Clangin and Ding Dang and Shortenin' Bread

[Jim V.]

Ok, so I know this has kinda been answered before, but I just want it clarified. What is the relationship between "Clangin", "Ding Dang" and "Shortenin Bread"? Did either grow out of "Shortenin Bread"? Was "Clangin" ever recorded? Finished? Does it indeed include the "Mow-Mama-Yama" part? What does the song even sound like?

And then, were "Ding Dang" and "Clangin" part of the same song idea or something? I notice Brian doin that "clangin, clangin, clangin" part in "Brian's Tune" or Ding Ding '74 or what have you.

Then one last question, when was the version of "Ding Dang" on Love You recorded? 1973 as AGDs book says? 1974? Or during the Love You sessions?

And lastly, whats with the alternate, faster version of "Shortenin Bread" from around KTSA with no vocals? Was that actually a backing track for some other song,  or what was it?

I know none of this is of any great importance but this situation kinda confuses me. And I figured this is the place to ask!

[Andrew G. Doe]

"Clang" & "Clangin'" are apparently different songs.  The former is the "mow-mama-yama-holy-halleluia" chant from early 1976 that wound up in TLOS (a friend of Brian's suggested it), while the latter is a variation/development of the "Pied Piper" theme. Granted, the "SB" section of "Bells Of Madness" with the "clang ding dangin'/now the bells are ringing" lyric throws something of a spanner into the works of that statement, but hey, this is Brian Wilson were discussing. 

"SB" with no lead vocal was recorded during the winter 1972/3 Iowa sessions. Bvs are Spring, Sandler & Brian.

[c-man]

Earle Mankey says his first ever session as an engineer at Brother was for Elton's "Don't Let The Sun Go Down On Me", and he says the first session he did with Brian was for the released version of "Ding Dang", so that might help narrow the chronology of that one a bit.

[Jim V.]

Wait so let me get this right...."Mow mama yama" came from "Clang"?

"Clangin"= reworking of "I'm The Pied Piper"? I thought "Lazy Lizzy" was a reworking of "Pied Piper"? Or is that a reworking of "Get Back in Bed'? BLAHHH!!

"Ding Dang" from Love You is from much earlier than the Love You sessions.

And one last thing, the alternate "SB" I'm asking about isn't the one from '73 and finished in '77 or whatever, but some version of "SB" or something that sounds like it from (I think) '79 or '80.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Wait so let me get this right...."Mow mama yama" came from "Clang"?

"Clangin"= reworking of "I'm The Pied Piper"? I thought "Lazy Lizzy" was a reworking of "Pied Piper"? Or is that a reworking of "Get Back in Bed'? BLAHHH!!

"Ding Dang" from Love You is from much earlier than the Love You sessions.

And one last thing, the alternate "SB" I'm asking about isn't the one from '73 and finished in '77 or whatever, but some version of "SB" or something that sounds like it from (I think) '79 or '80.

"Lizzie" evolved from "Better Get Back In Bed" (rather unfortunately, now I come to think of it...).

And sorry, yes, BW did a track for "SB" in 1980.

[punkinhead]

Wait so let me get this right...."Mow mama yama" came from "Clang"?

"Clangin"= reworking of "I'm The Pied Piper"? I thought "Lazy Lizzy" was a reworking of "Pied Piper"? Or is that a reworking of "Get Back in Bed'? BLAHHH!!

"Ding Dang" from Love You is from much earlier than the Love You sessions.

And one last thing, the alternate "SB" I'm asking about isn't the one from '73 and finished in '77 or whatever, but some version of "SB" or something that sounds like it from (I think) '79 or '80.

"Lizzie" evolved from "Better Get Back In Bed" (rather unfortunately, now I come to think of it...).

And sorry, yes, BW did a track for "SB" in 1980.

Do you know Brian's intentions with the re-cut SB? or My Solution?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Wait so let me get this right...."Mow mama yama" came from "Clang"?

"Clangin"= reworking of "I'm The Pied Piper"? I thought "Lazy Lizzy" was a reworking of "Pied Piper"? Or is that a reworking of "Get Back in Bed'? BLAHHH!!

"Ding Dang" from Love You is from much earlier than the Love You sessions.

And one last thing, the alternate "SB" I'm asking about isn't the one from '73 and finished in '77 or whatever, but some version of "SB" or something that sounds like it from (I think) '79 or '80.

"Lizzie" evolved from "Better Get Back In Bed" (rather unfortunately, now I come to think of it...).

