Does anybody know what sessions the Heroes and Villains material on UM are from?
Fish, I've been meaning to get back to you on this topic. Let's take stock of everything on SOT 17 labelled as H&V or related to H&V; using my own collection and other notes -
1. Heroes And Villains Theme (take 14) 0:51 * - this is part 2 of Do You Like Worms, 10/18/66.
2. Heroes And Villains Theme (take unknown) 1:06 * - this is the fade of Do You Like Worms, 10/18/66.
3. Heroes And Villains (part 1 - 1st vocal overdub) 0:52 - 3-7 are the 10/20/66 session (track 3, CD2 of the box set) with various vocal overdubs from 2/67; I'd wager either 2/21, 2/24, 2/26, or 2/27.
4. Heroes And Villains (part 1 - 2nd vocal overdub) 0:46
5. Heroes And Villains (part 1 - 3rd vocal overdub) 0:46
6. Heroes And Villains (part 1 - 4th vocal overdub) 0:47
7. Heroes And Villains (part 1 - 5th vocal overdub) 0:47
8. "In The Cantina" (vocal overdub take unknown) 0:38 * - this is Michael's vocal overdub on take 17, 1/27/67.
9. "My Children Were Raised" (vocal overdub take unknown) 0:18 * - this is a mono mix of this section, 1/23/67.
10. "How I Love My Girl" (vocal overdub take 10) 1:59 - this is where things get extremely confusing (I'm engaging in mental cartwheels just writing this part of the post!). All knowledge seems to point to various "Part 2" sessions being held in December of '66 and January/February of '67. This track is incorrectly labelled on the SOT 17 bootleg as a vocal overdub on take 10 yet it's really an attempt at a Part 2 mono mixdown. It follows "Gee" on BWPS up until 0:48, then immediately cuts into "Swedish Frog", which cuts (before the animal noises) at 1:21 into a vocal overdub on take 8 of a section known as "Hold On". It has become accepted (or at least until the box set tracklist had been released), that all of these segments were recorded on 12/27/66 or 12/28/66. However, the box set tracklist lists all of these segments as being from 2/20/67. Two things of note, however - the 12/27/66 session (which also featured vocal work on Cabin Essence and Wonderful) and 12/28/66 session were both vocal sessions with only Brian participating. The 2/20/67 session, however, has the entire band on vocals. All of these segments discussed under this umbrella clearly feature the entire band on vocals. HOWEVER; look at track 27 on CD2 of the box set -
27. Heroes and Villains: Part Two (Master Take) (2/27/67) (1:44) - this same track on SOT 17 that we're discussing, minus the count-offs and dead air, runs around 1:44. This might be the same track. So, I think this one is nailed down - the sessions are from 2/20/67, and the mixdown from 2/27/67.
11. Heroes And Villains (last part - mono mix) 1:13 * - 11 and 13 are mono/stereo mixes of the fade to The Old Master Painter, 11/30/66. 12 is a bootleg hiccup; it's a Can't Wait Too Long fragment.
12. Heroes And Villains (last part - stereo mix) 0:40
13. Heroes And Villains (last part - stereo mix) 1:09
14. Heroes And Villains (mono mix attempt) 1:55 * - 14-16 are mono mix attempts (obviously), 1/27/67.
15. Heroes And Villains (mono mix attempt) 0:52 *
16. Heroes And Villains (mono mix attempt) 1:21 *
17. Heroes And Villains Part 2 (takes 1 & 2) 1:40 - 17-19 are from the session for Part 2 of The Old Master Painter, 11/30/66.
18. Heroes And Villains Part 2 (takes 4-8) 2:35
19. Heroes And Villains Part 2 (takes 14 & 15) 1:45
Then we have the verse and Barnyard from the next session on October 20th. Is this the only recording of Barnyard that was ever done? The one that's available on boots? I heard that it was originally discovered as a single track on a low quality 4-track tape. I wonder if they found multitracks for this or what.
For some reason, Barnyard was considered to have been tracked on 12/13/66, but there is no documentation to support this. The 10/20/66 date sounds more plausible. There are two versions that circulate; the first is the common acetate copy and the second is from a tape source.
Then we have 10/27 I'm In Great Shape. Is this the version with 3 different takes with Van Dyke participating?
This is indeed the same session, although we're definitely going to hear more on the box set as the three booted takes combined only run about 2:25.
Next we have "Intro "Early Version"" from December, no exact date. AGD has 5 Heroes sessions listed for December, 4 of them were vocal sessions at Columbia. December 19th was at Western. Is that what this is from? Why weren't they able to pin down an exact date. I had always assumed that "Bag of Tricks" was the "early version" of the intro but that's track number 8. So what precisely is this? When does the version on the GV Box date from? I think this may be "Intro-Alternate Version" available on Heroes and Villains Sessions - Volume 2.
I'm thinking the "Intro (Early Version)" might be the "Intro" on the Good Vibrations box or the "Bells" intro (same as track 18 on H&V Sessions Volume 2), but I don't know for sure as both have been labelled as 3/1/67 sessions. Probably best to reserve any judgments until we hear the box.
