Surf's Up backing track

[mikeyj]

Obviously the backing track for the first section of the song was recorded during the SMiLE era. But ive always wondered what the arrangement to the second section would have been like had Brian gotten around to recording it? Anyway, what does everyone else think? What would the arrangement have been like, if Brian WAS at all going to record an arrangement for the second part of the song.

[Chris Brown]

I think it probably would have been very similar to what we got on BWPS.  I doubt that he would have fully orchestrated it like the 1st movement, so maybe just some strings would have done the trick.  Apparently he told this to Darian (that he had planned it this way), which is why the BWPS version had strings.  That being said, I'm still holding out for a Smile era 2nd movement acetate someday...

[Bill Barnyard]

Rumours that the 2nd movement of Surf's Up had been found a few years back appear to be unfounded although Peter Reum was sure that such a tape existed.

Brian does not appear to have remembered what the arrangement was like although 'wild horns' were reputed to be part of it. (George Fell Into His French Horn anyone). I know I heard/read about this about three years ago but it is most likely just part of the SMiLE mythology. Do we actually know whether the 2nd movement was actually tracked or recorded in any form?

 

[Andrew G. Doe]

FWIW there's no documentation nor contemporary mention. Priore muddied the waters here by stating in the past that it didn't exist, then claiming a few years ago that he'd heard it back in the 70s. Mark's view is along the lines of 'if-it-was-recorded-we'd-have-heard-it-by-now', and it's hard to argue with that.

[mikeyj]

FWIW there's no documentation nor contemporary mention. Priore muddied the waters here by stating in the past that it didn't exist, then claiming a few years ago that he'd heard it back in the 70s. Mark's view is along the lines of 'if-it-was-recorded-we'd-have-heard-it-by-now', and it's hard to argue with that.

Im only fairly a newbie in The Beach Boys-fan world but I read posts by fans who talk about the Durrie Parks acetates or something. I have NO idea what they are (and Im guessing nobody else does) but could something like this be on those tapes? Forgive me if Im totally mixed up here, if i am can someone explain what these Durrie Parks tapes are?

[Andrew G. Doe]

When Van Dyke & Durrie divorced, she got, in essence, pretty much everything, and that included several acetates of Smile tracks that Brian gave VDP during that period. They're not tapes but actual discs, pressed up from the session tapes. The big drawback with an acetate is that it deteriorates rapidly with usage, and after maybe 20-30 plays can be unlistenable. Durrie has confirmed she has acetates, but not what she has (I suspect she probably wouldn't know after all these years) but that's where the trail went dead several years ago.

[mikeyj]

When Van Dyke & Durrie divorced, she got, in essence, pretty much everything, and that included several acetates of Smile tracks that Brian gave VDP during that period. They're not tapes but actual discs, pressed up from the session tapes. The big drawback with an acetate is that it deteriorates rapidly with usage, and after maybe 20-30 plays can be unlistenable. Durrie has confirmed she has acetates, but not what she has (I suspect she probably wouldn't know after all these years) but that's where the trail went dead several years ago.

This begs the obvious question, why doesnt she give them to say Alan Boyd or something?

[Charles LePage @ ComicList]

Dan Lega said this March 2004:

"Rick you may be right! You are correct about the Durrie Parks' acetates, because I asked Darian about it. They are still unable to get to the Durrie Parks acetates -- he said that they were still "buried" in her garage and too hard to get at. Now this doesn't sound quite right to me -- most likely Drury is still holding them out for a big payday from Capital. (And I would bet she's holding them out with an outright or implicit OK from Van Dyke, himself!)"

Unless she has an enormous garage, I find it hard to believe someone couldn't volunteer to look for the acetates, and clean up the garage in the process.  Maybe the "Clean House" people should ring her up.  Then we can buy the acetates at the garage sale.

[Roger Ryan]

Brian does not appear to have remembered what the arrangement was like although 'wild horns' were reputed to be part of it. (George Fell Into His French Horn anyone).

Some of those "wild horns" from the "George Fell" session do show up as overdubs in the backing track to the first section (during "muted trumpeter's swan" for example). I tend to think that Brian's recollection of a string arrangement for the second half is accurate; it's hard to imagine that section having a more bombastic backing track.

[XY]

What about the "Surf's Up" session on January 23, 1967?

