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662027 Posts in 26535 Topics by 3795 Members - Latest Member: SeaOfTunes September 23, 2020, 03:57:57 AM
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Author Topic: Barnyard and Mrs O'Leary's Cow  (Read 456 times)
juggler
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« on: September 07, 2020, 11:33:40 PM »

This may have already been discussed at various points over the decades, but if it has, I missed it.  So here goes...  To my ear, at various points of MOLC, the drum pattern echoes the barnyard verse melody (i.e.,  "out in the barnyard the cook is chopping lumber").  I'm talking about the parts of MOLC that can be heard very clearly 0:26-029, 0:46-0:48, 1:04-1:07 on the tracking session excerpts on Disc 4 of TSS box.  You could sing an up-tempo "out in the farmyard the chickens do their number" over those parts.

Is this simply the case of Brian using some of the same musical ideas in multiple tracks?  Or is it an intentional echo across both tracks, just as there's an echo of Good Vibrations in Look, etc.?  No one seems to talk much about Barnyard as a potential Elements section, but could it have been?  Obviously, there's a farmyard animal theme with both pieces.  Barnyard, of course, began life as part of the Heroes and Villains orbit, but The Elements of course has its own connections to H&V, with what's used as the Fire Intro was recorded as "Heroes and Villains intro." Obviously the whole project was very fluid, and with the "Teenage Symphony to God" concept, perhaps it's not surprising that Brian might have borrowed the classical music concept of introducing various musical ideas in the overture (H&V?) that will reappear in later movements.

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thetojo
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« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2020, 12:05:29 AM »

I have suggested Barnyard as Earth.

I would say your onto something -

I might have another look at the Frank Holmes cartoons and have a think about a more extensive post here.
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SaltyMarshmallow
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« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2020, 02:25:12 AM »

There weren't really any intentional musical echoes through Smile, only recycled ideas that tended to result in the source song getting scrapped. Early fanmixes brought those repeating elements together through necessity and then BWPS decided to lean into it as a feature.

As for this, if there's anything there I think it's just because Brian often wrote in I-IV vamps at the time and used a small bag of similar rhythms. I personally don't hear it though. About half of everything from that era could be sung over anything else at random if you change the key and/or tempo. Pet Sounds has its repeating melodic motifs and chord patterns too, but that's down to writing habits rather than an attempt to connect things.

The Elements was The Elements - it was 1/4 or thereabouts of an unfinished track and wasn't worked on post-November. Its connection to the H&V 'intro' (I think that title is a mistake due to misreading the tape box anyway) didn't get established until decades later.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2020, 02:30:27 AM by SaltyMarshmallow » Logged
juggler
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« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2020, 10:43:39 AM »

I personally don't hear it though. About half of everything from that era could be sung over anything else at random if you change the key and/or tempo. Pet Sounds has its repeating melodic motifs and chord patterns too, but that's down to writing habits rather than an attempt to connect things.

Fair enough, but I would invite you to review the melody that Brian vocalizes at 3:02-3:07 in the Humble Harv demo (TSS, Disc 2, Track 36).  That is a down-tempo version of the aforementioned Fire drum pattern.  But, yeah, I'm just throwing this out there for discussion.   As you say, repeating melodic motifs and chord patterns doesn't necessarily imply something other than the same composer doing his thing.  In some of the Good Vibrations sessions, you can hear chord patters that turn up again in various H&V sessions.
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krabklaw
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« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2020, 02:14:26 PM »

This may have already been discussed at various points over the decades, but if it has, I missed it.  So here goes...  To my ear, at various points of MOLC, the drum pattern echoes the barnyard verse melody (i.e.,  "out in the barnyard the cook is chopping lumber").  I'm talking about the parts of MOLC that can be heard very clearly 0:26-029, 0:46-0:48, 1:04-1:07 on the tracking session excerpts on Disc 4 of TSS box.  You could sing an up-tempo "out in the farmyard the chickens do their number" over those parts.

Is this simply the case of Brian using some of the same musical ideas in multiple tracks?  Or is it an intentional echo across both tracks, just as there's an echo of Good Vibrations in Look, etc.?  No one seems to talk much about Barnyard as a potential Elements section, but could it have been?  Obviously, there's a farmyard animal theme with both pieces.  Barnyard, of course, began life as part of the Heroes and Villains orbit, but The Elements of course has its own connections to H&V, with what's used as the Fire Intro was recorded as "Heroes and Villains intro." Obviously the whole project was very fluid, and with the "Teenage Symphony to God" concept, perhaps it's not surprising that Brian might have borrowed the classical music concept of introducing various musical ideas in the overture (H&V?) that will reappear in later movements.


As I recall it, the use of the H&V intro being combined with Mrs. Oleary  didn't come from Brian. It was writers and fan mixers who did it when Smile speculation was an ongoing hot topic and the idea has just stuck over the years.
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Please visit 'The American(a) Trip Slideshow' where you can watch the videos and listen to fan mixes of all the Smile songs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doOws3284PQ&list=PLptIp1kEl6BWNpXyJ_mb20W4ZqJ14-Hgg
thetojo
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« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2020, 02:37:20 PM »

Quote from: krabklaw link=topic=27318.msg664855#msg664855
As I recall it, the use of the H&V intro being combined with Mrs. Oleary  didn't come from Brian. It was writers and fan mixers who did it when Smile speculation was an ongoing hot topic and the idea has just stuck over the years.

Didn't this combo first appear in the Linnet mixes of 1988. The thrust of what you say is correct though, it didn't come from Brian.
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SaltyMarshmallow
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« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2020, 04:24:03 PM »

Quote from: krabklaw link=topic=27318.msg664855#msg664855
As I recall it, the use of the H&V intro being combined with Mrs. Oleary  didn't come from Brian. It was writers and fan mixers who did it when Smile speculation was an ongoing hot topic and the idea has just stuck over the years.

Didn't this combo first appear in the Linnet mixes of 1988. The thrust of what you say is correct though, it didn't come from Brian.

Yeah, that was its debut. Not that it isn't a great idea!
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