Weezers Pinkerton

[andy]

Well, I think that progress, at least what I consider progress, is possible when you have the potential to be a great writer. Rivers has written some of the most articulate melodies (sorry, that's just the way I describe things) and songs of the past twenty years, and when I hear anyone with that gift I'm always rooting for them to do something amazing. Anyways, Those gifts of Rivers' have not been used very well on the past couple of albums. I love both Maladroit and Make Believe, and I give them way more listening time these days than I do most stuff, but it just wasn't much of a step in any direction. Just kind of treading water.

[I. Spaceman]

I'm sorry for letting my feelings get hurt.  I'll try to be more macho like a Stones fan next time.

It was pretty cold and literalist to me, but I think about music in a completely different way. But that's cool. You're a historian/musical theorist.
I'm a critic.

Guitar sounds are cold and literalist?  You have to make me understand how you think.  That's why I'm discussing music on a music board, to learn how other people think.  New perspective.

Not the sound, the descriptiveness and the contextual emphasis on sounds over meaning.
Aeij, your reaction proved what I was saying before.
That Weezer and the BB's are strangely tied together for people who may be be sensitive and emotionally damaged, as well as those who are damaged and act in anger in sarcastic manners, like me and Boxer.
We're all that way, and that's what draws us to the BB's.
We just act out in different ways, take it out on each other. In coversations about BOTH bands.
Do any other bands inspire such emotions in their fans?

[Chris D.]

Do any other bands inspire such emotions in their fans?

Bel Biv Devoe?

[I. Spaceman]

Feel free to Photoshop yourself in there, stud.

[Chris D.]

Feel free to Photoshop yourself in her, stud.

Bonus.

[I. Spaceman]

THREAD KILLAZ REUNION TOUR!

[Chris D.]

THREAD KILLAZ REUNION TOUR!

You're borrowing from Dylan again, aren't you?

[I. Spaceman]

THREAD KILLAZ REUNION TOUR!

You're borrowing from Dylan again, aren't you?

If you can't beat em, join em.

 

[Mitchell]

Wow, I missed a lot tonight.

I just have to say this... I think the problem for Rivers is that everyone thinks he's being ironic when he's being sincere.

[Boxer Monkey]

Yeah, well, I just have to say this: I am *NEVER* gonna enter into discussion with any of you pusillanimous Weezer simps (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE) again. How fodaing dare you tell everybody to foda off and then come back and blame your infantile outbursts on me? Kiss my ass! And I extend said cheeks to any cheezepuff moral arbiter who interjects the occasional "yeah" into the discussion as if this serves as a valid contribution, then chastizes *me* after I've just been told to foda off! Enough of that, you buncha babies! Associating with you losers is giving me contact diaper rash.

(And no: I'm NOT fodaing kidding, either.)

[I. Spaceman]

Awww f*** it. I'll be controversial and agree.

I like you dudes, you're great people, but where THIS band is concerned, we don't see eye to eye.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

the descriptiveness and the contextual emphasis on sounds over meaning.

Sound is meaning to me.  Are you saying that an instrumental piece can't have meaning, or that in a song the lyrics and the music are so inextricably tied that you can't take them apart?  If you believe the latter, then why do you and others discuss lyrics by themselves?

Again, I'm asking you to explain to me how you think.

I'll wager I grasp things a lot more abstractly and symbolically than you have me pegged for.  For example, I see music productions.  Music is mostly visual to me.

The reason I care so much about who played what on Beach Boys sessions is not some statistical urge, it's because I'm lonely and thinking about the people that I'm hearing on the session tape puts me in that room with those people.  Having that information just makes the connection.

Ultimately I've come to my opinions about Weezer not through analysis, but through pure emotion.  I noticed that the Blue Album made me cry and laugh, and that Maladroit made me want to go do something else.  So I wonder why I feel that way.  And you know what, in the end, I really don't know.

[Billgoodman]

I went to sleep with 5 pages of Pinkerton discussion!


I was like 10 when the Blue Album came out, I think a friend taped it for me
around 94/95. I got Pinkerton very soon it came out. After that my weezer admiration topped.
That was during the hiatus, there was no Weezer activity that I know of, I didn't have internet. I was
12  and there was no tour, nothing. I wrote Karl and he wrote back, that truly was something in the pre-internet days,
I was still going to primary school. When Green came out I was thrilled, finally a new record! And I liked it some much, but I think that was because I could really listen to something new. I had all the b-sides and the Rentals records came close but no close enough (still think their first is brilliant). The interesting episode started when they were putting lot's of recordinginfo on their website (yes I finally had internet!). I must have been 16 or something. And it was written in Karl's Korner during the recording of album 3 that there wass a meeting with Geffen and they simply hated the record. I think Geffen/Interscope intervention with Weezer (a band they forgot to dump after 1997) has been crucial for the Green Album, especially 'cause Cuomo generally likes to shitcan his own work. The songs that eventually came out are good, melodies are great, but the production? Garbage, simply garbage, I like the tone, the image it puts in to your head in the quiet parts, but when the song breaks it's too massive. It's the wall of sound without interesting ideas going on. The solo's were so lame too. The structure of the songs is too transparent.

