What's "circulating" ?

[Cal]

Can anyone give me a run-down of what's "circulating" of late?

Does anyone compile newsreel reports of the Beach Boys coming and going to and from concerts, and events in the early to mid-60's? Are there available newsreel footage of the Beach Boys performing live? Are there circulating live tv shows from the 60's, say from the '64 Austrailian tour?

I know as a Beatles collector too, all this (for thiem) is quite readily avaialble for collectors, but for the Beach Boys either it's not been collected or no one offers it up for collectors to compile.

Thanking in advance!

Regards,
Cal aka "Beatle Bob'

[The Heartical Don]

Hmmm... touchy subject, Cal. All of us respect your curiosity deeply. But, see, since 'circulating' stuff is immoral, we do our utmost best to avoid it like the plague. We never purchase or borrow it, or download it. Yet, by some grace of the Divinity, we succeed sometimes in, um, 'channeling' it, as it were. So we know some content without ever having been within 10,000 miles near it.

I hope I could make our (or at least, my) position clear...

[The Shift]

I hope I could make our (or at least, my) position clear...

I'd much rather that any bounder with underhand knowledge of nefarious circulating material makes my Position Yes yes yes, I don't know how to follow the rules!uddy.

(did you see what I did there? P.... M ... -  it's a code!    Really! Yes it is!

[The Heartical Don]

I hope I could make our (or at least, my) position clear...

I'd much rather that any bounders with underhand knowledge of nefarious circulating material makes my Position Yes yes yes, I don't know how to follow the rules!uddy.

(did you see what I did there? P.... M ... -  it's a code!    Really! Yes it is!

I deeply admire your sincerity and moral standing. And I just pissed myself.

[Cal]

Hmmm... touchy subject, Cal. All of us respect your curiosity deeply. But, see, since 'circulating' stuff is immoral, we do our utmost best to avoid it like the plague. We never purchase or borrow it, or download it. Yet, by some grace of the Divinity, we succeed sometimes in, um, 'channeling' it, as it were. So we know some content without ever having been within 10,000 miles near it.

I hope I could make our (or at least, my) position clear...

*LOL* -- But it shouldn't be a "touchy subject" as this board was created to talk about an often bootlegged and unrleased album, SMILE.

Talking about "what's out there" is different from saying "Can anyone tell me where to find/purchase it?" That is obviously left for PM's. But it seems the last few years since the GET THE BOOT releases and the last SOT set, folks are tight lipped about what's out there? I'm sure there's plenty "circulating" aand that would be good to know. It's my job then (obviously) to find out "how to" without putting the board in jeapordy. Something I understand. But is the "Beach Boys Police" to be that feared?

Some might know me as "Beatle Bob" on the Bootlegzone and 910 board (and on the For Elvis CD Collectors board) where this stuff is very open and things circulate very freely. It's refreshing.  Many new finds are uploaded for other collectors often. Compilations by Purple Chick were found via these avenues (PM's). Recent broadcast material like the recent George Martin Producers show and the BBC broadcast with upgrades is now available for everyone.....so why's it so different with my other favorite group the last few years? ...*SIGH*

Regards,
Cal aka "Beatle Bob"

[The Shift]

I think the reason for the sensitivity is simply that plenty of folk within the official world of the official organisations post here -  I'm thinking Alan and Mark primarily -  and share a lot of knowledge and expertise that are fantastic, invaluable, and wouldn't otherwise be public knowledge.

The silence compared to the other boards you mention is probably because it's their own hard work that the bootleggers have in the past stolen and taken advantage of.

I wish the bootleggers wouldn't be so lazy, actually - there's probably loads of stuff out there that they could track down without crossing too many official toes and ripping off our friends here... I'm thinking dusty radio station/TV station archives, for live sessions, interviews, etc. Yes, putting that stuff out would still be theft but it's also stuff which, if it was left to suits, might never otherwise be found.  As thorough as Mark and Alan and the colleagues strive to be, it'd be impossible for them to comb every archive in the world for this stuff and it's unlikely that it would otherwise be found by chance.

By way of... a few years ago I worked for a big UK newspaper and just out of interest one day called in the in-house picture library for all the shots they had of the Beach Boys. Imagine my surprise when a huge packet turned up containing a number of B&W shots of the BBs on stage in the UK, probably in the 80s, including several portraits of Brian looking like man who knew he looked insane and was milking it and having fun, by scaring the photographer. 

They might have been syndicated agency shots, in which case copies probably survive in many libraries; but equally, they might have been taken by an in-house snapper. I regret not getting copies because, as libraries get digitised and old prints are thrown out so execs can have more space to put their feet up on desks, prints are being destroyed like there was no tomorrow.

[Alex]

Hmmm... touchy subject, Cal. All of us respect your curiosity deeply. But, see, since 'circulating' stuff is immoral, we do our utmost best to avoid it like the plague. We never purchase or borrow it, or download it. Yet, by some grace of the Divinity, we succeed sometimes in, um, 'channeling' it, as it were. So we know some content without ever having been within 10,000 miles near it.

