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Author Topic: Pet Squares #3 The Surfer Girl album just released on youTube  (Read 2826 times)
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« on: May 10, 2021, 09:45:16 AM »

Episode 3 of PET SQUARES, a Geek's Guide to the Beach Boys, is up! A thorough deconstruction of the SURFER GIRL album with input from some of the most knowledgable Beach Boys geeks in the world. Lots of new information and irreverent fun. Check it out and if you like it, spread the word!  Also let me know if you hear a low G on "Surfer Girl" or not (see the video to understand the reference).

https://youtu.be/-iDFkXOV1Fw
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« Reply #1 on: May 10, 2021, 01:25:17 PM »

I'm watching right now. Enjoying it, just as last time. Thanks for sharing!


Re: The mysterious part on "Surfer Girl" (song)

Now, I haven't listened to the original and basically I'm not the one you should ask when it comes to multi part harmony. I just can't hear it. But I love it. What I was reminded of though, is an interview with Murry that I'd read in "Back to the Beach" (the german translation). Murry mentioned that he and Audree from time to time would fill out the voices on songs wthout the Boys' knowledge (IIRC Murry mentioned "409" as an example). I don't know if there's anything to that. Maybe he was just telling bs. But since this question came up I thought I would mention it.
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a diseased bunch of mo'fos if there ever was one… their beauty is so awesome that listening to them at their best is like being in some vast dream cathedral decorated with a thousand gleaming American pop culture icons.

- Lester Bangs on The Beach Boys


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To sum it up, they blew it, they blew it consistently, they continue to blow it, it is tragic and this pathological problem caused The Beach Boys' greatest music to be so underrated by the general public.

- Jack Rieley
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« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2021, 06:41:23 PM »

I'm watching right now. Enjoying it, just as last time. Thanks for sharing!


Re: The mysterious part on "Surfer Girl" (song)

Now, I haven't listened to the original and basically I'm not the one you should ask when it comes to multi part harmony. I just can't hear it. But I love it. What I was reminded of though, is an interview with Murry that I'd read in "Back to the Beach" (the german translation). Murry mentioned that he and Audree from time to time would fill out the voices on songs wthout the Boys' knowledge (IIRC Murry mentioned "409" as an example). I don't know if there's anything to that. Maybe he was just telling bs. But since this question came up I thought I would mention it.

Oh great info! Thank you for that. I wonder how they could have done it without the boys' knowledge though? Microphone in the booth? I'll ask Craig about that.
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« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2021, 02:14:56 AM »

I'm watching right now. Enjoying it, just as last time. Thanks for sharing!


Re: The mysterious part on "Surfer Girl" (song)

Now, I haven't listened to the original and basically I'm not the one you should ask when it comes to multi part harmony. I just can't hear it. But I love it. What I was reminded of though, is an interview with Murry that I'd read in "Back to the Beach" (the german translation). Murry mentioned that he and Audree from time to time would fill out the voices on songs wthout the Boys' knowledge (IIRC Murry mentioned "409" as an example). I don't know if there's anything to that. Maybe he was just telling bs. But since this question came up I thought I would mention it.

Oh great info! Thank you for that. I wonder how they could have done it without the boys' knowledge though? Microphone in the booth? I'll ask Craig about that.


No idea. But it's certainly possible that Murry was just talking crap. So it should be taken with a grain of salt. I just remembered that interview when you talked about that "missing" part. But it would be interesting if Craig knows something about it. Even if it's just to debunk Murry's claim.
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a diseased bunch of mo'fos if there ever was one… their beauty is so awesome that listening to them at their best is like being in some vast dream cathedral decorated with a thousand gleaming American pop culture icons.

- Lester Bangs on The Beach Boys


PRO SHOT BEACH BOYS CONCERTS - LIST


To sum it up, they blew it, they blew it consistently, they continue to blow it, it is tragic and this pathological problem caused The Beach Boys' greatest music to be so underrated by the general public.

