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Author Topic: Brian @ Hammerstein Ballroom in NYC, 7/11/08  (Read 11874 times)
37!ws
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« on: July 12, 2008, 08:54:41 PM »

This was kind of an usual show. It was billed as "Brian Wilson and friends," there was no official start time announced until the day of the concert (all that was said was "doors open at 7:00"), and it was a charity show to raise money to fight cancer, so the tickets were a bit on the pricey side. The show was promoted as a "greatest hits" show.

As for who the "friends" were, nobody involved with the show would reveal much. Someone on the "blue board" claimed to have called the venue and asked and was told Jimmy Webb, Vince Gill, and "a Beatle." ("Ringo?" "No, the other one.") Personally, I was hoping that the "friends" would be Rich Sloan, Robin Hood, Jean Sievers, David Leaf, and Loren Darg or whatever the heck he wants his name to be today.

We'd never heard of the Hammerstein Ballroom. It's basically a huge, empty room near Penn Station. A few box seats. The seating was just chairs. I must say, though, as charmless as the venue is, the sound last night was pretty good.

One of the "friends" was Lily Holbrook, of whom I'd never heard until last night. Heh...when the PA announcer said "Please give a warm welcome to Lily Holbrook," my entire section said "WHO?Huh?" in unison! (Indeed, talking with fans in line and around us, it was obvious that pretty much everybody was there for Brian.) Can't really say much other than "ho-hum." Nothing exciting. She played for about half an hour with her dime-a-dozen backup band...

There was an intermission, followed by Brian and a chopped-down band...regulars were Nick, Jeff, Scott (on drums), and Probyn (bass), with Gary Griffin sitting in on keyboards. It was a fairly short set for Brian -- kind of like in 2001...no intermission in Brian's set....

I gotta tell ya...yeah, I missed the other guys; yeah, it was a short show, but you know what? It was really, really good! The small band was very tight, very well-rehearsed. I say this every time I see Brian in concert, but....he sounded better than ever! -- not bad, considering he's getting over a nasty flu. He was also very animated, extremely UN-shy. (Someone commented that he might have been TOO unshy! then again, nothing will beat the Brian I saw in Chicago on October 2, 2004...)

The play list included the three #1 hits he wrote for the Beach Boys; a Pet Sounds mini-set that included "Wouldn't It Be Nice" (Jeff sang the verses, Brian sang the bridge; with this arrangement, they were able to do this song in E instead of the usual D), "Sloop John B.," "God Only Knows" (at which point Brian introduced Joan Osbourne, who sang the second verse), and "Caroline, No," at which point they brought out Al Kooper, who despite having a voice that shouldn't allow him to sing the song, he took the second verse; "Going Home" and "Southern California" from TLOS; a bunch of other well-known hits (including "Catch A Wave," "Surfer Girl," "When I Grow Up," and "California Girls"); and a few album tracks such as "Add Some Music To Your Day" and "Then I Kissed Her" (on which Jeff sang the first verse). Seriously, I hesitate to call it a "greatest hits" show, as there was more of a variety than a regular hits show would have.

A few things I noticed....
- There was no prompter. Brian sang completely from memory, no electronic crutch. I think on "Southern California" he forgot a couple of words that Scott very quickly backed him up on.
- It was nice to hear other singers now and then; I always believed that just because it's Brian that he doesn't HAVE to sing every word of every song. Just wish they'd alter lead singers on "Add Some Music," though.
- You know that piano bit in "Do It Again" that happens during the "been so long" part? Sure ya do! Well....Gary Griffin reproduced that quite nicely! I never heard that piano bit anywhere but the studio version.
- It was the first Brian concert I went to in a long time (we're talkin' eight years) in which Brian didn't do "Marcella." I was a bit disappointed, because I love how he and the band do that tune...
- They were selling tour paraphernalia. I gotta say, the book for That Lucky Old Sun is really nice. REALLY nice. My wife and I decided to grab it just in case there weren't any available when Brian eventually tours TLOS in the States...
- My wife mentioned this as we were taking the train out of the city, but....it was odd that not once, not at any point at all, did anybody mention the charity.