The next 6 tracks are all from the first session of 1967, a session at Columbia.
7. Heroes And Villains: Do A Lot [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/3/67]
8. Heroes And Villains: Bag Of Tricks [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/3/67]
9. Heroes And Villains: Mission Pak [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/3/67]
10. Heroes And Villains: Bridge To Indians [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/3/67]
11. Heroes And Villains: Part 1 Tag [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/3/67]
12. Heroes And Villains: Pickup To 3rd Verse [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/3/67]
I think the Do A Lot here is available on the Heroes and Villains Sessions-Vol. 2 boot. "If there's not any more cooperation man, I'm splitting". The Vega-Tables version of this has vibes I think, and vocals were recorded separately from the backing track. Here it seems to all be live with someone playing the Piano.
Bag of Tricks is well known, and has two different versions on H&V Sessions - Vol. 2.
Bridge to Indians is also on H&V Sessions - Vol. 2. It's the very brief vocal snippet that appears right before Gee on the GV Box "sections" track. Part 1 Tag has three takes available.
Pickup to 3rd verse and Mission Pak are the only things that don't appear on the Sessions Boot. But they are likely vocal tracks or feature little more than piano. Someone has pointed out that "Mission Pak" was a fruit cake company with a well known jingle. This session was just after New Years and someone in the other thread pointed out that on the track "Dum Dum Dum" on Heroes and Villains Session Vol. 1, as they try and record "Soul Made Beautiful" Brian is getting a little exasperated and instructs them for a "happy happy happy mission pak singing sound!"
So the only question what is "Pickup to 3rd Verse". It's probably something old, but might be something new.
Regarding the 1/3/67 date, I'm very hesitant to consider that as the definitive session date for all of those fragments. There is a comp reel in the vaults, dated 1/3/67, containing (also the source of) the following selections -
Do a Lot
Tag to Part One - three takes
Bridge to Indians
Pickup to 3rd Verse
Bag of Tricks - instrumental, 2 takes
All Day – multiple takes (piano only version of Dada, Part 2)
The reason I'm hesitant to call 1/3/67 the date for those selections is obvious - 1/3/67 was a vocal session at Columbia. Tag to Part One, Bag of Tricks, and All Day are both instrumental sessions. Brian only used Columbia for vocal recordings, and I doubt that he would have suddenly changed his mind on 1/3/67. Conceivably, the Bridge to Indians selection could date from 1/3/67 at Columbia as they are indeed vocal sessions. Do A Lot, I don't know, unless 1/3/67 was the date Brian had the band overdub their vocals over an earlier piano track. All Day, I believe, might be the 12/22/66 session as excerpted on CD4, track 8 of the box set (
8. Da Da (Taped Piano Strings) (1:00))
There are actually two versions of the "Part 1 tag". The first consists of three tracks on H&V Sessions Volume 2; the first is take 1 (possibly a "master", the announcement is "part 1 tag, take 1"), the second and third are two individual instrumental overdubs on top of take 1. The second version of the "Part 1 tag" is also on several bootlegs (and in best quality on Archaeology); it consists of takes 1 and 2 (the announcement before take 1 is, simply, "take 1"; after take 1 immediately falls apart, the announcement is "tag to part 1, second version, take 2"). The date of both is up for debate; I also don't think 1/3/67 is the date for either session.
"Mission Pak" is the "Soul Made Beautiful" session. However, the presence of a track called "Bridge to Indians" and "Pickup to 3rd Verse" is quite confusing, because at one point Bridge to Indians was known as the Pickup to 3rd Verse. Unless something else was found, color me curiously confused.
The next 6 tracks are from another session at Columbia, January 5th session at Western and and a January 20th session at Columbia aren't represented.
13. Heroes And Villains: Children Were Raised [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/27/67]
14. Heroes And Villains: Part 2 (Cantina track) [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/27/67]
15. Heroes And Villains: Whistling Bridge [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/27/67]
16. Heroes And Villains: Cantina [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/27/67]
17. Heroes And Villains: All Day [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/27/67]
18. Heroes And Villains: Verse Edit Experiment [Heroes And Villains Session: 1/27/67]
The Children Were Raised section here I guess is the "often wise" version. This session seems to be represented on the H&V Sessions Boot as well. All Day is the "early" version of Dada. There are two versions of the Cantina section here, I wonder what the difference is? Maybe one has vocals and one doesn't? "Whistling Bridge" is available as "Dumb Whistle", that's pretty well known.
Finally there's "Verse Edit Experiment", on the H&V Session Boot there appears between the other tracks in this cluster, tracks labeled "Mix Session" and "Test Edit", that seem to be unextraordinary fumblings with vocal mixes. I reckon "Mix Session" may be what "Verse Edit Experiment" is.
"All Day" on here is most definitely unbooted, and not the same as what's been going around on bootlegs under the same title. Agree on all other points.
The next session is a Western Session from Feb. 15th. Five Heroes sessions occurred between 1/27 and 2/15. One at Western, four at Columbia.
