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Author Topic: Beach Boys (Mike/Bruce) appearing on CNN 4th of July special  (Read 7766 times)
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« Reply #25 on: July 04, 2021, 11:13:43 PM »

As it should be….. Evil
And you're right, SB. I heard a good part of it on another board. Mike Love was absolutely awful with off key, thin tinny vocals and mostly sounding like a faulty jackhammer. The whole act is more shot than his voice and it's so sad to see the legacy treated this way by this money grubbing over the hill clown. It's far beyond time to pull whatever rights he may have and put this jackass out to pasture for good. The name (BB's) should also be retired as it should have after Carl and Dennis were gone and Mike Love kicked Al out of the band. Hey Mike, IT'S OVER!!! FOR GOD'S SAKE, LET IT GO!!!  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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« Reply #26 on: July 04, 2021, 11:35:00 PM »

As long as there are screaming people and a national TV broadcast, the end is not near.
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« Reply #27 on: July 05, 2021, 01:33:41 AM »

This really didn't sound as well on my small loudspeakers. Maybe this was just the TV mix and it sounded better in person?


Anyway, here's a little bit more:

Sloop John B:
https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/9596765/john-stamos-beach-boys-fourth-of-july-special/


EDIT:

Here's more of it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wug3rNqlK1o

00:00 - talk
00:16 - God Only Knows
03:20 - California Girls
06:27 - Sloop John B
09:40 - Wouldn't It Be Nice



Thanks to the uploader!
« Last Edit: July 05, 2021, 02:08:30 AM by Rocker » Logged

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« Reply #28 on: July 05, 2021, 06:06:46 AM »

Retire Mike.
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« Reply #29 on: July 05, 2021, 07:05:53 AM »

I’m gonna be honest, I actually thought that was pretty okay. They sounded much better than I would have expected. Definitely not the embarrassment the Mark McGrath performance of a couple of years ago was.
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« Reply #30 on: July 05, 2021, 08:38:20 AM »

I’m gonna be honest, I actually thought that was pretty okay. They sounded much better than I would have expected. Definitely not the embarrassment the Mark McGrath performance of a couple of years ago was.
Same. They sound old, but that's fine, because they are old. I'd take this over autotune or lipsynch.
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« Reply #31 on: July 05, 2021, 10:31:18 AM »

Most of the vocalists didn't sound so hot on this one.

I have to imagine the year and half with few shows has still left them a bit rusty. Mike and Bruce sound rougher than usual. Even Eichenberger kinda sounded pitchy on his stuff, both on his high vocal parts and his lead on WIBN. Christian Love's lead on "God Only Knows" was fine I guess, though even he seemed a little extra low energy and a little rough. But yeah, it still comes across as very "tribute band"; they start sounding more and more anonymous as the years go by. The shirts don't help.

It's even more perplexing because Mike has bloated the band out the way he seemed to frown up in the past. Given how this band sounded and the material they do in concert, they could easily drop the sax player and the bass player and have Eichenberger move back to bass.

The whole band sounded rather thin and fragile vocally and even musically. The time off has to be a factor, but I also think that age is not going to do anything but catch up with these guys, however slowly or swiftly.

I listened to a bunch of the bands on this multi-hour CNN thing, especially the older bands, and I have to say this telecast was not kind to much of any of the aging singers. Even the replacement to the replacement to the replacement of Peter Cetera guy in Chicago sounded a little rough. Robert Lamm was sounding pretty weak. The REO Speedwagon guy was struggling. Even Susanna Hoffs is having to drop keys and octaves to sing her songs; she has visually aged much better than most (note her band had Peter Asher as well as Jeff Alan Ross from Al Jardine's club tours). I guess the replacement guy in Foreigner sounded okay.

But a lot of these bands seem to be hobbling physically and musically/vocally a little more these days, and that's even after you factor in that most of these bands have been backfilled over the years with younger guys. Even the "younger" backing guys in these bands are sometimes starting to hit social security age.

And since when did Billy Ray Cyrus start looking *and sounding* like Rob Zombie?