- Jack Rieley
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« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2021, 02:31:59 AM »

I'm watching right now. Enjoying it, just as last time. Thanks for sharing!


Re: The mysterious part on "Surfer Girl" (song)

Now, I haven't listened to the original and basically I'm not the one you should ask when it comes to multi part harmony. I just can't hear it. But I love it. What I was reminded of though, is an interview with Murry that I'd read in "Back to the Beach" (the german translation). Murry mentioned that he and Audree from time to time would fill out the voices on songs wthout the Boys' knowledge (IIRC Murry mentioned "409" as an example). I don't know if there's anything to that. Maybe he was just telling bs. But since this question came up I thought I would mention it.

Oh great info! Thank you for that. I wonder how they could have done it without the boys' knowledge though? Microphone in the booth? I'll ask Craig about that.


No idea. But it's certainly possible that Murry was just talking crap. So it should be taken with a grain of salt. I just remembered that interview when you talked about that "missing" part. But it would be interesting if Craig knows something about it. Even if it's just to debunk Murry's claim.

I think we're all pretty certain that Al is the phantom fifth part. But prior to Al's re-entry into the group there are a few places where it's theorized that there's an extra voice in the mix with various possibilities...David Marks, Bob Norberg...Murry's certainly possible.
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« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2021, 03:43:09 AM »

I just found the article I was talking about. Here's the specific part:


Beach Boys: A California Saga, Part II
New developments, musical and political, in a group that has already influenced rock more than we probably know.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/beach-boys-a-california-saga-part-ii-233192/



See, the whole trade has given Brian credit for everything. Truthfully – I’m not beating myself on the back, but knowing them as a father, I knew their voices, right? And I’m musical, my wife is, we knew how to sing on key and when they were flat and sharp and how they should sound good in a song. And we put the echo on they wanted, and we got the balance; we used Telefunken mikes and we surged on their power here and there to make them sound better. When they’d run out of wind at the end of the sentence, we’d surge on the power to keep the level of their musical tone the same. Or if they were singing a phrase weak, when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d surge on the part. Without their knowledge, at first.

“A lot of artists think they’re doing it all because they get in front of a mike and open their damn mouths. But most artists have an engineer, a smart engineer, surging on the power here and there to help them when they’re weak and tired and run out of gas, to put an echo on them here and there and make them sound like gods. He’s got a lot of beautiful people, unsung heroes, under him, helping him make his career. Not to mention the record company and all the promotional people in the field, and the jobbers that push the records and everybody else that helps, you know? A lot of people. Artists don’t make themselves.”

That was Murry Wilson describing how he helped produce “409,” one of the Beach Boys’ earliest songs.




So, it seems I misremembered. I had in mind that Murry specifically mentioned that they'd sing on the track. Maybe it was also a wrong translation into german that I'd had in mind. If I understand correctly, Murry is talking about mastering here.
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a diseased bunch of mo'fos if there ever was one… their beauty is so awesome that listening to them at their best is like being in some vast dream cathedral decorated with a thousand gleaming American pop culture icons.

- Lester Bangs on The Beach Boys


PRO SHOT BEACH BOYS CONCERTS - LIST


To sum it up, they blew it, they blew it consistently, they continue to blow it, it is tragic and this pathological problem caused The Beach Boys' greatest music to be so underrated by the general public.

- Jack Rieley
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« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2021, 05:37:49 AM »

He's talking about riding the pots (they weren't faders, yet) to adjust the input from the microphone as the boys sang live.  Pretty common practice.  Surge the Power is such a funny way to put it.
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« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2021, 08:05:38 AM »

Now would be a good time to bring up one of my favorite Chuck Britz quotes...