And sorry, yes, BW did a track for "SB" in 1980.

Do you know Brian's intentions with the re-cut SB? or My Solution?

No idea. He just turned up at David Leaf's house one evening and asked him for a copy of the original "MS". Just a whim, I guess.

[The Heartical Don]

Earle Mankey says his first ever session as an engineer at Brother was for Elton's "Don't Let The Sun Go Down On Me", and he says the first session he did with Brian was for the released version of "Ding Dang", so that might help narrow the chronology of that one a bit.

That's one small step for a man, but...

[Myk Luhv]

I would kill to have been the engineer on "Ding Dang" or, better yet, "Rollin' Up to Heaven"!

[Jim V.]

Hey, this is an old thread of mine, but I had a few questions about this whole "Ding Dang"/"Clangin'"/whatever business I was wondering...

Does anybody know if the vocals the officially released, Love You version of "Ding Dang" were recorded in 1974 along with the rest of it? Or are they from 1976, because they sound much more '76 than they do '74.

Then, there is supposedly a recording of "Clangin'" from 1974, recorded at the same session as "Brian's Jam". Does anybody in the know have any idea if "Clangin'" is actually part of "Brian's Jam"? Because apparently "Brian's Jam" is apparently another example of Brian's usage of the "Shortenin' Bread" riff. So anybody got any info on this?

And then, apparently "Clangin'" was recorded in fall 1976? Around the Love You sessions? Is this true? Anybody know?

And then lastly, I've read that Brian's vocal on the Spring version of "Shortenin' Bread" is from either 1972 or 1973. But there's no way that's right. He totally sounds like his later '70s self. Anybody got confirmation on this one?

I know it's a bunch of random and relatively unimportant questions. But hey, that's what we like around here? So anyways, anybody got any information on this stuff? Such as the illustrious c-man? Or Andrew?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Hey, this is an old thread of mine, but I had a few questions about this whole "Ding Dang"/"Clangin'"/whatever business I was wondering...

Does anybody know if the vocals the officially released, Love You version of "Ding Dang" were recorded in 1974 along with the rest of it? Or are they from 1976, because they sound much more '76 than they do '74.

Not a clue. Possibly.

Then, there is supposedly a recording of "Clangin'" from 1974, recorded at the same session as "Brian's Jam". Does anybody in the know have any idea if "Clangin'" is actually part of "Brian's Jam"? Because apparently "Brian's Jam" is apparently another example of Brian's usage of the "Shortenin' Bread" riff. So anybody got any info on this?

Two different 'songs'.

And then, apparently "Clangin'" was recorded in fall 1976? Around the Love You sessions? Is this true? Anybody know?

Summer 1976.

And then lastly, I've read that Brian's vocal on the Spring version of "Shortenin' Bread" is from either 1972 or 1973. But there's no way that's right. He totally sounds like his later '70s self. Anybody got confirmation on this one?

Yup, bass vocal on the original 1973 recording of "SB" is Brian.

Oh, and just to nicely confuse things further, "Clangin'" and "Clang" are completely different songs. One is an extension of the "Pied Piper" theme, the other is the "Mow-mama-yama-holy-halleleuia" chant as per TLOS.

[Jim V.]

Hey, this is an old thread of mine, but I had a few questions about this whole "Ding Dang"/"Clangin'"/whatever business I was wondering...

Does anybody know if the vocals the officially released, Love You version of "Ding Dang" were recorded in 1974 along with the rest of it? Or are they from 1976, because they sound much more '76 than they do '74.

Not a clue. Possibly.

Then, there is supposedly a recording of "Clangin'" from 1974, recorded at the same session as "Brian's Jam". Does anybody in the know have any idea if "Clangin'" is actually part of "Brian's Jam"? Because apparently "Brian's Jam" is apparently another example of Brian's usage of the "Shortenin' Bread" riff. So anybody got any info on this?

Two different 'songs'.

And then, apparently "Clangin'" was recorded in fall 1976? Around the Love You sessions? Is this true? Anybody know?

Summer 1976.

And then lastly, I've read that Brian's vocal on the Spring version of "Shortenin' Bread" is from either 1972 or 1973. But there's no way that's right. He totally sounds like his later '70s self. Anybody got confirmation on this one?

Yup, bass vocal on the original 1973 recording of "SB" is Brian.

Oh, and just to nicely confuse things further, "Clangin'" and "Clang" are completely different songs. One is an extension of the "Pied Piper" theme, the other is the "Mow-mama-yama-holy-halleleuia" chant as per TLOS.

