Opinons on what's false about what's written in WIBN: My Own Story

[Iron Horse-Apples]

This book should be filed in the 'fiction' section of libraries and bookstores. Or have a disclaimer sticker on the front warning that 95% of the material is lifted from other books or made up by a man with as much objectivity as Hitler did when he wrote "Mein Kampf".

Not to play devil's advocate but at least Hitler wrote Mein Kampf.

No, Brian Wilson wrote "Mein Kampf", and I'll sue anyone who disagrees!

[cutterschoice]

zen??? .......  what zen......

from the man himself.....

 http://www.earcandymag.com/brianwilson-2004.htm

E.C.: So there were no Zen influences?

Brian Wilson: No. It wasn't inspired by Phil Spector either.


Here's an older interview segment. Has some relevance
(http://whatanicewaytoturn17.blogspot.com/2011/02/brian-wilson-by-jeremy-gluck-yknow-what.html)

JG – In view of your use of the word spiritual and its relevance to your music, do you believe in God? Are you religious in that sense?

BW – I never was....uh, I had what is called a “toehold”. I got that from a book called “A Toehold On Zen”. I learned from that book and from people who had a toehold on...say somebody had a grasp on life, a good grasp – they ought to be able to transfer that over to another thing. That's what happened with me; I got good with a great many things in my life. Business, music and sports....I'm a good athlete – I can play racket ball and basketball with the heavies, with the young people. I'm co-ordinated. I've got a grasp on music, sports....life

[Iron Horse-Apples]

Mein Kampf

By Adolph Hitler

And Tod Gold

I Imagined the headlines. Adolph Hitler. Third Reich Genius. Fired From Party.
Fired.
The word was absolutely foreign to me, impossible to understand or accept. I sat motionless, speechless, empassive.
"Listen to what we're saying", said Josef Goebbals, the Nazis' propaganda minister.
The Party was seated around a large conference table, watching my reaction to the letter they had given me to read. I read it several times then  glanced at each of my party members - stone faced Goebbals, baby faced Heinreich Himmler. My friend since high school Hermann Goerring. The word "terminated", and "final solution" resonated in my syrapy brain. In shock, I didn't know what to think, or how to react.
"I'm fired?" I asked. "Is that what you're telling me?"
"That's right", Goebbals said.
"Fired", I still didn't believe it. "What the f**k", I founded the Nazis!"

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I despise that picture so much...

Insert Quote
Mein Kampf
By Adolph Hitler
And Tod Gold
I Imagined the headlines. Adolph Hitler. Third Reich Genius. Fired From Party.
Fired.
The word was absolutely foreign to me, impossible to understand or accept. I sat motionless, speechless, empassive.
"Listen to what we're saying", said Josef Goebbals, the Nazis' propaganda minister.
The Party was seated around a large conference table, watching my reaction to the letter they had given me to read. I read it several times then  glanced at each of my party members - stone faced Goebbals, baby faced Heinreich Himmler. My friend since high school Hermann Goerring. The word "terminated", and "final solution" resonated in my syrapy brain. In shock, I didn't know what to think, or how to react.
"I'm fired?" I asked. "Is that what you're telling me?"
"That's right", Goebbals said.
"Fired", I still didn't believe it. "What the f**k", I founded the Nazis!"
Posted on: Today at 03:44:59 PM
Posted by: cutterschoice

LMAO

[Jason]

The Smiley Smile Message Board will be banned in Germany before the evening is out.

[Jon Stebbins]

And did Mike Love really say to Brian: 'those shoes are hideous? Nah.

The BB were not exactly known for their fashion sense, esp. in the 70s, so that would be a pot/kettle/black type of situation.

Especially in the 70's?? Your kidding right? The BB's were soooooooooooo much cooler in the '70's than they were in the '80's and '90's. I mean those ridiculous Tommy Bahama shirts and Hawaiian shirts and those tennis shorts and those wimpy country club izod and polo shirts that say sell-out all over them. Oh... and the pony tails on balding guys, and Mike's hideous color combinations. Khakis. Topsiders. I'm gonna barf!! They were pretty hip for most of the '70's in comparison.