Hal Blaine - drums
Roy Caton - horn/trumpet
Billy Green - horn
Jim Horn - horn/saxophone
Jay Migliori - horn/saxophone
Bill Pitman - guitar
Lyle Ritz - upright bass
Carl Wilson - guitar

and February 8, 1967 ?

Dates for 1st movement (please correct me if I'm wrong)

November 4, 1966 - basic track
November 7, 1966 - horn overdubs
November 8, 1966 - percussion overdubs / 1st movement mix down session

[Chris Brown]

That January session has definitely been a mystery Jasper...I tend to doubt that it was for the 2nd movement based on the instruments used, but who knows?  My only guess is maybe a re-do of the first movement (not likely) or a tag.  As I said before, I really don't think the 2nd movement would have been very "orchestrated".

Then again, it seems reasonable that Brian would have at least attempted to record the 2nd movement, since the first was done back in November.  Is there a list of musicians for the Feb. 8 session?  Maybe that was a 2nd movement attempt.  I really think that there must have been an attempt at some point.  I mean, except for a lot of lead vocals, there is very little of Smile that wasn't at least ATTEMPTED in some form.  In fact, many Smile songs (like H&V, Wonderful) have so many attempts that Brian couldn't make up his mind about whether or not use them.  So why wouldn't he have a session for the 2nd movement of "Surf's Up" at some point, even if it was just to see how it might sound?  Unless of course he didn't know yet what he wanted on it and never ended up getting around to it, but I doubt that was the case.  I'm sure Brian hadsomething in mind for it...maybe he kept changing his mind.  Again, who knows.   

Just one more reason why we need those Durrie Parks acetates!

[Bicyclerider]

I remember Alan saying that someone who claimed to have heard it said it had a lot of strange horns/wind instruments on it (like Intro to Heroes or Bag of Tricks?) but all attempts to find it have come to naught, so I think it's existence is in the legendary but not factual realm.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

As I said before, I really don't think the 2nd movement would have been very "orchestrated".

Why not?  I don't really think we can have any idea what was in Brian's head at the time.

As I think has been mentioned, the Jan 23 session instrumental line-up does not match anything we've heard, so whatever it is, it isn't something that has leaked out or anything.

Then again, it seems reasonable that Brian would have at least attempted to record the 2nd movement, since the first was done back in November.  Is there a list of musicians for the Feb. 8 session?  Maybe that was a 2nd movement attempt. 

February 8 seems to have been at CBS, so was likely vocals and not an instrumental tracking session.

[Charles LePage @ ComicList]

What about the "Surf's Up" session on January 23, 1967?
and February 8, 1967 ?

Pardon me for sounding absurd-- but what about Feb. 8?  I wasn't aware there was anything recorded on that date.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Only mention of a 2/8/67 "Surf's Up" session I can find is in Badman, who has it down as a tracking - and not a vocal - session at Columbia, which rather makes it questionable in my eyes. That he further has Mike Love present at a tracking session, and claims it would be re-used in the 1971 reconstruction blows it out of the water for me.

[Charles LePage @ ComicList]

On page 222 of Look Listen Vibrate Smile, there are photos dated 01/25/07 for a Surf's Up session.  However, there was no such session that I'm aware of; there was one on 01/23.  Are these photos from 01/23 or 01/25?

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Are those photos anywhere on the internet, uh, Mr. Spongee?  I would very much like to see them.

[Charles LePage @ ComicList]

Remarkably, they are:

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Thanks, Chuck.  I really need to get around to picking up that book.

I've seen all of those but the one with Ray Pohlman, which of course made my day.

I don't know that I would trust any of those captions...for one, Jim Gordon is misidentified as Glen Campbell, and Lyle Ritz is a bassist, not a cellist.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I'm thinking that someone has handwriting as bad as mine, thus 1/23 was misread as 1/25

[John]

Only mention of a 2/8/67 "Surf's Up" session I can find is in Badman, who has it down as a tracking - and not a vocal - session at Columbia, which rather makes it questionable in my eyes. That he further has Mike Love present at a tracking session, and claims it would be re-used in the 1971 reconstruction blows it out of the water for me.

Doesn't he say it's Mike Vosse, not Love?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Yup, my bad - the claimed lineup is Dennis, Mike Vosse & VDP. Still pretty dubious to these ears.