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668417 Posts in 26881 Topics by 3900 Members - Latest Member: imsetfree98 May 12, 2021, 01:18:32 PM
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1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Anniversary of Event that influenced a Beach Boy song on: May 05, 2021, 05:47:32 PM
Three at least.

The Doors - "Dead Cats, Dead Rats" (Jim Morrison) - "Absolutely Live" (1970), recorded on May 8th in Detroit.

Dead cats, dead rats
Can't see what they were at, all right
Dead cat in a top hat, wow
Sucking on the young man's blood
Wishing he could come, yeah
Sucking on the soldier's brain
Wishing it would be the same
Dead cat, dead rat
Can't you see what they were at?
Fat cat in a top hat
Thinks he's an aristocrat
Thinks he can kill and slaughter
Thinks he can shoot my daughter
Yeah right! Oh yeah!
Oh right! Yeeah!
Dead cats, dead rats
Think they're an aristocrat
Crap, now that's crap!
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Czechoslovakia concerts in 1969 on: March 27, 2021, 05:37:36 PM
There is a book by Dick Heckstall-Smith, the saxophonist from Colosseum, "The Safest Plece in the World", which has the first-hand account of a working musician; it includes some BB-related anecdotes like having to rely on a battery from a Soviet tank for their PA, and a rather huge section on a socio-political analysis - but it must be said that he was a "tankie".

Thanks so much!  I had never heard of this so will check it out. 

The latest edition from 2004 is called "Blowing the Blues: Fifty Years Playing the British Blues".
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Czechoslovakia concerts in 1969 on: March 23, 2021, 03:39:12 PM
There is a book by Dick Heckstall-Smith, the saxophonist from Colosseum, "The Safest Plece in the World", which has the first-hand account of a working musician; it includes some BB-related anecdotes like having to rely on a battery from a Soviet tank for their PA, and a rather huge section on a socio-political analysis - but it must be said that he was a "tankie".
4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The Ultimate Present for Brian! on: March 19, 2021, 06:16:11 PM
I think these are available for some years now. There are 5CD and 4CD sets of Spector's sessions which are different. The 4CD set of Captain Acid's remasters is recommended, if only because it's from a lossless source.
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Was a Beatles-like career arc ever possible for the Beach Boys? on: February 11, 2021, 04:24:17 PM
I became aware of The Beatles' music about 40 years ago - they were, like, my father's generation. It was obvious to me right from the start that their early music, even not as advanced as the later works, had that electrifying quality. In fact, that word is astutely mentioned in the subtitle of some North American LP of theirs, The Second Album (I am used to the UK discography). As for The Beach Boys' music, much as I love them - my first experience of them was about 10 years later, Carl and the Passions / So Tough album, and my first thought was, "What is that sh*t?", but amazingly, I got sucked into that album, knowing already it was their weakest from the early era - it does not have that innate electrifying quality, even though, of course, it has many other most splendid qualities. For the early rock, The Beatles simply were IT.
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Heroes and Villains format/versions on: January 31, 2021, 05:24:12 PM
I don't know if this has been proposed here, but in my opinion, Brian lacked a strong chorus, and whatever sequences there may be, they do not resemble a proper hit song because of this. IMO he should have worked on the "Bicycle Rider" thing.

Another thing - probably he did not want to build up anything resembling a hit (with a proper chorus in place) because of the problems with Capitol. So he worked on the song, but he wasn't working on the hit.
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smile Research Project - Recommendations? on: January 27, 2021, 05:17:38 PM

Are there other books, or recordings similar to the ones above, that you could recommend?

Any info would be appreciated!

Thank You!!
This thread:
http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,11250.0.html
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike's buddy Trump gives BBs collaborator Toby Keith National Medal of the Arts on: January 24, 2021, 04:50:04 PM
LOL. I think a band which had appropriated a song by Charles Manson in the past can survive any association with Donald Trump.
9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: December 13, 2020, 03:16:02 PM
I think I've found a good example of a most famous master recorded on a partially erased tape. The Doors, "Light My Fire". At the very start, roughly 5 seconds in, a female voice says something like "appeasingly". It's heard most clearly in the single mono mix, and (less so) in the mono mix. Stereo mix has it as well, but it's really subtle there. This means, it's on the 4-track master. Though it was the mono mix that was paid the most attention by Paul Rothchild and Bruce Botnick, they weren't able to do much in mono.

There is also unique stereo remix from the 4-track master made by Steve Hoffman, on the Audio Fidelity 2014 release "Legends / Get It On". This subliminal thing is still there, but oh-so-subtly. (Haven't checked yet the "Perception" remix by Bruce Botnick, as I am aware that some subtle noises are cleaned there.)