Overall, great show! I really had my doubts going into it, but I'm thrilled to say that it was great. Plus, the money went to a very worthy cause.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 10:26:27 AM by 37!ws » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2008, 09:23:57 PM »

Jeff singing leads? Sweet.
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« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2008, 01:03:03 AM »

Honestly, I was hoping for some of that in 2000.
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« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2008, 09:42:58 AM »

OMG...there are two or three people on the blue board bitching about the show because:

1) The opening act

2) The short Brian set (between 1:15 and 1:30)

3) The setlist

4) The price

5) The 8:00 start time versus the 7:00 time that Ticketbastard allegedly claimed

Despite the fact that:

1) It was billed as "Brian Wilson and friends"

2) You can't expect a full-length Brian show with "friends"

3) It was no secret well in advance that it was supposed to be a "greatest hits" show

4) It was known well in advance that it's a charity show

5) The tickets clearly said that doors OPEN at 7:00, and it was discussed at great length that people have tried to get the folks at the Hammerstein to say what the real start time is, but they wouldn't say.

NONE OF THIS WAS HIDDEN. THIS WAS WELL KNOWN LITERALLY MONTHS BEFORE THE CONCERT HAPPENED!!!!

Now, here's the reason I say "OMG" -- Melinda just posted saying that Brian will personally refund the ticket price to anybody who was disappointed with the show and mails the ticket stub to The Lippin Group.

That's embarrassing.
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« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2008, 10:24:08 AM »

But there was no mention I know of of the fact that the show was going to be performed with a skeleton crew on stage. I guess Probyn Gregory has to sing the Theremin/Tannerin parts because there's nobody on stage to play them. It was cool when at one show Probyn apparently saved the day when there was a problem by singing the parts - but that's a far cry from doing it deliberately.

No matter how good the band members present were, they simply can't replicate the performances turned in when the whole band is present.

I really don't think it's the money for most people. I think they just felt they didn't get what they came to see, and then the money issue arises as they deal with the let down.

The "money back" offer is a red herring IMHO. Nobody (well, VERY few I suspect) is going to ask for their money back. That won't make their disappointment go away. It's like getting your money back after a bad restaurant meal - I'd really rather have not been let down by the experience.

Melinda's "offer" was inappropriate though, I agree. Now if she'd said that if the next time the band is on the east coast they'd play a show in that area and give a special deal of some sort (discount tickets, meet and greet, whatever the logistics would allow) to fans who were disappointed that would have been much better.
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« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2008, 02:01:38 PM »

But there was no mention I know of of the fact that the show was going to be performed with a skeleton crew on stage. I guess Probyn Gregory has to sing the Theremin/Tannerin parts because there's nobody on stage to play them. It was cool when at one show Probyn apparently saved the day when there was a problem by singing the parts - but that's a far cry from doing it deliberately.

No matter how good the band members present were, they simply can't replicate the performances turned in when the whole band is present.

I really don't think it's the money for most people. I think they just felt they didn't get what they came to see, and then the money issue arises as they deal with the let down.

The "money back" offer is a red herring IMHO. Nobody (well, VERY few I suspect) is going to ask for their money back. That won't make their disappointment go away. It's like getting your money back after a bad restaurant meal - I'd really rather have not been let down by the experience.

Melinda's "offer" was inappropriate though, I agree. Now if she'd said that if the next time the band is on the east coast they'd play a show in that area and give a special deal of some sort (discount tickets, meet and greet, whatever the logistics would allow) to fans who were disappointed that would have been much better.

Some peope didin't enjoy the show,

Well that's not Brian's fault, the man is 66 or 67 can't remmeber, and his is still pumping out great music and touring.

Those people need to get over it, he's offering them a refund for fodas sake
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 05:23:01 PM by The Baker Man » Logged

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« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2008, 03:05:20 PM »

I'm not saying it's inappropriate that Brian (via Melinda) is offering a refund, but it's inappropriate that people's ignorance caused that to happen.

