s Up”, “Sunshine”, “The Old Master Painter”, “Barnyard”, “Cabin-essence” (incorporating “Iron Horse”), “Mrs. O’Leary’s Cow”, “I Love To Say Dada” (incorporating “Cool Cool Water”), and the different original versions of “Vege-tables”, “Wind Chimes”, and “Wonderful”. Most of them seem to come under the overall sub-title of “Heroes and Villains”.
Carl Wilson tells a story about the day he was working on the tape of “Master Painter”. “Somebody put the tape out with the garbage, by mistake. It got shredded, into a thousand pieces. I had to go out, find it, and put it back together again. It’s okay now, but we’ve made safety copies of everything, just in case. Those old things were done on four-track tape, and they’re very fragile.”
Carl is making his revelations by candlelight in a conference room at London’s Royal Garden Hotel.
Alan, Joel, and LostArt, your posts add a lot to the discussion. Thanks for posting!
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Moon Dawg
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #70 on:
June 09, 2015, 03:52:46 PM »
Quote from: adamghost on June 09, 2015, 11:58:27 AM
I always forget about the '72 SMiLE. Do we know definitively, if it was that close, why it didn't happen?
This is not verified fact, but in my opinion the 1972
SMiLE
was pieced together by Carl Wilson. An active Brian Wilson was essential for any reconstruction. That is why
SMiLE
'72 was never fully realized. I'm open to corrections.
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Moon Dawg
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #71 on:
June 09, 2015, 03:54:55 PM »
Quote from: punkinhead on June 09, 2015, 04:30:24 AM
Thank you to all acknowledging So Tough as an album by the Beach Boys and NOT a side project!! I'd been arguing on Facebook with a few fans who keep referring to it as a side project. There's no side project about it, title or no title! It's the album before Holland and after Surfs Up.
A real album to be sure, but it will always seem a bit tenuous in comparison with its predecessor and successor.
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Andrew G. Doe
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Re: So Tough question:
«
Reply #72 on:
June 09, 2015, 10:15:28 PM »
Quote from: Moon Dawg on June 09, 2015, 03:52:46 PM
Quote from: adamghost on June 09, 2015, 11:58:27 AM
I always forget about the '72 SMiLE. Do we know definitively, if it was that close, why it didn't happen?
This is not verified fact, but in my opinion the 1972
SMiLE
was pieced together by Carl Wilson. An active Brian Wilson was essential for any reconstruction. That is why
SMiLE
'72 was never fully realized. I'm open to corrections.
According to Steve Desper, he & Carl got the tapes from the archives, listened to them, copied them... and put them straight back on the racks. That's my recall, hopefully SWD will amplify or correct.
«
Last Edit: June 09, 2015, 10:18:13 PM by Andrew G. Doe
»
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