We know now it isn't Carol, as she recognised the fact herself  Grin
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: David Crosby comments on Mike Love...Go David! on: October 21, 2020, 03:52:05 PM
LOL. What's that saying about the opinions and that everybody has one.
11  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Help me find any academic writing about Beach Boys on: October 07, 2020, 05:36:53 PM
Check out this thread, it has a useful link to such a book:
http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,27362.0.html
12  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Streaming Versus Physical Product And A New Beatles Deluxe Book... on: September 18, 2020, 06:02:33 PM
I invest in books heavily. The market for physical books is alive and well. Yes there are authors who went the e-book route, either for new editions or entirely (Stephen MacParland is the obvious example regarding the BBs, but otherwise he'd have to sell physical books from his native Australia, and this is pretty much a problem). But their number is few, while an amazing number of music books is being printed, either as HB or PB, both by renowned publishing houses and by the "self-publishing" outlets, the scope is amazing.

A month ago, I was not able to buy a deluxe edition of a book on Hawkwind. Numbered at 500, it sold out as soon as it was announced to go "live", within days - at 50 GBP, at that!
http://strangeattractor.co.uk/shoppe/hawkwind-days-of-the-underground/
The deluxe edition offered a very good value for money in the guise of a bonus book.

As for the music releases, it all depends on the mindset of band members / management. Like, The Doors passed at issuing the promised multi-disc of "L.A. Woman" sessions back in 2011, while during the same time The Velvet Underground issued each of their 4 studio albums as multi-disc set, and then even more.

It's good that we've got "The Smile Sessions". I remember some people were complaining back at the time that this box is too pricey for them. Yet, were this material to appear in the '90s, it'd have been snapped like hot cakes. In my opinion, the labels shoot themselves in the foot by steering off the '90s model when a multi-disc box sold at what, $60 for 5 CDs? yes those weren't "deluxe" but in no way less classy.
13  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Streaming Versus Physical Product And A New Beatles Deluxe Book... on: September 18, 2020, 05:59:51 PM
...
14  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beatles First Audition Tape at Abbey Road FOUND - Emerick Family Legal Battle on: June 14, 2020, 07:51:03 AM

First, and foremost: The article clearly states VIDEO and cites people who have seen it. Quite literally, my reaction was WTF? Unless this was done and missed for almost 60 years by Beatles experts and everyone else including the band themselves, is this just a glaring king-size error in reporting to say video instead of audio? Why would EMI film an unknown band? I have to think it is *audio* of that first session. All the evidence points to it being only audio. But then again, who knew Geoff Emerick rescued such a tape from the trash for all those years? I have to think the Anthology producers including the other Beatles didn't know he had it, unless it was a well-guarded secret that stayed a secret among the true inner circle (including Neil Aspinall). Thoughts?

If there's video, it could be from the "Get Back" era, as they've played "Love Me Do" during those sessions.
15  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 06, 2020, 03:52:24 PM
Most likely, the Everlys tape was disregarded / binned / whatever, because it wasn't needed by them or their producer. Erased (incompletely, as it turned out) and tossed to the heap of other such tapes. Then somehow it got picked up. And even when the unwanted sounds got onto another tape, of a valued client, that was not a huge "crime". Worst things happen in the studios - valuable tapes get mangled, erased partially or completely, just because the machines or people sometimes malfunction.
16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 06, 2020, 03:33:36 PM
Here's a scenario -- The Everly's and the Studio Musicians record You Got the Power of Love on February 3rd.  Brian is around, likes the track, and asks for a dub so he can cut a mono to bring home.  By the time the engineer who did Power of Love gets around to giving Brian a copy, it's about a month later.  Brian brings the reel into the mixing session for the intermediate IWFTD track mix, planning to cut an acetate after he's done, and that's how it somehow accidentally gets used without getting erased.

Just as speculative as the other ways, but leaves out the byzantine process and ham-fisted engineering of some of the other hypothesis.
Such things simply weren't done. That's a violation of the very thing you value, the intellectual property. Probably a contract violation as well. Most producers/artists were against the notion that the others may get ideas from their work, so letting somebody other than producer/artist to take a copy home was the gravest violation imaginable. The asker would feel himself a fool were he to entertain the idea.