OK, so I think I got it. We've got "Ding Dang" recorded in '74 or so and that's on Love You.

Then we've got "Shortenin' Bread" from '72 or '73 originally by Spring but later with lead vocals by Carl. However Brian then records a new version that is then finished by Bruce, Carl and Dennis (?) for L.A. (Light Album). Then Brian also goes on and records another instrumental version of "Shortenin' Bread" in '80.

Then "Clangin'", which was first recorded in March 1974. And then once again in the summer of 1976. This song is an extension of the "Pied Piper" theme.

Then, there's "Brian's Jam" which was apparently recorded at the same March 1974 session as the first version of "Clangin'". Apparently "Brian's Jam" incorporates the "Shortenin' Bread" riff (surprise surprise!) and features Dennis and Carl amongst others on the track).

And then we can't forget "Brian's Tune" which is better known as "Rollin' Up to Heaven" or the dirty "Ding Dang", which was recorded in late '74.

That all sounds right?? And totally unnecessary. Ha. But whatever. We're obsessed. At least I am. Because I actually would like to hear all of these things.

But lastly, was "Clang" ever recorded beyond being taped for the NBC special or the Rolling Stone interview?

[c-man]

<<Then we've got "Shortenin' Bread" from '72 or '73 originally by Spring but later with lead vocals by Carl. However Brian then records a new version that is then finished by Bruce, Carl and Dennis (?) for L.A. (Light Album). Then Brian also goes on and records another instrumental version of "Shortenin' Bread" in '80.>>

Al also participated in the finishing of "Shortenin' Bread" for L.A. (Light). Not sure about Mike, but Al was there.
Brian's 1980 version was recorded at the same session as his 1980 version of "My Solution". The two songs together are titled on the AFM contract as "Song Within A Song".

[Andrew G. Doe]

May 21st, 1980, at Western.

[Steve Latshaw]

For AGD... Clang (the chant - which the Beach Boys sang in the Rolling Stone interview for The Healing of Brother Bri)... which song is that chant featured in on TLOS?

Thanks in advamce... have been dying to hear that since, literally, 1976...

[Andrew G. Doe]

It's a link piece at the beginning & the coda.

[Jim V.]

Andrew, you might not know, but is "Clang" just the "mow-mama-yama" thing? Or is there more to it? And when was this recorded?

Brian's 1980 version was recorded at the same session as his 1980 version of "My Solution". The two songs together are titled on the AFM contract as "Song Within A Song".

Hey c-man, do you know if this meant that they were meant to be in some kind of medley or something? Either way, it's interesting that Brian was reviving "Shortenin' Bread" when it was released just a bit over a year earlier. And also quite interesting that "My Solution" would be rerecorded after all that time.

[Andrew G. Doe]

No, two separate tracks: the tapes are out there, or were in the 80s.

[c-man]

No, two separate tracks: the tapes are out there, or were in the 80s.

And for the super-curious, info from the AFM contract:
The artist on the AFM sheet is listed as "Beach Boys", and the employer is "Columbia Records".
Musicians were Mitch Holder and Tim May (guitars), James D. Hughart (bass - 2 doubles), Ian Underwood (keyboard), and Earl Palmer (drums).
Underwood is a multi-instrumentalist who for a time was one of Frank Zappa's Mothers of Invention. He played sax, flute, and piano for Zappa, but by the early '80s was working as a session keyboardist, playing mostly piano and Mini-Moog. His TV/film credits include playing on the "Night Rider" theme and the "Titanic" soundtrack.

[Jim V.]

No, two separate tracks: the tapes are out there, or were in the 80s.

Oh, I know they are out there. I heard the 1980 version of "Shortenin' Bread" and I might have heard the 1980 "My Solution", can't remember. However, why would they be listed as one title if they were actually separate things? For money/contract purposes? I really don't know, because I don't understand that stuff.

[c-man]

No, two separate tracks: the tapes are out there, or were in the 80s.

Oh, I know they are out there. I heard the 1980 version of "Shortenin' Bread" and I might have heard the 1980 "My Solution", can't remember. However, why would they be listed as one title if they were actually separate things? For money/contract purposes? I really don't know, because I don't understand that stuff.

My guess: Brian would have edited them together...maybe "My Solution" with a "Shortenin' Bread" chorus, ala "Bells of Madness".

[Andrew G. Doe]

Gotta love Brian's consistency.

"Hmmm, need a chorus (or middle eight)... yup, "Shortenin' Bread" riff will do !"