[Chris Brown]

Mein Kampf

By Adolph Hitler

And Tod Gold

I Imagined the headlines. Adolph Hitler. Third Reich Genius. Fired From Party.
Fired.
The word was absolutely foreign to me, impossible to understand or accept. I sat motionless, speechless, empassive.
"Listen to what we're saying", said Josef Goebbals, the Nazis' propaganda minister.
The Party was seated around a large conference table, watching my reaction to the letter they had given me to read. I read it several times then  glanced at each of my party members - stone faced Goebbals, baby faced Heinreich Himmler. My friend since high school Hermann Goerring. The word "terminated", and "final solution" resonated in my syrapy brain. In shock, I didn't know what to think, or how to react.
"I'm fired?" I asked. "Is that what you're telling me?"
"That's right", Goebbals said.
"Fired", I still didn't believe it. "What the f**k", I founded the Nazis!"

 

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

And did Mike Love really say to Brian: 'those shoes are hideous? Nah.

The BB were not exactly known for their fashion sense, esp. in the 70s, so that would be a pot/kettle/black type of situation.

Especially in the 70's?? Your kidding right? The BB's were soooooooooooo much cooler in the '70's than they were in the '80's and '90's. I mean those ridiculous Tommy Bahama shirts and Hawaiian shirts and those tennis shorts and those wimpy country club izod and polo shirts that say sell-out all over them. Oh... and the pony tails on balding guys, and Mike's hideous color combinations. Khakis. Topsiders. I'm gonna barf!! They were pretty hip for most of the '70's in comparison.

True, but I don't consider the post-Dennis group to be the real BB

In all seriousness though, i was thinking of the late 70s BB when I posted that.

[18thofMay]

I despise that picture so much...

Insert Quote
Mein Kampf
By Adolph Hitler
And Tod Gold
I Imagined the headlines. Adolph Hitler. Third Reich Genius. Fired From Party.
Fired.
The word was absolutely foreign to me, impossible to understand or accept. I sat motionless, speechless, empassive.
"Listen to what we're saying", said Josef Goebbals, the Nazis' propaganda minister.
The Party was seated around a large conference table, watching my reaction to the letter they had given me to read. I read it several times then  glanced at each of my party members - stone faced Goebbals, baby faced Heinreich Himmler. My friend since high school Hermann Goerring. The word "terminated", and "final solution" resonated in my syrapy brain. In shock, I didn't know what to think, or how to react.
"I'm fired?" I asked. "Is that what you're telling me?"
"That's right", Goebbals said.
"Fired", I still didn't believe it. "What the f**k", I founded the Nazis!"
Posted on: Today at 03:44:59 PM
Posted by: cutterschoice

LMAO

And that whole interview is just flat out freaky...Freakier than normal!

[Bill Tobelman]

Andrew G. Doe said:

Brian's trips are well-documented.

Where?

[Mike's Beard]

Andrew G. Doe said:

Brian's trips are well-documented.

Where?

 

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

[Bill Tobelman]

The original goal of SMiLE was to bring about spiritual enlightenment.

Evidence of this is from Brian himself. In the Vosse piece Brian wants people to eat vegetables for health because "health is an important ingredient in spiritual enlightenment." He's promoting health (on the SMiLE album) to promote spiritual enlightenment.

This same theme can be detected in Brian's piece for The Beat.

"...Brian Gemini was a very quick-witted sort of soul, and he perceived instantly that he would need a great deal of out-of-sight energy to be able to cope with this brand new out-of-sight world which he had just seen with his new found out-of-sight vision....Shortly after this enlightening perception...." Once again the vegetables &, in this case, the out-of-sight world, are a health & spiritual enlightenment tie-in. Doubters should check out the piece in LLVS.

And Brian's explanation of the "Surf's Up" lyrics ends with "the joy of enlightenment, of seeing God." Once again a piece of SMiLE music is tied to spiritual enlightenment. But this isn't just done by Brian.

Frank Holmes in his piece at the end of Priore's latest SMiLE book explains some "Surf's Up" lyrics: "...and 'two-step to lamp's light' is an idea of stepping to enlightenment, finding your way there."

So how would one make an album that could inspire spiritual enlightenment? Please, will all the brilliant reading people reading this post write down how they'd make an album that could inspire spiritual enlightenment. DO IT!!!! Don't be gutless cowards. If you're so freakin' smart it should be easy. Take your time & don't read any further until you've done so. If you come up empty then realize that maybe you aren't so freakin' smart. If you can get over yourselves then read on.

