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Author Topic: Feel Flows box set  (Read 842186 times)
Menace Wilson
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« Reply #1150 on: August 15, 2020, 02:44:58 PM »

My guess is this is payback for the trophy hunting thing.  From here on out Mike will only support “his” BBs projects, which means corny remakes, etc. 
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« Reply #1151 on: August 15, 2020, 03:10:20 PM »

Hi, I have just joined the SS board, but have been massive BB fan since aged 10-ish (now 40) and they been my favorite band since then. I have been following the Feel Flows thread, checking in most days for news on a release, but alas, none so far. Still remaining optimistic we will see a release (soon), even if digital download only. Fingers and toes crossed!
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« Reply #1152 on: August 15, 2020, 03:33:20 PM »

Hi, I have just joined the SS board, but have been massive BB fan since aged 10-ish (now 40) and they been my favorite band since then. I have been following the Feel Flows thread, checking in most days for news on a release, but alas, none so far. Still remaining optimistic we will see a release (soon), even if digital download only. Fingers and toes crossed!

Welcome!!!

Hopefully we will see it released
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« Reply #1153 on: August 15, 2020, 04:00:31 PM »

Hi guys, I'm a huge BB fan and as such am desperate to see this thing come to light. I've always kept a eye on Smiley Smile to satiate my thirst for everything BB-related. The whole Feel Flows project and the work put into it behind the scenes has prompted me to sign up here and have my two-cents-worth - as stated previously, FF has the potential to be a game changer and in the grand scheme of things can only benefit this amazing band's legacy as a whole, personal differences aside. I'm sure there are many more like me who haven't voiced their love of the BBs on here before but really want to see the project come to full fruition and are ready to spend their hard-earned money on what would be the perfect Christmas present. I live in hope that one day the full FF set will sit next to my beloved BB vinyl collection and boxset releases.

Thanks for joining and adding your voice to the mix. For better or for worse, this place is looked at by those close to and (at times) by those in the band. So your voice is definitely noted. Hopefully whoever it is that is in the position of giving this set the green light will hear the voices and have a change of heart.
[/quote]


Absolutely. Jon Stebbins and Howie Edelson's contributions to this thread demonstrate the impact that SS has, and as and when the band members check in here I am sure they are struck by the passion and love for their work shown by their fans. I hope these sentiments can go some way to easing the problems that appear to be stalling this project.
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« Reply #1154 on: August 15, 2020, 04:05:13 PM »

rab, that pic reminds me of someone on the board who used to do amazing mockups of fantasy Beach Boys releases, during the Smile Sessions era perhaps (9 years, f***). Where is that valued poster these days?

I remember those! I forget who it was but man they really helped get us hyped up for the set. Can't believe that was almost 10 years ago - how time flies!

Hi guys, I'm a huge BB fan and as such am desperate to see this thing come to light. I've always kept a eye on Smiley Smile to satiate my thirst for everything BB-related. The whole Feel Flows project and the work put into it behind the scenes has prompted me to sign up here and have my two-cents-worth - as stated previously, FF has the potential to be a game changer and in the grand scheme of things can only benefit this amazing band's legacy as a whole, personal differences aside. I'm sure there are many more like me who haven't voiced their love of the BBs on here before but really want to see the project come to full fruition and are ready to spend their hard-earned money on what would be the perfect Christmas present. I live in hope that one day the full FF set will sit next to my beloved BB vinyl collection and boxset releases.

Thanks for joining and adding your voice to the mix. For better or for worse, this place is looked at by those close to and (at times) by those in the band. So your voice is definitely noted. Hopefully whoever it is that is in the position of giving this set the green light will hear the voices and have a change of heart.


Absolutely. Jon Stebbins and Howie Edelson's contributions to this thread demonstrate the impact that SS has, and as and when the band members check in here I am sure they are struck by the passion and love for their work shown by their fans. I hope these sentiments can go some way to easing the problems that appear to be stalling this project.
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« Reply #1155 on: August 15, 2020, 04:58:28 PM »

rab, that pic reminds me of someone on the board who used to do amazing mockups of fantasy Beach Boys releases, during the Smile Sessions era perhaps (9 years, f***). Where is that valued poster these days?

I remember those! I forget who it was but man they really helped get us hyped up for the set. Can't believe that was almost 10 years ago - how time flies!

