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Author Topic: New album info (as it rolls out...)  (Read 787928 times)
Wylson
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« Reply #2750 on: May 17, 2012, 05:56:11 AM »

Quote from: littlepad
How is Good Timin' keeping up with the sound of 1979?

Answer:
Quote from: littlepad
I would have complained in 1985 had I been born.


Oh dear, hoisted by my own petard.

What exactly is your point?
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Matt Allison
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« Reply #2751 on: May 17, 2012, 06:02:41 AM »

No I wouldn't say more. But From Here To Back Again and Pacific Coast Highway are probably of the same level, and they're quite slow ballads so sticks out more.
I think I get you guys now; "any vocal that isn't single-tracked and only has reverb or echo on it... is horribly "autotuned" "
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Wirestone
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« Reply #2752 on: May 17, 2012, 06:20:33 AM »

Ultimately, the only thing that will matter, in the end, is if the album is any good. I was a stalwart defender of Imagination back in the 90s, because I figured that if master pop musician Brian Wilson wanted to make an AC pop record, so be it. If ultimate 60s pop act the Beach Boys want to make a shiny pop record in 2012, okay. The record's quality will not be determined by vocal effects, one way or another. It will be the solidity of the songs, the commitment of the vocalists, the twists and turns of the harmony, and the originality of the arrangements.

This isn't to say aesthetic concerns over vocal effects aren't relevant. They certainly are. But ultimately I think attempts to draw distinctions between digital pitch correction (which has been on practically every Beach Boys and Brian Wilson release since 1985) and other kinds of analogue vocal effects are arbitrary, an attempt to erect some sort of purity fence around an musical act that we treasure, an attempt to believe -- however strong the evidence to the contrary -- that the BBs are different and better in some fundamental way that goes beyond simply making great records.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2012, 09:35:53 PM by Wirestone » Logged
Wylson
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« Reply #2753 on: May 17, 2012, 06:27:14 AM »

Ultimately, the only thing that will matter, in the end, is if the album is any good. I was a stalwart defender of Imagination back in the 90s, because I figured that if master pop musician Brian Wilson wanted to make an AC pop record, so be it. If ultimate 60s pop act the Beach Boys want to make a shiny pop record in 2012, okay. The record's quality will not be determined by vocal effects, one way or another. It will be the solidity of the songs, the commitment of the vocalists, the twists and turns of the harmony, and the originality of the arrangements.

This isn't to say aesthetic concerns over vocal effects aren't relevant. They certainly are. But ultimately I think the attempts to draw distinctions between digital pitch correction (which has been on practically every Beach Boys and Brian Wilson release since 1985) and other kinds of analogue vocal effects strikes me as arbitrary, an attempt to erect some sort of purity fence around an musical act that we treasure, an attempt to believe, however strong the evidence to the contrary, that the BBs are different and better in some fundamental way that goes beyond simply making great records.

Good points wirestone. However, I'm not sure that Brian does want to make AC pop records.
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« Reply #2754 on: May 17, 2012, 06:32:51 AM »


Good points wirestone. However, I'm not sure that Brian does want to make AC pop records.

i don't think he wanted to for Imagination either.  But i think he had some control on this album and liked how the vocal effect sounded and went with it. 
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Wirestone
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« Reply #2755 on: May 17, 2012, 06:37:35 AM »

Ultimately, the only thing that will matter, in the end, is if the album is any good. I was a stalwart defender of Imagination back in the 90s, because I figured that if master pop musician Brian Wilson wanted to make an AC pop record, so be it. If ultimate 60s pop act the Beach Boys want to make a shiny pop record in 2012, okay. The record's quality will not be determined by vocal effects, one way or another. It will be the solidity of the songs, the commitment of the vocalists, the twists and turns of the harmony, and the originality of the arrangements.

This isn't to say aesthetic concerns over vocal effects aren't relevant. They certainly are. But ultimately I think the attempts to draw distinctions between digital pitch correction (which has been on practically every Beach Boys and Brian Wilson release since 1985) and other kinds of analogue vocal effects strikes me as arbitrary, an attempt to erect some sort of purity fence around an musical act that we treasure, an attempt to believe, however strong the evidence to the contrary, that the BBs are different and better in some fundamental way that goes beyond simply making great records.