I hope I could make our (or at least, my) position clear...

*LOL* -- But it shouldn't be a "touchy subject" as this board was created to talk about an often bootlegged and unrleased album, SMILE.

Talking about "what's out there" is different from saying "Can anyone tell me where to find/purchase it?" That is obviously left for PM's. But it seems the last few years since the GET THE BOOT releases and the last SOT set, folks are tight lipped about what's out there? I'm sure there's plenty "circulating" aand that would be good to know. It's my job then (obviously) to find out "how to" without putting the board in jeapordy. Something I understand. But is the "Beach Boys Police" to be that feared?

Some might know me as "Beatle Bob" on the Bootlegzone and 910 board (and on the For Elvis CD Collectors board) where this stuff is very open and things circulate very freely. It's refreshing.  Many new finds are uploaded for other collectors often. Compilations by Purple Chick were found via these avenues (PM's). Recent broadcast material like the recent George Martin Producers show and the BBC broadcast with upgrades is now available for everyone.....so why's it so different with my other favorite group the last few years? ...*SIGH*

Regards,
Cal aka "Beatle Bob"

I have no idea about what newsreels are making the rounds these days...but a couple of years ago some new SOT stuff came out... which I do not posess and never have posessed ..."SMiLE Sessions Source Tape", it has alternate takes and sessions for H&V, Fire, Da Da, etc...."In The Beginning: The Garage Tapes", has recordings Brian made on his Wollensak recorder as a teenager, rehearsals of Surfin' and other early tracks, demos of songs Brian wrote with Gary Usher, Bob Norberg, etc.

As far as the BB are concerned, people like Alan Boyd and Mark Linett are sometime posters here...Boyd got pissed a while back when a board member made a pro-bootleg statement...Boyd left the board and didn't come back for quite a while...plus, it seems like every other video on youtube with BB content in it is removed at the behest of BRI. A coupe years ago I'd heard that Bruce Johnston threatened to sue a guy who had posted a couple hundered BB videos on Youtube (I don't know exactly how true that story is.).  And I keep reading around here about "actual BB police" who read all the messageboards and look for illicit content and have it deleted/taken down.  Let's face it, the BBs aren't exactly the Grateful Dead!!

[Cal]

[ Let's face it, the BBs aren't exactly the Grateful Dead!!

Best line written. It sums it up nicely....*sigh*. But you know... if it weren't for bootlegs, no one would be keeping their "flame" alive much anymore. Look at what ULTRA RARE TRAX, UNSURPASSED MASTERS and the Great Dane mega box set, LIVE ON THE BBC did for the Beatles collectors. It  forced Apple's hand to release unreleased gems from the vault. Dr. Ebbetts  Beatles releases had the same effect on the most recent Beatles In Mono box set. KEEP THE FLAME ALIVE

Regards,
Cal aka "Beatle Bob"

[Thunderfingers75]

Cal, check your PM.

[Cal]

Cal, check your PM.

Will do. Thanks!

Regards,
Cal aka "Beatle Bob"

[sleeptalk]

he's merely asking what's out there, not for you to post links or to express that you own a copy. just preamble with some BS ("my friend played the following for me, so i know these are out there," etc) and then get down to it. this board's inability to even talk about bootlegs is probably its biggest (and most pointless) hangup.

[Jason]

You think it's bad here? Go on the BLUEBOARD! Jesus Christ, I was on there years ago talking about Sweet Insanity with a couple folks only to have Bluebird (aka the Blueboard police) come on and say "excuse me gentlemen but Brian does not like discussion of bootlegs on his website." Fucking asshole.

Joking aside, trying to "avoid" the bootleg discussion is like trying to "avoid" the elephant in the living room. It's there and it's going to be noticed. Oh well. The logical response to the bootleg situation should be "well, it's out there anyway so..." but it's not that easy. People have caught themselves in deep trouble over bootlegs. The Get the Boot/Secret Smile thing back in 2004 didn't end too pretty for the parties involved, but by then the damage was done. Even the people taping concerts have had the ball clamp put on them.

This leads to one logical conclusion - when you're a hardy fan, like the majority of us all here, the official releases hold you for a while and then, amazingly, you want MORE! Familiar? This has happened to everyone. And everyone finds their way to the bootleg arena, whether it's the curious fans who loved the half-hour of Smile on the Good Vibrations box set and downloaded the Vigotone 2 CD set to hear even more of the stuff, or the rabid fans of the In Concert album who downloaded a random Blondie/Ricky-era concert to hear an unedited setlist and possibly even more rare songs done live.

In closing, the bootleg debate is simply this - if not for bootlegs, no-one outside of the Beach Boys' organization would have given a damn about Smile. It would have been a footnote. PERIOD. Think about it. I mean really think about it.

[c-man]

In closing, the bootleg debate is simply this - if not for bootlegs, no-one outside of the Beach Boys' organization would have given a damn about Smile. It would have been a footnote. PERIOD. Think about it. I mean really think about it.

