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Author Topic: How many corporate/private gigs have The BBs/ Brian done in their careers?  (Read 2398 times)
rab2591
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« Reply #25 on: February 01, 2020, 02:31:38 PM »

And for something so absurd, no less, as a big-game or trophy hunting corporate gig...it's hard to fathom but here we are on February 1, 2020 witnessing this.

I think we've been spoiled by a drama-free Mike for 12+ months now? It was only a matter of time before something absurd like this happened.
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« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2020, 02:41:29 PM »

I'm puzzled as to why Mike and Bruce, who are vegetarians, are even considering playing this event.

Money "Trumps" All
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« Reply #27 on: February 01, 2020, 11:03:13 PM »

I'm puzzled as to why Mike and Bruce, who are vegetarians, are even considering playing this event.


$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$...etc.

And from all indications, no sense of the bigger picture beyond the noses on their faces.

In other words, Mike either doesn't get it, or he doesn't care. And BRI as a corporate entity with any say in the use of the brand name must not give a sh*t at all at this point.

It's sad to see all the negative comments about the Beach Boys' music and people saying they're going to boycott the music when this is 100% on Mike Love and NOT THE BEACH BOYS. Even 50 people saying this kind of thing would be sad considering what the music of The Beach Boys has been known for.

How very sad.

Wonder what BRI and other entities with skin in this game are thinking when there is a petition like this going around against "The Beach Boys" when it's really Mike Love and his management making these calls.

Asking the age-old question...Where's the outrage? Those who know who I'm talking about will get it.

Some of those comments were heartbreaking....but I completely get why they're pissed off.

And there are still those who think The Beach Boys legacy can go completely untarnished no matter what. Just because The Beach Boys recorded 'Wouldn't It Be Nice' doesn't mean that every stupid thing they've done since then doesn't partially latch onto their image. Case in point: any time a major news article comes out about The Beach Boys, no matter what the subject is about, you always read how fractious the relationship between some of the members is because of their history of lawsuits. Their music isn't some magical antidote designed to erase the humanity/history of the band. The words and actions of the band go hand-in-hand with the music.

And the more dumb crap they do the more fodder the media will have to create click-bait articles about the band. And the media and pop-culture does a great job at shaping public opinion. Ask people in my parents' generation about the Beach Boys they talk about the lawsuits. Ask people from my generation about The Beach Boys and they talk about Full House. No, it's clearly not all about the music as some like to spout. Now they are gigging an event that glorifies the needless slaughter of beautiful animals.

My question is that if TM-loving Mr. Positivity vegetarian Mike Love actually wanted to do this gig, did anyone in the band or management question/protest the involvement? If not for the love of the animals, how about at least the love of the entity they have been entrusted with (The Beach Boys name).

Welp, the petition is nearing 5,000 signatures...can't wait to see how this unfolds.

After all these years there *has to be* some basic knowledge that the name "The Beach Boys" is a legacy of beautiful music which heals and makes people happy above all else, and an event or action that compels thousands of people to sign a petition or react negatively to the name "Beach Boys" is *not* in the best interest of the band, the legacy, the music, and all who love and want to protect it.

No matter what that event or action may be, I'm shocked that Mike, his management, or BRI (or a combination of all three and more) would have agreed to something like this...knowing there was a potential hot-button issue at the center of it that could cause a backlash which ultimately harms the band, the legacy, and above all the music.

Like I said earlier, they're aiming for 5,000 signatures on the petition - Even if it were 50 people out there saying they will no longer listen to the music of The Beach Boys because of something done by Mike Love that has nothing to do with the band itself or the music, it would be beyond sad to see the music and fan enjoyment of it tarnished that way.

And for something so absurd, no less, as a big-game or trophy hunting corporate gig...it's hard to fathom but here we are on February 1, 2020 witnessing this.

Just play another gig at a fair, a theater, or regular venue instead. Leave these kinds of gigs for other acts whose legacies are nowhere near as special as the Beach Boys.

You said everything Iíve been thinking since this ugly piece of news came to my attention.  I could not agree more with everything youíve said.  I might be naive, but Iím truly shocked that Mike and his management thought that any of this was okay. 

