Unreleased Sunflower Outtakes

[TimeToGetAlone]

I'm just curious if there is any information available on the Sunflower outtakes that have never seen release.  To my knowledge this would be Carnival, What Can The Matter Be?, You Never Give Me Your Money, I'm Going Your Way, and Walkin' (the only one I really know anything about).  I also came across one more as a bonus on a lyric page, but the name escapes and I can't seem to find it.  Its writing credit was Brian Wilson and another person which was complete unknown to me.

[the captain]

I think you'd have to include the early "Back Home," at least. Is the first "Big Sur" that old, or was that nearer "Surf's Up"? Then of course there's the big batch of tunes from this era that were released on later albums and compilation albums.

[John]

Carnival aka Over The Waves is IIRC about a minute long, with the guys signing wordless harmonies. It's that old circus-y waltzy theme.

You Never Give Your Money is apparently not only instrumental, but just played on the keyboard.

I'm Going Your Way is a Denny rocker which is said to be like Slip On Through. I think it's available on bootleg but I've not got it.

Was the other guy David Sandler? Is the song Awake?

[John]

I think you'd have to include the early "Back Home," at least. Is the first "Big Sur" that old, or was that nearer "Surf's Up"? Then of course there's the big batch of tunes from this era that were released on later albums and compilation albums.

I think it's nearer Surf's Up, like mid-1970.

[Malc]

Then there's the alternate/early version of "Add Some Music" ... with alternate lyrics 

[elnombre]

If only Sunflower would get the proper reissue + bonus tracks treatment it so deserves...

[Alex]

I'm just curious if there is any information available on the Sunflower outtakes that have never seen release.  To my knowledge this would be Carnival, What Can The Matter Be?, You Never Give Me Your Money, I'm Going Your Way, and Walkin' (the only one I really know anything about).  I also came across one more as a bonus on a lyric page, but the name escapes and I can't seem to find it.  Its writing credit was Brian Wilson and another person which was complete unknown to me.

Carnival, I'm Going Your Way, and Walkin' are all on boots. I've never even heard of those other 2 songs, though. The Sunflower outtakes I know of (and have heard), are Carnival, I'm Going Your Way, It's a New Day, Lady, Sound of Free, Soulful Old Man Sunshine, Loop De Loop, Good Time, Big Sur, a take of Slip on Through with just drums, Walkin', Back Home, alternate versions of Add Some Music and Tears in the Morning, the Wild Honey-era version of Cool Cool Water, I Just Got My Pay, When Girls Get Together, HELP Is On The Way, Games Two Can Play, and probably a couple others whose names have slipped my mind at the moment.

[Dancing Bear]

http://www.btinternet.com/~bellagio/gigs69.html
http://www.btinternet.com/~bellagio/gigs70.html

Those tracks were worked in time for a Sunflower release. Different levels of completion, though:

San Miguel
What Can The Matter Be?
Loop de Loop
I’m Going Your Way
Soulful Old Man Sunshine
Walkin'
Games that Two Can Play
When Girls Get Together
Where is She?
Suzie Cincinatti
Carnival
I Just Got My Pay
Take A Load Off Your Feet
Fallin’ in Love / Lady
Back Home

Those had work started between the mastering of Sunflower and its release:

Seasons In The Sun
Lookin' At Tomorrow
Big Sur
'Til I Die
H.E.L.P. Is On The Way

[Ian]

Though no AFM has turned up, don't forget the flip side of "Lady", "Sounds of Free"

[SG7]

"Where is She" is one of those missing Sunflower outtakes also

[TimeToGetAlone]

Thanks for the replies all...

Carnival aka Over The Waves is IIRC about a minute long, with the guys signing wordless harmonies. It's that old circus-y waltzy theme.

You Never Give Your Money is apparently not only instrumental, but just played on the keyboard.

I'm Going Your Way is a Denny rocker which is said to be like Slip On Through. I think it's available on bootleg but I've not got it.

Was the other guy David Sandler? Is the song Awake?

Well that gives a little more background into the former three. I'm sure the one I came across was no Awake though.  It was a rather unusual last name if I recall, and I'm pretty sure it was a three word song.  Wish I could add more to that.  Maybe I'll look around for it again.

Wher Is She is one I had not heard of before, so that's interesting as well.  Does anyone know about What Can The Matter Be?

[John]

And then there's "My Solution" too...

[Smilin Ed H]

If it's Won't You Tell Me, that's a little later.  I'm pretty sure My Solution was recorded after the Sunflower session, but check the AGD's site.  You might consider the acappella versions of Add Some Music and Cottonfields and the alt Tears in the Morning. The fifnished vesion of It's A New Day is later - Blondie's on lead vocal.

[TimeToGetAlone]

Upon searching around I found the mystery song was Lady Love (Wilson/Hinsche).  Turns out I knew the other name afterall, but he would have been pretty young in the Sunflower era and I didn't even know he was associated with the band back then.  I'm assuming this was just an error on the site and it was a song from well later on, but maybe people can verify.