Good points wirestone. However, I'm not sure that Brian does want to make AC pop records.

Well, he hasn't made many. At least for Imagination, he was very interested in having a hit. Almost above all, according to those around him, he wanted to be on the charts again. AC was presented to him as the means to that end, and he embraced it, at least for awhile. It was then handy of him to bad mouth Joe when the record wasn't a big hit and he had found a new group of enablers.

I am not a big fan of letting Brian off the hook for what are ultimately his creative decisions, good or bad. He's a big boy. He has for too long allowed others to take the heat when things don't work out and basked in kudos when they did. Fans do this too -- if it's something we like, Brian must be responsible. If it's something we hate, he was being manipulated by evil outside forces.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2012, 06:38:49 AM by Wirestone » Logged
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« Reply #2756 on: May 17, 2012, 06:40:12 AM »

well he can't take the brunt for the quality of songs on imagination heh. 
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seltaeb1012002
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« Reply #2757 on: May 17, 2012, 06:41:13 AM »

I recently came across an interview with Brian from 2005 (someone may have posted it here) where he says that he prefers recording now as opposed to the 60's due to pitch correction being available. I'd say it's pretty likely that he wanted the record to sound this way.
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krabklaw
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« Reply #2758 on: May 17, 2012, 07:07:30 AM »

Im so happy I can listen to an album without giving a f*ck whether the songs are autotuned or not

I second that emotion. Cheesy
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« Reply #2759 on: May 17, 2012, 07:12:57 AM »

No I wouldn't say more. But From Here To Back Again and Pacific Coast Highway are probably of the same level, and they're quite slow ballads so sticks out more.
I think I get you guys now; "any vocal that isn't single-tracked and only has reverb or echo on it... is horribly "autotuned" "

Um.... Except that neither reverb nor echo sound even remotely similar to autotune.
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« Reply #2760 on: May 17, 2012, 07:14:33 AM »

No I wouldn't say more. But From Here To Back Again and Pacific Coast Highway are probably of the same level, and they're quite slow ballads so sticks out more.
I think I get you guys now; "any vocal that isn't single-tracked and only has reverb or echo on it... is horribly "autotuned" "

Um.... Except that neither reverb nor echo sound even remotely similar to autotune.

neither is what some people are calling autotune (i think that's his point)
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drbeachboy
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« Reply #2761 on: May 17, 2012, 07:15:46 AM »

Ultimately, the only thing that will matter, in the end, is if the album is any good. I was a stalwart defender of Imagination back in the 90s, because I figured that if master pop musician Brian Wilson wanted to make an AC pop record, so be it. If ultimate 60s pop act the Beach Boys want to make a shiny pop record in 2012, okay. The record's quality will not be determined by vocal effects, one way or another. It will be the solidity of the songs, the commitment of the vocalists, the twists and turns of the harmony, and the originality of the arrangements.

This isn't to say aesthetic concerns over vocal effects aren't relevant. They certainly are. But ultimately I think the attempts to draw distinctions between digital pitch correction (which has been on practically every Beach Boys and Brian Wilson release since 1985) and other kinds of analogue vocal effects strikes me as arbitrary, an attempt to erect some sort of purity fence around an musical act that we treasure, an attempt to believe, however strong the evidence to the contrary, that the BBs are different and better in some fundamental way that goes beyond simply making great records.
If, as you say, this has been happening since 1985, then what really is the issue? 27 years worth of releases and we are still bitching about it? This is the way Brian makes records, now. If you want new product, then the ears just need to adjust to these recording techniques.
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On Stage As It Is In Studio,
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And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
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pixletwin
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« Reply #2762 on: May 17, 2012, 07:18:25 AM »

No I wouldn't say more. But From Here To Back Again and Pacific Coast Highway are probably of the same level, and they're quite slow ballads so sticks out more.
I think I get you guys now; "any vocal that isn't single-tracked and only has reverb or echo on it... is horribly "autotuned" "

Um.... Except that neither reverb nor echo sound even remotely similar to autotune.

neither is what some people are calling autotune (i think that's his point)