The person who'd be able to make a copy for his personal use, other than the producer/artist, would be an engineer. But I doubt this would have been the case in the first half of the sixties - no general need for this and stricter workplace discipline.
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 05, 2020, 07:17:08 AM
Again, these are pretty evidence-less assumptions.  Do we really know what it would take for old tape to get reused?  I imagine there was some amount of tape recycling done, but on the other hand, depending on the situation, studios may not have had the right to do that with everyone if the record company claimed ownership of all materials.  That's not to say they always did, nor that intellectual property rights were always honored.  The Everly's are a pretty big act, as are the Beach Boys.  Would the studio really deem a Brian Wilson project "less important" and not worthy of a new reel?

I don't know the answer to any of these questions, but we can't close the book on this without better evidence.

If the tape was erased - and it was, just not perfectly - it was marked for a "lesser use", say for a recording by an unproven act, so the act could've save a bit of the money on the tape which wasn't brand new, and the studio was efficient in saving on their expenditure. The only question is, how that binned tape ended up used not by nobodys, but the BBs.
18  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 05, 2020, 07:12:22 AM

The bleed-through is also present on the 8-track session tape for "IWFTD" - it's audible on the S.O.T. boot before the song starts, I just don't hear it in the final mix.

Like you, I wonder if the management allowed the engineers at Columbia futzing with the fuddy-daddy brand-new 8-track machine just to save somebody's mix...but most likely so in the case of a common 4-track one. Could it be the SOT bootleg represents the results before the Columbia session?
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 05, 2020, 07:05:00 AM
It could be that they caught the problem at Columbia, and an engineer did a temporary alignment change of the heads on a Columbia machine, the 4-track one, so they'd be able to rid of the unwanted sound.

Huh? The unwanted sound is there on the final mix, do I don't think they got rid of it...

Oh, I've meant, they caught the problem in time for "IWFTD". In what order were the songs recorded?
20  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 05, 2020, 07:02:31 AM
That's a lot of supposition.  Lots of questions we have to answer before a winner can be decided.  First, if that's what happened, why and how did a tape from United by a different artist get reused?  Second, IF the sound got picked up at Unite Western, this requires the fairly bold assumption that they did a mix essentially for no reason, sacrificing a whole tape generation in exchange for what?  Portability?  I'd be more willing to buy that if we knew of some 4-track reels with a bunch of the mono backing tracks.  

And then there's the whole issue of how professional engineers are letting this happen.  CBS seems very unlikely to have misaligned machines--they probably had boffins do that every day (as I'd expect U/W did, despite being more of a mom & pop kinda place.)


If the Everlys cut out their final mix off that tape, as C-man suggested, the rest of the tape most likely was binned for less important uses.

I've rethought my initial suggestion. It was not the Columbia machine but some machine that was used for erasing the United recording by the Everlys.
21  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 05, 2020, 06:56:35 AM
It could be that they caught the problem at Columbia, and an engineer did a temporary alignment change of the heads on a Columbia machine, the 4-track one, so they'd be able to rid of the unwanted sound.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 05, 2020, 06:43:32 AM
Actually, this needs to be thought up in more detail. Obviously the sounds from the erased tape were caught up by some other machine, one at Columbia or the second one used for bouncing at Western. So: the machine at United used for THE EVERLYS RECORDING was misaligned, thus remnants of the original sound remained on the tape. And if that tape received the 1-track mono mix at the second one used for bouncing at Western, I wonder if the engineer had to listen to the result of that bounce, to ensure there are no dropouts before taking it to another session at Columbia? or did they just rely on the overall quality of their machines and tapes. As an owner of a domestic reel-to-reel some decades ago, I remember well the left channel of my stereo was always a pain in the ass regarding the possibility of a drop-out, because that's where the corresponding head was, against the very edge of the tape. Probably the studio engineers, minding this, transferred a mono backing track to a track not on the edge? But, had they a listen to the result or not?

P.S. Not "the machine at United used for THE EVERLYS RECORDING was misaligned", but a machine that was used for ERASING that tape.
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mono Basic Track Mixes Used For Columbia 8-Track Overdubs on: June 05, 2020, 03:20:05 AM
Probably the heads of one of the Columbia machines were misaligned versus the others. It is possible that when they've made the mono mix of the backing track there was nothing wrong with it, as the heads of this machine and the one used for erasing were in alignment with each other. But when they transferred it later at Columbia, that machine's heads caught the remnants of sound from the incompletely erased tape. And it was too late to cancel the Columbia session because of this imperfection.
24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Why are BB albums so short? on: May 20, 2020, 04:09:07 PM
Thank you, I was aware of Jim Morrison's KHJ promo, it's just, I am not that much into the history of pop broadcasting as such.
25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Why are BB albums so short? on: May 20, 2020, 03:02:57 PM
I've read that DJs had a silent strike for Phil's record because he acted snooty toward them or something. And we have H&V radio "demo" maybe because of that. 
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