Is anyone else fed up....

[Andrew G. Doe]

I put a few things on there that management and blue meanies alike clearly took exception to...

Otherwise known as a balanced view of proceedings. I was at The Roundhouse, and even allowing for a dodgy sound mix, it wasn't "Brian & the band at their best", as one hard-core Blooie put it. It was OK, acceptable, enjoyable, and not even in the same universe as the shows in 2002, 2004 and 2007. Brian only really engaged during the newer songs - although, I grant his rendition of "GOK" was excellent - while dialling it in (at best) for others. It's an open secret that Brian doesn't like doing GH shows, yet his management persist. It used to be that a BW show was a rare and precious thing. Not any more - check Brian's touring history since he started in 1999.

1999 - 24 shows [4 overseas]
2000 - 38 shows [mostly Pet Sounds]
2001 - 26 shows [24 opening for Paul Simon]
2002 - 40 shows [30 overseas, mostly Pet Sounds]
2003 -   3 shows
2004 - 72 shows [46 overseas, mostly BWPS]
2005 - 45 shows [25 overseas, mostly GH]
2006 - 11 shows [2 overseas]
2007 - 26 shows [29 overseas, GH and TLOS]
2008 - 36 shows [7 overseas]
2009 - 38 shows [13 overseas]

To save your fingers, that's over 370 gigs in 11 years, or roughly 33 a year: nothing compared with Mike & Bruce but hell, The Stones don't play that many gigs in five years... and this is Brian Wilson we're talking about, the very definition of a non-sustainable resource. The original gameplan back in spring 1999 was do three, four dates, rest up then do three four more, and so on. An excellent idea that was history by fall the same year.

[c-man]

Which begs the question, WHY does his management continue to send him out on these greatest-hits tours?  The only sensible reasons for an artist to tour are (a) to earn money, or (b) to promote product.  Since Brian's greatest-hits tours (b) lose money, and (b) serve to promote nothing, what's the point?  Not that I mind hugely, but I'm just curious....supposedly, it's to give Brian something to do.  Keep him occupied & therefore healthy.  Yet it seems he was very occupied & very healthy (or at least happy) two summers ago when he worked up TLOS with Scotty.

[Sam_BFC]

I'm not one of these Blueboard types, but I thought the Roundhouse was really good - perhaps especially considering it was a hits show, (and compared to my first show it Brighton 2005 which was not so great in hindsight).  Parts of the show were for me the best that I have seen him sing live e.g Southern California.

That said however, it wasn't up there with the LOS shows at the RFH where he was truly on fire running across the stage etc.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Interesting - I was at Brighton in '05, and thought he was OK without excelling. At Birmingham a day or so later, he was excellent. Go figure.

And agreed, the new material brings out the best in Brian, an observation that gained me a nod from someone a lot closer to the whole thing.

[The Shift]

Great to have AGD's take on this cos it pretty much mirrors my own, and I (nearly) always respect and agree with what he has to say.

The "new" material tours  -  maybe that should be the "creative and interesting music" tours given that PS and BWPS include the odd 40-year-old ditty -  are the ones that BW seems to take the most interest in. He also usually sees a lot happier when missus comes along.

To add to Andrew's list of gigs, didn't Brian announce he was retiring prior to the 2005 GH tour, or then-a-bouts?

Can his management not even get "retirement" right?

Bri -  congrats on geeting blocked from the Bloo... there's a lot better sense talked here.



Oh -  but I forgot, am I the only one who's fed up with the fed-up folks who've derailed this fed-up thread?

[Dr. Tim]

Possibly a further derailment  - but not really, based on the above.

One thing that made Brian's shows something to see from 2004 through the TLOS tour was that he presented brand-new works in their entirety, something he clearly enjoyed doing.  While he was not the first to do "the whole album" in concert, or to do "the whole new album" in concert, he certainly help made it fashionable.  And now lots of other acts are doing the same - see Bob Lefsetz's take:

http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2009/09/09/album-festival/trackback/

So the Decemberists do their new album on their tour, and of course classic acts like Van Morrison and Steely Dan are doing entire LPs start to finish as one set.  I think this is something Brian can claim some credit for.

Which, as noted by Wee Helper and AGD, again begs the question: why keep doing GH hits tours if they don't make money, don't sell product, and bore him to tears?

[punkinhead]

Is the US tour this fall still the greatest hits?

[The Shift]

One thing that made Brian's shows something to see from 2004 through the TLOS tour was that he presented brand-new works in their entirety...

Point of order: he's only really done that once. And I'm sure AGD would challenge even that!

[Andrew G. Doe]

One thing that made Brian's shows something to see from 2004 through the TLOS tour was that he presented brand-new works in their entirety...

Point of order: he's only really done that once. And I'm sure AGD would challenge even that!