"I know Murry said things like 'surge, surge, surge' to me all the time. And I just turned up the monitor to make him think I was surging. His idea was to pin those needles right up on the board and I kept saying, 'Murry, you can't do that, you're not going to get anything worthwhile.' I finally just started lowering everything way down on the machines so he could look up and see those needles pegging and then I just turned the monitor up to full bore and he'd think I was surging like crazy."
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« Reply #8 on: May 11, 2021, 08:09:33 AM »

Yeah, it's pretty clear Murry's talking about, as Joshilyn says, pushing the vocals up in the mix or when it's going to tape.
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« Reply #9 on: May 11, 2021, 08:36:01 AM »

Yes, damn, I hoped I could add something worthwhile. As mentioned, I somehow remembered Murry talking about singing, but it's clear he's not.
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a diseased bunch of mo'fos if there ever was one… their beauty is so awesome that listening to them at their best is like being in some vast dream cathedral decorated with a thousand gleaming American pop culture icons.

- Lester Bangs on The Beach Boys


PRO SHOT BEACH BOYS CONCERTS - LIST


To sum it up, they blew it, they blew it consistently, they continue to blow it, it is tragic and this pathological problem caused The Beach Boys' greatest music to be so underrated by the general public.

- Jack Rieley
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« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2021, 08:40:09 AM »

Now would be a good time to bring up one of my favorite Chuck Britz quotes...

"I know Murry said things like 'surge, surge, surge' to me all the time. And I just turned up the monitor to make him think I was surging. His idea was to pin those needles right up on the board and I kept saying, 'Murry, you can't do that, you're not going to get anything worthwhile.' I finally just started lowering everything way down on the machines so he could look up and see those needles pegging and then I just turned the monitor up to full bore and he'd think I was surging like crazy."

This is still pretty much what recording engineers have to do for clients to this day.
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« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2021, 09:42:14 AM »

There seems to be two techniques in question here. Chuck implied Murry would just want to pin the levels so they're in the red to create - in Murry's mind I guess - excitement or power in the track, or whatever. That's pretty common for people who are not as skilled in mixing tracks. More volume in the monitors during the mix equals "better". People sometimes think louder is better, call it psychology or whatever. But if it makes clients happy in the moment, they will come back and play you more money lol. I was at a mixdown session at the former Sony studios in NYC where they literally had the volume so loud during the playback it hurt, not just my ears either. Rock track, party atmosphere, with some people who are or would become pretty well-known in the biz...but it was ridiculously loud for no reason I could see (or hear). But that's what the people there were grooving on.

The thing Murry described in the interview is more nuanced, and it's a technique which an outboard compressor (or limiting amplifier for those who want technical accuracy) does electronically, and automatically. When a vocalist starts trailing off on a note, or runs out of breath sustaining a note, both the volume decreases and the pitch will drop too. A compressor will automatically boost the volume at that trail-off point when necessary, and it levels everything out. The old-school engineers would sometimes prefer to manually "ride" the fader pots on lead vocals instead of using the compressor, and I've read that Sinatra's crew at Putnam's studios - specifically Jimmy Bowen who I *think* was mixing those Reprise sessions - would mix all of that manually, riding the vocals the whole time while going with the ebb and flow of the music. Engineers who were even then used to patching in a compressor/limiter device to do that would watch these live mixes go down and be kind of amazed at how musical the fader-riding process was, because it was even then considered old-school in some circles.

And in terms of pitch trailing off as the singer runs out of breath, that was one of the killer apps of Antares' Autotune, where if it was set just right the Autotune would kick in at that trail-off point and correct the wavering pitch as the singer started to lose breath at the end of a note or phrase. That's how that tool is used transparently, unless the singer was really drifting off, no one would notice the pitch-up at the end of those phrases but it would make a pretty significant difference in the mix to have a solid sustained vocal note remaining in-tune the entire time. And that is completely separate from the deliberate overuse of the tool, aka Kanye and T-Pain and 99% of all pop and R&B music in the past two decades.

So according to Chuck, Murry was talking s**t and they just tricked him to appease him in the booth after which they'd do the real mixing of the track. Yet Murry himself - seeming to yet again take more credit than he was due in the process - describes a valid fader-boosting technique that would enhance vocal tracks, but which most engineers would be doing in general anyway with or without outboard compressors, and without Murry's orders.

