gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
638969 Posts in 25537 Topics by 3626 Members - Latest Member: Julia October 19, 2018, 07:12:17 PM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
gfxgfx
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.       « previous next »
Pages: [1] Go Down Print
Author Topic: Had SMiLE been released, what would Brian have subsequently done?  (Read 1981 times)
Watamushi(Polly Poller)
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1700



View Profile
« on: May 31, 2018, 01:29:45 AM »

This is kinda similar to the ongoing "What if..." thread, so I'm a little reluctant to ask, but I'll ask anyway.

If SMiLE had been completed and released early in 1967, what would Brian have worked on subsequently? 

Would he have burned out on recording, or he would've worked on something like Wild Honey? Or Smiley Smile? Or something else?

Sorry if this question is pointless, but this is one of the what-ifs I'm always wondering.
Logged
Jukka
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 730



View Profile
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2018, 01:52:50 AM »

We'd be without Smiley Smile or Lei'd in Hawaii (which would be a bummer), but I believe Wild Honey would have happened in one form or another anyway.

Think about other big names: The Beatles and Dylan both went back to stripped down, relatively basic rock after their big, epic albums (Pepper & Blonde on Blonde). Brian, who was keeping an eye on what the competition (especially the Beatles) were doing, would have taken his cue from their moves, I presume, just like he did with Smile.
Logged

"Surfing and cars were okay but there was a war going on."
Pitter Patter
Smiley Smile Newbie

Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 9



View Profile
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2018, 04:08:42 AM »

I think if SMiLE was finished and released, it would've been successful in reigniting The Beach Boys' popularity, but in a completely different way to it was when they were singing about surfing/cars/summer. They would've been appreciated as part of the hip psychedelic scene alongside The Beatles, early Pink Floyd, the Laurel Canyon artists/bands etc. and their next few albums would be much higher anticipated than they were in reality.

I agree Brian probably would've followed up SMiLE with something similar to Wild Honey, although Mama Says most likely wouldn't have been on it. Friends would remain mostly unchanged as well, apart from perhaps the Child is The Father of The Man section from Little Bird. It does make me wonder what the SMiLE songs on 20/20, Sunflower and Surf's Up in this universe would be replaced with.
Logged

My luck was so bad, I thought I used up all the luck I had. I sail an unsettled ocean on the Sloop John B, I've been taken for lost and gone and unknown for a long, long time, and I've got tears in the morning, but I know I'd like to get a crack at your love.
WonderBill
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 10



View Profile
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2018, 08:20:12 AM »

I agree Brian probably would've followed up SMiLE with something similar to Wild Honey, although Mama Says most likely wouldn't have been on it. Friends would remain mostly unchanged as well, apart from perhaps the Child is The Father of The Man section from Little Bird. It does make me wonder what the SMiLE songs on 20/20, Sunflower and Surf's Up in this universe would be replaced with.

I have all my music on iTunes and it includes SMiLE. So for practical purposes I replace Our Prayer and Cabinessense on 20/20 with Sail Plane Song and Olí Man River, respectively. The rest of it is the same.

Iíve never noticed any references to Child is Father of the Man in Little Bird. Could you elaborate on that, please?
Logged

Over and over,
The crow cries uncover the cornfield...
Over and over,
The thresher and hover the wheat field...
Pitter Patter
Smiley Smile Newbie

Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 9



View Profile
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2018, 08:59:02 AM »

I agree Brian probably would've followed up SMiLE with something similar to Wild Honey, although Mama Says most likely wouldn't have been on it. Friends would remain mostly unchanged as well, apart from perhaps the Child is The Father of The Man section from Little Bird. It does make me wonder what the SMiLE songs on 20/20, Sunflower and Surf's Up in this universe would be replaced with.

I have all my music on iTunes and it includes SMiLE. So for practical purposes I replace Our Prayer and Cabinessense on 20/20 with Sail Plane Song and Olí Man River, respectively. The rest of it is the same.

Iíve never noticed any references to Child is Father of the Man in Little Bird. Could you elaborate on that, please?

