Where does "Carl and the Passions - 'So Tough' " rank?

[Rocker]

The funny thing about CaTP-ST is that it still stands as a solid album, there’s nothing phoney about it. Mind you, it’s 27 years old and I don’t think it has aged a second.

Truer words have never been spoken. I never thought about that, but you're right on. Thanks for mentioning that.

And just for the fun, "You need a mess..." from the "Ol' grey whistle test", partly live
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMmX30uyWX4&feature=related

[the captain]

I disagree about "hasn't aged," but I will say I think it has aged considerably better than Holland.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Yeah, Holland has aged "worse" but it's still my all-time fave!

I think C&TP just sounds fresh because it really doesn't sound like The Beach Boys but more like the debut album of some weird band that fizzled quickly after. It sounds a lot like what a Dennis/Carl album might've been like. Blondie and Ricky might very well have played on such an album, Brian might've very well gifted or co-wrote a couple tracks.... Dennis might've very well brought in the same two songs, maybe a couple more (Carry Me Home?)

Sprinkle in a bit of Mike and Al though, and you've got what must be called a Beach Boys album, even if begrudgingly.

[the captain]

As any have said before, C&TP is more four singles with B-sides than anything else. And don't get me wrong, I prefer Holland. By far. It just sounds more dated.

[Awesoman]

The album kind of seems unfinished; only being like 8 tracks.  They certainly could have put out at least 3-4 more.  There are some strong songs on here such as "Marcella", "YNAMOHTSA" and "All This Is That".  I dig the Blondie/Ricky tunes as well (I know I'm in the minority here).  I could do without the two lumbering Dennis songs. 

[phirnis]

The album's shortness is among the things I really like about So Tough. The Beach Boys were just so very good at making these beautiful sufficient records that clocked in at 30 minutes or even less, just very focused and unpretentious. In addition, however, they should have made another two of these short ones in the early seventies. I'm pretty sure that no one would be complaining.

[phirnis]

By the way, in He Come Down who's singing "Men see, cries before the road..." and "Tell me life is over..."? Alan, Carl?

[mikeyj]

By the way, in He Come Down who's singing "Men see, cries before the road..." and "Tell me life is over..."? Alan, Carl?

I'd have to give it a good listen, but isn't it Blondie?

[mtaber]

I remember in the days just prior to the album hitting the stores that I was listening to an FM radio station, hoping they'd play some tracks from CATP.  Info back then was obviously not as readily available as nowadays, and i didn't know Blondie and Ricky had joined the group.  It was (and still is) common practice for the DJ to play a set of 5 or 6 tracks by various artists, and then come on to identify the songs and artists after the set was over.  So, I'm listening all day, and I hear nothing like a Beach Boys track.  Then, at the conclusion of a set of songs, the DJ comes on and says "that set included tracks by (insert any 4 or 5 early 70's artists) and the Beach Boys"! 

I am freaking out, I have been listening closely and there was NO BEACH BOYS SONG IN THAT SET!!!  I keep listening, then maybe 4 hours later, the same thing happens.  Now I think I'm going crazy.  What is this DJ smoking?  This drove me mad.

A few days later, when the album hit the stores, I finally figured out that the song they played on the radio was "Here She Comes"...

[The Heartical Don]

By the way, in He Come Down who's singing "Men see, cries before the road..." and "Tell me life is over..."? Alan, Carl?

I'd have to give it a good listen, but isn't it Blondie?

I agree. See what our Resident Dean on all things Historical has to say about it...

[The Heartical Don]

Oh, I forgot the main question. I have my problems with both CATP and Holland, although I like them a lot. Both, esp. Holland, have autumnal qualities that I like. Holland now and then reminds me of The Band. Perhaps I miss a bit of 'light', a bit of 'cheer', don't know. Both would not make my BBs top-10. That said, both albums have beautiful moments. 'All This Is That', 'Marcella', 'Steamboat', 'California Saga (Big Sur)', 'Sail On Sailor'... I'd say they'd get a ranking just above the middle (I avoid 'average', because compared to other artists the word 'average' is not in my BBs dictionary).