I guess the answer lies somewhere in between. And I'd *still* like to know both if and when they rigged up a fake console for Murry to twiddle knobs and do all his "surges" while the actual mixing was being done without his input or barking of orders. 

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« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2021, 11:00:40 AM »

There seems to be two techniques in question here. Chuck implied Murry would just want to pin the levels so they're in the red to create - in Murry's mind I guess - excitement or power in the track, or whatever. That's pretty common for people who are not as skilled in mixing tracks. More volume in the monitors during the mix equals "better". People sometimes think louder is better, call it psychology or whatever. But if it makes clients happy in the moment, they will come back and play you more money lol. I was at a mixdown session at the former Sony studios in NYC where they literally had the volume so loud during the playback it hurt, not just my ears either. Rock track, party atmosphere, with some people who are or would become pretty well-known in the biz...but it was ridiculously loud for no reason I could see (or hear). But that's what the people there were grooving on.

The thing Murry described in the interview is more nuanced, and it's a technique which an outboard compressor (or limiting amplifier for those who want technical accuracy) does electronically, and automatically. When a vocalist starts trailing off on a note, or runs out of breath sustaining a note, both the volume decreases and the pitch will drop too. A compressor will automatically boost the volume at that trail-off point when necessary, and it levels everything out. The old-school engineers would sometimes prefer to manually "ride" the fader pots on lead vocals instead of using the compressor, and I've read that Sinatra's crew at Putnam's studios - specifically Jimmy Bowen who I *think* was mixing those Reprise sessions - would mix all of that manually, riding the vocals the whole time while going with the ebb and flow of the music. Engineers who were even then used to patching in a compressor/limiter device to do that would watch these live mixes go down and be kind of amazed at how musical the fader-riding process was, because it was even then considered old-school in some circles.

And in terms of pitch trailing off as the singer runs out of breath, that was one of the killer apps of Antares' Autotune, where if it was set just right the Autotune would kick in at that trail-off point and correct the wavering pitch as the singer started to lose breath at the end of a note or phrase. That's how that tool is used transparently, unless the singer was really drifting off, no one would notice the pitch-up at the end of those phrases but it would make a pretty significant difference in the mix to have a solid sustained vocal note remaining in-tune the entire time. And that is completely separate from the deliberate overuse of the tool, aka Kanye and T-Pain and 99% of all pop and R&B music in the past two decades.

So according to Chuck, Murry was talking s**t and they just tricked him to appease him in the booth after which they'd do the real mixing of the track. Yet Murry himself - seeming to yet again take more credit than he was due in the process - describes a valid fader-boosting technique that would enhance vocal tracks, but which most engineers would be doing in general anyway with or without outboard compressors, and without Murry's orders.

I guess the answer lies somewhere in between. And I'd *still* like to know both if and when they rigged up a fake console for Murry to twiddle knobs and do all his "surges" while the actual mixing was being done without his input or barking of orders. 


Yep, it seems Murry at least believed he was telling the truth here, and was unaware that Chuck wasn't actually letting him "surge" the vocals.
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« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2021, 11:26:53 AM »

Adam, was just about to watch this AND damn Brother have pulled it  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2021, 11:27:47 AM »

...

The thing Murry described in the interview is more nuanced, and it's a technique which an outboard compressor (or limiting amplifier for those who want technical accuracy) does electronically, and automatically. When a vocalist starts trailing off on a note, or runs out of breath sustaining a note, both the volume decreases and the pitch will drop too. A compressor will automatically boost the volume at that trail-off point when necessary, and it levels everything out. The old-school engineers would sometimes prefer to manually "ride" the fader pots on lead vocals instead of using the compressor, and I've read that Sinatra's crew at Putnam's studios - specifically Jimmy Bowen who I *think* was mixing those Reprise sessions - would mix all of that manually, riding the vocals the whole time while going with the ebb and flow of the music. Engineers who were even then used to patching in a compressor/limiter device to do that would watch these live mixes go down and be kind of amazed at how musical the fader-riding process was, because it was even then considered old-school in some circles.