True. There is a cry of "AUTOTUNE" around here that reminds me of chicken little. But you can't deny the presence of autotune on the new album. It's there. Not anything necessarily wrong about that. It's well known that John Lennon hated his voice and favored putting what he called "ketchup" on his vocals.
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Autotune
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« Reply #2763 on: May 17, 2012, 07:41:44 AM »

Ultimately, the only thing that will matter, in the end, is if the album is any good. I was a stalwart defender of Imagination back in the 90s, because I figured that if master pop musician Brian Wilson wanted to make an AC pop record, so be it. If ultimate 60s pop act the Beach Boys want to make a shiny pop record in 2012, okay. The record's quality will not be determined by vocal effects, one way or another. It will be the solidity of the songs, the commitment of the vocalists, the twists and turns of the harmony, and the originality of the arrangements.

This isn't to say aesthetic concerns over vocal effects aren't relevant. They certainly are. But ultimately I think the attempts to draw distinctions between digital pitch correction (which has been on practically every Beach Boys and Brian Wilson release since 1985) and other kinds of analogue vocal effects strikes me as arbitrary, an attempt to erect some sort of purity fence around an musical act that we treasure, an attempt to believe, however strong the evidence to the contrary, that the BBs are different and better in some fundamental way that goes beyond simply making great records.

Good points wirestone. However, I'm not sure that Brian does want to make AC pop records.

Imagination = AC
Christmas = AC
Gershwin = AC
Disney = AC
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« Reply #2764 on: May 17, 2012, 08:25:34 AM »

No I wouldn't say more. But From Here To Back Again and Pacific Coast Highway are probably of the same level, and they're quite slow ballads so sticks out more.
I think I get you guys now; "any vocal that isn't single-tracked and only has reverb or echo on it... is horribly "autotuned" "

Um.... Except that neither reverb nor echo sound even remotely similar to autotune.

neither is what some people are calling autotune (i think that's his point)

True. There is a cry of "AUTOTUNE" around here that reminds me of chicken little. But you can't deny the presence of autotune on the new album. It's there. Not anything necessarily wrong about that. It's well known that John Lennon hated his voice and favored putting what he called "ketchup" on his vocals.

Oh theres def autotune. Which is perfectly fine. But some people were saying that al's vocal on fttba is autotuned, when that obviously isnt pitch correcting.
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I. Spaceman
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« Reply #2765 on: May 17, 2012, 08:34:11 AM »

And btw, Paul McCartney, Paul Simon, Joni Mitchell, and Bob Dylan haven't recorded a song in many decades that can even hold a candle to the worst one on this album. 

Dylan? You're kidding, right? A fair amount of Dylan's greatest work has been recorded over the last 15 years.
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« Reply #2766 on: May 17, 2012, 08:46:21 AM »

And btw, Paul McCartney, Paul Simon, Joni Mitchell, and Bob Dylan haven't recorded a song in many decades that can even hold a candle to the worst one on this album. 

Dylan? You're kidding, right? A fair amount of Dylan's greatest work has been recorded over the last 15 years.

I definitely agree there... Even Paul's last couple original albums have been his best since the early Wings stuff imo.
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« Reply #2767 on: May 17, 2012, 09:13:37 AM »

And btw, Paul McCartney, Paul Simon, Joni Mitchell, and Bob Dylan haven't recorded a song in many decades that can even hold a candle to the worst one on this album.  

Dylan? You're kidding, right? A fair amount of Dylan's greatest work has been recorded over the last 15 years.

I definitely agree there... Even Paul's last couple original albums have been his best since the early Wings stuff imo.

Well, that covers album he just released was pretty bad, but his other recent albums have been good, I agree. He's still got it.
Oh yeah- Beach Boys board- The Beach Boys still got it too!
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« Reply #2768 on: May 17, 2012, 09:15:19 AM »

Isn't It Time sounds really cool, it's definitely the one I'm looking the most forward to listening to.
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« Reply #2769 on: May 17, 2012, 09:38:32 AM »

Isn't It Time sounds really cool, it's definitely the one I'm looking the most forward to listening to.
Yes, this is my favorite as well. "Isn't It Time" is my favorite of all the tracks so far. It is simple, but it has a certain charm that is in short supply these days, and can only be provided by The Beach Boys.