[Andrew G. Doe]

By the way, in He Come Down who's singing "Men see, cries before the road..." and "Tell me life is over..."? Alan, Carl?

Once I figured out where these came in the song (hint: it's not what I'm hearing  ), yes, pretty sure that's Mr. C.

BTW, Brian was quite heavily involved in this track.

[smile-holland]

By the way, in He Come Down who's singing "Men see, cries before the road..." and "Tell me life is over..."? Alan, Carl?

Once I figured out where these came in the song (hint: it's not what I'm hearing  ), yes, pretty sure that's Mr. C.

BTW, Brian was quite heavily involved in this track.

If you search for lyrics of this song on the www, you'll find a standard set of lyrics that are all the same. And apparently the translation is not 100% correct. Including the lines that were quoted here.

As for Mr. C (following phirnis' question if it's Alan or Carl).
Mr. Carl or Mr. Chaplin? I Always thought it was the latter....


EDIT: reading mikey's and Heartical's reply, you probably meant Chaplin.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Sorry, me being obtuse - Blondie.

[phirnis]

I got that set of lyrics from the Cabinessence website. Couldn't make them out myself.

Relistening to the whole record as I type, I have to say it sounds much better than I thought it would. I can definitely picture Brian being heavily involved in "He Come Down", which is not that different from what the group would later attempt with "That Same Song".

[Rocker]

So was HCD written by Brian, Mike and Al or Carl, etc? Always wondered about that.
And I think that HCD is a great production and cool song, no matter who did it. I remember being blown away by it when I first heard it. The singing and arrangement are superb.

[phirnis]

It's credited to Jardine/B. Wilson/Love.

Love that shrill organ sound at 2:45. Anyone know if Brian had a hand in the vocal arrangement?

[Rocker]

It's credited to Jardine/B. Wilson/Love.

Thanks ! My booklet just says Wilson/Jardine/Love, that's why I wondered

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

By the way, in He Come Down who's singing "Men see, cries before the road..." and "Tell me life is over..."? Alan, Carl?

Once I figured out where these came in the song (hint: it's not what I'm hearing  ), yes, pretty sure that's Mr. C.

BTW, Brian was quite heavily involved in this track.

Ha! I *knew* Brian was...people used to say I was crazy when I said that years ago. I mean, never mind the fact you can hear his (admittedly buried) vocals.

Sweet vindication!

[Aegir]

I never thought otherwise. That track is so Brian.

[B-Rex]

Just catching up after an extended vacation.  From 1970 on:

!. Surf's Up
2. Holland
3. Sunflower
4. So Tough
5. 15 Big Ones
6. Still Cruisin'
7. Beach Boys '85
8. M.I.U.
9. Keeping the Summer Alive
10. L.A.
11. Love You

I've tried time and again to see what is at all appealing about Love You.  I keep coming up with "The Night Was So Young", "Let Us Go on This Way", "Ding Dang" and the rest is pure drivel.  So Tough was their last solid album.  I've never heard Summer in Paradise, but I'm not about to shell out $30 to give it a listen based on virtually everyone's opinion.

[GLarson432]

The first, last, and only time I found any redeeming value in "Love You" was on Sean Macreavys 15 minute medley on his cd "Dumb Angel".  I went from hating it to loving it.

But only Sean's version.  I can appreciate a lot of stuff that is said about the arrangements and melodies (Love You; 1977) but I still can't enjoy listening to the album.

[Alex]

The first, last, and only time I found any redeeming value in "Love You" was on Sean Macreavys 15 minute medley on his cd "Dumb Angel".  I went from hating it to loving it.

But only Sean's version.  I can appreciate a lot of stuff that is said about the arrangements and melodies (Love You; 1977) but I still can't enjoy listening to the album.

WHAAATTT?? You can't not love Love You!! I get riled up every single time I hear "To get you babe I went through the ringer..."