Not trying to be a downer; the new "pop" music on this thing was truly dreadful. I guess I'd still rather hear a fourth generation Cetera replacement sing "25 or 6 to 4."
« Last Edit: July 05, 2021, 10:32:46 AM by HeyJude » Logged

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« Reply #32 on: July 05, 2021, 01:24:18 PM »

Wow, that performance was really awful. Mike sounds every bit the 80 year old man, he sounded terrible, couldn't even hit the notes correctly, voice cracked more than once. Gee, how long can this sharpening of the name continue?
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« Reply #33 on: July 05, 2021, 02:14:54 PM »

If they would bother with doing a good mix at least the band would sound a lot better. These mixes does them no justice to be fair.
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« Reply #34 on: July 05, 2021, 06:37:16 PM »

Damn, that was rough. Among the worst singing I've heard from Mike. It's almost like he's trying to sing "California Girls" a half step lower than the band's playing. Instrumentally, it's not bad, just blah...which is odd, after such a stretch of not playing these tunes live, you'd think it would be a rejuvenating experience.
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« Reply #35 on: July 05, 2021, 07:45:07 PM »

Poor Mike couldn't get through "California Girls," which is a relatively undemanding lead vocal. That's not a good sign. If he can't handle his own leads any better than that, a 60th anniversary tour is a very dire prospect indeed. Al can't sing all the leads!!  3D
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« Reply #36 on: July 06, 2021, 04:02:43 AM »

Watch John Stamos Join Beach Boys for ‘Wouldn’t It Be Nice’

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/john-stamos-beach-boys-wouldnt-it-be-nice-1192902/?fbclid=IwAR3uyfe2zwDQFtVZPa412WRNWWJo6gLlri-JL4FlimC1YR1ICQ5gIqHFS5g
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a diseased bunch of mo'fos if there ever was one… their beauty is so awesome that listening to them at their best is like being in some vast dream cathedral decorated with a thousand gleaming American pop culture icons.

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To sum it up, they blew it, they blew it consistently, they continue to blow it, it is tragic and this pathological problem caused The Beach Boys' greatest music to be so underrated by the general public.

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« Reply #37 on: July 06, 2021, 07:09:49 AM »


That was a bit painful and the lack of balance in the mix isn't even the biggest problem.
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« Reply #38 on: July 06, 2021, 09:24:26 AM »

A shoddy mix, or a mix plagued by technical gremlins will of course make a difference in how audiences perceive it. But the mix itself - good or bad - has nothing to do with performance issues. If someone is singing or playing out of tune or if the performance overall is lacking energy or cohesion, even the best mix going out to the house or the live broadcast feed won't fix or change that.

Not knowing the details, if people are blaming CNN and their engineers for this mix, consider that live feeds for a broadcast are usually taken from the board mixing the performance live, after soundchecks and tests have been run for both the house and the tap into the board for the live broadcast feed. If there were issues with the balance between instruments and whatnot, I'd think that came from Mike's own sound and tech crew working the show. The CNN crew is not going to have control over individual tracks and unless Mike farmed out the mixing duties to a local crew-for-hire or had the venue's house crew doing all the mixing with no supervision, and that was Mike's own team running that live mix. And there are always unforseen technical gremlins that could affect it, but who knows if that was the case here.

Whatever the case, the mix has nothing to do with the quality of the performance being mixed. And ultimately the soundchecks on the heels of a national broadcast should have fixed most of those issues before air time. In a perfect world lol.
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« Reply #39 on: July 06, 2021, 09:28:50 AM »

Was anybody else surprised at the song selection? For what was going out on a national broadcast, there were 3 Pet Sounds tracks, two of which Mike had little or nothing to do with originally, and one which I thought they'd feature because it's an all-time highlight and one which Mike was directly involved in creating and performing. So unless there were more songs broadcast on Sunday - I only caught the videos after the fact - it was surprising to see 3 out of the 4 tracks coming from Pet Sounds.

And I'm wondering why, given past history and with John Stamos there especially, they did not do Kokomo for this broadcast.
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« Reply #40 on: July 06, 2021, 11:03:46 AM »

A shoddy mix, or a mix plagued by technical gremlins will of course make a difference in how audiences perceive it. But the mix itself - good or bad - has nothing to do with performance issues. If someone is singing or playing out of tune or if the performance overall is lacking energy or cohesion, even the best mix going out to the house or the live broadcast feed won't fix or change that.

Not knowing the details, if people are blaming CNN and their engineers for this mix, consider that live feeds for a broadcast are usually taken from the board mixing the performance live, after soundchecks and tests have been run for both the house and the tap into the board for the live broadcast feed. If there were issues with the balance between instruments and whatnot, I'd think that came from Mike's own sound and tech crew working the show. The CNN crew is not going to have control over individual tracks and unless Mike farmed out the mixing duties to a local crew-for-hire or had the venue's house crew doing all the mixing with no supervision, and that was Mike's own team running that live mix. And there are always unforseen technical gremlins that could affect it, but who knows if that was the case here.