I really wish some of the stuff mentioned in this thread regardless would get a release of some kind.

[brianc]

"Lady Love" has been released. It was a 45 by Dino, Desi & Billy from 1970. It's also on Sundazed's CD compilation of DD&B. Great Brian Wilson tune.

[brianc]

Also, Billy Hinsche would not have been too young, at that time. I don't know his bio that well, but I know that in 1965, DD&B were a go-go/folk-rock act in Hollywood, playing clubs throughout the area. They were written up in tons and tons of teen music magazines.

Billy was also Carl Wilson's brother-in-law, so there was the early Beach Boys connection. Not sure when he joined the touring band, but I remember Billy telling me that he was invited to go to Holland with the band in 1972. The co-write with Brian from 1970 is a valid piece of info from the internet.

I believe it was Billy you were talking about, right?

[brianc]

I'm sure the one I came across was no Awake though.

"Awake" was, like, an old Americana song by Floyd Tucker or someone like that. Brian did a solo vocal version of it in 1970, then Spring covered it a year later for the b-side of the single "Now That Everything's Been Said," both of which appeared on the 1972 Spring album. I think the lyrics are different, and Brian's 1970 version has a catatrophic falsetto vocal.

Whether that could be considered a "Sunflower" outtake, I don't know. I thought it was more of a demo.

[John]

Just an addendum to my earlier post: My Solution, was, I believe, recorded October 31, 1970.

[TimeToGetAlone]

Also, Billy Hinsche would not have been too young, at that time. I don't know his bio that well, but I know that in 1965, DD&B were a go-go/folk-rock act in Hollywood, playing clubs throughout the area. They were written up in tons and tons of teen music magazines.

Billy was also Carl Wilson's brother-in-law, so there was the early Beach Boys connection. Not sure when he joined the touring band, but I remember Billy telling me that he was invited to go to Holland with the band in 1972. The co-write with Brian from 1970 is a valid piece of info from the internet.

I believe it was Billy you were talking about, right?

Hmm yeah I was aware the song was released after the fact.  At the time I just saw it as something related to Sunflower so I naturally assumed it was something never released.  If I had known it wasn't a Beach Boys recording I probably wuldn't have mentioned it.  The birth date I had would have made him 19 at this time, which in the BB scheme of things is manageable.  I only knew of him from years a little later however.  Would he have been Carl's brother-in-law in 1970?

Just an addendum to my earlier post: My Solution, was, I believe, recorded October 31, 1970.

I do find it interesting how this one is pretty much all by itself in between the conscious efforts for albums.  I haven't heard it so I don't know what to expect.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Also, remember that Billy was allegedly going to replace Bruce when Jack Rieley took over.

[MBE]

I'm sure the one I came across was no Awake though.

"Awake" was, like, an old Americana song by Floyd Tucker or someone like that. Brian did a solo vocal version of it in 1970, then Spring covered it a year later for the b-side of the single "Now That Everything's Been Said," both of which appeared on the 1972 Spring album. I think the lyrics are different, and Brian's 1970 version has a catatrophic falsetto vocal.

Whether that could be considered a "Sunflower" outtake, I don't know. I thought it was more of a demo.

Actually to me Brian sounds great on it. I think it was cut in 1971 along with Silly Walls.

[mikeyj]

Would he have been Carl's brother-in-law in 1970?

Carl married Annie Hinsche early in 1966

EDIT: Just checked the exact date (February 3)

[TimeToGetAlone]

Would he have been Carl's brother-in-law in 1970?

Carl married Annie Hinsche early in 1966

EDIT: Just checked the exact date (February 3)

I should have known Carl was married by that time haha.  His first son was even on the Sunflower cover.  How would people have felt if Billy had actually replaced by the time Surf's Up came around?

[Aegir]

Surf's Up, nah. I really like the Bruce-vibe Surf's Up has. If he had replaced Bruce after he left, and we'd had Brian, Carl, Dennis, Mike, Al, Billy, Ricky, and Blondie, that would've been sweet. But Billy was already in the band anyway kinda. Does anyone know if he contriubted anything in the studio (like Ed Carter) or was he strictly a road-only guy?

[Andrew G. Doe]

I'm sure the one I came across was no Awake though.

"Awake" was, like, an old Americana song by Floyd Tucker or someone like that. Brian did a solo vocal version of it in 1970, then Spring covered it a year later for the b-side of the single "Now That Everything's Been Said," both of which appeared on the 1972 Spring album. I think the lyrics are different, and Brian's 1970 version has a catatrophic falsetto vocal.

Whether that could be considered a "Sunflower" outtake, I don't know. I thought it was more of a demo.

"Awake", with "Silly Walls" was a Wilson/Sandler demo for Spring, recorded the first week of October 1971. The lyric is identical to the Spring version, which was recorded 10/8/71.