Listen at 1:24.  Smiley
Logged

My luck was so bad, I thought I used up all the luck I had. I sail an unsettled ocean on the Sloop John B, I've been taken for lost and gone and unknown for a long, long time, and I've got tears in the morning, but I know I'd like to get a crack at your love.
Chocolate Shake Man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Online Online

Posts: 2794


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2018, 09:15:17 AM »

I think it would have been a crossroads moment. If Brian wanted to continue being part of the production race, I think that the band would have split up. If his preference was to keep the band together, I think they would have had to go the Wild Honey route. In fact, I think that was very much the dilemma Brian was facing in 1967 anyway.
Logged
Needleinthehay
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 126


View Profile
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2018, 09:40:19 AM »

Even if it had gotten them popular with the psychedelic rock scene that was popular during that period, that movement only really lasted a few years, about 66-70 was the height. They might have stayed hip for a few more years, but then what? My guess is they still would've been has-beens after stuff like Led Zeppelin started taking over.
Logged
SydBarrett
Smiley Smile Newbie

Offline Offline

Posts: 9


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2018, 11:34:30 AM »

I think if SMiLE was finished and released, it would've been successful in reigniting The Beach Boys' popularity, but in a completely different way to it was when they were singing about surfing/cars/summer. They would've been appreciated as part of the hip psychedelic scene alongside The Beatles, early Pink Floyd, the Laurel Canyon artists/bands etc. and their next few albums would be much higher anticipated than they were in reality.

I agree Brian probably would've followed up SMiLE with something similar to Wild Honey, although Mama Says most likely wouldn't have been on it. Friends would remain mostly unchanged as well, apart from perhaps the Child is The Father of The Man section from Little Bird. It does make me wonder what the SMiLE songs on 20/20, Sunflower and Surf's Up in this universe would be replaced with.

Heres how I would have done it

Wild Honey: Been Way Too Long
Friends: Same (Would be a nice call back)
20/20: We're Together Again and Ol' Man River
Sunflower: Same
Surf's Up: Retitle the album to Landlocked and make (Wouldn't It Be Nice) To Live Again as the closer
Logged
Little Pistol
Smiley Smile Newbie

Offline Offline

Posts: 1


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2018, 12:31:30 PM »

We'd be without Smiley Smile or Lei'd in Hawaii (which would be a bummer), but I believe Wild Honey would have happened in one form or another anyway.

Think about other big names: The Beatles and Dylan both went back to stripped down, relatively basic rock after their big, epic albums (Pepper & Blonde on Blonde). Brian, who was keeping an eye on what the competition (especially the Beatles) were doing, would have taken his cue from their moves, I presume, just like he did with Smile.

Hi - first post on here!

Wild Honey was released a week or so before John Wesley Harding and two or three months before The Beatles signalled a "back to basics" trend with Lady Madonna. Brian's ahead of the curve although it's probably more like all these guys have acute commercial instincts. Once all the grand-standing with production became a cliche there was only one way to go really. Brian wasn't taking cues from anyone though, he knew it, even on Smiley Smile.
Logged
Joel Goldenberg
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 445



View Profile
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2018, 06:53:14 AM »

Brian kind of indicated his plans. If he had successfully completed Smile and it was well received commercially and critically, he probably would have gone full steam ahead on making Brother Records an experimental, artsy label with the planned humor, fitness, etc. albums. Not sure how the rest of the BBs would have taken it, although if they each had an outlet for their own musical whims on Brother, it might have worked out. Of course, the material would have to have been more accessible than, say, John and Yoko's Two Virgins, The Wedding Album, Life With the Lions, etc.
Logged
Bicyclerider
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2001


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: June 07, 2018, 06:25:01 AM »

Interesting point Joel.  If Smile had been finished and been successful, I think Brian would have taken a break.  There would be no pressure to quickly followup an unsuccessful album with something more commercial (like he did with Wild Honey after Smiley tanked).  In the break Brian could have developed Brother records more, and produced other artists.  Redwood would have released the singles Darlin' and Time to Get Alone, followed by an album.   A Stephen Kalinich poetry album would be released (he was signed to Brother).  Other artists would be produced by Brian, Carl and Mike (the Pickle Brothers) - Ron Wilson, the Honeys/Spring, and probably others.  Lei'd in Hawaii would be released at the end of 67 as a stopgap album, then something akin to Friends would be the next Beach Boys album.  I suspect with the triumph of Smile, most of the songs on Wild Honey would have ended up being used for other artists, a couple would end up on Friends.
Logged
SMiLE-addict
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 758



View Profile
« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2018, 03:23:18 PM »

Maybe the Beach Boys would have turned into a American version of Yes.

Though if that happened, you'd probably have had a couple of the band members leave.
Logged
Jukka
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 730



View Profile
« Reply #12 on: June 08, 2018, 01:57:26 AM »

As for the music, I'm happy things went the way they went. IF they'd gone for overwrought pop-classical-progressive direction even more, it could have turned cheesy. I, for one, shudder to think Beach Boys going Queen-Pink Floyd-progressive route in the seventies. But then again, I don't think there ever was danger of that. Brian was a song guy, who followed his muse. The songs he had in him were the ones we hear on Wikld Honey anyway, so possible changes in the timeline (had Smile been released, that is) wouldn't have been that big. Maybe less skeletal arrangements, but then again, even Smile was heading skeletal way during the final sessions.
Logged