...
 

According to some sources, including our own Mark Linett, and sort of alluded to by Larry Levine in some interviews he did, and suggested by some photos of Bruce Botnick, Western, Gold Star, and Sunset Sound really didn't use compression for tracking at all.  Although they certainly could have patched any number of compressors or limiters into a single channel input, the primary use of those things was still more programatic, aimed at the mono buss more than anything else.  Easy enough to put one on a vocal buss, too, of course, but I feel like Chuck was someone who preferred to work the pots.  Heck, you can hear him doing it sometimes.
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« Reply #15 on: May 11, 2021, 12:05:52 PM »

Adam, was just about to watch this AND damn Brother have pulled it  Roll Eyes

Huh, what for? I didn't spot anything that could be considered copyright material. Hope you manage to get it back up Adam.
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« Reply #16 on: May 11, 2021, 06:16:20 PM »

...

The thing Murry described in the interview is more nuanced, and it's a technique which an outboard compressor (or limiting amplifier for those who want technical accuracy) does electronically, and automatically. When a vocalist starts trailing off on a note, or runs out of breath sustaining a note, both the volume decreases and the pitch will drop too. A compressor will automatically boost the volume at that trail-off point when necessary, and it levels everything out. The old-school engineers would sometimes prefer to manually "ride" the fader pots on lead vocals instead of using the compressor, and I've read that Sinatra's crew at Putnam's studios - specifically Jimmy Bowen who I *think* was mixing those Reprise sessions - would mix all of that manually, riding the vocals the whole time while going with the ebb and flow of the music. Engineers who were even then used to patching in a compressor/limiter device to do that would watch these live mixes go down and be kind of amazed at how musical the fader-riding process was, because it was even then considered old-school in some circles.

...
 

According to some sources, including our own Mark Linett, and sort of alluded to by Larry Levine in some interviews he did, and suggested by some photos of Bruce Botnick, Western, Gold Star, and Sunset Sound really didn't use compression for tracking at all.  Although they certainly could have patched any number of compressors or limiters into a single channel input, the primary use of those things was still more programatic, aimed at the mono buss more than anything else.  Easy enough to put one on a vocal buss, too, of course, but I feel like Chuck was someone who preferred to work the pots.  Heck, you can hear him doing it sometimes.

Plus, we know how Murry (when he was there) loved to manually SURGE - no compressors needed when he was around!
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« Reply #17 on: May 11, 2021, 06:47:25 PM »

...

The thing Murry described in the interview is more nuanced, and it's a technique which an outboard compressor (or limiting amplifier for those who want technical accuracy) does electronically, and automatically. When a vocalist starts trailing off on a note, or runs out of breath sustaining a note, both the volume decreases and the pitch will drop too. A compressor will automatically boost the volume at that trail-off point when necessary, and it levels everything out. The old-school engineers would sometimes prefer to manually "ride" the fader pots on lead vocals instead of using the compressor, and I've read that Sinatra's crew at Putnam's studios - specifically Jimmy Bowen who I *think* was mixing those Reprise sessions - would mix all of that manually, riding the vocals the whole time while going with the ebb and flow of the music. Engineers who were even then used to patching in a compressor/limiter device to do that would watch these live mixes go down and be kind of amazed at how musical the fader-riding process was, because it was even then considered old-school in some circles.

...
 

According to some sources, including our own Mark Linett, and sort of alluded to by Larry Levine in some interviews he did, and suggested by some photos of Bruce Botnick, Western, Gold Star, and Sunset Sound really didn't use compression for tracking at all.  Although they certainly could have patched any number of compressors or limiters into a single channel input, the primary use of those things was still more programatic, aimed at the mono buss more than anything else.  Easy enough to put one on a vocal buss, too, of course, but I feel like Chuck was someone who preferred to work the pots.  Heck, you can hear him doing it sometimes.

