Soul Searchin'

[DonnyL]

sounds like Carl doubled ... but sounds like he wasn't singing along to the first vocal , i.e. they were two separate overdubs.

[Wirestone]

sounds like Carl doubled ... but sounds like he wasn't singing along to the first vocal , i.e. they were two separate overdubs.

That indeed makes sense. After more listens, it really does sound like two Carls.

[HeyJude]

sounds like Carl doubled ... but sounds like he wasn't singing along to the first vocal , i.e. they were two separate overdubs.

That indeed makes sense. After more listens, it really does sound like two Carls.

I've been leaning towards this as well. I suppose this makes it a bit less annoying. Still, the "California Feelin'" 1978 mix that was uber-futzed with (with great results mind you) seems to indicate that they don't *have* to mix up everything that is there on the multi-track. If that was two Carls on the bridge, the second overdub was unneeded and mucks the whole thing up sonically.

[EgoHanger1966]

sounds like Carl doubled ... but sounds like he wasn't singing along to the first vocal , i.e. they were two separate overdubs.

I had assumed it was just sloppy double tracking from my first listen. If Carl really didn't like doing the tune, it makes some sense.

[Pacific Coast]

I remember reading somewhere that the reason the song was left to collect dust was Carl was unhappy with his singing on the bridge, and since the project fell apart, there was no return to sweeten it. That explains why Brian recorded new bridge vocal for his solo album.

[Jay]

The bridge part confuses me. A full beat or two after Carl sings the word "out", you hear another voice singing the word. Did they even *try* to make the artificial double tracking sync up?

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

It sounds like a different vocal take in the background. Whatever it is, it doesn't work.

[Jay]

The really confusing part is that I hear two voices in that section that sound like Carl, and parts of it that sound like Brian's GIOMH vocal. 

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I wouldn't be entirely shocked if Brian is on there somewhere

I think one Carl is from the Was sessions, hence the credit.

[Jay]

I hear what seems to be a shouty Brian on the second "out", and on the word "sign".

This might be the geekiest conversation anybody has ever had. 

[MarcellaHasDirtyFeet]

Two Carls, for sure. IMO

[HeyJude]

I remember reading somewhere that the reason the song was left to collect dust was Carl was unhappy with his singing on the bridge, and since the project fell apart, there was no return to sweeten it. That explains why Brian recorded new bridge vocal for his solo album.

I'd be interested to see where Carl was referenced as having disliked his own vocal on the song. The bits I've read have seemed to suggest he didn't like the recording, meaning presumably the backing track. The fact that they pulled off the Was backing track and then stuck the Paley backing track on Carl's (and the group's) vocals seemed to support this idea. I recall that the inference was that while it was done while Carl was still alive, he never got to hear it for obvious reasons and presumably would have been given a chance to hear it if time had allowed.

[HeyJude]

I wouldn't be entirely shocked if Brian is on there somewhere

I think one Carl is from the Was sessions, hence the credit.

Carl supposedly only participated in "Was sessions." As best as I can tell, the chain of events would be: Brian and Paley cut a backing track (and Paley's guide vocal). Then, Was gets involved and has his session guys cut backing tracks for "Soul Searchin'" and "You're Still a Mystery" (and perhaps other stuff?). Carl and the group add vocals to the Was backing tracks. After work on a few songs, the whole thing fizzles out (partly due to Carl's dislike of something; something that made him like the songs enough to sing on them but not enough to continue with the sessions or release the songs; which is what supports the "not liking the backing track" theory), and then at a later date and without any BB involvement, Carl and the group's vocals are grafted onto the old Brian/Paley backing track to "Soul Searchin'." While Carl may have indeed been additionally involved (what was the story I read not too long ago where Carl appeared at a random "Proud Mary" session?), but other than that possibility, I'd guess all of Carl's vocals were done during the "Was" sessions.

I think the order of production credits on the "MIC" set, if they mean anything, would indicate that "more" of YSAM contained Was-produced content (both the backing track and the vocals), while SS contained less (only Was-produced vocals). Andy Paley was apparently involved production-wise with both the initial sessions with Brian (obviously) as well as the Was-produced sessions, hence his co-production credit on both tracks on the "MIC" set.

It was an interesting time in the band's history! Still kind of sketchy.

[southbay]

I wouldn't be entirely shocked if Brian is on there somewhere

I think one Carl is from the Was sessions, hence the credit.

Carl supposedly only participated in "Was sessions." As best as I can tell, the chain of events would be: Brian and Paley cut a backing track (and Paley's guide vocal). Then, Was gets involved and has his session guys cut backing tracks for "Soul Searchin'" and "You're Still a Mystery" (and perhaps other stuff?). Carl and the group add vocals to the Was backing tracks. After work on a few songs, the whole thing fizzles out (partly due to Carl's dislike of something; something that made him like the songs enough to sing on them but not enough to continue with the sessions or release the songs; which is what supports the "not liking the backing track" theory), and then at a later date and without any BB involvement, Carl and the group's vocals are grafted onto the old Brian/Paley backing track to "Soul Searchin'." While Carl may have indeed been additionally involved (what was the story I read not too long ago where Carl appeared at a random "Proud Mary" session?), but other than that possibility, I'd guess all of Carl's vocals were done during the "Was" sessions.

