gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
664538 Posts in 26635 Topics by 3819 Members - Latest Member: Occasional grilled cheese December 02, 2020, 08:29:02 AM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
gfxgfx
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.       « previous next »
Pages: [1] 2 Go Down Print
Author Topic: 1997 Tour Footage w/Carl on YouTube  (Read 1982 times)
HeyJude
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 9096



View Profile WWW
« on: November 05, 2020, 03:23:06 PM »

Looks like someone posted about 30 minutes of concert footage from a pre-September 1997 Beach Boys show with Carl. As we all know, 1997 footage is pretty rare (some point out that folks might be holding back footage of Carl not doing too well, and while that's one possibility, I also think just not that many folks bothered to capture the mid-late 90s somewhat rote BB show on video).

In any event, here's "I Can Hear Music": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD41cFE_rJE

And here is the full available footage (the first half of this video is an unrelated later Brian solo show): https://youtu.be/6AXmO42nfKU?t=2925
Logged

THE BEACH BOYS OPINION PAGE IS ON FACEBOOK!!! http://www.facebook.com/beachboysopinion - Check out the original "BEACH BOYS OPINION PAGE" Blog - http://beachboysopinion.blogspot.com/
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
The Dr. of Wilsonomics
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11438


🍦🍦 fear2stop.bandcamp.com ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2020, 03:41:11 PM »

Hard to watch but he still sounded great which is crazy. He literally sounded the same (and better than in the late 70s which blows my mind)
Logged

RIP Daniel Dale Johnston ( 1961-2019)
_______________________________________________________
Fear 2 Stop: eating all of Elon Musk's nightmares as he sleeps

"I've never heard such ear-pleasing screams before!"
________________________________________________
Free Feel Flows!!!!

Just to let you know, no announcements re: FEEL FLOWS will be coming via a fanzine.
If and when the project picks up steam -- I promise you guys will be first to know.





覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧-

http://fear2stop.bandcamp.com/track/tricky-treats
HeyJude
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 9096



View Profile WWW
« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2020, 03:42:35 PM »

Haven't heard Carl sound bad on a 1997 (or other late era) recording. Voice was good. The most consistent of anybody in the band (apart from maybe Al).
Logged

THE BEACH BOYS OPINION PAGE IS ON FACEBOOK!!! http://www.facebook.com/beachboysopinion - Check out the original "BEACH BOYS OPINION PAGE" Blog - http://beachboysopinion.blogspot.com/
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 4747


View Profile WWW
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2020, 07:02:03 PM »

When I saw them in June of '97 - literally eight months to the day before he passed - Carl sounded great on guitar and vocals. The only clues to his illness where when he sat down in the middle of the show for a couple of songs, and when Mike mentioned his illness and how he was fighting it while staying on the road. I've read that he sat through almost all of other shows on that tour, so I guess I'm lucky I caught them on one of his "good" nights.
Logged
Lonely Summer
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3529


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2020, 07:09:35 PM »

I don't know why people say this is hard to watch. Sure, you can tell that he's a bit bloated from the meds, but man, he sounds so good! I admire that he did the tour that year, even though he was in the middle of the fight of his life.
Only wish I knew how he would sound at 70-something; I wish he was here.
Logged
Zargo
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 115


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2020, 11:26:20 PM »

I don't know why people say this is hard to watch. Sure, you can tell that he's a bit bloated from the meds, but man, he sounds so good! I admire that he did the tour that year, even though he was in the middle of the fight of his life.
Only wish I knew how he would sound at 70-something; I wish he was here.

It is admirable, but a strange choice. Perhaps a way of fighting the idea of the cancer being fatal. If he felt there was a good chance it wouldn't be, surely his wife and kids would have been the complete focus.
Logged
juggler
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 776


View Profile
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2020, 12:13:53 AM »

I don't know why people say this is hard to watch. Sure, you can tell that he's a bit bloated from the meds, but man, he sounds so good! I admire that he did the tour that year, even though he was in the middle of the fight of his life.
Only wish I knew how he would sound at 70-something; I wish he was here.

It is admirable, but a strange choice. Perhaps a way of fighting the idea of the cancer being fatal. If he felt there was a good chance it wouldn't be, surely his wife and kids would have been the complete focus.

You know, having had a family member with terminal illness at age similar to Carl, I get why he did what he did.  He had an illness. He was going to doctors, getting whatever treatment he was getting, but beyond that what can you really do beyond just trying to live your life?  To be in that situation, there's just a huge desire for normalcy.  You can't spend all day, every day completely focusing on your illness, having tear-filled "maybe this is our last conversation" conversations, etc.  Being "the sick person" is a huge drag.