It makes me so sad.  Itís one thing to cringe at the many embarrassing moments theyíve racked up over the years but this is a level of hypocrisy and immorality that I just canít tolerate. 
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Tord
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« Reply #28 on: February 02, 2020, 10:08:54 PM »

It seems like Brian has signed the petition now!

https://brianwilson.websitetoolbox.com/post/show_single_post?pid=1310681361&postcount=37&forum=250209
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« Reply #29 on: February 02, 2020, 10:41:01 PM »

In my opinion, I really don't see what the big deal is. Most of us hear including myself eat meat. We cause a lot of pain to millions and millions of animals for our meals. I think there is a lot of hypocrisy happening right now with this.

We ignore our own shortcomings and point out someone else's.

The event will go on either way. I don't mind them playing there, It's the same as performing a private gig for a company that sells meat, or even a concert that was sponsored by a meat company.

Honestly, would any of us here sign a petition if the band was performing at a venue that was sponsored by a meat company?

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« Reply #30 on: February 02, 2020, 11:18:10 PM »

I would rather not debate the issue other than to say we all have our causes and beliefs that while legal, many find abhorrent.

My interest with the current debate is the hypocrisy M&B are showing with the environment. They have often plugged The Surfrider Foundation, an organisation promoting clean beaches and the ocean I believe. For Bruce and Mike, thatís their environmental cause. For others itís trying to outlaw trophy hunting.

I didnít want to bring it up, but whatís next. An NRA rally? Perfectly legal as well.

Ok, apologies if this thread derails into a sh!tstorm of ugliness, so Iíll leave it there.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2020, 11:23:52 PM by Pretty Funky » Logged
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« Reply #31 on: February 02, 2020, 11:46:41 PM »

In my opinion, I really don't see what the big deal is. Most of us hear including myself eat meat. We cause a lot of pain to millions and millions of animals for our meals. I think there is a lot of hypocrisy happening right now with this.

We ignore our own shortcomings and point out someone else's.

The event will go on either way. I don't mind them playing there, It's the same as performing a private gig for a company that sells meat, or even a concert that was sponsored by a meat company.

Honestly, would any of us here sign a petition if the band was performing at a venue that was sponsored by a meat company?



50,000 plus people so far disagree with you and were compelled enough by this event to sign a petition. Can you label all of them hypocrites without knowing how many of those thousands are vegetarians,  vegans,  or how many more may eat meat but just don't support the hunting and safari style killing of exotic animals for the purpose of bagging a trophy rather than hunting for food? I think the real hypocrisy is coming from Mike after decades of promoting and writing/singing about environmental causes including animal protection and then playing a gig and taking money for a gig like this. And there are those who signed who may not like the name and legacy of The Beach Boys attached to safari, big game, and trophy hunting considering what the music has stood for since the 60's.

But again, that's why people felt strongly enough to sign this petition. It's a message being sent directly to BB's management and Mike that they don't agree with this decision.
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« Reply #32 on: February 02, 2020, 11:59:38 PM »

I get where you're coming from. I definitely don't know how many of the 50,000 are meat eaters or not, But I highly doubt that this petition would exist if the band played for a meat company.

Definite hypocrisy on Mike's part but there is also hypocrisy coming from us here.
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #33 on: February 03, 2020, 12:01:04 AM »

In my opinion, I really don't see what the big deal is. Most of us hear including myself eat meat. We cause a lot of pain to millions and millions of animals for our meals. I think there is a lot of hypocrisy happening right now with this.

We ignore our own shortcomings and point out someone else's.

The event will go on either way. I don't mind them playing there, It's the same as performing a private gig for a company that sells meat, or even a concert that was sponsored by a meat company.

Honestly, would any of us here sign a petition if the band was performing at a venue that was sponsored by a meat company?