Hmmm...I would disagree with that last part, in that well-read fans of the BBs (and of pop/rock music in general) had been hearing about the SMiLE myth years before any of the boots showed up on the scene.  I, for one, was salivating for a SMiLE release as early as '77/'78.  It had been written about in Crawdaddy, Rolling Stone, NME, and other places for years, not to mention the various BBs biographies that showed up starting in the late '70s.  I think even without the boots, the fans would've still turned out for BWPS, both in concert and on record.  I will admit, though, that the boots helped "spread the word" outside the BBs/BW fan "circle", and helped bring in a lot of fans of "alternative" music.

[rogerlancelot]

People have caught themselves in deep trouble over bootlegs. The Get the Boot/Secret Smile thing back in 2004 didn't end too pretty for the parties involved, but by then the damage was done.

Is there more this story? I think the second title you mentioned is purely MP3 sourced but either way I'd love to know more about these titles and the consequences to those involved in sharing them.

Edit: If anyone feels uncomfortable about sharing this info on a public forum, please PM me.

[SG7]

Similar to TRBB, I was temporarily blocked when I even asked He Gives Speeches at one point.


I've realized over the years it's worth not having everything, but I do have things I listen to and still am in awe I got to hear them period.  

[the captain]

You think it's bad here? Go on the BLUEBOARD! Jesus Christ, I was on there years ago talking about Sweet Insanity with a couple folks only to have Bluebird (aka the Blueboard police) come on and say "excuse me gentlemen but Brian does not like discussion of bootlegs on his website." friggin' butthole.

Joking aside, trying to "avoid" the bootleg discussion is like trying to "avoid" the elephant in the living room. It's there and it's going to be noticed. Oh well. The logical response to the bootleg situation should be "well, it's out there anyway so..." but it's not that easy. People have caught themselves in deep trouble over bootlegs. The Get the Boot/Secret Smile thing back in 2004 didn't end too pretty for the parties involved, but by then the damage was done. Even the people taping concerts have had the ball clamp put on them.

This leads to one logical conclusion - when you're a hardy fan, like the majority of us all here, the official releases hold you for a while and then, amazingly, you want MORE! Familiar? This has happened to everyone. And everyone finds their way to the bootleg arena, whether it's the curious fans who loved the half-hour of Smile on the Good Vibrations box set and downloaded the Vigotone 2 CD set to hear even more of the stuff, or the rabid fans of the In Concert album who downloaded a random Blondie/Ricky-era concert to hear an unedited setlist and possibly even more rare songs done live.

In closing, the bootleg debate is simply this - if not for bootlegs, no-one outside of the Beach Boys' organization would have given a damn about Smile. It would have been a footnote. PERIOD. Think about it. I mean really think about it.

The only thing I want to add--or inquire about, really, and I'm sure I'm not the only one--is where can a guy get one of these ball clamps of which you speak?

[Jason]

The only thing I want to add--or inquire about, really, and I'm sure I'm not the only one--is where can a guy get one of these ball clamps of which you speak?

Most men marry them eventually.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

In any case, I'm the sort of Beach Boys fan whose favorite stuff generally is the unreleased stuff, so yeah...

[Mr. Wilson]

Anybody remember Deep Treasures 1+2..Those 2 cd"s supposedly were up for consideration for release..Until they were booted..Hawthorne came out instead...I collect the gray area stuff but i"d be upset also so im in middle. I do believe all...LIVE stuff is fair game and BRI should leave it alone..Studio stuff is much more delicate matter..Also didnt Mark in late 80"s compile all releasable Smile stuff + that got stolen + booted..And of course theres the Pizza tapes Jerry Garcia..Pizza deliveryman STOLE the tapes while dropping of some pizza at David Grissmans house..So yea..it can be a pain in the A** to protect your rights as a musician..

[Bedroom Tapes]

Just gotta say...Google Blog search.   

[donald]

PM.         PM.            Not AM,........... but PM.    Make friends.    Get Emails......share emails.......get snail mail addresses and share things with your friends.   Send things by US mail if you must.

[punkinhead]

Besides recent live stuff being booted, I feel like the newest stuff with the rarest of rare is the Get the Boots Volumes and the Garage Tapes and a couple others along with them that I cant remember right now

[Jay]

I remember that when Get The Boot came out, quite a few people were irritated. I'm also curios to know the whole story.

[The Shift]

I remember that when Get The Boot came out, quite a few people were irritated. I'm also curios to know the whole story.

Yeah, I used to love it when this stuff came out. Now I'm more worried that it scotches the official release of the same stuff.

That said, I hope that when some stuff does come out officially, there isn't a repeat of the Knebworth release mess.

After we'd paid for the CD and DVD, we were then assaulted with very cheap re-releases of the CD, and a multitude of CDs given away free with weekend newspapers which repeated the Knebworth tracks again and again. It's like "Thanks for the cash, fans; thanks for being such mugs -  we never valued the music anyway so we're giving it away now."

It just cheapens and demeans the whole process.

I hope to God this doesn't happen with the 1972 Carnegie Hall material when that comes out officially.