Carl loved the music, and he loved playing the music.  There's a story that's been told many time by the former Hawthorne High gym coach about how Carl didn't want to participate in Phys Ed class, preferring to sit on the bench practicing his guitar.  The coach warned him, "Carl, you're going to fail this class." Carl's response was along the lines of, "That's okay, Coach, I don't really like P.E. I just want to learn to play this guitar."  The coach later laughed at his own response: "Carl, you're never going to make a living playing that guitar. I'm going to end up seeing you selling pencils on Hawthorne Blvd."   I'm sure that touring was strenuous, but there on that stage for a few hours he wasn't "Carl Wilson, the sick person."  He was Carl Wilson, the Beach Boy, performing some of the most sublime songs ever written.
Logged
Tony S
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 580


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: November 06, 2020, 03:43:38 AM »

I remember seeing the Beach Boys and Carl at the end of August 1997 live at the old Garden State Arts Center in New Jersey. One of Carl's last performances he was still phenomenal when he sang God Only Knows especially, he sat most of the show except for that tune.
Logged
mtaber
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 395


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2020, 06:00:42 AM »

Juggler, that was a great response. Thank you.
Logged
Emdeeh
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2649



View Profile
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2020, 07:55:23 AM »

Agree, thank you Juggler. My own feeling about Carl's situation was that performing was, in part, therapy for him.
Logged
CenturyDeprived
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5510



View Profile
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2020, 11:30:03 AM »

Juggler, that was a great response. Thank you.

+1
Logged
The 4th Wilson Bro.
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 218


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2020, 12:28:27 PM »

I'll add my "thank you" for that post, juggler. God only knows how much it meant to Carl to be on stage performing with his bandmates at a time when so many others would have used that illness as an excuse to withdraw from life. Lord, how I loved and admired that man, as I know many of you did as well. I never got an opportunity to meet, or even hear Carl play/perform live, but the impact he made on my life is real and something I'll cherish as long as I live.
Logged
Lonely Summer
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3529


View Profile
« Reply #12 on: November 06, 2020, 05:57:42 PM »

Juggler nailed it. Slightly similar: earlier this year, when a lot of us were in lockdown at home, I'm sure we tried to get through the whole thing as normally as possible. I know I did. I could have sat frozen on my couch, worried myself sick, and become depressed. Instead, I developed new routines - mostly involving music making. That was my way of getting through a scary time.
Logged
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
The Dr. of Wilsonomics
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11438


🍦🍦 fear2stop.bandcamp.com ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2020, 09:23:19 PM »

To clarify...when I meant it was hard to watch, I meant knowing what he was going through. I meant it on an empathetic level
Logged

RIP Daniel Dale Johnston ( 1961-2019)
_______________________________________________________
Fear 2 Stop: eating all of Elon Musk's nightmares as he sleeps

"I've never heard such ear-pleasing screams before!"
________________________________________________
Free Feel Flows!!!!

Just to let you know, no announcements re: FEEL FLOWS will be coming via a fanzine.
If and when the project picks up steam -- I promise you guys will be first to know.





覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧-

http://fear2stop.bandcamp.com/track/tricky-treats
Jay
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5890



View Profile
« Reply #14 on: November 06, 2020, 11:20:46 PM »

For me it's hard seeing him not looking a whole lot like Carl.
Logged

A son of anarchy surrounded by the hierarchy.
Jim V.
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2926



View Profile
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2020, 07:45:03 PM »

I知 not usually one to overdo it, but my God, what a voice. Only months left, with God knows how much strength and the voice sends a tingle down my spine. What a man. What a singer.
Logged
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9185


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2020, 10:49:00 AM »

I second all of the comments about Carl's final shows, the man loved the music and performing it for his fans, and did the best he could under terrible health conditions...and he also delivered great performances as shown in that video. What a singer indeed.

I just wish some of the same sentiments expressed here about Carl would be extended to his brother Brian in terms of performing, because in some circles (thankfully small but loud enough to notice) there have been voices for over 20 years trying to say Brian should quit performing, he's not up to it, his health is suffering, it's tough to see him on stage like that, etc.

When in reality all one needs to do is apply the same sentiments being directed to Carl's performing in 1997 and it makes perfect sense why and how Brian is still playing live and wants to play live even more once things straighten out in the world. How some can apply the sentiment of performing under tough physical circumstances to Carl but almost do the complete opposite toward Brian and suggest now for two decades that he should stop due to health issues is yet another one of those mysteries and contradictions surrounding the mindset of this band's fanbases and various factions.
Logged

"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
Emdeeh
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2649



View Profile
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2020, 11:34:25 AM »

Speaking of Brian, I got a survey from one of the larger local arts venues yesterday. In addition to the expected Covid-19 driven questions, they asked who would you like to see play there in the future. My response was "BRIAN WILSON!!!" I listed a number of other performers too, but Brian topped my list because this venue is absolutely perfect for his show.