That being said, after Green, Weezer put out everything they worked on (that's how I like it!)
Remember the day that they posted the DC recordings? I was thrilled, it was so down to earth, the songs were fun.
Don't tell me that you don't like the acoustic Puerta Vajarta? What a great instrumental, it's only a demo, but you can hear that it would have been great if it was going to be fleshed out (sadly the maladroit isn't that fleshed out). Keep Fishin' sounded so fresh compared to the Green stuff. Listen Up had a vibe that they never captured after that (the maladroit demo of it is too dark, too heavy). Saturday Night, not a super song, but it had a funky riff, it was fun, when they finally did it for maladroit it was tied with a metal riff, sounded awful. Zep song/Not in Love with You, ok you can hear the metal riffing comming up, not a fan of that sort of music, I think it's a part of Rivers, but not really fitting with his voice, not with Weezer anyway. But at least the music breaths, American Gigolo, same story, they play it higher, it gives the song a happier feeling. Take Control, although I like the big sound on Maladroit, it's the Weezer sound that we all know, was better on the DC demos. A great fingerpicking line by Brian (I asume) and a nice melody played staccato( or something like that) which to me know sounds like something Franz Ferdinand or Kaiser Chiefs could do.
Burdnt Jamb, what do I have to say about that? They played it great here, but even better on Maladroit. It's a great song.

The DC Demos of 5/27/01 showed that Weezer still had it, now if you don't mind, I will do all the other Maladriot demo-sessions later. But I think the DC demos make it clear that Rivers was going for another sound, new funkier, happier, melodic things (Keep Fishin',Saturday Night, Burndt Jamb, Puerte Vajarta) and some heavy riff things (American Gigolo, Zep Song). Take Control and Listen Up could go either way,  eventually Weezer choose the heavy side of their new sound. The progression that Weezer made was a rhythmical one.
 

[Chris D.]

Yeah, well, I just have to say this: I am *NEVER* gonna enter into discussion with any of you pusillanimous Weezer simps (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE) again. How fodaing dare you tell everybody to foda off and then come back and blame your infantile outbursts on me? Kiss my ass! And I extend said cheeks to any cheezepuff moral arbiter who interjects the occasional "yeah" into the discussion as if this serves as a valid contribution, then chastizes *me* after I've just been told to foda off! Enough of that, you buncha babies! Associating with you losers is giving me contact diaper rash.

(And no: I'm NOT fodaing kidding, either.)

Yeah.

[andy]

I agree with you, Bill. I think the Maladroit-era songs are fun and loose. As much crud is given to that time period and how much of it is considered mindless indulgence, I can still hear the personal touches of each member in each song. It's weezer in that sense. It's Rivers' style of shredding, Scott's style of bass playing, and Pat's style of drumming all in the mold of someone else's style of arena rock.

[Jonas]

Everyone just needs to relax and get it through to them that Weezer sucks now. Yes, they were awesome...but they suck now.

now lets throw on 'My Name is Jonas' and get psyched!

p.s. anyone ever been to a website named 'Jonas' Weezer Page'?

yeaaaaaaaaaaaaa 

[Billgoodman]

it doesn't exist anymore
what was on it?

[Jonas]

That was the site I put up when I was like 12 or 13 years old...I learned HTML just to put that sucker up.

[Billgoodman]

Funny,

come to think of it
I also made a weezer site in Word. Haha! I didn't know how to make a site.

[Kirk Lowdermilk]

I made a Weezer newsletter with two Arby's Big Montana wrappers. I used a mixture of my tears and horsey sauce for ink.

[Chris D.]

I made a Weezer newsletter with two Arby's Big Montana wrappers. I used a mixture of my tears and horsey sauce for ink.

That's one of my favorite posts on this site.

Do any of you think the tensions in the Weezer fan base would evaporate if Rivers was solo?  So many solo artists from popular groups are, generally, torn apart by critics and/or fans once they leave the group: Paul McCartney, Lou Reed, Frank Black.  I think if Rivers had gone solo instead of dragging Weezer out, people would just rip his solo stuff and not fight over Weezer so much.

[andy]

Yeah, that might be right. Look at BW though.  It's the reverse for him almost. People rip all over the existing BB but overly praise BW.

[andy]

But, since Rivers is pretty much weezer, and the other members haven't really interfered with letting him BE weezer, that situation might not happen. It could depend on the quality of the music. Maybe people expected Macca and the others you listed to be better when they were a part of a group. I don't think people have that with Rivers. So many factors, Chris.

[Chris D.]

Yeah, that might be right. Look at BW though.  It's the reverse for him almost. People rip all over the existing BB but overly praise BW.

People totally flame certain Brian albums though.  Because of Brian's personal issues he's sort of in a different class.  It's trendy to like someone like that.

But, since Rivers is pretty much weezer, and the other members haven't really interfered with letting him BE weezer, that situation might not happen.

That's why I think it hasn't happened.  I mean if Rivers had broken up the band after Pinkerton instead of going on a long break.

It could depend on the quality of the music. Maybe people expected Macca and the others you listed to be better when they were a part of a group.

It usually doesn't depend on the music, though, which is what I was trying to get at.  I'm not saying you can't dislike a person's solo work while liking their group work, but I think often fans do that because it's acceptable and easy.  People expect them not to be better in the group, so much, but to replicate the group's work, which is stupid.  Despite the fact that Rivers "is" Weezer I think it could have happened to him just as it happened to Frank Black, who was the Pixies, for the most part.  It could probably happen to anyone assuming their are no overarching factors influencing their popularity -- like Brian with mental illness or the "idiot savant" public image he gets from a lot of people.

[mike thornton]

this is phuckin hilarious. weezer is just okay. eminem is waaaay more talented. which isn't saying much. the day the music died lately was when kurt played the ultimate chickenshyat. selfishasshole. gee, come to think of it, that does in a lot of great collaborative art. the bb's/bw attractive to whiner types? wounded types? follower in the mom's basement types? that's pretty pathetic. no, kidz brian is a phucking genius. this dismembered psyche crap that seems to follow brian around is really sad. geesus, all you musician types. get off the computer and find your own voice. don't sit around worshipping someone. the *only* reason i come here is for the times that the principals post. thank you stephen!!! i think i'll go have a drink with mike vosse. lata.