In Brian's bio (despite all its flaws) the bookstore acid flashback scene presents a possible way to do this. Brian seems taken to solving the riddle and recalls Loren saying that flashbacks are "comparable to Zen riddles, mysteries full of meaning." So perhaps presenting "mysteries full  of meaning" would produce a result (spiritual enlightenment) that was comparable to Zen riddles & their result (spiritual enlightenment).

If we step back & consider hypothetically an album capable of prompting the spiritual "oceanic" experience then a strange thing happens: all of the farthest out claims about the SMiLE project (based upon the perceptions of folks surrounding the project & involved in the project) come true. Brian knew no boundaries---TRUE. He was the potential leader of the movement ----TRUE. He & Van Dyke were  making a mind-blowing fully integrated concept album----TRUE. Nothing was impossible----TRUE.

And this spiritual goal also completely meshes with Brian's consistent claims from the era: that he was making spiritual music.

If we consider Brian's claims the SMiLE was ahead of it's time----YEAH. What about Brian's claims that it still is too advanced---YEAH. What about Brian's claims that it's "inappropriate music"----YEAH, quite possibly (tho I have to add that such endeavors are also held in the highest regard my many religions).

This is totally consistent stuff. The spiritual enlightenment goal solves it all, and elevates SMiLE in a league of its own (perhaps the greatest album ever???).

[18thofMay]

Have you asked Brian or Van-Dyke??

[Bill Tobelman]

No.

Brian blocked the release of the SMiLE material for years (due to its 'inappropriate" nature). He has never explained how the music was "inappropriate." Apparently, he doesn't want folks to know what he really was up to. Peter Reum even recently admitted that Brian isn't spilling any beans.

You'll also notice that Van Dyke has taken on more of the "ask me, I wrote all the words" role to take the pressure off of Brian as he doesn't want to handle the hard SMiLE questions. VDP is adept at fielding the toughies.

If those guys admit to what they were up to (Bob Hanes said "Brian & Van Dyke knew exactly what they were doing") a lot of folks likely would be pretty pissed off. SMiLE has become a big deal over the years. Better to play it out as is.

Plus, mysteries and myths sell records.

[bgas]

The original goal of SMiLE was to bring about spiritual enlightenment.

Evidence of this is from Brian himself. In the Vosse piece Brian wants people to eat vegetables for health because "health is an important ingredient in spiritual enlightenment." He's promoting health (on the SMiLE album) to promote spiritual enlightenment.

This same theme can be detected in Brian's piece for The Beat.

"...Brian Gemini was a very quick-witted sort of soul, and he perceived instantly that he would need a great deal of out-of-sight energy to be able to cope with this brand new out-of-sight world which he had just seen with his new found out-of-sight vision....Shortly after this enlightening perception...." Once again the vegetables &, in this case, the out-of-sight world, are a health & spiritual enlightenment tie-in. Doubters should check out the piece in LLVS.

And Brian's explanation of the "Surf's Up" lyrics ends with "the joy of enlightenment, of seeing God." Once again a piece of SMiLE music is tied to spiritual enlightenment. But this isn't just done by Brian.

So I'm following you with all the above, and giving you the benefit.
 But then you go off into this mighty/flighty "he said" stuff. As far as I can tell, Frank didn't write the words, so his interpretation isn't worth anymore than mine or yours or AGD's, on down the line. He based his artwork, on what HE supposed VDP was saying, but there's no solid evidence that's what he(VDP) meant. I've never heard VDP spell it out like that.
Have you? 

And then you trip back down the lane into Gold -land once more, pre-supposing that Brian wrote it, when it's been hammered out time and again that it's a work of fiction, rivaling "Glimpses".
I get a kick out of your presentations, and your not backing down, but I have to wonder if you really even believe any of the malarkey you're spouting yourself?
 

Frank Holmes in his piece at the end of Priore's latest SMiLE book explains some "Surf's Up" lyrics: "...and 'two-step to lamp's light' is an idea of stepping to enlightenment, finding your way there."


In Brian's bio (despite all its flaws) the bookstore acid flashback scene presents a possible way to do this. Brian seems taken to solving the riddle and recalls Loren saying that flashbacks are "comparable to Zen riddles, mysteries full of meaning." So perhaps presenting "mysteries full  of meaning" would produce a result (spiritual enlightenment) that was comparable to Zen riddles & their result (spiritual enlightenment).