Hi guys, I'm a huge BB fan and as such am desperate to see this thing come to light. I've always kept a eye on Smiley Smile to satiate my thirst for everything BB-related. The whole Feel Flows project and the work put into it behind the scenes has prompted me to sign up here and have my two-cents-worth - as stated previously, FF has the potential to be a game changer and in the grand scheme of things can only benefit this amazing band's legacy as a whole, personal differences aside. I'm sure there are many more like me who haven't voiced their love of the BBs on here before but really want to see the project come to full fruition and are ready to spend their hard-earned money on what would be the perfect Christmas present. I live in hope that one day the full FF set will sit next to my beloved BB vinyl collection and boxset releases.

Thanks for joining and adding your voice to the mix. For better or for worse, this place is looked at by those close to and (at times) by those in the band. So your voice is definitely noted. Hopefully whoever it is that is in the position of giving this set the green light will hear the voices and have a change of heart.


Absolutely. Jon Stebbins and Howie Edelson's contributions to this thread demonstrate the impact that SS has, and as and when the band members check in here I am sure they are struck by the passion and love for their work shown by their fans. I hope these sentiments can go some way to easing the problems that appear to be stalling this project.

This place can get rather opinionated, so I’m sure whenever band members decide to visit they either see great support or very blunt negative criticism. Al Jardine is probably the only one who escapes any criticism however haha. Just the nature of any fandom I suppose.

You’re absolutely right though. While I do complain about Mike, I really hope he knows that every fan does appreciate what he brought to the music - be it his unique vocals or incredible lyrical contributions. And I hope Brian knows that even in the face of criticism for his solo output that the reason why we’re all willing to sign up for a message board is because of his music.

We all do have great passion for this music - whether it’s OldSurferDude or Cam Mott. We’re all here because we freaking love this band, the history of this band, and the drama that follows this band. This is just yet another part of a chapter in The Beach Boys saga, and hopefully this chapter has a happy ending.
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« Reply #1156 on: August 15, 2020, 05:07:18 PM »

Hi guys, I'm a huge BB fan and as such am desperate to see this thing come to light. I've always kept an eye on Smiley Smile to satiate my thirst for everything BB-related. The whole Feel Flows project and the work put into it behind the scenes has prompted me to sign up here and have my two-cents-worth - as stated previously, FF has the potential to be a game changer and in the grand scheme of things can only benefit this amazing band's legacy as a whole, personal differences aside. I'm sure there are many more like me who haven't voiced their love of the BBs on here before but really want to see the project come to full fruition and are ready to spend their hard-earned money on what would be the perfect Christmas present. I live in hope that one day the full FF set will sit next to my beloved BB vinyl collection and boxset releases.
Welcome to the board!
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« Reply #1157 on: August 15, 2020, 06:25:00 PM »

Welcome, as well!  We are happy to have you.
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Joel Goldenberg
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« Reply #1158 on: August 15, 2020, 06:41:31 PM »

The idea that the Feel Flows box would change the public perception of who the Beach Boys are and what they represent has me thinking, how would Mike and Bruce have to respond to this? Would it mean a return to guru robes for Mike (and showing his bald head on stage)? Would all the surfing, cars, girls songs be replaced with the likes of Be Still, Meant For You, Country Air, Wake the World, All I Wanna Do, This Whole World, Long Promised Road, All This is That, and the full California Saga? Would Bruce actually sit at a grand piano, in long pants, playing audible parts?
No more beach balls in the crowds; pass the incense and peppermints instead.
No more state fair and Seaworld gigs; instead, they would play colleges and coffee houses.
Instead of selling t-shirts and baseball caps, the souvenir stand would feature organic vege-tables, herbal supplements, and copies of Whole Earth News.


And tubes of Mama Says organic toothpaste. Also, the concert stage could be a replica of the Radiant Radish.
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« Reply #1159 on: August 16, 2020, 05:05:35 PM »

Someone on the Hoffman forum claims to know the real reason the box is delayed.  Of course he isn't telling, so...
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« Reply #1160 on: August 17, 2020, 05:00:33 AM »

Someone on the Hoffman forum claims to know the real reason the box is delayed.  Of course he isn't telling, so...

