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Author Topic: Feel Flows box set  (Read 372825 times)
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
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« Reply #3075 on: March 26, 2021, 05:40:34 AM »

For what it’s worth, my band’s recent 50 track compilation was released by us on our BandCamp site on a Friday...but retailers put it up on a Tuesday. Course they then had the nerve to price  it at ten bucks or less and slap “Deluxe Edition” on the title 🤬
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 08:49:11 AM by ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 » Logged

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« Reply #3076 on: March 26, 2021, 08:01:28 AM »

I got all excited there as page 124 opened....
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Greg Parry
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« Reply #3077 on: March 26, 2021, 09:07:07 AM »

I got all excited there as page 124 opened....

Just wait till we hit 125
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Greg Parry
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« Reply #3078 on: March 26, 2021, 09:14:49 AM »

Stephen Desper just posted this at EH

Quote
COMMENT:    NO ONE has consulted me at any time on liner notes, tape tracks, or perhaps issuing SF and SU resolved through the matrix. To me it seems an ideal time to break with tradition and bring theses albums into the 21st century with a proper mastering -- but nothing. So far, Recording The Beach Boys is the only source for hearing these albums as Carl and I heard them at mixdown; resolved through the playback matrix. And also the only source to hear both albums actually mastered by Carl and myself . . . not some staff engineer who wasn't even around when the albums were made.

Alan, who was reviewing the liner notes, called me to ask what type of echo device was in use for the mixdowns at The House Studio.  Seems Alan had forgotten that there was an acoustic chamber used at The House Studio. He said he wrote in the liner notes that it was a plate echo device. That's the EMT Plate Echo system, which did not exist at Bellagio. Al called on the last day for printed changes to the liner notes. After some discussion, I could see that the liner notes may contain some false information -- MAY, as I have not seen anything. Al said I was quoted in the liner notes and I informed him of my copyrighted book of 553 pages . . . and that no one has passed the liner notes across my eyes for review -- which if there is infringement, we don't want cease & desist letters screwing up the release time-line. Soon thereafter, BB lawyer Jerry Shilling and I entered into telephone discussions. But since we were then talking after the press date for changes, we just left it open, so we shall see. 

In our conversations, both Alan and Jerry cited July 22, 2021 as the release date. Other than that, I do not know.  ~swd

So, 22nd of July then.
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SMiLE Brian
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« Reply #3079 on: March 26, 2021, 12:46:22 PM »

Can’t see BRI being too happy with Mr. Desper right now... Undecided
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And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
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« Reply #3080 on: March 26, 2021, 03:06:02 PM »

Personally if Desper is really being left out of the conversation, I think it's needlessly dumb. His sound is what made those albums what they were in the first place. I can understand not wanting to commit to new quadrophonic mixes, but it sounds to me that the archivists just want to rush the music out, and are probably underbudgeted. But in the end, I don't come into this set for anything else but the music, and assume that there are always going to be politics at play. That's the nature of being a Beach Boys fan. It's messy, and you gotta wade through all the politics in order to get into the music. Hopefully we can hear from Desper's perspective, but in the end, the fact that this music is getting reissued in the first place is a cause for joy in and of itself.
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SMiLE Brian
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« Reply #3081 on: March 26, 2021, 03:27:40 PM »

Totally, Steve Desper was an integral part of the 1970s BBs sound...
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And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #3082 on: March 26, 2021, 03:58:37 PM »

Personally if Desper is really being left out of the conversation, I think it's needlessly dumb. His sound is what made those albums what they were in the first place. I can understand not wanting to commit to new quadrophonic mixes, but it sounds to me that the archivists just want to rush the music out, and are probably underbudgeted. But in the end, I don't come into this set for anything else but the music, and assume that there are always going to be politics at play. That's the nature of being a Beach Boys fan. It's messy, and you gotta wade through all the politics in order to get into the music. Hopefully we can hear from Desper's perspective, but in the end, the fact that this music is getting reissued in the first place is a cause for joy in and of itself.

Totally, Steve Desper was an integral part of the 1970s BBs sound...

+1 to both of these posts. Much respect to everyone involved behind the scenes in championing this release, and to Mark, Alan, and Steve.

Politics suck.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 04:00:34 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
thetojo
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« Reply #3083 on: March 26, 2021, 04:42:41 PM »

Personally if Desper is really being left out of the conversation, I think it's needlessly dumb. His sound is what made those albums what they were in the first place. I can understand not wanting to commit to new quadrophonic mixes, but it sounds to me that the archivists just want to rush the music out, and are probably underbudgeted. But in the end, I don't come into this set for anything else but the music, and assume that there are always going to be politics at play. That's the nature of being a Beach Boys fan. It's messy, and you gotta wade through all the politics in order to get into the music. Hopefully we can hear from Desper's perspective, but in the end, the fact that this music is getting reissued in the first place is a cause for joy in and of itself.