"Skeleton crew"Huh More than enough to perform the songs that they did; most of the songs didn't require a lot. "Good Vibrations" was really the only stand-out, and even that was decent enough - the only thing really missing, besides cellos, was the Tannerin.

Do you really need eight instrumentalists for "Surfin' USA," "Help Me, Rhonda," "I Get Around," "Fun, Fun, Fun," "Add Some Music," "Then I Kissed Her," "Going Home," "Johnny B. Goode," etc.?
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« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2008, 05:41:05 PM »

Melinda just posted saying that Brian will personally refund the ticket price to anybody who was disappointed with the show and mails the ticket stub to The Lippin Group.

She's starting to grow on me....
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« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2008, 08:37:13 PM »

"Skeleton crew" tonight in New Hampshire as well.
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« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2008, 09:05:49 PM »

I'm not saying it's inappropriate that Brian (via Melinda) is offering a refund, but it's inappropriate that people's ignorance caused that to happen.

"Skeleton crew"Huh More than enough to perform the songs that they did; most of the songs didn't require a lot. "Good Vibrations" was really the only stand-out, and even that was decent enough - the only thing really missing, besides cellos, was the Tannerin.

Do you really need eight instrumentalists for "Surfin' USA," "Help Me, Rhonda," "I Get Around," "Fun, Fun, Fun," "Add Some Music," "Then I Kissed Her," "Going Home," "Johnny B. Goode," etc.?
Well, I mean, the whole appeal of seeing Brian's band is that they try to make the songs sound as much like the studio recording as possible.
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« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2008, 09:35:04 PM »

.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 07:47:09 AM by Don't Back Down » Logged

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« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2008, 07:12:19 AM »

Well, I mean, the whole appeal of seeing Brian's band is that they try to make the songs sound as much like the studio recording as possible.

That was my point exactly.
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« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2008, 07:58:09 AM »

Understood...but...the thing is, they were still pretty darned close, I must admit.
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« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2008, 02:23:52 PM »

Alright, now, before the blueboard becomes a scapegoat yet again, let's take note that there are people on _this_ board who didn't like the stripped-down shows either.

But I'm not one of them. Yes, the smaller band was a surprised because it was not what we're used to, but no one promised the entire band. What was promised was Brian Wilson and a backup band, and that's what we got. I said it on the blueboard and I'll say it here-- if Brian had started his solo touring with this band that played at the Hammerstein, no one would be complaining. It's just that we've been spoiled by the 10-piece band thing.

"The whole appeal of the band is that it re-produces the records"-- or whatever was said. Well, yes. But initially the alternative to that seemed to be the Joe Thomas adult contempo thing, and the Hammerstein show was certainly not that. It was exceptional musicians playing Brian's songs exceptionally well. People ranging in age from 15 to 65 were dancing. Okay, so there was no French horn on God Only Knows. There was no theramin on Good Vibrations. But what there was-- Brian in good voice, Scott beating the hell out of the drums, Nelson going nuts on percussion, those gorgeous harmonies-- was terrific. No objective observer could have watched that show and said it wasn't good.

The only problem I had with it was that the opening act was a bit incongruous. Her music was sort of like Jewel and very "modern" in the sense that it wasn't very melodic. And I didn't really see how it could appeal to this audience. But anyway, that's a minor quibble.

As for Melinda's offer, my first thought was that it was sort of her passive aggressive way of making people feel bad for complaining. She said it was Brian's idea, but who knows? I don't think she really expects anyone to have the nerve to send in a ticket stub, particularly since this show was for charity. Honestly, if I were her, I might have responded in the same way, just because-- who complains like that about a charity show? And the suggestion that they have discounts or rewards  for people who didn't like this one? Give me a break. The band has been playing A+ shows for years, and now, since you deem this one to be a C because of show length and setlist (even though 90 percent of the people give it an A), you want a consolation prize? Brian will tour TLOS in the U.S., according to Melinda. Go to that show and be happy!