"Surfing and cars were okay but there was a war going on."
phirnis
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2349



View Profile
« Reply #13 on: June 08, 2018, 04:22:58 AM »

Speaking of Friends and Smile, that little guitar part at 0:10 in WtW always reminds me of Surf's Up. Maybe it's just me.
Logged
hideyotsuburaya
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 185


View Profile
« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2018, 08:55:58 AM »

by I've rather saturated myself with listens to all of both Sunshine Tomorrow CD's

enough so that I feel confident making this statement, that had SMiLE album been finished & released originally and been any level of success, that no Brian would not have produced an album then like Wild Honey
Logged
Jcc
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 46


View Profile
« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2018, 10:37:56 AM »

I once wrote an "alternate history" of the Beach Boys after SMiLE.   My thought was that if SMiLE had been released and been successful, the Boys would have played Monterey (so no Lei'd in Hawaii, but maybe something a lot better), and certainly no Smiley Smile.   Wild Honey would still have happened, but probably released in time for Christmas 1967...sort of around the time of John Wesley Harding.   

1968 would have maybe been a double album (like the Beatles) that was essentially a combination of Friends and 20/20, perhaps even having all the Brian songs on one record and the "Produced by the Beach Boys (a.k.a. Carl)" stuff on the other disc.  So of course there's no 20/20 but maybe a killer live album in 1969, sort of like a Live in London but with the quality of a Get Your Ya Ya's Out.  That alone would satisfy their contract obligations with Capitol as 20/20 was designed to do. 

At this point, I had the band breakup with one last album (Sunflower, or maybe titled "Landlocked").  I figured at this point Brian and the rest of the band would be at creative odds, BW might be dealing with drugs and mental illness, and everyone might just want to go their separate ways.  That's not the end of the story, and I can certainly post the whole thing if anyone wants to read it.
Logged
SydBarrett
Smiley Smile Newbie

Offline Offline

Posts: 9


View Profile
« Reply #16 on: July 06, 2018, 11:44:41 AM »

I once wrote an "alternate history" of the Beach Boys after SMiLE.   My thought was that if SMiLE had been released and been successful, the Boys would have played Monterey (so no Lei'd in Hawaii, but maybe something a lot better), and certainly no Smiley Smile.   Wild Honey would still have happened, but probably released in time for Christmas 1967...sort of around the time of John Wesley Harding.   

1968 would have maybe been a double album (like the Beatles) that was essentially a combination of Friends and 20/20, perhaps even having all the Brian songs on one record and the "Produced by the Beach Boys (a.k.a. Carl)" stuff on the other disc.  So of course there's no 20/20 but maybe a killer live album in 1969, sort of like a Live in London but with the quality of a Get Your Ya Ya's Out.  That alone would satisfy their contract obligations with Capitol as 20/20 was designed to do. 

At this point, I had the band breakup with one last album (Sunflower, or maybe titled "Landlocked").  I figured at this point Brian and the rest of the band would be at creative odds, BW might be dealing with drugs and mental illness, and everyone might just want to go their separate ways.  That's not the end of the story, and I can certainly post the whole thing if anyone wants to read it.

Please do! And a tracklist too if you don't mind!
Logged
Pitter Patter
Smiley Smile Newbie

Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 9



View Profile
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2018, 06:47:29 AM »

I'd like to see this alternate history too!  Grin
Logged

My luck was so bad, I thought I used up all the luck I had. I sail an unsettled ocean on the Sloop John B, I've been taken for lost and gone and unknown for a long, long time, and I've got tears in the morning, but I know I'd like to get a crack at your love.
♩♬☮ Billy C ♯♫♩☮
The Dr. of Wilsonomics
Global Moderator
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 10322


🍦🍦 ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2018, 03:41:18 PM »

Was this the one where Brian basically followed John Lennonís path?
Logged

RIP Alexa Lestage (8 May 1995- 10 June 2018) .

https://www.gofundme.com/help-support-the-jurkowlaniecs

Quote
Lady:ĒSir why you are drowning my son!!! ď
Guy:ďMaaím, the ad clearly reads...SEA horse rides for a dollar ď
jiggy22
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 423



View Profile WWW
« Reply #19 on: July 19, 2018, 10:51:21 AM »

Was this the one where Brian basically followed John Lennonís path?
You mean the one on the surfermoon website where Brian quits the group after Landlocked and is assassinated instead of John Lennon? That one is quite silly in some spots IMO.
Logged

Do happy happy happy Mission Pak singing sound!

My blog, where I post my original Beach Boys mixes and whatnot:
http://www.jiggy22.blogspot.com
gfx
Pages: [1] Go Up Print 
gfx
Jump to:  
gfx
Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.215 seconds with 22 queries.
Helios Multi design by Bloc
gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!