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Author Topic: Barney Kessel WIBN Mandolin Found AND Sold Nov 10th...But the mystery deepens...  (Read 7414 times)
aeijtzsche
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« Reply #100 on: December 07, 2018, 03:35:26 PM »

Also, consider if Barney were mic'ed up for the session you'd hear more than just the live feed going into the echo chamber, which is what we hear most on those session tapes. You literally don't hear anything but the strings, and if it were close-mic'ed it would be reasonable to assume the mic would pick up more noise and various sounds.

The description given for a long time of this session was that the guitars were plugged in direct and were in the control room cutting the tracks due to the limited space at Gold Star on the studio floor. That's the scenario replicated in the L&M film for what it's worth.

I really think whatever it is is plugged in.  Wouldn't be surprised if the two intro instruments were coupled and plugged in to the same input, actually.

As far as a pick-up for the mando-guitar goes, I did a little research today and it seems like there were mandolin pick-ups that you could clamp on without screwing anything in, and also guitar pickups that you could temporarily affix with putty.  So it being an acoustic instrument really isn't an issue, although it is one more little step in the process.
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guitarfool2002
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« Reply #101 on: December 08, 2018, 08:00:55 PM »

I am a member - I'm not sure if they have a non-altered version available for the public due to usage rights and all that. I'm assuming the blacked-out version is what they received in order to list for the auction but could be wrong. Did you want me to drop them a line? Might be a longshot since the auction already happened weeks ago.

Can you post the direct link where you found it, or was it just in the general listing?

I found a way to contact them without signing up and did so.  We'll see if they respond.

Excellent! Keep us posted, and I could send them something too if needed. I'm curious to see the full shot, and always wondered why whoever sourced it for the '96/'97 PS box project wouldn't have the full uncut shot available as well or why it has never appeared publicly (unless it has). Fingers crossed.
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« Reply #102 on: December 08, 2018, 08:06:21 PM »

Also, consider if Barney were mic'ed up for the session you'd hear more than just the live feed going into the echo chamber, which is what we hear most on those session tapes. You literally don't hear anything but the strings, and if it were close-mic'ed it would be reasonable to assume the mic would pick up more noise and various sounds.

The description given for a long time of this session was that the guitars were plugged in direct and were in the control room cutting the tracks due to the limited space at Gold Star on the studio floor. That's the scenario replicated in the L&M film for what it's worth.

I really think whatever it is is plugged in.  Wouldn't be surprised if the two intro instruments were coupled and plugged in to the same input, actually.

As far as a pick-up for the mando-guitar goes, I did a little research today and it seems like there were mandolin pick-ups that you could clamp on without screwing anything in, and also guitar pickups that you could temporarily affix with putty.  So it being an acoustic instrument really isn't an issue, although it is one more little step in the process.

I agree - With the limited number of sends on that board, it also sounds to me like both instruments' signals got sent to the echo chamber together. The decay "bounce" around the chamber and whatnot seems to be hitting both the same way.

I agreed that a pickup would be possible, but again it sticks in my mind why would they need to do all of this (like putting a pickup on a mandolin) when a stock 12-string or a Bellzouki for example would be as simple as plug-in-and-play to get the part down. And I believe both Fender and Vox and maybe more had electric mandolins on the market yet you really don't hear examples of too many of these coming from the LA studios in the mid-60's.
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"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
aeijtzsche
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« Reply #103 on: December 11, 2018, 06:11:54 PM »

Just received word that the photo came to the auctioneers like that, so poop.
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guitarfool2002
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« Reply #104 on: December 11, 2018, 06:22:48 PM »

Just received word that the photo came to the auctioneers like that, so poop.

The hope might be that the photo in full does exist, as in there had to be something to blur...what I'm getting at is maybe we can track down whoever was the source of that photo when the PS box and booklet was being assembled, because that too was cropped from the same larger image. And the larger image exists, at least we know that now after seeing the blurred version.

Thanks for checking!

Sometimes I wonder why photos like this - especially ones we know to exist - are kept so close to the collective vest rather than just allowing interested fans to see them before it's too late.

Same goes for the 47+ minute long Good Vibrations studio footage. No reason to keep that hidden. None.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2018, 06:23:33 PM by guitarfool2002 » Logged

"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
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« Reply #105 on: December 25, 2018, 07:37:38 AM »

Y'know, I thought it might be beneficial to check out the session tapes for OTHER songs where it sounds like it could be that the same mystery guitar was used, starting with the earliest: "My Childhood" (aka "You Still Believe In Me"), from mid-October '65. Barney and Glen were the only guitarists on that date. On this tape, we hear the following exchange between Brian and a guitarist who must be Barney (because it sure isn't Glen) on the Unsurpassed Masters boot of the Pet Sounds sessions, Vol. 1, Disc 3, Track 4, at 9:18:

Brian: “We’re starting to really sound dead on that.”

Barney: “Brian, Brian - up here, it’s going to sound choked and doesn’t speak as well. Because…”

Brian: “I know. Let’s go. I like that (kind of guitar) anyway.”

Barney: “Alright...(I'll do what I can with) my hands for ya.”
(the words in parentheses are somewhat unintelligible, so I've provided my best guest as to what was said there)

Brian's and Barney's comments here back up the notion that this was not an "ordinary" guitar, but rather one with the special "ringy-ding" quality that Brian so loved...and also one which was a bitch to play up high on the neck, even for someone with the formidable talents of Barney Kessel.

And...its use on this particular session (if indeed this is the earliest example of Barney playing it on one of Brian's productions) might indicate WHY it was used in such a manner (as a guitar rather than as a mandolin) in the first place!  Since a bicycle bell and horn were used on this session, it seems reasonable that Brian might have asked Barney if he had an instrument that was capable of producing a specifically "childlike" sound - and in response, Barney pulled out his one-of-a-kind Gibson mando-guitar, stringing and tuning it like a 12-string electric (if it wasn't already), and using it as such on that session, to get that special "tone" that a regular 12-string electric simply couldn't. EDIT: and it was definitely electrified on the "Childhood" session, indicating the use of the removable pickup discussed earlier on this thread - and the dialogue between Brian and Barney on this session seemingly occurred in the control booth, meaning Barney was plugged directly into the board. In the book that accompanies the Pet Sound Sessions box set, Barney recalled, "I remember that Glen Campbell was also on some of the sessions, and sometimes, Glen and I were in the engineering booth playing and the band was in the studio, on the other side of the glass." THIS would seemingly be one such session!

Then, Brian - now enamoured with the sound - subsequently asked Barney to use that specific guitar on "Wouldn't It Be Nice", "Hang Onto Your Ego"/"I Know There's An Answer", and "I Just Wasn't Made For These Times" (if in fact it was used on those last two...it sounds to me like it was).

This may be the key to the whole mystery!
« Last Edit: December 25, 2018, 09:23:47 AM by c-man » Logged
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