Whatever the case, the mix has nothing to do with the quality of the performance being mixed. And ultimately the soundchecks on the heels of a national broadcast should have fixed most of those issues before air time. In a perfect world lol.

Yeah this is all true, but when you see stamos own video from California girls it doesn't even sound like the same show, or band either for that matter haha, sh*t sounds amazing on there imo
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« Reply #41 on: July 06, 2021, 11:58:05 AM »

I agree that Mike sounded a little rough. It did almost sound like he sang almost the entirety of Cal Girls a half step lower than the group. I thought the rest of the band sounded pretty damn good. I  like raspy Bruce!  LOL LOL Cheesy

I thought Ike sounded fine , Cowsill's drums, Randy's sax, Keith's bass, and especially  Tottens guitar sounded great as always. The mix truly did them no justice. I agree that the mixing really did none of the classic/oldies acts any favors. What was coming out of the broadcast Sounded like a very shoddy mix.

The clip from Stamos' instagram sounded fucking incredible.

I think we may have reached a point where Mike is having a similar vocal situation as Brian. Al and Bruce still sound terrific. Bruce sounded like a slightly raspier version of his 65 self on Cal Girls, GOK, and Sloop. His vocals always blow me away. He's been having a bit of rasp on and off since he rejoined the group, so it didnt phase me.

I will still go and support every single BB related event, be it the BBs band, Brian's band, or any other solo endeavors. Its amazing and inspiring to see the core members still at it and doing what they love. 
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« Reply #42 on: July 06, 2021, 02:59:52 PM »

My reaction was out loud laughter when Mike started singing California Girls.  It's a shame that this group is legally entitled to be called The Beach Boys.
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« Reply #43 on: July 06, 2021, 11:13:47 PM »

I think that the group on whole sounded out of shape. The fact that they were off the road for so long, rehearsals (which Mike has said they DO NOT NEED) are needed. And at the advanced age of some of the members, a vocal coach is in order. Of course Mike and Bruce are macho dudes that don't think they need that sh*t. But I would tell them that you wouldn't ask a sprinter who has been sidelined with an injury to get right back to running the 440 at top speed. Oh you can ask for it, but it won't be pretty. And what really bothers me, is that when you perform in the shape they are in and don't seem to want to rehearse, its a BIG middle finger to the audience. Yeah, maybe most members of the crowd won't care, but YOU SHOULD!
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« Reply #44 on: July 07, 2021, 04:09:06 AM »

The mix truly did them no justice. I agree that the mixing really did none of the classic/oldies acts any favors. What was coming out of the broadcast Sounded like a very shoddy mix.

The clip from Stamos' instagram sounded fucking incredible.


It really did, sounded like a different concert. Also, Bruce must have had a cold on the fourth of July show, he wasn’t that raspy in may. Mike sounded stronger in may as well. The band actually sounds better than they have for a long time to me imho https://youtu.be/JriU8mLDqlQ
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« Reply #45 on: July 07, 2021, 09:02:00 AM »

I think that the group on whole sounded out of shape. The fact that they were off the road for so long, rehearsals (which Mike has said they DO NOT NEED) are needed. And at the advanced age of some of the members, a vocal coach is in order. Of course Mike and Bruce are macho dudes that don't think they need that sh*t. But I would tell them that you wouldn't ask a sprinter who has been sidelined with an injury to get right back to running the 440 at top speed. Oh you can ask for it, but it won't be pretty. And what really bothers me, is that when you perform in the shape they are in and don't seem to want to rehearse, its a BIG middle finger to the audience. Yeah, maybe most members of the crowd won't care, but YOU SHOULD!

If there were not even more rehearsals before a live TV appearance like this, which ultimately is a big advertisement for the band/brand to influence people's decisions to buy or not buy tickets for their shows and other merch, that would be ridiculous. It's one thing to brag "we don't need to rehearse!", if that's what was happening, but it's another to get a performance which gets pretty widely panned by people not invested in the band across the internet.

I'm wondering too how much of the reaction both inside the organization and outside among the public gets into the objective versus subjective perspectives. It's one thing for a fan to say subjectively they thought it was good. It's another thing to say objectively that there were some serious problems in that performance, whether it's 10-second YouTube cel phone clips of various songs circulating online or the performance that went out to people watching CNN and later online. California Girls was a shambles, objectively the vocals were out of tune. And the bridge of Wouldn't It Be Nice almost fell apart. Those are things a fan could subjectively say were good and that's anyone's opinion, but when something is out of tune or not tight musically, those are objective facts, and issues that need to be addressed I'd think.