Not necessarily for tracking, but for mixing too. I remember one of the younger engineers working for Putnam describing a Sinatra mix session, where he was assisting one of those old-schoolers, who I'm pretty sure was Jimmy Bowen or someone like that. This was later into the 60's when compressors became standard, or more standard to where everyone started using them because they wanted that sound. I think in terms of rock and pop music, it was Revolver which changed the game and when clients would say "I want the Revolver sound" on such-and-such track and a lot of that sound after 1966 was compressing the s**t out of everything, especially drums and vocals...oh, and then there's "Mr Tambourine Man" running McGuinn's Rickenbacker through a chain of *three* separate compressors! Then every folk-rock track with an electric 12-string part had to sound like McGuinn and those three compressors chained together. So overusing the tool became a signature sound yet again.

But this engineer was watching Bowen work those faders real-time on the vocal and he described it as watching a human compressor in action, the moves were perfect for smoothing out that vocal track and being purely musical in doing so as well. So yes, when compressors became an electronic "sound" or when they became standard practice overall after '65-'66 or so, of course there were still many old-school engineers doing it manually. But when you have engineers who were most accustomed to patching in an external compressor watching a guy sit there and do manually what a compressor did electronically, it's no wonder they would be somewhat in awe of the skill because it wasn't in their wheelhouse.

It would be like a ProTools engineer watching another engineer splice 4-bars out of a drum track on a 2" tape and splice in a fixed version without missing a micro-second of a beat. What looks like a magic trick in a modern sense because it's old technology was daily operations back in the day, and you needed those skills. But just the same, the ProTools guy could accomplish that same feat digitally in a fraction of the time it would take to copy and splice tape to do such fixes. Better to use a slide rule or an advanced calculator to make the same calculations?

But I still come back to the fact that Murry Wilson was mostly talking s**t and patting himself on the back for things he didn't do or things he wasn't a part of. You know things are bad when the real engineers had to find ways to trick Murry or pull a total sham act on the guy so they could keep him out of the real work they needed to do, and so he wouldn't screw it up.  LOL
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« Reply #18 on: May 11, 2021, 07:42:24 PM »

Just for everyone's info (not to sidetrack this discussion), BRI has taken down the video and youTube assessed a copyright strike on the grounds that I posted "the entire Surfer Girl album." Since there's no content from the album at all barring a short segment where I break down the harmony parts to "Surfer Girl," this is obviously a clerical error albeit a careless and infuriating one. The video will return once BRI and I have had words on this subject.
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« Reply #19 on: May 11, 2021, 07:44:04 PM »

Adam, was just about to watch this AND damn Brother have pulled it  Roll Eyes

Yup, for absolutely no reason. Clerical error, apparently.

AWA#40 came very close to being pulled - after nearly 1,500 views - because CDBaby refused to let me upload a sync license agreement that showed I had the right to use the one song they administered included among the 30 or so music cues in that show.
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« Reply #20 on: May 12, 2021, 11:45:05 AM »

Good ol' Murry--it sounds as though the engineers quickly learned to do the "two-step side step" when he was in the studio!  3D

Looking forward to watching the new one, Adam--this series will just get better and better as you close in on the mid-60s.
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« Reply #21 on: May 13, 2021, 08:29:11 AM »

I wanted to let you know that I just had a look at the german translation of the "A California Saga Part II" article as it appeared in "Back to the Beach" by Kingsley Abott. The translation can indeed be misunderstood, that's why I thought Murry said he and Audree sang on some recordings.

The original says, "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d surge on the part." Now "surge" was translated to "unterstützen" which itself translates to english as "assist so.", "support s.o" or even "back so." "Surge" is actually translated "hochschlagen" and similar expressions. That's why I understood it as "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d support him on the part." Sorry again if I caused any confusion.
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a diseased bunch of mo'fos if there ever was one… their beauty is so awesome that listening to them at their best is like being in some vast dream cathedral decorated with a thousand gleaming American pop culture icons.

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To sum it up, they blew it, they blew it consistently, they continue to blow it, it is tragic and this pathological problem caused The Beach Boys' greatest music to be so underrated by the general public.

