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Author Topic: Feel Flows box set  (Read 451031 times)
alanjames
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« Reply #1950 on: October 09, 2020, 01:37:42 PM »

Itís so sad to read about the possibility regarding Dennis material being dropped from this set only because of crap/Mike Love jealousy towards Dennis.
If this set doesnít come out as originally planned, surely Iíll sell Mikeís stuff that I have in my collection.
If only he could put aside his jealousy to see that Dennis material could be a reason to have more sales...
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Tom
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« Reply #1951 on: October 09, 2020, 02:02:43 PM »

My understanding is simplistic but don't Dennis' estate have some kind of ownership over Dennis' compositions? At very least the publishing side of things. I.e. Is there a chance those recordings could one day come out on a Dennis specific release where other band members have no authority to stop it?

Very upsetting if the Dennis material is indeed removed. It's one of the main things that actually interests me about the set, as I'm sure is true for many of us.
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« Reply #1952 on: October 09, 2020, 02:07:55 PM »

While it's obviously not the actual reason for the holdup, my mind keeps going back to the fact that these sets are now entering the historical period where Mike would prefer us to believe that he was the one holding the band together. This is a blatant myth that he'd probably convinced himself of over time - but the contents of this set certainly won't reflect that. I counted a while back and I'm pretty sure he had in the realm of a dozen writing credits in this period, and probably not many more lead vocals. Mike openly fawned over Dennis' writing in the 70's - shows his true character that he would now potentially sabotage his cousin's legacy in order to preserve his ego.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2020, 02:09:05 PM by Tom » Logged
Join The Human Race
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« Reply #1953 on: October 09, 2020, 03:27:07 PM »

Just catching up on this thread; mostly a passerby as mentioned way back earlier. Anyway, the set is done, right? Like fully complete and ready to ship? Or do they still have to press the final copies but every thing else (mastering, sequencing, liner notes) is done? If the set is complete and ready for sell, then wouldn't all those copies have Dennis' songs?

Also, is there an official source that confirms the hold up is over Dennis' material? Or is that speculation when the information got out that it may get released, but with fewer songs? Again, is there an official source saying that its' Dennis getting the axe or just speculation that it could be his songs due to the complicated history between him and Mike?

Regardless of what happens, I do not think you have to worry about Mike rewriting the history of the Beach Boys regardless of who is the final member left. The music of Brian is out there. Summer in Paradise is also out there. Even if Mike rewrote Beach Boys' history, do you think the fans are just going to be silent about Brian? Hell no! Fans like us are in this stuff deep. So much of the inner drama doesn't even go to the surface. The stuff that does reach the surface is their music; which is now available almost anywhere. That's always going to define the band and be the introduction for new fans. That's the history people will remember. The sessions are all out there of Brian kicking ass in the studio. That's literally music history happening. I, like most of you, probably wish for their popularity to increase; in particular away from the hits, Pet Sounds, and Smile. At the same time, I'm okay with this era being a deep fan one. Not many people can appreciate songs like 'Til I Die and A Day in The Life of A Tree.

I hope the full set is released, obviously.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2020, 03:27:59 PM by Join The Human Race » Logged
HeyJude
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« Reply #1954 on: October 09, 2020, 03:33:16 PM »

Just catching up on this thread; mostly a passerby as mentioned way back earlier. Anyway, the set is done, right? Like fully complete and ready to ship? Or do they still have to press the final copies but every thing else (mastering, sequencing, liner notes) is done? If the set is complete and ready for sell, then wouldn't all those copies have Dennis' songs?

Also, is there an official source that confirms the hold up is over Dennis' material? Or is that speculation when the information got out that it may get released, but with fewer songs? Again, is there an official source saying that its' Dennis getting the axe or just speculation that it could be his songs due to the complicated history between him and Mike?

No manufacturing has taken place as far as I know. It has been essentially ready to manufacture for some time now.

If you read recent posts, the hold up has not been Dennis material. The removal of Dennis material is a separate issue. Read the last page or two of posts.

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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #1955 on: October 09, 2020, 04:11:41 PM »


The stuff that does reach the surface is their music; which is now available almost anywhere. That's always going to define the band  


Yep, what's out there (and what's not out there) is indeed always going to define the band. The intentional absence of material from this set is part of that definition.

Who but Mike would have ANY reason to try and release a cut down version of the box that cuts out Dennis' material? I'd love to hear anyone's theory on how it could possibly be anyone/anything other than Mike. Please note: we already know from past posts in this thread, from people in the know, that it's not a legal/rights thing, so that potential option goes out the window. But hey, what do I know. I'm all ears if anybody has any logical suggestions other than the obvious suspect.

