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Author Topic: What if the Wilsons had had a neighbor that played drums in 1961?  (Read 1990 times)
The Old Ranger
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« on: February 23, 2021, 03:54:31 PM »

They get him and Marks as the neighbor guys. This time when Audrey forces Dennis in, it would be as a singer. He would be freed up from drumming and could sing lead and harmony as he had done since the first album (in the studio.) The live harmony would be huge with an extra voice on each song. Sorta on a different note, isn't it strange that on most of The Beach Boys albums, Dennis doesn't drum a whole lot, but he sings lead and harmony on every album. Then on stage, he mostly drummed and didn't sing a whole lot. How I miss Dennis Wilson!!!!!
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Greg Parry
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« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2021, 02:44:49 AM »

There would have been an entirely different group dynamic, both onstage and off. Would Dennis have been given all of Mike's leads? If not, both Dennis and Mike would have been fighting for attention as 'lead singer', with Mike's stage antics literally upstaged by Dennis's appeal as the group's recognised sex symbol. One can only imagine the arguments and jealousy.

I can only see it working if Mike hadn't been in the band, which is a whole different 'what if......?'

« Last Edit: February 24, 2021, 02:52:44 AM by Greg Parry » Logged
gregcoffeymusic
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« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2021, 08:06:18 AM »

They get him and Marks as the neighbor guys. This time when Audrey forces Dennis in, it would be as a singer. He would be freed up from drumming and could sing lead and harmony as he had done since the first album (in the studio.) The live harmony would be huge with an extra voice on each song. Sorta on a different note, isn't it strange that on most of The Beach Boys albums, Dennis doesn't drum a whole lot, but he sings lead and harmony on every album. Then on stage, he mostly drummed and didn't sing a whole lot. How I miss Dennis Wilson!!!!!

Interesting! Do you think Dennis would have been in the group at all?
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The Old Ranger
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« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2021, 08:11:41 AM »

Actually, I don't think Dennis would have been in the group either. It was just a crazy "what if" deal. Recently read "Becoming The Beach Boys" and all that early stuff was on my mind. One thing's for sure, Mike and Dennis up front  would have made The Kinks look like rookies.
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Rebel
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« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2021, 07:38:10 PM »

They get him and Marks as the neighbor guys. This time when Audrey forces Dennis in, it would be as a singer. He would be freed up from drumming and could sing lead and harmony as he had done since the first album (in the studio.) The live harmony would be huge with an extra voice on each song. Sorta on a different note, isn't it strange that on most of The Beach Boys albums, Dennis doesn't drum a whole lot, but he sings lead and harmony on every album. Then on stage, he mostly drummed and didn't sing a whole lot. How I miss Dennis Wilson!!!!!

Oh, come now. “Dennis didn’t drum a lot”. He drummed more than most realize. Especially in the early days. Then after the band become more of a self contained unit.

We need a list of every confirmed song Dennis plays drums on. I think it would shock a lot of people.
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Summer_Days
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« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2021, 09:05:43 PM »

They get him and Marks as the neighbor guys. This time when Audrey forces Dennis in, it would be as a singer. He would be freed up from drumming and could sing lead and harmony as he had done since the first album (in the studio.) The live harmony would be huge with an extra voice on each song. Sorta on a different note, isn't it strange that on most of The Beach Boys albums, Dennis doesn't drum a whole lot, but he sings lead and harmony on every album. Then on stage, he mostly drummed and didn't sing a whole lot. How I miss Dennis Wilson!!!!!

Oh, come now. “Dennis didn’t drum a lot”. He drummed more than most realize. Especially in the early days. Then after the band become more of a self contained unit.

We need a list of every confirmed song Dennis plays drums on. I think it would shock a lot of people.

According to AGD’s site, Dennis drummed on:

- Every track on Surfin’ Safari (except ‘Surfin’’)
- Every track on Surfin’ USA (except the title track)
- Every track on Surfer Girl (though I thought Hal Blaine played on ‘Our Car Club’)
- Every track on Little Deuce Coupe
- Every track on Shut Down Vol. 2
- Every track on All Summer Long
- Every track on the Christmas Album (except the Dick Reynolds-arranged tracks I believe)
- Every track on Summer Days (And Summer Nights!!), apparently
- At least one track (‘That’s Not Me’) on Pet Sounds

I’m not sure if he played at all on Today.

So yeah.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2021, 09:07:12 PM by Summer_Days » Logged

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All Summer Long
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« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2021, 09:34:09 PM »

They get him and Marks as the neighbor guys. This time when Audrey forces Dennis in, it would be as a singer. He would be freed up from drumming and could sing lead and harmony as he had done since the first album (in the studio.) The live harmony would be huge with an extra voice on each song. Sorta on a different note, isn't it strange that on most of The Beach Boys albums, Dennis doesn't drum a whole lot, but he sings lead and harmony on every album. Then on stage, he mostly drummed and didn't sing a whole lot. How I miss Dennis Wilson!!!!!