Totally, Steve Desper was an integral part of the 1970s BBs sound...

+1 to both of these posts. Much respect to everyone involved behind the scenes in championing this release, and to Mark, Alan, and Steve.

Politics suck.

4 years of Trump malarky and a post from S W Desper triggers the comment "Politics suck".    Grin  That's what I call late to the party.

Disappointed, like most people, that Desper has had little/no involvement in this, but this group has to remember that what we might want isn't always going to be commercially sensible. I'd love a 32 bit / 384 kHz release of every Beach Boys thing in existence (in multitrack). . . but it doesn't mean it makes sense for it to be released.

If there's been infringement of SWDs copyright then he has his rights - but we don't know that, and the last thing any of us want is a further delay to the set.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 04:50:00 PM by thetojo » Logged
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« Reply #3084 on: March 26, 2021, 06:05:16 PM »

Four years of "malarkey"" has led to perhaps the greatest political statement ever from a President.
"So the best way to get something done, if you, if you hold near and dear to that, you uh, um, like to be able uh...Anyway." Blue Collar Joe.

As Frank Drebin said and the media repeats, nothing to see here, please disperse!!
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« Reply #3085 on: March 26, 2021, 06:06:25 PM »

.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 06:07:33 PM by joe_blow » Logged
CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #3086 on: March 26, 2021, 07:25:28 PM »

Personally if Desper is really being left out of the conversation, I think it's needlessly dumb. His sound is what made those albums what they were in the first place. I can understand not wanting to commit to new quadrophonic mixes, but it sounds to me that the archivists just want to rush the music out, and are probably underbudgeted. But in the end, I don't come into this set for anything else but the music, and assume that there are always going to be politics at play. That's the nature of being a Beach Boys fan. It's messy, and you gotta wade through all the politics in order to get into the music. Hopefully we can hear from Desper's perspective, but in the end, the fact that this music is getting reissued in the first place is a cause for joy in and of itself.

Totally, Steve Desper was an integral part of the 1970s BBs sound...

+1 to both of these posts. Much respect to everyone involved behind the scenes in championing this release, and to Mark, Alan, and Steve.

Politics suck.

4 years of Trump malarky and a post from S W Desper triggers the comment "Politics suck".    Grin  That's what I call late to the party.

Disappointed, like most people, that Desper has had little/no involvement in this, but this group has to remember that what we might want isn't always going to be commercially sensible. I'd love a 32 bit / 384 kHz release of every Beach Boys thing in existence (in multitrack). . . but it doesn't mean it makes sense for it to be released.

If there's been infringement of SWDs copyright then he has his rights - but we don't know that, and the last thing any of us want is a further delay to the set.

To clarify what I meant in this case... band/US/world politics suck when they adversely affect this band and its music/reputation/etc. Anyway.
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thetojo
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« Reply #3087 on: March 26, 2021, 07:57:03 PM »

Okay

Hope I didn't offend anyone - just trying to pass the time between now and whenever the hell this box hits the shelves with a bit of light banter.

Too soon?
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♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
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« Reply #3088 on: March 27, 2021, 01:07:19 AM »

Okay

Hope I didn't offend anyone - just trying to pass the time between now and whenever the hell this box hits the shelves with a bit of light banter.

Too soon?



Never too soon in my book lol
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« Reply #3089 on: March 27, 2021, 07:19:20 AM »

Not to flog a dead horse, but it is inconceivable to me that the engineer and co producer of Sunflower and Surfs Up wasn’t interviewed for this project and consulted on the remastering.  I understand they want a new mastering, but Steve is now the only one who knows what Carl and his intentions were in mastering how they did, and that info could be very helpful when remastering the albums even if they want to go for a more modern sound. 
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« Reply #3090 on: March 27, 2021, 08:33:55 AM »

It's funny sometimes how things change over a few years - When I had similar opinions about engineer Geoff Emerick being almost totally excluded from the Sgt Pepper deluxe reissue project and eventual box set material, there was more pushback and debate, almost like the replies were saying "get over it". And yet Geoff perhaps knew as much about nearly every bar of music on those Pepper tapes as anyone else, including the Beatles themselves and George and Giles Martin.


On a side note, referring back to an earlier comment: Politics? In the world of the Beach Boys? Naaahhhh.... LOL

The inside politics of this band, the inside politics surrounding those claiming to be insiders, the inside politics of nearly every facet of this band and various fan outlets are what almost ruins it for me until I can actually listen to some music and flush all that garbage away. But that's life.  Smokin
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« Reply #3091 on: March 27, 2021, 10:11:43 AM »

Not to flog a dead horse, but it is inconceivable to me that the engineer and co producer of Sunflower and Surfs Up wasn’t interviewed for this project and consulted on the remastering.  I understand they want a new mastering, but Steve is now the only one who knows what Carl and his intentions were in mastering how they did, and that info could be very helpful when remastering the albums even if they want to go for a more modern sound.  