It really wasn't a good presentation for the band and brand, for whatever reasons that was the case on Sunday. And again, a good or bad live-feed or house mix can't "fix" out of tune vocals. They're either in tune or out. These were out.
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« Reply #46 on: July 07, 2021, 09:21:53 AM »

I'm not sure who could possibly listen to Bruce's voice now and say it sounds *anything* like 1965.

Granted, I don't think he sounds notably *worse* now than in the last few years. His voice has aged differently than the others. He can still get his voice in a high range, but he has no power or air behind his voice. He's had that same raspy, whisper singing voice since the 90s. Even in the 90s it sounded sometimes like he could barely make it through "Do You Wanna Dance."

On some nights, it can have a little more air behind it. He sounded okay on "Disney Girls" back in 2012, but then sounded really weak on "Wendy."

But even in the 90s, and certainly now, he doesn't have anything near the power or clarity he did say, singing something like "I Write the Songs" at Knebworth in 1980.
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« Reply #47 on: July 07, 2021, 09:27:44 AM »

I know some folks here understand how live (or any) mixing works, and perhaps some others not so much.

A live mix can make something sound "worse", but it's not like the mixing is making the singers sing off-key. Rather, what I would say is that a more "sympathetic" mix can cover up or minimize deficiencies.

A little-heard later TV airing of that 1981 Queen Mary gig (from European TV I think?) featured a full *remix* of the live show, and even on something as dreadful as that show, that later remix *does* sound better. It covers up some of the icky bits.

So a better mix on this recent CNN gig could have covered up *some* of the bad parts, but it's not like the mix is causing the underlying problem.

I would also say that there is probably less room to blame "bad TV mixing" on this CNN gig, because unlike some deals where a band appears on a TV show specifically for TV (e.g. a talk show or something), on this July 4th thing, CNN was mostly just tapping into live audio and video feeds from various regular concerts, almost surely using the in-house audio feed. It seemed like they just randomly dropped in on an in-progress Mike show for this, which might explain why they weirdly started with a backing member singing "God Only Knows", and why "Kokomo" stunningly *didn't* get an airing.
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« Reply #48 on: July 07, 2021, 10:19:48 AM »

It seemed like they just randomly dropped in on an in-progress Mike show for this, which might explain why they weirdly started with a backing member singing "God Only Knows", and why "Kokomo" stunningly *didn't* get an airing.

That’s exactly what happened. No GV either, for the same reason.
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« Reply #49 on: July 07, 2021, 11:47:43 AM »

I know some folks here understand how live (or any) mixing works, and perhaps some others not so much.

A live mix can make something sound "worse", but it's not like the mixing is making the singers sing off-key. Rather, what I would say is that a more "sympathetic" mix can cover up or minimize deficiencies.

A little-heard later TV airing of that 1981 Queen Mary gig (from European TV I think?) featured a full *remix* of the live show, and even on something as dreadful as that show, that later remix *does* sound better. It covers up some of the icky bits.

So a better mix on this recent CNN gig could have covered up *some* of the bad parts, but it's not like the mix is causing the underlying problem.

I would also say that there is probably less room to blame "bad TV mixing" on this CNN gig, because unlike some deals where a band appears on a TV show specifically for TV (e.g. a talk show or something), on this July 4th thing, CNN was mostly just tapping into live audio and video feeds from various regular concerts, almost surely using the in-house audio feed. It seemed like they just randomly dropped in on an in-progress Mike show for this, which might explain why they weirdly started with a backing member singing "God Only Knows", and why "Kokomo" stunningly *didn't* get an airing.


That's pretty much what I posted yesterday.

CNN or other network engineers working with live feeds are not balancing individual instrument and vocal tracks on their boards and creating another mix when they do a live feed like this one in Ft Lauderdale. The mix is usually taken direct from the in-house feed from the band's or the venue's board going to the audience. If a separate mix is done for the broadcast remote, it's not done by the television crew tapping into the feed. Whatever balancing issues were happening were happening at the board, at the venue. Why they were so off in some cases, like the 2nd supporting guitar being too hot in the mix of WIBN's intro whereas the lead 1st part was buried...who knows. But levels and live mixing are mostly involving volume, balance, and EQ. It has nothing to do with pitch and performance issues as I mentioned before. And people's main gripes with this broadcast seem to be about pitch and performance issues. And yes, that should be addressed because it didn't come off too well for the band on Sunday.
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