50,000 plus people so far disagree with you and were compelled enough by this event to sign a petition. Can you label all of them hypocrites without knowing how many of those thousands are vegetarians,  vegans,  or how many more may eat meat but just don't support the hunting and safari style killing of exotic animals for the purpose of bagging a trophy rather than hunting for food? I think the real hypocrisy is coming from Mike after decades of promoting and writing/singing about environmental causes including animal protection and then playing a gig and taking money for a gig like this. And there are those who signed who may not like the name and legacy of The Beach Boys attached to safari, big game, and trophy hunting considering what the music has stood for since the 60's.

But again, that's why people felt strongly enough to sign this petition. It's a message being sent directly to BB's management and Mike that they don't agree with this decision.

These 50k+ signers aren't "Mike haters" either. Read through the comments - they are music fans, casual fans, 50-year BBs fans, and plain old decent folks with ethics, who are disgusted and won't have anything to do with the brand anymore. Awesome work, Mike. Hope it was worth it.

I am guessing he is aware of the petition now, and is stubbornly not backing down to "show them" and not have anyone dare question his behavior or decisions. Cold-blooded slaughter of the otter, uh-huh
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 12:12:02 AM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
rab2591
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« Reply #34 on: February 03, 2020, 02:41:33 AM »

Honestly, would any of us here sign a petition if the band was performing at a venue that was sponsored by a meat company?

Why would I support the end to eating all meat when for some people that is a means of survival? Yet there is absolutely no one in the world right now whose survival depends on the skinning/decapitating of an exotic animal that has been needlessly killed for the sport of it.

If the push to become a more civilized species depended on a complete lack of hypocrisy we would still be climbing trees. Fact is that every person alive is doing something that kills another living thing...even vegetarians. This doesn't mean that we have no right to attempt to stop something that is clearly wrong. Hunting/killing animals to merely survive (as some places in this world just don't have enough farmland to sustain that local population) is going to happen for the time-being. What doesn't need to happen is rich people getting airlifted to exotic parts of the world to needlessly hunt wildlife all so they can mount a taxidermied head to their wall. What doesn't need to happen is Mike Love using The Beach Boys music to promote this sociopathic hobby.

Someone is being paid right now to delete negative comments about this gig from The Beach Boys Facebook page. That alone should enrage any fan regardless of your stance on this issue. It is clear that the need for a quick buck is far more important than longtime fans of The Beach Boys being able to express their valid opinion. Not surprising considering just 15 years ago Mike's lawsuit at Brian and Co. completely lied about Brian in an attempt to gouge his pockets.

Elsewhere someone is defending the convention itself in an attempt to defend Mike. Here we are being called hypocrites. I know some of you have to defend Mike at all costs, but maybe look past that for two seconds and see that this is genuinely a wrong cause for The Beach Boys (of all bands) to support.
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« Reply #35 on: February 03, 2020, 06:37:50 AM »

Mike needs the name taken away if it means this little to him.
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« Reply #36 on: February 03, 2020, 06:46:57 AM »

The PR aspect vs. the moral/ethical issue are two separate things (though can certainly be related).

Regardless of one's personal opinion, this is awful PR for Mike and his band, and also unfortunately awful PR for the *brand*, because we're just seeing "Boycott the Beach Boys!", not "Boycott the touring operation who licenses use of the trademark solely for touring purposes!"

There's no reason to expect non-fans (or even casual fans) to know the ins-and-outs of the license. And frankly, the shareholders over the years who didn't vote against this licensing set-up have helped this situation to continually arise from time to time over the years. This happened back in 2017 with the inauguration debacle. Mike ended up not playing the actual main event, but did end up playing some black tie private event in town tied to the inauguration. I guess that flew under the radar enough that that particular PR debacle blew over.

As to the personal moral/ethical debate, that could go on endlessly here. Simply put, there are surely plenty of "meat eaters" who are still against this. If anything, it says something about the abhorrent nature of "trophy hunting" that the issue unites plenty of "meat eaters" with staunch vegetarians and animal rights activists.