At risk of joining in the dead-horse flogging, how can anyone possibly disagree with this?  It's incomprehensible to me that one could look at the situation objectively and shrug and say, "Stephen Desper? Hmmn, not really seeing how he could have any unique insights into any of this."  
 
The Sunflower-Surf's Up era is one of the most interesting in the group's recording history, particularly with the other members of the group blossoming to such a great extent while Brian was still delivering the goods in reduced, but still potent way.  And Desper had a hand in all of it.  And 50 years later, he's alive and cogent and responsive (and frankly seems like a very nice guy who was once very close to the Wilson brothers), and no one bothers to involve him?   As GF mentions, this sort of thing does happen (cf. Geoff Emerick and Beatles remasters/reissues), but it's unfortunate that it does.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2021, 10:12:56 AM by juggler » Logged
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« Reply #3092 on: March 27, 2021, 12:33:02 PM »

Not to flog a dead horse, but it is inconceivable to me that the engineer and co producer of Sunflower and Surfs Up wasn’t interviewed for this project and consulted on the remastering.  I understand they want a new mastering, but Steve is now the only one who knows what Carl and his intentions were in mastering how they did, and that info could be very helpful when remastering the albums even if they want to go for a more modern sound.  

At risk of joining in the dead-horse flogging, how can anyone possibly disagree with this?  It's incomprehensible to me that one could look at the situation objectively and shrug and say, "Stephen Desper? Hmmn, not really seeing how he could have any unique insights into any of this."  
 
The Sunflower-Surf's Up era is one of the most interesting in the group's recording history, particularly with the other members of the group blossoming to such a great extent while Brian was still delivering the goods in reduced, but still potent way.  And Desper had a hand in all of it.  And 50 years later, he's alive and cogent and responsive (and frankly seems like a very nice guy who was once very close to the Wilson brothers), and no one bothers to involve him?   As GF mentions, this sort of thing does happen (cf. Geoff Emerick and Beatles remasters/reissues), but it's unfortunate that it does.


I assume there are some unfortunate politics that we all simply don't know about. It's the same type of disappointment when Van Dyke Parks was not involved with the Smile Sessions 2011 box - that was also an inconceivable omission, yet it happened. I'm sure there are reasons why in both cases, neither of those omissions could simply be some random oversight, but certainly from a fan/historical perspective it's deeply unfortunate.
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« Reply #3093 on: March 27, 2021, 12:50:13 PM »

Well we know why Van Dyke didn’t participate in the Smile Sessions box set - he was P.O.’d at the protracted negotiations between Capitol and Frank Holmes and the insultingly low amount of compensation offered to him.  They finally came to an agreement but by then the notes and book were essentially done and Van wasn’t in a frame of mind to contribute.
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« Reply #3094 on: March 27, 2021, 01:11:27 PM »

Van should write a book like Stephen's, but about SMiLE.

Now that would P.O. a few people.
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« Reply #3095 on: March 27, 2021, 02:20:14 PM »

Yes, the VDP/Smile box situation is somewhat analogous.  As much as I love that package, would the liner notes, if nothing else, have been enhanced by VDP's track-by-track comments? Without a doubt.  I will say, though, that as much I'm a fan of VDP's lyrics and music, the impression that I have is that he's not necessarily the easiest person in the world to work with it.  His comments often display a fair amount of snottiness and pettiness... e.g., his claim that he "had been victimized by Brian Wilson's buffoonery."

I guess my point is that VDP non-involvement with TSS wasn't necessarily entirely the fault of the other side.

I don't know Steve Desper personally, but I have seen enough in the way of interviews and online posts by him to have the opinion that the guy is a mensch and a straight-shooter, and once-upon-a-time a good friend of Carl, Dennis and Brian.  If he says "No one has consulted me at any time on liner notes, tape tracks," etc., the story is likely as simple as that. 
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♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
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« Reply #3096 on: March 28, 2021, 04:39:41 PM »

Gotta say, it’s great to read a FF thread that doesn’t have most of the board and moderators ganging up on a single member and telling them their posts are awful
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Individual: “I’m not!”

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SMiLE Brian
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« Reply #3097 on: March 28, 2021, 04:50:27 PM »

endless harmony.... Roll Eyes
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And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
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« Reply #3098 on: March 28, 2021, 09:16:05 PM »

That being said -- Stephen is pretty emphatically retired, and also emphatic that the best (only?) way to listen to the material he recorded with the Boys is the through the original mixes. A box featuring remixed material and outtakes seems by definition something he'd disapprove of. Mark and Alan could certainly read his posts here for many years to see that.
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« Reply #3099 on: March 29, 2021, 11:45:25 AM »

Gotta say, it’s great to read a FF thread that doesn’t have most of the board and moderators ganging up on a single member and telling them their posts are awful
isn't that the guy you called a waste of flesh
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