Yeah, I asked if he could give anything close to a indication of how he feels it's going... and he kinda sits where we are. It's more (he says) that he knows someone in the know, rather than actually knowing the project.
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« Reply #1161 on: August 17, 2020, 05:10:39 AM »

My guess is this is payback for the trophy hunting thing. 

Totally doubtful.  Assuming Mike is the culprit in the first place (we're just making educated assumptions after all), this seems like it's just him being his usual difficult self. 
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« Reply #1162 on: August 17, 2020, 05:24:59 AM »

The more I read this thread the more I just feel frustrated.
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« Reply #1163 on: August 17, 2020, 05:48:09 AM »

Two more points on this:

—There is a massive irony in play at this point when one takes a look at the material in the recent ESQ related to SUNFLOWER. In the interview segment Mike and Bruce are prominent (far more so than Brian) and both speak positively about the material on the LP--and, what’s more, each goes out of his way to say positive things about Dennis' songs on the LP.

That said, it's another step from a warm/fuzzy memory of the material officially released on the LP to an all-out endorsement of opening up the vaults and releasing scores of unreleased material. That's why it is so crucial that someone leak the actual contents of the FEEL FLOWS box set: not only is it the only way that the music press will be cognizant of just how much is there and how much of a game-changer such a wealth of material is, but it's also the only way we are ever going to be able to determine what the actual reason for the hold-up is.

—Howie alluded to several key points in the process where he had to intercede on the project's behalf, but he hasn't provided us with any details about what the issues were at those points in time. Rather than specify that, he's chosen to tell us that he was under the impression that those hurdles were overcome and that there had been signoff from all relevant parties. (Someone correct me if I have that wrong, please.) I think he should make a few more of those in-process details available in the hopes that it might at least tell us more about what may be hanging things up.

I would think that this can be done without mentioning specific names, since that seems to be the piece of info with the potential to blow the entire thing up to a point of permanent disrepair.

The upshot is that we need as much specificity as possible coming from a grassroots effort of this type. If that is supplied, then this info can be used to get the rock media involved, which is the key thing that can move the needle.

So, to sum up, it means we really need: the track listing for the box set out there in public view, and a generalized idea of what the earlier objections and impediments to the set were over the course of the project’s inception and development.
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« Reply #1164 on: August 18, 2020, 10:13:33 AM »

Has anyone heard from Howie of Stebbins about if anyone at BRI cares about the petition at change.org.  It looks like it is starting to stall at 640 signatures.
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« Reply #1165 on: August 18, 2020, 11:37:48 AM »

The idea that the Feel Flows box would change the public perception of who the Beach Boys are and what they represent has me thinking, how would Mike and Bruce have to respond to this? Would it mean a return to guru robes for Mike (and showing his bald head on stage)? Would all the surfing, cars, girls songs be replaced with the likes of Be Still, Meant For You, Country Air, Wake the World, All I Wanna Do, This Whole World, Long Promised Road, All This is That, and the full California Saga? Would Bruce actually sit at a grand piano, in long pants, playing audible parts?
No more beach balls in the crowds; pass the incense and peppermints instead.
No more state fair and Seaworld gigs; instead, they would play colleges and coffee houses.
Instead of selling t-shirts and baseball caps, the souvenir stand would feature organic vege-tables, herbal supplements, and copies of Whole Earth News.


And tubes of Mama Says organic toothpaste. Also, the concert stage could be a replica of the Radiant Radish.
I love it! Cool
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« Reply #1166 on: August 18, 2020, 12:29:17 PM »

Has anyone heard from Howie of Stebbins about if anyone at BRI cares about the petition at change.org.  It looks like it is starting to stall at 640 signatures.

Whatever the outcome, there are now over 600 fans saying they will buy this set if and when it would come out, and that's only those who signed this petition. How many more who didn't sign feel the same way? It's good to allow fans to have a voice in the process and show how interested they are in a product like this.

What I still do not understand is why were there efforts to criticize and label fans who support releasing this as entitled or worse, suggest doing anything like this is pointless, try to impugn or lessen Howie's enthusiasm for getting the set to the fans, or even more of a mystery why there are *still* people suggesting the set doesn't exist after all that has been said by band members and those who have been working on it? I seriously don't understand why there is a negative pushback on something which does exist and which would be nothing but POSITIVE for the fans and the band.