That there's golden stuff that will potentially not reach the surface due to some horse manure is an absolutely tragic thing.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2020, 07:21:40 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
alanjames
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« Reply #1956 on: October 09, 2020, 06:22:06 PM »

Just catching up on this thread; mostly a passerby as mentioned way back earlier. Anyway, the set is done, right? Like fully complete and ready to ship? Or do they still have to press the final copies but every thing else (mastering, sequencing, liner notes) is done? If the set is complete and ready for sell, then wouldn't all those copies have Dennis' songs?

Also, is there an official source that confirms the hold up is over Dennis' material? Or is that speculation when the information got out that it may get released, but with fewer songs? Again, is there an official source saying that its' Dennis getting the axe or just speculation that it could be his songs due to the complicated history between him and Mike?

No manufacturing has taken place as far as I know. It has been essentially ready to manufacture for some time now.

If you read recent posts, the hold up has not been Dennis material. The removal of Dennis material is a separate issue. Read the last page or two of posts.



But thereís some talk between the shareholders/parties involved about removing Dennis material?
They have been using it as a condition to give the green light to release the box?
Itís sad if this is a valid topic now, and if they have been discussing it at their meetings regarding the box.
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« Reply #1957 on: October 09, 2020, 09:44:42 PM »

If John Stamos is privy to the goings on re: FEEL FLOWS -- that's most likely coming from a source that will undoubtedly wipe ALL of Dennis' brilliant material off the set. Watch.

Sad

That's what I'm most curious about hearing
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Don Malcolm
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« Reply #1958 on: October 09, 2020, 10:44:53 PM »

All of the reasoning about Dennis' material in this time frame "not being BBs music" ignores the fact that some of it originally intended for his original solo project wound up being released on BB albums. Using that logic, a song such as "My Solution" shouldn't be included, either, since Brian eventually reworked it into "Happy Days" on IMAGINATION.

Given the complicated relationship of Dennis' material as it relates to the band, it makes a good bit more sense in 2020 to include it as part of a compilation like FEEL FLOWS in order to fully document the creative atmosphere of the band members during the 1969-71 time frame.

That's a point that should also be made publicly by anyone writing about the current situation. It makes the public disclosure of the track listing for FEEL FLOWS that much more imperative, in order to demonstrate exactly what might be vulnerable as a result of this faulty, selective reasoning.

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thetojo
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« Reply #1959 on: October 10, 2020, 01:26:26 AM »

Checked in to see there'd been a bit of movement, and got a bit excited. Then started reading and got very disappointed.
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Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll
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« Reply #1960 on: October 10, 2020, 02:47:21 AM »

As far as I can tell there is no evidence that Mike has a problem with Dennis material. I believe he was quite happy with the Dennis stuff on MIC.

Then you pop into this thread and it can become really REALLY confusing because of people speculating.

Disrespectful to Darian to talk about legacy and Stamos at the same time.

All he said was "soonish" for gawd sake  Huh
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« Reply #1961 on: October 10, 2020, 04:40:37 AM »

As far as I can tell there is no evidence that Mike has a problem with Dennis material. I believe he was quite happy with the Dennis stuff on MIC.

^ This. All I've read so far is pure speculation. Yet it looks like some people are treating it as an undisputable fact.
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« Reply #1962 on: October 10, 2020, 08:18:26 AM »

Y'all so good at speculations, you should sell houses.
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« Reply #1963 on: October 10, 2020, 12:28:41 PM »

A suitable response:

https://youtu.be/ElJRY0PoZgY
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alanjames
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« Reply #1964 on: October 10, 2020, 05:53:28 PM »

All of the reasoning about Dennis' material in this time frame "not being BBs music" ignores the fact that some of it originally intended for his original solo project wound up being released on BB albums. Using that logic, a song such as "My Solution" shouldn't be included, either, since Brian eventually reworked it into "Happy Days" on IMAGINATION.

Given the complicated relationship of Dennis' material as it relates to the band, it makes a good bit more sense in 2020 to include it as part of a compilation like FEEL FLOWS in order to fully document the creative atmosphere of the band members during the 1969-71 time frame.

That's a point that should also be made publicly by anyone writing about the current situation. It makes the public disclosure of the track listing for FEEL FLOWS that much more imperative, in order to demonstrate exactly what might be vulnerable as a result of this faulty, selective reasoning.



If Dennis material would be removed from this set, really I wouldnít mind if it will be canceled and released in digital.
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Don Malcolm
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« Reply #1965 on: October 10, 2020, 08:08:46 PM »

Jiggy over at the other place surmises that we will have a copyright dump at the end of the year, and the FEEL FLOWS package will get released as currently configured around the time of the 50 anniversary of the SURF's UP LP (late August '21). Manning was slogging us for what he claims will be eight more months of fine whinery...but it's actually ten months until that date, and the folks on the inside have the ability to assist us in a decrescendo on this subject by simply addressing what the freak is going on.

Those who appear to know something more about all this should feel free to weigh in...