I am comforted to know that there is no autotune on any of the vocals. It must just be double-tracking, or perhaps they recorded their vocals through a cellphone and that is causing notes to snap in new and different ways.
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« Reply #2770 on: May 17, 2012, 09:48:06 AM »

And btw, Paul McCartney, Paul Simon, Joni Mitchell, and Bob Dylan haven't recorded a song in many decades that can even hold a candle to the worst one on this album.

You're not gonna make friends outta me with a statement like that, pal.  You should do some research before laying down such ridiculously sloppy comments.  Both Paul Simon and Bob Dylan have put out some of their strongest works in their recent albums.  Paul Simon's latest "So Beautiful or So What" is impressive, and it contains all the elements that would make the common Brian Wilson fan smile:  complex arrangements, unconventional melodies and wonderful vocals.  Don't knock other artists just becuase you don't get what they're doing. 
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« Reply #2771 on: May 17, 2012, 10:05:30 AM »

And btw, Paul McCartney, Paul Simon, Joni Mitchell, and Bob Dylan haven't recorded a song in many decades that can even hold a candle to the worst one on this album.

Comparing The Shins, Mumford and Sons, Fleet Foxes, Flaming Lips to Brian Wilson is laughable.

8x derivative indie rock to the original? Great argument you have there.
Summer In Paradise does sound quite a bit like Katy Perry, as I have noted elsewhere on this board.
Incidentally, Eventide Harmonizer was used on Cher's "Believe" along with Antares or similar.

Paul McCartney released Chaos and Creation in the Back Yard in 2005, Memory Almost Full in 2007, and Electric Arguments in 2009. Three of my favorite McCartney records, and I have his whole catalogue. Yes, the mastering on MAF sucks, but the songs are excellent.

Bob Dylan's "Love and Theft," "Modern Times" and "Time Out of Mind" are, again, three of his best works, and Paul Simon has done some of his best work in the past decade as well.

Joni Mitchell has been coasting, I will grant you that... and personally I am not into any of the indie bands you mentioned, aside from the Flaming Lips. Actually have never heard the others, so I can't say one way or another if they are good.

Welcome to the board, Matt.
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« Reply #2772 on: May 17, 2012, 10:11:57 AM »

I just don't want them to ruin what sound like beautiful songs with BAD application of modern technology, that sounds nothing like contemporary records (except for utter crap mainstream pop).

Oh ok, so were you complaining when they made 'Getcha Back'? or 'Good Timin'?

Other than the 'Love You' album, please proffer me ONE album where this band did not *completely* try to stay current with whatever was going on sonically in pop music.

Here's three. Pet Sounds, Wild Honey, Friends.
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« Reply #2773 on: May 17, 2012, 10:18:17 AM »

I just don't want them to ruin what sound like beautiful songs with BAD application of modern technology, that sounds nothing like contemporary records (except for utter crap mainstream pop).

Oh ok, so were you complaining when they made 'Getcha Back'? or 'Good Timin'?

Other than the 'Love You' album, please proffer me ONE album where this band did not *completely* try to stay current with whatever was going on sonically in pop music.

Here's three. Pet Sounds, Wild Honey, Friends.
Don't forget one of their best albums, Sunflower.
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« Reply #2774 on: May 17, 2012, 10:33:29 AM »

I just don't want them to ruin what sound like beautiful songs with BAD application of modern technology, that sounds nothing like contemporary records (except for utter crap mainstream pop).

Oh ok, so were you complaining when they made 'Getcha Back'? or 'Good Timin'?

Other than the 'Love You' album, please proffer me ONE album where this band did not *completely* try to stay current with whatever was going on sonically in pop music.

Here's three. Pet Sounds, Wild Honey, Friends.

Also Smiley Smile. Can't get much more out of step than that. And 15 Big Ones doesn't sound like any other record from that time.

So in other words, every post-1966 Beach Boys record where Brian was in charge.

(Although for that matter I've never heard anything else, ever, that sounds quite like the sound the band got on some tracks from Surf's Up through Holland where they were combining analogue synth sounds with acoustic folk instruments like the banjo.)
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