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« Reply #22 on: May 13, 2021, 10:27:21 AM »

I wanted to let you know that I just had a look at the german translation of the "A California Saga Part II" article as it appeared in "Back to the Beach" by Kingsley Abott. The translation can indeed be misunderstood, that's why I thought Murry said he and Audree sang on some recordings.

The original says, "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d surge on the part." Now "surge" was translated to "unterstützen" which itself translates to english as "assist so.", "support s.o" or even "back so." "Surge" is actually translated "hochschlagen" and similar expressions. That's why I understood it as "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d support him on the part." Sorry again if I caused any confusion.

Strange to imagine an alternate universe where the Wilsons were German and Murry would yell "Hochschlagen!" and tell Brian that "Ich bin auch ein Genie, Brian."
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« Reply #23 on: May 13, 2021, 10:43:04 AM »

I wanted to let you know that I just had a look at the german translation of the "A California Saga Part II" article as it appeared in "Back to the Beach" by Kingsley Abott. The translation can indeed be misunderstood, that's why I thought Murry said he and Audree sang on some recordings.

The original says, "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d surge on the part." Now "surge" was translated to "unterstützen" which itself translates to english as "assist so.", "support s.o" or even "back so." "Surge" is actually translated "hochschlagen" and similar expressions. That's why I understood it as "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d support him on the part." Sorry again if I caused any confusion.

Strange to imagine an alternate universe where the Wilsons were German and Murry would yell "Hochschlagen!" and tell Brian that "Ich bin auch ein Genie, Brian."



I have to check out the german synchro on "Love & mercy"  Grin

Just to be clear: "hochschlagen" is not the way it would be used in this context. You probably would say something like "hochdrehen" ("turn it up").
« Last Edit: May 13, 2021, 10:46:05 AM by Rocker » Logged

a diseased bunch of mo'fos if there ever was one… their beauty is so awesome that listening to them at their best is like being in some vast dream cathedral decorated with a thousand gleaming American pop culture icons.

- Lester Bangs on The Beach Boys


PRO SHOT BEACH BOYS CONCERTS - LIST


To sum it up, they blew it, they blew it consistently, they continue to blow it, it is tragic and this pathological problem caused The Beach Boys' greatest music to be so underrated by the general public.

- Jack Rieley
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« Reply #24 on: May 13, 2021, 12:27:28 PM »

I wanted to let you know that I just had a look at the german translation of the "A California Saga Part II" article as it appeared in "Back to the Beach" by Kingsley Abott. The translation can indeed be misunderstood, that's why I thought Murry said he and Audree sang on some recordings.

The original says, "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d surge on the part." Now "surge" was translated to "unterstützen" which itself translates to english as "assist so.", "support s.o" or even "back so." "Surge" is actually translated "hochschlagen" and similar expressions. That's why I understood it as "when Mike was singing ‘She’s fine, that 409,’ we’d support him on the part." Sorry again if I caused any confusion.

Funny enough, I don't think there is any confusion in the translation at all! Something Stephen Desper said would suggest the word "surge" and the translation of the word as used by Murry is accurate to what Murry would say during a mixdown. Stephen reported that when Murry was there with him in the control room, Murry would grab Stephen's shoulders and squeeze them and say "surge here! surge here!" at various points during the playback. You can read Stephen's own words and description somewhere on this board's archives, I just can't recall where.

But yes indeed, Murry is on the record from the Boys' engineer as saying "surge!" during a mixdown and using the word to emphasize certain sections of a track, and again back to the two different techniques being discussed, in Murry's case it seemed to be as much a case of raising the volume for emphasis as it was the other technique described above.

And in "409", the part described would be a prime candidate for such a volume-boosted "surge"...no reports if Murry also squeezed Chuck Britz's shoulders during that mixdown.  LOL


EDIT: Stephen's description of Murry saying "surge!" during mixing can be found on page 142 of the Peter Carlin book.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2021, 12:35:21 PM by guitarfool2002 » Logged

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