...in the meantime, the current FEEE FLOWS track listing is still the best way to give those folk with more influence something to work with. I urge any of those who are privy to that information to make it publicly available. We can't rely on Stamos...we need a shoe to drop.
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« Reply #1966 on: October 10, 2020, 09:25:06 PM »

something just came to me about this whole Dennis Wilson situation. now this may be far fetched but WHAT IF the Beach Boys are releasing a new album next year and they are saving a couple of his songs to finish and place it on there, Ala: Free as a bird or Soul Searchin'. just a thought. but of course if one of them sees this. that may not be a bad idea, plus an unreleased Carl song too..hint hint...
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« Reply #1967 on: October 10, 2020, 10:48:09 PM »

If they're going to include solo Dennis material on sets supposedly devoted to the group, then what if, in the future, solo Carl stuff turns up on a Beach Boys set? Maybe some of Mike's unreleased solo stuff - First Love, Country Love?
I always thought it odd that River Song was on the Ten Years of Harmony comp.
Maybe Caroline, No should have been left off Pet Sounds, since that was a Brian solo single.
 Huh Huh Huh
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« Reply #1968 on: October 11, 2020, 02:51:22 AM »

Maybe Caroline, No should have been left off Pet Sounds, since that was a Brian solo single.
 Huh Huh Huh

And maybe the title track... and Let's Go Away for a While.... and Don't Talk Put Your Head on My Shoulder...,

Let's face it. There are more a few "Beach Boys" songs, particularly pre-1968, in which only one "Beach Boy" (i.e., Brian) had any involvement.

I get the distinction of "well, this is different because it's stuff Dennis never intended for a Beach Boys record whereas Brian's stuff was always intended for the BBs."   But at this point, who cares?  If it's good material from the relevant period, why not put it out there?
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« Reply #1969 on: October 11, 2020, 09:52:54 AM »

As far as I can tell there is no evidence that Mike has a problem with Dennis material.
This would only be true if there was no "evidence" that is not widely known to the public. I doubt many here would think that's the case.
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Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll
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« Reply #1970 on: October 11, 2020, 10:19:47 AM »

As far as I can tell there is no evidence that Mike has a problem with Dennis material.
This would only be true if there was no "evidence" that is not widely known to the public. I doubt many here would think that's the case.

I thought it had been cleared up earlier in this thread that at least re: feel flows, this wasn't an issue.

I'm aware they had plenty of personal issues in the past but as far as that impacting Dennis Wilson material appearing in later years on comps and so on, then I'm unaware of that and would be interested to know more.
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« Reply #1971 on: October 11, 2020, 10:26:23 AM »

As far as I can tell there is no evidence that Mike has a problem with Dennis material.
This would only be true if there was no "evidence" that is not widely known to the public. I doubt many here would think that's the case.

Nice to see you here again this Sunday Jon.
Are you speaking in more general terms or specifically in relation to Dennis material that may form a part of a Feel Flows set?

I donít find it difficult to believe that he would have a problem with some Dennis material in general but if the latter this seems like a new development.
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« Reply #1972 on: October 11, 2020, 10:31:17 AM »

As far as I can tell there is no evidence that Mike has a problem with Dennis material.
This would only be true if there was no "evidence" that is not widely known to the public. I doubt many here would think that's the case.

I thought it had been cleared up earlier in this thread that at least re: feel flows, this wasn't an issue.

I'm aware they had plenty of personal issues in the past but as far as that impacting Dennis Wilson material appearing in later years on comps and so on, then I'm unaware of that and would be interested to know more.

I addressed this several times in recent posts, including one on this page above. 

The issue of removing Dennis material is a more recent development separate from the initial issues with the set's delay.
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« Reply #1973 on: October 11, 2020, 10:36:53 AM »

something just came to me about this whole Dennis Wilson situation. now this may be far fetched but WHAT IF the Beach Boys are releasing a new album next year and they are saving a couple of his songs to finish and place it on there, Ala: Free as a bird or Soul Searchin'. just a thought. but of course if one of them sees this. that may not be a bad idea, plus an unreleased Carl song too..hint hint...

No,  not even close. 
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« Reply #1974 on: October 11, 2020, 10:39:57 AM »

As far as I can tell there is no evidence that Mike has a problem with Dennis material.
This would only be true if there was no "evidence" that is not widely known to the public. I doubt many here would think that's the case.

I thought it had been cleared up earlier in this thread that at least re: feel flows, this wasn't an issue.

I'm aware they had plenty of personal issues in the past but as far as that impacting Dennis Wilson material appearing in later years on comps and so on, then I'm unaware of that and would be interested to know more.

I addressed this several times in recent posts, including one on this page above. 

The issue of removing Dennis material is a more recent development separate from the initial issues with the set's delay.


OK, so, Dennis Wilson solo material had nothing to do with the initial delay however it's now unlikely to be released in whatever version of FF is released? and it's likely because of Mike Love objections?
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