Oh, come now. “Dennis didn’t drum a lot”. He drummed more than most realize. Especially in the early days. Then after the band become more of a self contained unit.

We need a list of every confirmed song Dennis plays drums on. I think it would shock a lot of people.

According to AGD’s site, Dennis drummed on:

- Every track on Surfin’ Safari (except ‘Surfin’’)
- Every track on Surfin’ USA (except the title track)
- Every track on Surfer Girl (though I thought Hal Blaine played on ‘Our Car Club’) - CORRECTION: most
- Every track on Little Deuce Coupe - CORRECTION: except Our Car Club
- Every track on Shut Down Vol. 2 - CORRECTION: not on Why Do Fools Fall in Love
- Every track on All Summer Long
- Every track on the Christmas Album (except the Dick Reynolds-arranged tracks I believe)
- Every track on Summer Days (And Summer Nights!!), apparently
- At least one track (‘That’s Not Me’) on Pet Sounds

I’m not sure if he played at all on Today.

So yeah.

- On The Beach Boys Today, Dennis played on When I Grow Up To Be A Man, Dance Dance Dance, I’m So Young, and She Knows Me Too Well
- On SDSN, Then I Kissed Her, Girl Don’t Tell Me, and You’re So Good To Me
- Almost all of Wild Honey
- Do It Again and I Can Hear Music from 20/20
- Add Some Music To Your Day from Sunflower
- Student Demonstration Time from Surf’s Up
- almost all of 15 Big Ones
- a little bit of Love You and MIU
- Good Timin, Shortenin’ Bread, and an overdub on Love Surrounds Me from LA
« Last Edit: February 25, 2021, 10:15:36 AM by All Summer Long » Logged
Lonely Summer
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« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2021, 01:12:21 PM »

Actually, I don't think Dennis would have been in the group either. It was just a crazy "what if" deal. Recently read "Becoming The Beach Boys" and all that early stuff was on my mind. One thing's for sure, Mike and Dennis up front  would have made The Kinks look like rookies.
As performers, or fighters?
No, I don't like the idea of Dennis not being the drummer. I guess I am the only one who admires him more for his energetic drumming than his singing or songwriting. He had a good voice in his early years, not a great voice; and it deteriorated seriously in the 70's. Dennis' drumming pushed that band on stage.

but it might have been funny to see Mike and Dennis get into a brawl onstage ala Dave Davies and Mick Avory.
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Lonely Summer
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« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2021, 01:13:52 PM »

They get him and Marks as the neighbor guys. This time when Audrey forces Dennis in, it would be as a singer. He would be freed up from drumming and could sing lead and harmony as he had done since the first album (in the studio.) The live harmony would be huge with an extra voice on each song. Sorta on a different note, isn't it strange that on most of The Beach Boys albums, Dennis doesn't drum a whole lot, but he sings lead and harmony on every album. Then on stage, he mostly drummed and didn't sing a whole lot. How I miss Dennis Wilson!!!!!

Oh, come now. “Dennis didn’t drum a lot”. He drummed more than most realize. Especially in the early days. Then after the band become more of a self contained unit.

We need a list of every confirmed song Dennis plays drums on. I think it would shock a lot of people.

According to AGD’s site, Dennis drummed on:

- Every track on Surfin’ Safari (except ‘Surfin’’)
- Every track on Surfin’ USA (except the title track)
- Every track on Surfer Girl (though I thought Hal Blaine played on ‘Our Car Club’)
- Every track on Little Deuce Coupe
- Every track on Shut Down Vol. 2
- Every track on All Summer Long
- Every track on the Christmas Album (except the Dick Reynolds-arranged tracks I believe)
- Every track on Summer Days (And Summer Nights!!), apparently
- At least one track (‘That’s Not Me’) on Pet Sounds

I’m not sure if he played at all on Today.

So yeah.
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Occasional grilled cheese
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« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2021, 01:23:13 PM »


but it might have been funny to see Mike and Dennis get into a brawl onstage ala Dave Davies and Mick Avory.

BB shows featuring on stage brawls are on the shortlist for my time machine itinerary, though with all the theoretical red tape I can't tell if I actually hope its useful or not.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2021, 01:28:55 PM by Occasional grilled cheese » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2021, 04:21:44 PM »

The main "what if" I wonder about the BB's would be what if Mike Love was a much better saxophone player? He could have played a lot more sax parts in their songs, sorta like Clarence Clemons was for Springsteen. So he would probably also have sung less. And maybe if he had sung less he wouldn't have tried to claim co-writing songs he didn't really contribute much to the writing of.
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Greg Parry
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« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2021, 01:57:59 AM »

What if California's underground sport circa 1961 had been Table Tennis?