Back to the Carl discussion. Love the man, love his voice.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2020, 11:35:14 AM by Emdeeh » Logged
UEF
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 224


Sheriff John-ston


View Profile
« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2020, 12:18:42 PM »

Quite a bit here too https://youtu.be/6AXmO42nfKU?t=4355
Logged
Gerry
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 321


View Profile
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2020, 01:11:38 PM »

Regarding affording the same kindness and understanding to Brian as people have to Carl: in 1997 Carl still sounded great, Brian, since approx. the last 10 years has not. However , if Brian wants to continue to tour, God bless him.
Logged
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9185


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #20 on: November 08, 2020, 01:48:57 PM »

Regarding affording the same kindness and understanding to Brian as people have to Carl: in 1997 Carl still sounded great, Brian, since approx. the last 10 years has not. However , if Brian wants to continue to tour, God bless him.

Understood, but the calls for Brian to step down and quit have been going on since his first tour in 1998. I've seen him sound great at shows I attended in person, nights where he was "on" and the crowd was fully engaged. I've seen videos which were less, sometimes far less, depending on the song too. But that's the nature of live performance. And unless someone had seen or been to all of those final shows Carl played, we don't know how consistently "on" he was either, and no one talks about it for obvious reasons, mainly that videos and audio of every show simply do not exist for us to hear. Reports are that Carl sang his heart out as best he could, and delivered for those shows which people attended and recalled, which is good enough for me.

But it wasn't the quality of the vocals I was pinpointing, maybe I didn't make that clear. How many comments both on fan forums and in various outlets have focused on Brian's difficulty walking, how he sat or moved, how he looked, how he had trouble getting on and off the stage as reasons why he needs to quit playing live shows...and just like Carl's appearance in 1997, what the f*** does that have to do with the music when it's all tallied up? I'm just saying for all of those who made such comments about how Brian looked bad, or looked like he was struggling physically on stage, what about trying to answer that scenario using the sentiments about Carl's physical difficulties and health issues in '97, and showing a little equity across the two situations? You can't suggest one thing for one scenario where physical health and appearance to audiences was a factor, then totally flip the opinion for another when similar issues were in play, in these cases physical appearances and struggles on stage.

One thing to recall too, and this may not be popular to bring up but it's worth mentioning, is how it was Brian in '97 who defended Carl's decision to continue touring despite his health struggles and told BRI essentially that Carl should be able to decide how long he wants to play shows with The Beach Boys. This was in response to a band member sending a letter to BRI saying Carl's health issues and on-stage appearance were of such concern that either Carl leave the band or the one writing the letter would quit. Fortunately that never happened, and again in part thanks to Brian saying Carl should be allowed to tour as long as he wishes to tour as a Beach Boy.

Logged

"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
Lonely Summer
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3529


View Profile
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2020, 02:23:41 PM »

The difference is that Carl was always part of the touring Beach Boys - well, okay, someone will point out 1981 as the exception, but he was touring on his own that year. Touring was a big part of his life. Brian dropped out of the touring band very early on, and his appearances with them after 1964 were sporadic at best. I was always told that Brian's home was in the studio, that he didn't like playing live. I did see him with the group a couple times - the Kingdome in Seattle, 1983; his contributions were minimal; and in 1985 at the Puyallup Fair, subbing for Carl. He sang God Only Knows and played the key-tar on some songs. I thought it was cool to see him with the group, but it was not something I expected.
so now when I see video of him being wheeled out on stage, sitting behind his piano looking uncomfortable, appearing to be in pain, I don't enjoy it. Maybe with all the time off this year he will regain some of his physical strength. Or maybe not. I have no idea what he is doing with his time right now.
Brian and Carl - two completely different people, different situations.
Logged
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9185


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2020, 04:28:03 PM »

The difference is that Carl was always part of the touring Beach Boys - well, okay, someone will point out 1981 as the exception, but he was touring on his own that year. Touring was a big part of his life. Brian dropped out of the touring band very early on, and his appearances with them after 1964 were sporadic at best. I was always told that Brian's home was in the studio, that he didn't like playing live. I did see him with the group a couple times - the Kingdome in Seattle, 1983; his contributions were minimal; and in 1985 at the Puyallup Fair, subbing for Carl. He sang God Only Knows and played the key-tar on some songs. I thought it was cool to see him with the group, but it was not something I expected.
so now when I see video of him being wheeled out on stage, sitting behind his piano looking uncomfortable, appearing to be in pain, I don't enjoy it. Maybe with all the time off this year he will regain some of his physical strength. Or maybe not. I have no idea what he is doing with his time right now.
Brian and Carl - two completely different people, different situations.