I have no idea if Mike would possibly cancel this gig. Looking at the news online, this story is (both fortunately and unfortunately) not seeming to hit the big media outlets. A Google News search on "The Beach Boys" shows no hits regarding this story in the first few pages. This seems to be a thing getting passed around on social media.
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« Reply #37 on: February 03, 2020, 06:50:33 AM »

Someone needs to tell the organizer of this online petition that Elliott Lott isn't the Manager of the band nor President of BRI, and hasn't been for some years.

https://www.change.org/p/beach-boys-stop-supporting-trophy-hunting

Jerry Schilling is still the president of BRI as far as I know. I don't know if they have anyone working for BRI who actually has the title of "Manager." The individual members (well, at least Brian and Mike) have their own personal managers.

I also wish the petition delineated between Mike's "Beach Boys" and the band/corporation as a whole. I'm not really particularly for a boycott of the band's back catalog of music. The boycott should be of Mike's touring band, and Mike's solo material.
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« Reply #38 on: February 03, 2020, 07:29:25 AM »


The boycott should be of Mike's touring band, and Mike's solo material.


22 years this week. (Carlís death)
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« Reply #39 on: February 03, 2020, 07:57:06 AM »

I also wish the petition delineated between Mike's "Beach Boys" and the band/corporation as a whole. I'm not really particularly for a boycott of the band's back catalog of music. The boycott should be of Mike's touring band, and Mike's solo material.

But Brian, Al, and Carlís estate can take away the license. So this is their issue as well. Believe me, I wish this had nothing to do with those guys but it does. Say Mike goes through with this, and what if he does the gig again next year? Thatís 54,000 people and counting that BRI is actively ignoring.

So while this was Mikeís decision, Brian and Al and Carlís estate will be making money from this gig (at least Iím assuming they also make money from private shows?) - so they can be held responsible as well. Thus the boycotting of the catalogue: in my opinion if The Beach Boys (Brian, Al, Carlís estate) as a whole decide itís cool for Mike to play gigs like this, then why wouldnít we boycott the music that is helping put money in their pockets?
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« Reply #40 on: February 03, 2020, 09:02:23 AM »

I also wish the petition delineated between Mike's "Beach Boys" and the band/corporation as a whole. I'm not really particularly for a boycott of the band's back catalog of music. The boycott should be of Mike's touring band, and Mike's solo material.

But Brian, Al, and Carlís estate can take away the license. So this is their issue as well. Believe me, I wish this had nothing to do with those guys but it does. Say Mike goes through with this, and what if he does the gig again next year? Thatís 54,000 people and counting that BRI is actively ignoring.

So while this was Mikeís decision, Brian and Al and Carlís estate will be making money from this gig (at least Iím assuming they also make money from private shows?) - so they can be held responsible as well. Thus the boycotting of the catalogue: in my opinion if The Beach Boys (Brian, Al, Carlís estate) as a whole decide itís cool for Mike to play gigs like this, then why wouldnít we boycott the music that is helping put money in their pockets?

This is true, but I have a lot of understanding for an almost 78-year-old Brian, who surely at this age doesn't want to get into a prolonged legal conflict with his litigious cousin. Think about Brian's options at this point. He would literally have a giant legal albatross over his shoulder indefinitely as he approaches 80, because Mike I'm sure would do *everything* in his power to get his way and never under any circumstances budge on the license, and I'm sure Mike's lawyers would have no qualms with making any opposing parties' lives as miserable as possible, and drag things on and on and on.

It's not good for anybody's health.   So I'd say Brian's hands are more or less tied, unless he can do more subtle guilt trip stuff on social media to get Mike to realize the bad PR on this.

What a situation. Depraved sh*t, and Mike is so, so, so out of touch with reality and bereft of ethics to think this is something decent to do.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 09:14:11 AM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #41 on: February 03, 2020, 09:03:06 AM »

Guys, this just depresses the hell out of me.
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« Reply #42 on: February 03, 2020, 09:21:19 AM »

I also wish the petition delineated between Mike's "Beach Boys" and the band/corporation as a whole. I'm not really particularly for a boycott of the band's back catalog of music. The boycott should be of Mike's touring band, and Mike's solo material.

But Brian, Al, and Carlís estate can take away the license. So this is their issue as well. Believe me, I wish this had nothing to do with those guys but it does. Say Mike goes through with this, and what if he does the gig again next year? Thatís 54,000 people and counting that BRI is actively ignoring.