If we step back & consider hypothetically an album capable of prompting the spiritual "oceanic" experience then a strange thing happens: all of the farthest out claims about the SMiLE project (based upon the perceptions of folks surrounding the project & involved in the project) come true. Brian knew no boundaries---TRUE. He was the potential leader of the movement ----TRUE. He & Van Dyke were  making a mind-blowing fully integrated concept album----TRUE. Nothing was impossible----TRUE.

And this spiritual goal also completely meshes with Brian's consistent claims from the era: that he was making spiritual music.

If we consider Brian's claims the SMiLE was ahead of it's time----YEAH. What about Brian's claims that it still is too advanced---YEAH. What about Brian's claims that it's "inappropriate music"----YEAH, quite possibly (tho I have to add that such endeavors are also held in the highest regard my many religions).

This is totally consistent stuff. The spiritual enlightenment goal solves it all, and elevates SMiLE in a league of its own (perhaps the greatest album ever???).

[18thofMay]

No.

Brian blocked the release of the SMiLE material for years (due to its 'inappropriate" nature). He has never explained how the music was "inappropriate." Apparently, he doesn't want folks to know what he really was up to. Peter Reum even recently admitted that Brian isn't spilling any beans.

You'll also notice that Van Dyke has taken on more of the "ask me, I wrote all the words" role to take the pressure off of Brian as he doesn't want to handle the hard SMiLE questions. VDP is adept at fielding the toughies.

If those guys admit to what they were up to (Bob Hanes said "Brian & Van Dyke knew exactly what they were doing") a lot of folks likely would be pretty pissed off. SMiLE has become a big deal over the years. Better to play it out as is.

Plus, mysteries and myths sell records.

Sorry Bill but that above response is an absolute joke!
Brian "junked" SMiLE for many well documented reasons and Van Dyke was the lyricist!

[Jim V.]

Basically Gold - and he admitted this in Billboard - took other people's quotes and put them in Brian's mouth (his excuse was that he had to flesh out Brian's terse/monosyllabic interview responses).

When was it that Brian became so terse in his responses?
I've seen and heard early interviews where he's very talkative and articulate. Is it that, these days, Brian isn't just terse in interviews, but just in general?

Was it a sudden shift as a result of the abuse his mind was put through with the over-medication of psychotropic drugs, or a more gradual thing?

Brian was always slightly eccentric in interviews but before 1976 it wasn't glaring by rock star standards. His interviews could be strange from 76-82 but generally he seemed to be aware of what was being asked and knew how to react to it. After 1982 Brian's reactions become more odd and gradually he became less engaged by his surroundings. There are exceptions but you have to be very carefull with a post 1983 quote. I got him to talk a little because I covered music he usually didn't discuss much, but he wasn't nearly as through as I expect a pre second Landy term Brian would have been.

Hey, MBE, maybe you've discussed this before...but anyways, is there anywhere I can read this interview with him, where you "covered music he didn't discuss much"? That sounds really interesting, and I'm sure you did a great job, as you are usually one of the most sensible posters here.

[Bill Tobelman]

Frank Holmes is key to understanding SMiLE. By being somewhat out of the loop his honesty regarding his contribution is illuminating.

How did YOU propose to make an album capable of prompting spiritual enlightenment? You didn't say.

The point of the bio reference was to indicate that the unreliable bio DID have an idea how to achieve the goal of SMiLE. Wow. It's as if a total piece of crap had the clue that could produce the greatest album never made.

My guess is that none of the online geniuses reading my prior post could come up with a single way to make an album with the ability to promote spiritual enlightenment.

So then, if the bio has a better idea then any of the online geniuses could come up with.....who do you think is the genius who came up the idea for the bio?

[bgas]

So then, if the bio has a better idea then any of the online geniuses could come up with.....who do you think is the genius who came up the idea for the bio?

That's obvious. Bill Tobelman

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

So then, if the bio has a better idea then any of the online geniuses could come up with.....who do you think is the genius who came up the idea for the bio?

Oh my fucking sh*t....BRIAN DID NOT WRITE THE DAMN THING.  As much as you wish and hope he did, he did not. Who came up with idea for the bio? Try Landy and Brian's management at the time.