How different is it when you break it down to the basics and see two musicians on stage playing through physical pain and other health issues which we can't even pretend to know what they're going through yet are still out there doing shows for their fans? And both of them expressed the desire to do just that - Continue touring and performing their music for the fans. The contradiction is when Carl's decision to continue touring despite all the issues is and was (rightfully) praised, and Brian for over two decades now has been saddled with this false narrative that he's being "forced" to play and shouldn't be playing because of how he looks on stage despite Brian himself telling people he wants to get back on the road again.

The difference - which is a sad one - is that Brian has these small pockets of Beach Boys fans who have been saying he should quit for years against his own stated wishes because of how he comes off on stage or again the fallacy of being "forced" onto these tours, and Carl had the fans behind him all the way yet had a fellow bandmate write a letter to BRI threatening to quit because of Carl's health issues on tour. Again for everyone praising Carl's decision to keep playing through the pain, and I'm one of them, and even more those fortunate enough to see him live one last time on his final run of live shows, it's a good thing Brian among others stepped in and said Carl should be allowed to make that decision himself to tour as a Beach Boy or to quit, and not be hit with an ultimatum from a bandmate because his health had taken a turn for the worst.

If musicians like Brian and Carl want to tour, and fans are wanting to see them play in person, let them decide to tour or stay home. Not pockets of fan bases complaining or bandmates issuing an ultimatum.
Logged

"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
juggler
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 776


View Profile
« Reply #23 on: November 08, 2020, 10:32:30 PM »

One thing to recall too, and this may not be popular to bring up but it's worth mentioning, is how it was Brian in '97 who defended Carl's decision to continue touring despite his health struggles and told BRI essentially that Carl should be able to decide how long he wants to play shows with The Beach Boys. This was in response to a band member sending a letter to BRI saying Carl's health issues and on-stage appearance were of such concern that either Carl leave the band or the one writing the letter would quit. Fortunately that never happened, and again in part thanks to Brian saying Carl should be allowed to tour as long as he wishes to tour as a Beach Boy.

Hadn't heard that story.  Interesting.  An example (perhaps a rare one) of BRI *Brother* Records Inc. living up its to name.
Logged
HeyJude
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 9096



View Profile WWW
« Reply #24 on: November 09, 2020, 07:24:05 AM »

One thing to recall too, and this may not be popular to bring up but it's worth mentioning, is how it was Brian in '97 who defended Carl's decision to continue touring despite his health struggles and told BRI essentially that Carl should be able to decide how long he wants to play shows with The Beach Boys. This was in response to a band member sending a letter to BRI saying Carl's health issues and on-stage appearance were of such concern that either Carl leave the band or the one writing the letter would quit. Fortunately that never happened, and again in part thanks to Brian saying Carl should be allowed to tour as long as he wishes to tour as a Beach Boy.


Ray Lawlor a few years back finally filled in these details on that episode, and it is indeed important info. All we previously knew was Elliott Lott saying in a Rolling Stone article that Mike had not wanted to appear on stage with Carl anymore, but that it was "out of love" because Carl was on oxygen and wearing a wig, etc. Ray filled in more details, indicating that Mike sent a letter to BRI saying either Carl would have to be told to leave the tour, or he (Mike) was going to leave.

After that, though, the timeline is still murky only in that we don't know whether BRI ever answered or acted on that letter, or if Carl's health leading to him leaving the tour rendered the letter moot. Ray mentioned that Brian's take on the situation was that Carl should be allowed to tour as long as he (Carl) felt he was able to and wanted.

I'm guessing the letter was rendered moot before long, as Mike never quit in 1997 as far as I can tell, and there's no evidence Carl leaving (temporarily at the time) in August of 1997 was due to anything but immediate health issues. If Carl had gotten somewhat better but was still in rough shape and tried to continue touring later in 1997 or 1998, perhaps then there would have been that impasse with Mike vis-a-vis BRI. Remember as well that the whole Al/David thing was going down at this same time. Things may have gotten *even uglier* in 1997/98 had all that happened at the same time.

Dark times for the band in a myriad of ways.
Logged

THE BEACH BOYS OPINION PAGE IS ON FACEBOOK!!! http://www.facebook.com/beachboysopinion - Check out the original "BEACH BOYS OPINION PAGE" Blog - http://beachboysopinion.blogspot.com/
gfx
Pages: [1] 2 Go Up Print 
gfx
Jump to:  
gfx
Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.482 seconds with 21 queries.
Helios Multi design by Bloc
gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!