So while this was Mikeís decision, Brian and Al and Carlís estate will be making money from this gig (at least Iím assuming they also make money from private shows?) - so they can be held responsible as well. Thus the boycotting of the catalogue: in my opinion if The Beach Boys (Brian, Al, Carlís estate) as a whole decide itís cool for Mike to play gigs like this, then why wouldnít we boycott the music that is helping put money in their pockets?

I mentioned in my previous post that the shareholders have some level of responsibility for the current state of affairs concerning the license.

That being said, as far I'm aware, Al Jardine voted against Mike getting an exclusive license back in 1998-ish, and there has reportedly been no vote undertaken since that initial vote. So you can't hold Al much responsible.

As to the issue of the idea that "Brian, Al, and Carl's estate can take the license away", the short answer to that is that it's effectively nearly impossible to do in their lifetime. If they moved to do so, it would likely be tied up in litigation for years.

So yes, technically all three other shareholders could start making moves to take the license away. But it would be very expensive, would tie things up for years, and yield nobody any benefit in their lifetimes. I'm not even sure they'd succeed in a temporary injunction against Mike using the name.

Now, I think some shareholders who never put up a fight back in 1998 can be held responsible to some degree for this state of affairs, of essentially allowing Mike to assert a "possession is 9/10 of the law" sort of stance on this thing.

I'd say where the shareholders currently seemingly could at least *try* to do *something* would be to flex just a little bit more muscle. Within a corporation, there is something in between rolling over versus taking the license away. They could try to get everybody to the negotiating table and say "Okay Mike, we know it would be hard on everyone to just vote to take the license away. But we have some concerns about a few of your bookings. If you want to avoid a big hassle, we'd simply ask you to refrain from just a few shows that we feel would reflect negatively on the brand as a whole."

I'm not naive. Even that scenario isn't likely or particularly possible. But especially considering the bruising the brand took PR-wise back in 2017, you'd think Brian, Al, and Carl's estate would try to assert themselves in just a few specific cases.

But I'm not going to lay a ton of blame for this latest debacle on Brian or Al. It's really not practical, given the current status quo (regardless of how we got to this place), to suggest Brian and Al could prevent this gig from happening. It's really on Mike at this moment in time to make that call.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 09:26:15 AM by HeyJude » Logged

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« Reply #43 on: February 03, 2020, 09:26:33 AM »

54 years of excuses to make for this guy are 54 years too many. Yes, I know what he contributed, but he's still lost the benefit of the doubt from me, forever. And I will still enjoy the old music, but I'm taking the memorabilia down, and I'm not wearing the T-shirts in public anymore, either. A lot of people don't know the difference between the touring band and the musical legacy, and I don't need or want that association attributed to me. It's against everything I stand for as a compassionate human.
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« Reply #44 on: February 03, 2020, 09:45:21 AM »

Honestly, would any of us here sign a petition if the band was performing at a venue that was sponsored by a meat company?

Why would I support the end to eating all meat when for some people that is a means of survival? Yet there is absolutely no one in the world right now whose survival depends on the skinning/decapitating of an exotic animal that has been needlessly killed for the sport of it.

If the push to become a more civilized species depended on a complete lack of hypocrisy we would still be climbing trees. Fact is that every person alive is doing something that kills another living thing...even vegetarians. This doesn't mean that we have no right to attempt to stop something that is clearly wrong. Hunting/killing animals to merely survive (as some places in this world just don't have enough farmland to sustain that local population) is going to happen for the time-being. What doesn't need to happen is rich people getting airlifted to exotic parts of the world to needlessly hunt wildlife all so they can mount a taxidermied head to their wall. What doesn't need to happen is Mike Love using The Beach Boys music to promote this sociopathic hobby.

Someone is being paid right now to delete negative comments about this gig from The Beach Boys Facebook page. That alone should enrage any fan regardless of your stance on this issue. It is clear that the need for a quick buck is far more important than longtime fans of The Beach Boys being able to express their valid opinion. Not surprising considering just 15 years ago Mike's lawsuit at Brian and Co. completely lied about Brian in an attempt to gouge his pockets.