As I said on the blueboard, if Brian was not releasing new music (of astonishingly high quality, all things considered), I might balk at the greatest hits format. But as things are, a greatest hits show is a nice bonus. Very enjoyable.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 02:26:38 PM by Amy B. » Logged
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« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2008, 02:57:23 PM »

From what I've heard of the show I would have loved to have been there.
Been way too long  Cool since I seen them, nearly a year FFS  Wink
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« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2008, 09:12:42 PM »

What was promised was Brian Wilson and a backup band, and that's what we got.

Hmmm, so you'd have been okay if Brian would have just picked up some local guys to play with a la Chuck Berry, yes?

Quote
I said it on the blueboard and I'll say it here-- if Brian had started his solo touring with this band that played at the Hammerstein, no one would be complaining.


But he didn't, did he?

Quote
But initially the alternative to that seemed to be the Joe Thomas adult contempo thing,  and the Hammerstein show was certainly not that.

I don't know what you mean by that.

Quote
It was exceptional musicians playing Brian's songs exceptionally well.


I'm sure it was, but that's not the point. It never was the point and it's not going to be the point.

Quote
Okay, so there was no French horn on God Only Knows. There was no theramin on Good Vibrations.


Because the BW organization was too cheap to have enough people there to play them.

Quote
But what there was-- Brian in good voice, Scott beating the hell out of the drums, Nelson going nuts on percussion, those gorgeous harmonies-- was terrific. No objective observer could have watched that show and said it wasn't good.


I'm sure that was true, those guys are unbelievable - but it isn't the point.

Quote
As for Melinda's offer, my first thought was that it was sort of her passive aggressive way of making people feel bad for complaining. She said it was Brian's idea, but who knows? I don't think she really expects anyone to have the nerve to send in a ticket stub, particularly since this show was for charity. Honestly, if I were her, I might have responded in the same way, just because-- who complains like that about a charity show?

If the charity show had been the only one with the econo-band (and that is NOT a slam against the guys who were there!!) I doubt it would be such a sore point for a lot of people. If it hadn't come on the heels of letting Jim and Bob go over what AGD and other insiders seem to be saying was a money issue..

An aside - I guess it is true that if you said to Jim and Bob "take this deal or leave" and they left you could say they left on their own.

Quote
And the suggestion that they have discounts or rewards  for people who didn't like this one? Give me a break.

What's wrong with that?

Quote
The band has been playing A+ shows for years, and now, since you deem this one to be a C because of show length and setlist (even though 90 percent of the people give it an A), you want a consolation prize?


I came away with the impression that the show length and set list were not the issue (or the only issue) for many. And nobody said they wanted a consolation prize - nobody. Show me a post where someone asked for their money back or any other consideration.

I wasn't at any of those shows. What bothered me about what happened had nothing to do with the performance of the band or Brian personally. It has more to do with the "do it on the cheap" approach the BW camp took on the recent USA shows. They are very lucky thay have such great musicians in that band. I'm sure the seven guys did a hell of a job.

I'm sure if you put Brian on stage with Probyn, Scott, Jeff and Nick they could put on a real good show. Almost as good as the recent shows which were almost as good as what the full band could do. Would it be okay with you if you showed up and the band was only four guys and Brian - if you were expecting the full band?

Quote
Brian will tour TLOS in the U.S., according to Melinda. Go to that show and be happy!

As I said on the blueboard, if Brian was not releasing new music (of astonishingly high quality, all things considered), I might balk at the greatest hits format. But as things are, a greatest hits show is a nice bonus. Very enjoyable.

All true - and not the least bit relevant to this discussion.

Look, if you are happy with what happened that's fine. But a good number of people were disappointed by the small band (as well as some other issues). And  I can see their point. My issue - I hate to see the recent trend that appears to point towards compromising to save a buck. Dump your long time rhythm section apparently over money - cut back on the band size for a whole series of shows... Not an encouraging trend in my view.