I think the order of production credits on the "MIC" set, if they mean anything, would indicate that "more" of YSAM contained Was-produced content (both the backing track and the vocals), while SS contained less (only Was-produced vocals). Andy Paley was apparently involved production-wise with both the initial sessions with Brian (obviously) as well as the Was-produced sessions, hence his co-production credit on both tracks on the "MIC" set.

It was an interesting time in the band's history! Still kind of sketchy.

I wouldn't be entirely shocked if Brian is on there somewhere

I think one Carl is from the Was sessions, hence the credit.

Carl supposedly only participated in "Was sessions." As best as I can tell, the chain of events would be: Brian and Paley cut a backing track (and Paley's guide vocal). Then, Was gets involved and has his session guys cut backing tracks for "Soul Searchin'" and "You're Still a Mystery" (and perhaps other stuff?). Carl and the group add vocals to the Was backing tracks. After work on a few songs, the whole thing fizzles out (partly due to Carl's dislike of something; something that made him like the songs enough to sing on them but not enough to continue with the sessions or release the songs; which is what supports the "not liking the backing track" theory), and then at a later date and without any BB involvement, Carl and the group's vocals are grafted onto the old Brian/Paley backing track to "Soul Searchin'." While Carl may have indeed been additionally involved (what was the story I read not too long ago where Carl appeared at a random "Proud Mary" session?), but other than that possibility, I'd guess all of Carl's vocals were done during the "Was" sessions.

I think the order of production credits on the "MIC" set, if they mean anything, would indicate that "more" of YSAM contained Was-produced content (both the backing track and the vocals), while SS contained less (only Was-produced vocals). Andy Paley was apparently involved production-wise with both the initial sessions with Brian (obviously) as well as the Was-produced sessions, hence his co-production credit on both tracks on the "MIC" set.

It was an interesting time in the band's history! Still kind of sketchy.

This is in line with everything I have read/heard.  Add in that Carl and Mike earlier participated in the Baywatch Nights sessions which was a 1995 Brian/Paley session at Mark Linnet's studio, also pre-dating any Don Was involvement.

[Wirestone]

Here is all the information you need on this Wilson, Paley and Was.

Chuck should really make this info more easily available. Hint hint. 

http://smileysmile.net/OLDlibrary/timeline.html

[Pacific Coast]

I remember reading somewhere that the reason the song was left to collect dust was Carl was unhappy with his singing on the bridge, and since the project fell apart, there was no return to sweeten it. That explains why Brian recorded new bridge vocal for his solo album.

I'd be interested to see where Carl was referenced as having disliked his own vocal on the song. The bits I've read have seemed to suggest he didn't like the recording, meaning presumably the backing track. The fact that they pulled off the Was backing track and then stuck the Paley backing track on Carl's (and the group's) vocals seemed to support this idea. I recall that the inference was that while it was done while Carl was still alive, he never got to hear it for obvious reasons and presumably would have been given a chance to hear it if time had allowed.

Sorry, I can't recall where I read that Carl disliked his vocal on the bridge. It's been at least ten years or so, but the remark really struck me at the time.

[Lonely Summer]

It is really hard to understand what Carl's objections were with Soul Searchin' and Still a Mystery. This stuff was worlds better than that SIP junk, which presumably he approved of, since he sang on it, and it was released in his lifetime.

[Nicko1234]

It is really hard to understand what Carl's objections were with Soul Searchin' and Still a Mystery. This stuff was worlds better than that SIP junk, which presumably he approved of, since he sang on it, and it was released in his lifetime.

But we still haven't heard the Don Was stuff...

And Carl did a professional job on the SIP stuff but that doesn't mean he liked it. He didn't appear on the U.K. versions did he?

[Jay]

Maybe Carl rejected it simply because I was too good? I mean, wouldn't it have been majorly embarrassing to go from digitally "enhanced" pro-tools crap passing itself off as music, to material that quite possibly might have formed their best work since Sunflower? They would have been laughed at for needing Brian to "save the day".

[runnersdialzero]

Yeah man, Pro-Tools wrote Summer In Paradise and made it what it is.

[Jay]

Yeah, a piece of sh*t.   

[Gertie J.]

sip is a classic example of everything an album shouldn't be.

[runnersdialzero]

Yeah, a piece of sh*t.   

Poor Mike.

[Gertie J.]

poor you.

[Niko]

sip is a classic example of everything an album shouldn't be.

In other words, it's just a bad album