Elsewhere someone is defending the convention itself in an attempt to defend Mike. Here we are being called hypocrites. I know some of you have to defend Mike at all costs, but maybe look past that for two seconds and see that this is genuinely a wrong cause for The Beach Boys (of all bands) to support.

Yup.  There are a couple of points I'd like to make here.  

It's very very hard to live a life that causes no suffering to animals, but we can all try our best.  And some things are a lot easier than others.  I would say that saying no to ONE GIG is pretty easy.  

I don't think it's hypocrisy for anyone on this board to criticize Mike for playing this show.  This organization (Safari Club International) helps rich North Americans go to Africa to kill wild, often endangered, animals.  Elephants, rhinos, and many other species that are on track for extinction in a matter of years.  They justify it by saying that they're putting big bucks into the economies of these poor countries.  I personally don't think that killing elephants - one of the most intelligent and complex species in the world - is okay, and it doesn't matter to me how much you pay to do it or who your dad is, it's wrong and it definitely isn't "pro-conservation".  If I want to kill a rhino, does it make it okay if I pay $15 000 to do it?  Okay then.  So by that logic, can I also go into a poor country and buy a child bride if the price is high enough?  What else can I do if I have enough cash?  It's a disgusting concept.  

This is the organization that Mike and Bruce are going to play for on Wednesday.  It would be so easy to say no.  

And to add insult to injury, when longtime fans post legitimate questions on Mike's social media, the posts are simply deleted.  Over and over again.  Mr. Student Demonstration Time, social justice, peace-to-all:  deleting everything he doesn't like in an effort to keep this ugly gig out of the public eye.  

It makes me sick.  Many of you have been fans for much longer than I and have long been disenchanted by Mike.  I've always tried to focus on his musical contributions - and this may be naive, but I always respected that he was outspoken about the environment, clean water, etc...  But this whole disgusting business - and by that I mean both playing this gig AND the attempt at covering it up by deleting any mentions of it on social media - absolutely sickens me.  

My only wish at this point is that he might understand in some small way the extent to which this has deeply upset many many people who really care about the Beach Boys' music and legacy.  But I suspect that isn't likely. 



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« Reply #45 on: February 03, 2020, 09:50:02 AM »

54 years of excuses to make for this guy are 54 years too many. Yes, I know what he contributed, but he's still lost the benefit of the doubt from me, forever. And I will still enjoy the old music, but I'm taking the memorabilia down, and I'm not wearing the T-shirts in public anymore, either. A lot of people don't know the difference between the touring band and the musical legacy, and I don't need or want that association attributed to me. It's against everything I stand for as a compassionate human.

This actually makes me want to cry, because I agree with you 100 percent. 
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« Reply #46 on: February 03, 2020, 10:10:26 AM »

54 years of excuses to make for this guy are 54 years too many. Yes, I know what he contributed, but he's still lost the benefit of the doubt from me, forever. And I will still enjoy the old music, but I'm taking the memorabilia down, and I'm not wearing the T-shirts in public anymore, either. A lot of people don't know the difference between the touring band and the musical legacy, and I don't need or want that association attributed to me. It's against everything I stand for as a compassionate human.

This actually makes me want to cry, because I agree with you 100 percent.  

Yesterday I wore my uniqlo SMiLE shirt around the campus near where I live, and at one point a guy gave me kind of a funny look. I thought at the time that maybe he was just into the music or curious (I was blissfully unaware of the controversy yesterday), but now I wonder if he thought I could be wearing it as an act of defiance. I'm not taking a chance again.  Sad
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 10:12:30 AM by Mr. Tiger » Logged
Mr. Tiger
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« Reply #47 on: February 03, 2020, 10:18:25 AM »

This brings to mind the old Denny quote regarding the ballcapped one and karma. I won't repeat it because you all probably know it by heart.
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Jay
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« Reply #48 on: February 03, 2020, 10:24:04 AM »

Since the other petition thread is locked, I guess I'll ask this here. How many people on this board are meat-eaters?
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« Reply #49 on: February 03, 2020, 10:57:19 AM »

The thread is unlocked.
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"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
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