True - I doubt even the staunchest Blooie would claim BWPS was "brand new" (and if you're being really picky, neither was TLOS... but I'll let that pass. Just this once.  )

[Andrew G. Doe]

Is the US tour this fall still the greatest hits?

Yup. Always was announced as such.

[Dr. Tim]

What I thought you'd all call me on - correctly - would be his prior "Pet Sounds start to finish" tour - though that proves my point about the doing- entire-albums-thing-as-fashion-statement, which was the main point.

I agree that 90% of the pieces used in BWPS are old, and not brand new works in the strict sense.  I concede not all of TLOS is new, either, but the completed "suites" in both instances, if you will, were "new" concert works, which became new albums, eventually issued as such.  To that degree I stand by my prior statement.

[Pretty Funky]

As much as I would hate to sound critical about Brians band, as I think they are great, are the GH's tours just a job creation scheme for them?

Brian doesn't need the tours or should IMO so is he being used to keep them in a job? If so it is a shame. For a band once described as 'the best in the business' by Paul McCartney to be unable to make a living without Brians name is a indication how tough the job can be I guess.

I wonder how good a group album minus Brian, other than as a guest co-writer for a few tracks, could be?
 

[The Shift]

I don't think it is job creation for the band, as some members have had to turn the gigs down in recent months -  from what I've gathered on this board the call goes out to the band and they're expected to drop everything and assemble, which just doesn't work. They're all talented artists in their own right and, while some might be more successful than others, I pretty sure none of them would starve if it wasn't for Brian.

I think the tours are still thought to be therapy for the big man himself - there doesn't seem to be any financial incentive, other than probably sparking a few back-catalogue sales , and I'd hazard a guess that some of the band guys hit the road out of love and respect for him.

The band without Brian? Crazy Horse without Neil Young? Or The Who without Townshend? Love without Arthur Lee?

Would you buy a Brian album without Brian? Hmmm...

[Pretty Funky]

If I am honest, I havn't bought the last album WITH Brian!

Seems to me with this group, and it has a lot of members, they must have some song writing ability amongst them surely.

I've heard bits of Taylors solo album and while it had some Brian Wilson content, nobody would call it his work in any way. Just a helping hand and a bit of encouragement. Maybe he could do something similar for the whole group.

Of course as they were titled with the Wondermints tag for years, the Brain Wilson Band would be a harder name to shake.

[Aegir]

Crazy Horse without Neil Young?

Crazy Horse has released quite a number of albums that have minimal Neil Young involvement.

[Dancing Bear]

While I'm sure it's a job he loves, I don't think Darian (for example) would have frozen the Wondermints years ago if they were a financially viable way of life. He does what he gotta do to make a living, touring with Brian Wilson and Heart.

[The Shift]

While I'm sure it's a job he loves, I don't think Darian (for example) would have frozen the Wondermints years ago if they were a financially viable way of life. He does what he gotta do to make a living, touring with Brian Wilson and Heart.

Interesting... I suspect Darian'll check this board occasionally. Can anyone prompt him to perhaps enlighten us on this matter?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Oh, this board, like all others, is monitored. But not, I strongly suspect, by Mr. S. 

[The Shift]

Oh, this board, like all others, is monitored. But not, I strongly suspect, by Mr. S. 

I thought he might pop by recreationally, rather than monitorially, being one of the original die-hard fan boy, like us!

[Dr. Tim]

OK, I'm confused now.

The tours are therapeutic for Brian, so that's why people drop what they're doing and sign on?  So he likes doing them because they help him feel better/useful/whatever?  Or else he wouldn't show up?

But then again, he's bored doing GH?  So then it's not therapeutic anymore?  I know he's somewhat passive in these things sometimes but he can't say "I'm fuckin bored, I AM the artiste, change it up?" 

Yeah, yeah, I know...   

I've never posted on the Bloo.  The whole structure gives me a headache.  And I'm not that big a fanboy of ANYBODY. 

[hypehat]

OK, I'm confused now.

The tours are therapeutic for Brian, so that's why people drop what they're doing and sign on?  So he likes doing them because they help him feel better/useful/whatever?  Or else he wouldn't show up?

But then again, he's bored doing GH?  So then it's not therapeutic anymore?  I know he's somewhat passive in these things sometimes but he can't say "I'm fuckin bored, I AM the artiste, change it up?" 

Yeah, yeah, I know...   

I've never posted on the Bloo.  The whole structure gives me a headache.  And I'm not that big a fanboy of ANYBODY. 

I think the two can be separated. I'm not sure whether touring is therapeutic, but the entire experience is considered to be so by Brian's 'people', not just the setlist. of course, the setlist seems to be very significant to whether Brian actually likes and gets a lot out of the experience, which you thought would have been considered.