Mike Love's songwriting

[matt 1234]

yeah, he was there. thats all, he was bringing them down until the whole smile thing.  in fact hes probably the perfect guy for all the commercial stuff, if you look at the two sides of beach boys music.

[I. Spaceman]

HAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jason]

You mean the Beach Boys had a period when they were uncommercial?

[Surfer Joe]

And I think the band changed with Mike Love. When he was clean cut and shirt-tucked, the band had that feeling as well. His beard sprung up right around the point where the band was becoming more mature. He went to transcendental meditation camp in India and came back with a long beard and a robe, and the Beach Boys became effed-up hippies. When he started becoming more conservative again in his older age, the band returned to "feel good, fun-in-the-sun" music.

A very interesting point.

I don't even agree with the Ringo/Mike point... because in my opinion, they both were very talented. 

Agree completely. 

[b.dfzo]

I don't even agree with the Ringo/Mike point... because in my opinion, they both were very talented. 

Agree completely. 

I'll say it again, to run this point into the ground: I think they are both talented...talent wasn't exactly the focus of the Ringo/Mike comparison.  Think of it like this, and this was not written by me, but I happened to find it on Google about 1 second ago:

"If George Harrison was one of the luckiest individuals on Earth to find himself sandwiched between the likes of John Lennon and Paul McCartney, then Ringo damn well won the lottery. Ringo's simple, yet distinctive style of drumming may have rounded out the Beatles' sound nicely but, let's face it, he was somewhat disposable."

I don't agree that he is disposable, but this guy is being honest.  Who would you say compares to Ringo in The Beach Boys, in terms of disposability?  Just sending this up the flagpole to see who wants to burn it.

[Surfer Joe]

Have your band try to cover "Ticket To Ride" and then tell me Ringo was disposable.  "Strawberry Fields"..."Rain"...as McCartney has often said, there was no dead wood in that band. 

People who think he needed to be Ginger Baker or Gene Krupa or Keith Moon or whoever, and George needed to be Clapton or Hendrix or Django Reinhart or whoever, just don't get the Beatles.  Any of those guys would have been poor substitutes for Ringo or George, who brought exactly what was needed (before the Supergroup mentality took over).

[jazzfascist]

I don't even agree with the Ringo/Mike point... because in my opinion, they both were very talented. 

Agree completely. 

I'll say it again, to run this point into the ground: I think they are both talented...talent wasn't exactly the focus of the Ringo/Mike comparison.  Think of it like this, and this was not written by me, but I happened to find it on Google about 1 second ago:

"If George Harrison was one of the luckiest individuals on Earth to find himself sandwiched between the likes of John Lennon and Paul McCartney, then Ringo damn well won the lottery. Ringo's simple, yet distinctive style of drumming may have rounded out the Beatles' sound nicely but, let's face it, he was somewhat disposable."

I don't agree that he is disposable, but this guy is being honest.  Who would you say compares to Ringo in The Beach Boys, in terms of disposability?  Just sending this up the flagpole to see who wants to burn it.

Well in terms of musicianship I would say all of them, Brian used studio musicians on a lot of the recordings and I don't think anybody could tell the difference.

Søren

[b.dfzo]

Have your band try to cover "Ticket To Ride" and then tell me Ringo was disposable.  "Strawberry Fields"..."Rain"...as McCartney has often said, there was no dead wood in that band. 

People who think he needed to be Ginger Baker or Gene Krupa or Keith Moon or whoever, and George needed to be Clapton or Hendrix or Django Reinhart or whoever, just don't get the Beatles.  Any of those guys would have been poor substitutes for Ringo or George, who brought exactly what was needed (before the Supergroup mentality took over).

Surfer Joe: I agree with you totally that he was not disposable.  But, I'm going to shoot myself in the foot here: guess who came up with the "Ticket To Ride" drum pattern?  Paul.  The point, though, is who (grudgingly, from what I've read) executed it so well?  Ringo!  Aw, yes, he was essential.

[matt 1234]

i think it wouldve been best if mike love and brian wilson just parted ways and both did what they did best. brian was heading in another direction, mike love was heading in his own equally weird direction.   does anyone else agree that not parks, not love, but manson couldve been the best collaborator for brian wilson.  is there any connection between smiley smiles release and manson?

[Jason]

Charles Manson HATED Brian Wilson. In fact, Brian was on his hitlist.

[jabba2]

Any reason why? I know that Charles recorded in Brians house for several weeks. Sometimes just with Brian.

[Jason]

I believe Manson told an interviewer that he hated Brian. I'm going on a shakier-than-usual memory. But maybe a Mansonaholic in here can help out.

[Mitchell]

is there any connection between smiley smiles release and manson?

Nope. Manson came a couple of years later.

[Jason]

Couple of years? Try nine months.

[I. Spaceman]

But maybe a Mansonaholic in here can help out.

You rang?

[Jason]

Manson supposedly claimed that he wanted to kill Brian Wilson, true or false, Ian?

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

i think it wouldve been best if mike love and brian wilson just parted ways and both did what they did best. brian was heading in another direction, mike love was heading in his own equally weird direction.

They kind of did part ways and do what they did best.  Brian ate birthday cake, Mike toured the schight out of the world.

[matt 1234]

well i was kidding about manson, i have the song that he wrote somewhere on my comp, i cant remember the name of it

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

You know, the more than a rumour is that Manson had a hand in up to three Beach Boys songs, I think.

[Andreas]

You know, the more than a rumour is that Manson had a hand in up to three Beach Boys songs, I think.

So what's the third one? Celebrate The News?

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

I don't remember now, but Celebrate the News has always , to me, had an odd air of Manson to it, not lyrically, but in the phrasing of the melody or something.

[Jason]

Never Learn Not To Love, Be With Me, and Celebrate the News are the three Dennis tunes that Manson actually wrote or co-wrote.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Yeah, there it is.

[Surfer Joe]

Surfer Joe: I agree with you totally that he was not disposable.  But, I'm going to shoot myself in the foot here: guess who came up with the "Ticket To Ride" drum pattern?  Paul.  The point, though, is who (grudgingly, from what I've read) executed it so well?  Ringo!  Aw, yes, he was essential.

I knew Paul worked up Ringo's part there, and many of George's parts were specifically directed as well.  Maybe both our points are made at once.  Did Ringo not execute that part as well as somebody else might have?  To me he always sounds beyond great (and so does George).  Brian directed most of what Hal Blaine played.  Could someone else have done it better?  Actually, both Hal Blaine and Ringo brought a consistent sound, professionalism, and personality to the recordings they drummed on.

I've always said: listen to any Beatles cover and the drums are where they miss.  There's never as much thought or design as the original had.  The same would be true for Beach Boys covers, except they're going to miss in a lot more areas as well.

I've read most of what there is on Manson, and I never encountered anything notable about him and Brian except for the stories about the recording session at the house and Marilyn's reaction to it.  I've never heard of Brian being on any list, but I'm not saying he wasn't.  That's also the first I've heard about "Celebrate" or "Be With Me", though that's perfectly credible.  What's the source?

I happened to meet Chuck Britz years ago, and my big regret later was not asking him about Manson.