What if Mike had a Mohican instead of a beard on the cover of Pet Sounds?

What if 'Don't Worry Baby' had been in 5/8 time?

What if Al had joined NASA?

What if David Marks had lived next door to Paul McCartney?





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« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2021, 04:38:24 AM »

What if Al had joined NASA?

Then he'd have faced John Denver on MTV's Celebrity Deathmatch
« Last Edit: February 26, 2021, 04:39:32 AM by Occasional grilled cheese » Logged

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Lonely Summer
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« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2021, 08:05:31 PM »

What if California's underground sport circa 1961 had been Table Tennis?
Do you love me? Table Tennis Girl.

What if Mike had a Mohican instead of a beard on the cover of Pet Sounds?
Do you mean a mowhawk? Mike pioneered the reverse mowhawk.

What if 'Don't Worry Baby' had been in 5/8 time?
You mean it wasn't?

What if Al had joined NASA?
Didn't Mike join NASCAR?

What if David Marks had lived next door to Paul McCartney?
Then George Harrison would have been out of a job.






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Tony S
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« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2021, 06:52:01 AM »

The "What If" I always think of with Dennis....what if he had stayed clean and sober, he would have likely taken the band in a very different direction, in those later ''America's Band" years. Sadly though a lot of those later years shows that he drummed in(as his voice was mostly shot and lost on stage) was accompanied on video of usually Carl, sometimes Bruce, constantly turning around to check on his drumming, was he ok, was he keeping time correctly etc... ergo the reason for the 2cd drummer, primarily for the shows he failed to show up for. What If, indeed!
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Tony S
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« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2021, 06:55:09 AM »

The "What If" I always think of with Dennis....what if he had stayed clean and sober, he would have likely taken the band in a very different direction, in those later ''America's Band" years. Sadly though a lot of those later years shows that he drummed in(as his voice was mostly shot and lost on stage) was accompanied on video of usually Carl, sometimes Bruce, constantly turning around to check on his drumming, was he ok, was he keeping time correctly etc... ergo the reason for the 2cd drummer, primarily for the shows he failed to show up for. What If, indeed!
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Greg Parry
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« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2021, 07:09:07 AM »

The "What If" I always think of with Dennis....what if he had stayed clean and sober, he would have likely taken the band in a very different direction, in those later ''America's Band" years. Sadly though a lot of those later years shows that he drummed in(as his voice was mostly shot and lost on stage) was accompanied on video of usually Carl, sometimes Bruce, constantly turning around to check on his drumming, was he ok, was he keeping time correctly etc... ergo the reason for the 2cd drummer, primarily for the shows he failed to show up for. What If, indeed!

I've always thought Dennis's self destructive behaviour really began after the horrific Tate / LaBianca murders. The behaviour manifested itself both as substance abuse and a growing disinterest in using the Beach Boys as a creative outlet for his songs.

So for me, this 'what if' involves that nasty waste of space Manson never worming his way into Dennis's life.
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Tony S
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« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2021, 08:35:21 AM »

Could well be, but Sunflower was recorded after all of that, and IMHO that was the top of creative time with the Beach Boys. And he was in good shape through the mid 70s and his zenith POB. Seems like the downfall started after his relationship with Karen Lamb....that's when I've read it started to go badly for him with the drugs and stuff. The slide to Christine McVie was then a noticeable down hill spiral, worsening drugs and alcohol, leading to a downfall in lifestyle and performing/recording. Who really knows....but what a sad ending....What If?
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joe_blow
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« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2021, 10:43:29 AM »

The main "what if" I wonder about the BB's would be what if Mike Love was a much better saxophone player? He could have played a lot more sax parts in their songs, sorta like Clarence Clemons was for Springsteen. So he would probably also have sung less. And maybe if he had sung less he wouldn't have tried to claim co-writing songs he didn't really contribute much to the writing of.
https://youtu.be/flhaZZszgoc
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Lonely Summer
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« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2021, 12:53:09 PM »

The main "what if" I wonder about the BB's would be what if Mike Love was a much better saxophone player? He could have played a lot more sax parts in their songs, sorta like Clarence Clemons was for Springsteen. So he would probably also have sung less. And maybe if he had sung less he wouldn't have tried to claim co-writing songs he didn't really contribute much to the writing of.
https://youtu.be/flhaZZszgoc
I can't believe we're questioning Mike's ability on the sax. I remember seeing them on Solid Gold in 1986 performing California Dreamin' and being surprised that Mike did the sax solo on that.
Of course everyone knows he played the sax on Kokomo, Problem Child, and Hot Fun in the Summertime.
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« Reply #20 on: March 01, 2021, 03:16:32 PM »

He might have gotten better as time wen on. But it seems to me if he'd been a good player in the 60's they would have utilized him more?
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