I am amazed that on the same board that CRUCIFIED BW and company for not using a "real" harpsichord in the recording of BWPS and went ape-merda over the way Darian sang "do-you", that nit-picks every passage on every recording - that it's now okay that there's no horns, no theremin, no woodwinds, etc. in a BW live show.

Shouldn't they have at least told people in advance this was what they were doing? As you said, for some people it would have made it a must-see event!

Interesting too that it never happens on tours to England - Darian is tied up, Scott can't go - we'll get Gary and Billy Hinsche to fill in for the greatest hits tour there. There's always a full band for those tours.

To each their own I guess.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 09:39:58 PM by Jim McShane » Logged
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« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2008, 04:54:32 AM »

A quote-by-quote, eh?  I'll try to reply.   Roll Eyes

No, I would have been disappointed if Brian had played with "some guys," although it might have been interesting. But no one promised Brian's full band. I mean, other bands play with changing line-ups all the time. This isn't billed as a Brian Wilson and His 10-Piece Band Show; it's a Brian Wilson show. He has the right to use whatever he wants, whether it makes you happy or not.

No, he didn't start with a 6-piece band. "But he didn't, did he?" What does that mean? I'm saying we've gotten spoiled as fans.

The Joe Thomas comment-- someone argued (you? I can't remember) that "the whole point of Brian's band" is that they reproduce Brian's original recordings. They made a point of doing that in 1999 as an alternative to the original plan for the touring band, which was to "modernize" the live shows into adult contempo style, didn't they? But what they did at the Hammerstein, while not a complete reproduction, did not suck the life out of the music-- far from it. As far as Brian's organization being "cheap," that's pure speculation, but if economics played a role, can you blame them? Have you been paying attention to the economy? It can't be easy to support that whole band. But if you had your way, apparently you'd prefer the alternative-- that they had just stayed home rather than reduce the size of the band. The Bob and Jim thing-- also speculation. We're going by AGD's hints, and that to me is not a confirmation. Melinda claims they left on their own. If they were let go for economic reasons, then I can understand that-- better that than them being let go because they did something to offend Melinda.

By "consolation prize," I'm talking about the discounts and rewards you or someone else suggested in a previous post. Are you kidding me? A discount to people who didn't enjoy the last show? Did Loews give me a discount because I didn't like Sex and the City? Did Broadway give me a discount because I hated "Cats"?

As far as crucifying Brian because he didn't use a real harpsicord or because of the Darian "do-you's," I thought that was ridiculous. If this board is getting more tolerant, good for them. To get upset because people aren't being nitpicky... uh, no. Besides, recordings and live shows are two different things.

The greatest hits format was one of the things people took issue with on the blueboard, so I brought it up here.

There are several problems with your argument, the least of which being that you didn't even go to these shows, so you're criticizing something you didn't even hear. Also, you're basing your whole argument on this idea that BriMel is "doing it on the cheap" and trying to save money, which is (A) a valid thing to do if true and (B) possibly not even true.  And since 90 percent of the people on the boards think this new approach had a good, even great result, that punches even more holes in your argument. Part of me thinks they should have advertised the stripped down band, but how would they have done this? So, I let it go, because it was a good show.

Melinda has said that the others will be back and the full band will play TLOS in the U.S. in the fall. Given this, if Brian had just stayed home this summer so that all of his shows had the full band, you would have been happier. But based on attendance and reaction, these shows were a good idea.




What was promised was Brian Wilson and a backup band, and that's what we got.

Hmmm, so you'd have been okay if Brian would have just picked up some local guys to play with a la Chuck Berry, yes?

Quote
I said it on the blueboard and I'll say it here-- if Brian had started his solo touring with this band that played at the Hammerstein, no one would be complaining.


But he didn't, did he?

Quote
But initially the alternative to that seemed to be the Joe Thomas adult contempo thing,  and the Hammerstein show was certainly not that.

I don't know what you mean by that.

Quote
It was exceptional musicians playing Brian's songs exceptionally well.


I'm sure it was, but that's not the point. It never was the point and it's not going to be the point.

Quote
Okay, so there was no French horn on God Only Knows. There was no theramin on Good Vibrations.