And here a lot of us thought something like this would be a big win all around, and bring the fan base together for once when we all need it. I guess the implied message in the negative is f*** that, just move on. Sad.

I could say more but I won't. For once.  Grin
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« Reply #1167 on: August 18, 2020, 04:04:57 PM »

I just can't see the petition gaining much more traction unless someone higher up in these organizations promotes the thing. Part of me hopes that the deafening silence coming from any of the camps right now is a sign that talks are happening. Perhaps the petition has already put pressure on whoever is blocking this thing.

If it's Mike blocking the set I would hope that Brian (whose camp didn't hesitate at all to call Mike out for the pathetic trophy hunting gig) would do whatever he could to get this set released (ie go to Rolling Stone, share the petition on social media).

If it's Brian blocking the set I would hope that Mike would spend a couple minutes talking about yet another horrible mistake a Wilson brother made ("And Brian blocking this set is just another example of bad decisions that Brian has made - have I ever told you about the hard drugs he used to use??").

Or I wish that Al would innocently spill the beans about whatever is holding this thing up.

Thank you to the person who created the petition in the first place, and thanks to all of you who signed and shared it. Hopefully some waves will be made and this thing will see a positive outcome.
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« Reply #1168 on: August 18, 2020, 07:12:07 PM »

It certainly is a bizarre situation when fans are excited about buying an archival Beach Boys product and this is the response. Nothing but silence. I think the petition at least showed that there is a viable interest from the fan base in buying this. I don't know what other upcoming products from BRI or the band in general have that interest, especially for an expensive, deluxe edition type of set. It surely hasn't been the touring, since Brian and Al called their whole year off (wisely), Mike keeps plugging away at one-night-stand gigs in the middle of the US for some reason, and the greatest hits downloads that have always sold and will never not sell are always on the market as they've been for decades. Mike's recent comments on that podcast were definitely not encouraging, in fact they bordered on the absurd when he said he wasn't sure what is in the vault.
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« Reply #1169 on: August 19, 2020, 07:10:58 AM »

Don M. makes the most sensible point above. Get the rock press interested in the story. I could see that influencing the project favorably. Free press and public attention are two things the band loves. That is a smart strategy, and more likely to get a response than letters, posts, and a petition aimed at the band itself. Think of it the same way you would if you were going after a big corporation or a politician. They ignore you until the press gets involved. The press are harder to ignore.
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« Reply #1170 on: August 19, 2020, 09:18:41 AM »

Don M. makes the most sensible point above. Get the rock press interested in the story. I could see that influencing the project favorably. Free press and public attention are two things the band loves. That is a smart strategy, and more likely to get a response than letters, posts, and a petition aimed at the band itself. Think of it the same way you would if you were going after a big corporation or a politician. They ignore you until the press gets involved. The press are harder to ignore.

No doubt - This isn't the only issue with this band that some wider reporting in the music press would have been welcome. But the issue is also that it's "this band", and in the case of the box set there is a probably a very small handful of people who know what's going on, and if one of them becomes the source for a press report on the box set being held up, you could probably cue the exit music for them.

And I'd also think back to probably the last time the Beach Boys name got picked up by the international press outside of the music outlets, which was the trophy hunting gig Mike played earlier this year. The petition was the catalyst for getting the attention on the event itself by the larger news outlets, aided by the political overtones of the event. Had there not been thousands signing it originally, which led to people in the band signing it too, there would have been no coverage. The press, music or traditional, will not run with a story if there is no interest in that story, or if people are not talking about it in some way. If it's a petition started by fans in Beach Boys fan communities that has signatures to back up the interest in an archival release, it shows editors that there is something happening here and there is an interest. If someone randomly drops a tip that a Beach Boys box set is the topic of conversation, it would help to see that people are actively talking about it and also wondering what's going on.

I was talking with someone maybe 5-6 years ago who booked bands for a well-known venue in the Northeast. He said when a band sends promo material to be considered for a booking, one of the main factors they looked at was how many fans and followers they had on social media, and how many would potentially turn out to the venues to see the band. If a band had a fantastic EP or demo and only 200 followers online, and another band had a lesser recording yet had 7000 followers within a 100 mile radius of the venue, they'd first go with the group that had more fans/followers because there was a demonstrated interest and following for the group who would buy tickets and buy the concessions at a show. It's practically the same with news outlets choosing which stories to pick up. They'll run the story which they know people will click on and generate ad revenue for their parent company, and if they see groups of BB's fans actively involved in an issue, it will be more likely to run.   
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« Reply #1171 on: August 19, 2020, 12:13:53 PM »

As for the "cue the exit music" caveat for those with more direct involvement with the band (and its highly individualistic individuals!)...