My guess is that none of the online geniuses reading my prior post could come up with a single way to make an album with the ability to promote spiritual enlightenment.

You guessed wrong.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Andrew G. Doe said:

Brian's trips are well-documented.

Where?

That well-known paragon of accuracy, Wouldn't It Be Nice - My Own Story.

Also, every other source Gold stole those accounts from. 

'Course... if you're implying that Brian's trips are fiction, or even inaccurately reported, then 50% of your 'clear-light' theory just keeled over and died. Can't have it both ways, Bill. Can't manipulate the evidence to your own ends.

[Andrew G. Doe]

The original goal of SMiLE was to bring about spiritual enlightenment.

Evidence of this is from Brian himself. In the Vosse piece Brian wants people to eat vegetables for health because "health is an important ingredient in spiritual enlightenment." He's promoting health (on the SMiLE album) to promote spiritual enlightenment.

If you're referring to the Fusion article... I can't find anything even close to him saying that. if it's not, care to point me at the article in question ?

"...Brian Gemini was a very quick-witted sort of soul, and he perceived instantly that he would need a great deal of out-of-sight energy to be able to cope with this brand new out-of-sight world which he had just seen with his new found out-of-sight vision....Shortly after this enlightening perception...." Once again the vegetables &, in this case, the out-of-sight world, are a health & spiritual enlightenment tie-in. Doubters should check out the piece in LLVS.

Firstly, where's the reference to vegetables in this... secondly, Bill, that whole piece is a put-on, a joke, hence the repetitions of "out-of-sight" in an intentionally square spelling.

And Brian's explanation of the "Surf's Up" lyrics ends with "the joy of enlightenment, of seeing God." Once again a piece of SMiLE music is tied to spiritual enlightenment.

That sounds to me, and many others, like Brian repeating what Van Dyke told him in explanation.

In Brian's bio (despite all its flaws) the bookstore acid flashback scene presents a possible way to do this. Brian seems taken to solving the riddle and recalls Loren saying that flashbacks are "comparable to Zen riddles, mysteries full of meaning." So perhaps presenting "mysteries full  of meaning" would produce a result (spiritual enlightenment) that was comparable to Zen riddles & their result (spiritual enlightenment).

Is this flashback reported anywhere else except in this book ? If not, then it's immediately suspect.

Brian blocked the release of the SMiLE material for years (due to its 'inappropriate" nature). He has never explained how the music was "inappropriate." Apparently, he doesn't want folks to know what he really was up to. Peter Reum even recently admitted that Brian isn't spilling any beans.

Or... he didn't want to be reminded of one of the worst times of his life, and of his greatest artistic and personal failure.

Plus, mysteries and myths sell records.

Ummm, and exactly how does blocking the release of something for over 40 years promote the sales of same ?

[Jay]

zen??? .......  what zen......

from the man himself.....

 http://www.earcandymag.com/brianwilson-2004.htm

E.C.: So there were no Zen influences?

Brian Wilson: No. It wasn't inspired by Phil Spector either.


Here's an older interview segment. Has some relevance
(http://whatanicewaytoturn17.blogspot.com/2011/02/brian-wilson-by-jeremy-gluck-yknow-what.html)

JG – In view of your use of the word spiritual and its relevance to your music, do you believe in God? Are you religious in that sense?

BW – I never was....uh, I had what is called a “toehold”. I got that from a book called “A Toehold On Zen”. I learned from that book and from people who had a toehold on...say somebody had a grasp on life, a good grasp – they ought to be able to transfer that over to another thing. That's what happened with me; I got good with a great many things in my life. Business, music and sports....I'm a good athlete – I can play racket ball and basketball with the heavies, with the young people. I'm co-ordinated. I've got a grasp on music, sports....life

I think that the interview referenced above is about all the proof you need, regarding the legitimacy of the "autobiography".

[Andrew G. Doe]

Frank Holmes is key to understanding SMiLE. By being somewhat out of the loop his honesty regarding his contribution is illuminating.

His contribution was to make illustrations (which are splendid visual puns) from the lyrics supplied to him by Brian & Van Dyke: he never heard one note of the music and his direct involvement in the project was done by early fall 1966. No-one spoke to him at the time: all his observations have the benefit of a couple of decades of hindsight.