Because the BW organization was too cheap to have enough people there to play them.

Quote
But what there was-- Brian in good voice, Scott beating the hell out of the drums, Nelson going nuts on percussion, those gorgeous harmonies-- was terrific. No objective observer could have watched that show and said it wasn't good.


I'm sure that was true, those guys are unbelievable - but it isn't the point.

Quote
As for Melinda's offer, my first thought was that it was sort of her passive aggressive way of making people feel bad for complaining. She said it was Brian's idea, but who knows? I don't think she really expects anyone to have the nerve to send in a ticket stub, particularly since this show was for charity. Honestly, if I were her, I might have responded in the same way, just because-- who complains like that about a charity show?

If the charity show had been the only one with the econo-band (and that is NOT a slam against the guys who were there!!) I doubt it would be such a sore point for a lot of people. If it hadn't come on the heels of letting Jim and Bob go over what AGD and other insiders seem to be saying was a money issue..

An aside - I guess it is true that if you said to Jim and Bob "take this deal or leave" and they left you could say they left on their own.

Quote
And the suggestion that they have discounts or rewards  for people who didn't like this one? Give me a break.

What's wrong with that?

Quote
The band has been playing A+ shows for years, and now, since you deem this one to be a C because of show length and setlist (even though 90 percent of the people give it an A), you want a consolation prize?


I came away with the impression that the show length and set list were not the issue (or the only issue) for many. And nobody said they wanted a consolation prize - nobody. Show me a post where someone asked for their money back or any other consideration.

I wasn't at any of those shows. What bothered me about what happened had nothing to do with the performance of the band or Brian personally. It has more to do with the "do it on the cheap" approach the BW camp took on the recent USA shows. They are very lucky thay have such great musicians in that band. I'm sure the seven guys did a hell of a job.

I'm sure if you put Brian on stage with Probyn, Scott, Jeff and Nick they could put on a real good show. Almost as good as the recent shows which were almost as good as what the full band could do. Would it be okay with you if you showed up and the band was only four guys and Brian - if you were expecting the full band?

Quote
Brian will tour TLOS in the U.S., according to Melinda. Go to that show and be happy!

As I said on the blueboard, if Brian was not releasing new music (of astonishingly high quality, all things considered), I might balk at the greatest hits format. But as things are, a greatest hits show is a nice bonus. Very enjoyable.

All true - and not the least bit relevant to this discussion.

Look, if you are happy with what happened that's fine. But a good number of people were disappointed by the small band (as well as some other issues). And  I can see their point. My issue - I hate to see the recent trend that appears to point towards compromising to save a buck. Dump your long time rhythm section apparently over money - cut back on the band size for a whole series of shows... Not an encouraging trend in my view.

I am amazed that on the same board that CRUCIFIED BW and company for not using a "real" harpsichord in the recording of BWPS and went ape-merda over the way Darian sang "do-you", that nit-picks every passage on every recording - that it's now okay that there's no horns, no theremin, no woodwinds, etc. in a BW live show.

Shouldn't they have at least told people in advance this was what they were doing? As you said, for some people it would have made it a must-see event!

Interesting too that it never happens on tours to England - Darian is tied up, Scott can't go - we'll get Gary and Billy Hinsche to fill in for the greatest hits tour there. There's always a full band for those tours.

To each their own I guess.
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« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2008, 05:30:41 AM »

"Good number of people" complained?? I counted three, tops. It's just that they raised such a stink.

Also....allegedly, it was the promoter or venue who mandated the number of musicians on stage...plus, technically, they DID have enough to provide the tannerin and the French horn -- you don't need two guitars on "God Only Knows", so Jeff or Nick could have played the bass on that one while Probyn played the French horn for the brief time he'd need it. Brian theoretically could have played the tannerin on Good Vibrations, or even Nelson. But they didn't; big deal.