--While that very well may be true, I would counter with the proposition that this is the "hill to die on" when it comes to the band, its music, and its legacy. While I am probably among the greatest fans of "Mess of Help to Stand Alone" you'll ever find, reports from those in the know suggest that there is no version of the tune with the original "Beatrice" lyrics forthcoming from the vaults, and the pickings become progressively leaner from that point on ("Rooftop Harry" die-hards notwithstanding).

So if one or the other of those insider folks does decide to "go rogue" at this moment, they'd be picking the best possible point to sacrifice that future access--so long as the package as characterized by Howie is released more or less intact.

Clearly FEEL FLOWS represents the last and best chance to give the Beach Boys their most encompassing historical perspective, showcasing the collective depth and range of their talents. For those who believe that this is the best and most warranted course of action that the band could take to burnish their legacy and gain points for opening one more window into the ferment of their creative and personal lives at that time, it's an action that has a great deal of principle behind it despite any "corporate repercussions."

Surely there must be enough folks privy to that track listing to create "plausible deniability", no?  police

The press could handle the story by referring to the supplier of the info as "sources close to those involved in the project" or some other such media dodge-ball phrase...

Should anyone protect their relationship over the prospect of being involved with a down-the-line box set release of MIU? With THIS box set still locked away? Huh?? Really???
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« Reply #1172 on: August 19, 2020, 12:26:20 PM »

I wonder since there seemed to be a general consensus among the Beach Boys themselves that a Feel Flows box set was a good idea, that maybe the conflict/delay is simply about what the actual market is for such a release and the retail price they want to charge for it.

For example, if it is believed that this box set would have a somewhat limited market but at the same time would also have intense interest among those who do want to buy it, then maybe there is a push among some in BRI to jack up the retail price way beyond what you might expect it to cost based upon the retail price of previous historical releases like the Smile Sessions or some of the other Brother historical CD releases over the past few years.  

Or maybe some want to split up the box set into parts (including maybe a vinyl record that can be sold separately) to maximize whatever profit there is to be made from the project, and/or make all or part of it some kind of a high-end big bucks limited collector's release.  

I just find it hard to believe that any of the stakeholders would block the release for some stupid personal reason(s), especially if there is money to be made and what with the loss of touring revenue due to Covid-19.

I mean, you can only release a repackaging of Pet Sounds and Smile and Beach Boys Summer Hits so many times and then the market just isn't there. So a Feel Flows box set might be seen by some in BRI as the last big opportunity for the Beach Boys to make money on a new release. Because after that, I doubt that there will be a lot of interest in the 15 Big Ones Sessions or in an official release of Adult/Child or in a re-mix of M. I. U. or in 75 distinct and separate versions of "Kokomo" or in the 30th Anniversary release of Summer in Paradise.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2020, 01:07:40 PM by Phlip » Logged
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« Reply #1173 on: August 19, 2020, 12:53:52 PM »

Is this all fallout from the trophy hunter gig? Did Mike ask for a bunch of freebie copies to hand out to the trophy hunters? Maybe he demanded that Donald Trump's liner notes not be expunged from the booklet.
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« Reply #1174 on: August 19, 2020, 01:07:32 PM »

This was addressed a couple weeks ago in the thread, but as far as I'm hearing, the trophy hunting gig situation has zero to do with the current "Feel Flows" situation.

I also don't think marketing or pricing issues or questions about the interest/marketability are at play. It was greenlit and *completed*; it's money and time spent at this stage, so the ideal thing for everybody would be to have the set released, and that investment can be recouped.

I've mentioned several times in previous posts that focusing too much on the *why* of the hold-up is kind of a non-starter. It's not going to be made public any time soon, if ever. Because of that, and because from everything I'm hearing the issues don't have anything to do with the *content* of the set, the best course is to convince them why releasing the set is a good idea.
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