19. Heroes And Villains: Prelude To Fade [Heroes And Villains Session: 2/15/67]
20. Heroes And Villains: Piano Theme [Heroes And Villains Session: 2/15/67]
"Prelude to Fade" is widely available, for my money "Piano Theme" is probably the Bicycle Rider theme. I think this session is represented on the H&V Sessions boot as well.
No arguments.
The next six tracks are from Feb. 20th. AGD's site does not have a session listed on this date. 2/21, 2/24, and 2/26 are listed as vocal sessions, 2/27, and 2/28 were Western sessions. It seems the 2/20 session was a vocal session. Is this a previously unknown session, or is it a revised date for one of the three Columbia sessions?
21. Heroes And Villains: Part 2 [Heroes And Villains Sesssion: 2/20/67]
22. Heroes And Villains: Part 2 (Gee) (Master Take) [Heroes And Villains Sesssion: 2/20/67]
23. Heroes And Villains: Part 2 Revised [Heroes And Villains Sesssion: 2/20/67]
24. Heroes And Villains: Part 2 Revised (Master Take) [Heroes And Villains Sesssion: 2/20/67]
25. Heroes And Villains: Part 3 (Animals) (Master Take) [Heroes And Villains Sesssion: 2/20/67]
26. Heroes And Villains: Part 4 [Heroes And Villains Session: 2/20/67]
What exactly are these? We know what Gee is, which leads me to believe these are all vocal bits or have vocals maybe. Actually attempting to parse out which section is part 2, part 3, or part 4 is difficult. UM 17 has Part 2 as the "False Barnyard" Fade section. Following the "Prelude to Fade" bits on the H&V Sessions Boot there are some funny little lyrics recorded over the fade section. Maybe that's from this session. Maybe one of these is "Barnshine". I don't think that "Part 2" here is an actual whole song, I doubt it's the B-side of the 45. I think it's some different gos at the fade section.
Part 3 (Animals) is a mystery to me, possibly something Barnyard related? Does anybody have any idea what Heroes sections Brian was calling Part 3 and Part 4? These maybe are new.
If I had to guess these are all vocal segments, like Swedish Frog, or the "doo doo doo-Heroes and villains-doo doo doo" parts.
See my comments above about track 10 of SOT 17.
2/27 was a session at Western, at least two vocal sessions took place between 2/20 and 2/27.
27. Heroes And Villains: Part Two (Master Take) 2/27/67 [Heroes And Villains Sesssion: 2/27/67]
28. Heroes And Villains: Fade 2/28/67 [Heroes And Villains Sesssion: 2/27/67]
Notice how track 28 is listed as being from two different sessions. Not sure if that's just an error or what. In any event we know what the fade is, no mystery there. Of course that raises questions whether "Part 2" is also the fade, as listed on the UM 17 boot. Sort of uncertain as to what these two pieces represent.
See my comments above about track 10 of SOT 17. The "fade" here is a 2/28/67 re-recording of the fade section tracked as Part 2 of The Old Master Painted on 11/30/66.
The next session is from Western 3/1, the last sessions before this one were 2/27 and 2/28.
29. Heroes And Villains: Verse remake [Heroes And Villains Session: 3/1/67]
30. Heroes And Villains: Organ Waltz / Intro [Heroes And Villains Session: 3/1/67]
I imagine the "Intro" here is the one we know and love, perhaps these were overdubs on the original track. I have no idea what "Organ Waltz" is, somebody said earlier in the thread that they heard a boot of Van Dyke playing the intro on Organ, I don't think I've ever heard that, and the date here is after Van Dyke left isn't it? On inspection this appears to be the track "Evening Session" from Heroes and Villains Sessions Volume 1
In what way was the verse section remade? A total rerecord? Are we getting closer to the Smiley version of the song at this session? If "Evening Session" is indeed only one session, the 3/1/67 Western session, then that track also seems to include "Verse Remake", which would be 1:25 to 2:17 of that track.
This one, I believe, will have to wait until we hear the box.
The final session on the box is 6/14, the only Heroes session following 3/1 was a 3/2 session at Western. The 6/14 session is a Smiley session that took place in Brian's home studio:
31. Heroes And Villains: Chorus Vocals [Heroes And Villains Session: 6/14/67]
32. Heroes And Villains: Barbershop [Heroes And Villains Session: 6/14/67]
33. Heroes And Villains: Children Were Raised (Remake) [Heroes And Villains Session: 6/14/67]
34. Heroes And Villains: Children Were Raised (Master Take Overdubs Mix 1) [Heroes And Villains Session: 6/14/67]
35. Heroes And Villains: Children Were Raised (Master Take A Capella) [Heroes And Villains Session: 6/14/67]
It seems these are all vocal bits. Children Were Raised and Chorus vocals sound self explanatory. Barbershop is totally unknown to me, maybe just an outtake or rehearsal or something, done on the fly by the guys. I imagine The Children Were Raised here is the "regular" version without the "Often wise" part.
Agree on all counts.
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