Ahh...now that I think about it, there was something particularly odd -- during "God Only Knows," they didn't do the proper instrumental transition; they did that "chromatic" thing (which isn't actually chromatic) as the transition; my guess is it was dumbed down for Gary Griffin...kinda weird -- Brian's band doing the cop-out, and the one time I saw the Beach Boys (which was in 1996), they did it the "proper" way...
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« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2008, 06:38:02 AM »

There are several problems with your argument, the least of which being that you didn't even go to these shows, so you're criticizing something you didn't even hear. 


No, that's not my concern, you don't understand. Maybe I wasn't clear.

My concern is that of late the BW organization seems to me to be willing to make too many compromises that impact artistic integrity. And for some reason they do it in the USA and don't do it overseas. It seems to me they take the US audiences for granted.

One last comment - yes there is a difference between recordings and live shows. But isn't the BW camp (for these shows) just presenting the equivalent of the old Mike & Bruce traveling jukebox? Yes, with Brian's band musicians it's one hell of a jukebox.  But imagine the reaction here if the M&B band had someone sing theremin parts, didn't play the break properly in GOK, etc.

That's all I'm going to say - if we disagree we disagree.
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« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2008, 06:58:25 AM »

I addressed the traveling jukebox issue in a previous post by writing, "As I said on the blueboard, if Brian was not releasing new music (of astonishingly high quality, all things considered), I might balk at the greatest hits format. But as things are, a greatest hits show is a nice bonus. Very enjoyable."  But you dismissed it and said that wasn't what we were discussing here.

As to the other stuff, I guess you're right--  we will have to agree to disagree.




There are several problems with your argument, the least of which being that you didn't even go to these shows, so you're criticizing something you didn't even hear. 


No, that's not my concern, you don't understand. Maybe I wasn't clear.

My concern is that of late the BW organization seems to me to be willing to make too many compromises that impact artistic integrity. And for some reason they do it in the USA and don't do it overseas. It seems to me they take the US audiences for granted.

One last comment - yes there is a difference between recordings and live shows. But isn't the BW camp (for these shows) just presenting the equivalent of the old Mike & Bruce traveling jukebox? Yes, with Brian's band musicians it's one hell of a jukebox.  But imagine the reaction here if the M&B band had someone sing theremin parts, didn't play the break properly in GOK, etc.

That's all I'm going to say - if we disagree we disagree.

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« Reply #20 on: July 15, 2008, 07:32:38 AM »

I addressed the traveling jukebox issue in a previous post by writing, "As I said on the blueboard, if Brian was not releasing new music (of astonishingly high quality, all things considered), I might balk at the greatest hits format. But as things are, a greatest hits show is a nice bonus. Very enjoyable."  But you dismissed it and said that wasn't what we were discussing here.

Let me just clarify one more time - when I said the "traveling jukebox" I didn't mean the content of the show. I used that term to identify a band (while it's apparently gotten much better recently) that wasn't capable (for whatever reason) of performing Brian's music at the highest levels . I meant that the M&B band didn't have a theremin, didn't play the break in GOK right, didn't have the brass and wind instrument support to add the subtleties and nuance that is featured in so much of Brian's music, etc.

There has been a lot of criticism over the years of the "dumbed down" arrangements, etc., that the M&B band used. I just think it's appropriate to apply the same standards when the BW management does the same thing. And again, no, I'm not criticising ANY member of the BW band, I'm a huge fan.

Instead of calling it the "traveling jukebox" I should have just said the M&B band. It was a poor choice on my part.

My apologies - again I wasn't clear.
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« Reply #21 on: July 15, 2008, 09:02:17 AM »

Especially since with a jukebox, you get to choose the songs you hear.  Grin
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« Reply #22 on: July 15, 2008, 03:56:49 PM »

There was some guy on the Brian Wilson message board who posted his dissatisfaction with the performance.  He was very fair about it and didn't say anything mean-spirited.  Yet he got bombarded with replies from the typical BW message board nutjobs who scolded him for having that opinion and even resorted to name-calling.   Roll Eyes  Sheesh.  Just goes to show you that many of Brian's fans are loonier than he ever could be. 
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