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640819 Posts in 25595 Topics by 3640 Members - Latest Member: greenhorn December 10, 2018, 10:45:13 PM
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Author Topic: WIBN in final (?) Nancy comic strip  (Read 6942 times)
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« Reply #125 on: February 21, 2018, 10:35:14 AM »

If you're trying to insinuate that I hijacked the thread, and not the string of 5 immediately preceding your original post that is ridiculous.

But isn't the fact that a brand new publication, the comic printed in 2018, went out of its way to list "Wilson/Asher"... which contradicts the "new" revised credits? That is a topic worthy of discussion, which then led to a topic of the whole issue with the credits having been revised in the 1st place, which naturally pisses some people off because Mike's name on the credits is still (and will always be) a source of debate/contention to most fans who are knowledgeable about the history.

But it's not like there's zero relation to the original topic.  Conversations (either in real life, or on message boards) will often lend themselves to other topics that are related.

If the original comic had not been a panel with WIBN, but instead had been a panel with a topic about Al Jardine's preferred brand of t-shirts, I somehow doubt it would have led his line of messages into the discussion topic of Mike Love and his crediting overreaching.

But the comic went out of its way to show a now-outdated WIBN credit. So why is it "hijacking" for that comic to lend itself naturally to a discussion about the credits for that song?  We are nerds. We know the history of that song, and the revised credit, and that is only natural to become a topic of discussion as a result.

It's not rocket science why it went there; Mike himself, via so, so many of his actions over the years, has done stuff that many fans find in poor taste, crass (even Al Jardine publicly stated such - imagine what he must say/think privately!) ... essentially Mike has spread his own tentacles over so much of the story of the band, that when those things he has done - which many think are bad, egocentric, narcissistic decisions - are innumerable, it's only natural that perhaps a larger percentage of topics (when compared to other members) might eventually go down that road of discussing Mike critically, even if the original topic wasn't specifically about that, but tangentially might naturally lead there.

In a nutshell, basically, you can't act the way Mike has for so many years without many things indirectly leading back to a discussion of him/his actions. It's not gonna happen every time of course. Mike has nobody to thank but himself for that unique distinction. I'm also certain that if Mike had long ago completely ceased with stoking the flames of smack-talking other members while comically trying to build himself up - people would be somewhat a little less inclined to naturally have topics veer in this direction.

I never said it was zero relation, I always maintained it as "little relation".  A writing credit whose revision most casual fans don't know about on a drawing of a 50 year old record in a frame of a comic strip that is ending.  That is "little relation".

If you step outside of this bubble for a minute, here are the most likely reasons for that cover:
1- Guy googled the WIBN single cover and drew it.
2- This was the record he had as a kid, with Wilson/Asher on it, or it's one that he picked up at a used record store as an adult.
46- He is expressing a subversive hatred of Mike by recognising that the credits were amended and going against the court decision in his drawing

What you're trying to defend isn't some sort of academic discussion about why the record appeared as it did, you're trying to defend your friends' immediate replies of "Mike is a litigous POS" or "He's gonna sue the comic strip".  You're trying to characterise that after the fact as some sort of Superfan Discourse that logically resulted from the OP.  What is telling is that in your own words here you use the reasoning of Mike being crass/in poor taste with his public behavior as grounds for these replies.  You show here, that the direction is merely "the guy sucks so obviously people will freely stick it to him whenever possible".  

Sure, and I really don't think many people on here really think/thought, truly, that there was any remote "good chance" that there was an underhanded "stick it to Mike" intent by the cartoonist. But being as Mike seems to have a history of finding ways to sue or get offended/feel slighted over things that many other people view as unwarranted (he can get upset over anything he wants of course, just as we can roll our eyes if he does), I don't see how people need to get upset over posters jokingly tying in Mike's history of actions into a conceivable (though unlikely) hypothetical Mike/Mike lawyer reaction.

Basically it comes down to fans venting. Many fans are frustrated to know that Mike has been so litigious - especially the 2005 nonsense lawsuit - and it's because of actions like that,  compounded by the omission of mentioning said lawsuit/ not expressing an iota of regret about it in his autobio (thus insulting the intelligence of fans, making it seem like simply omitting it will make negative sentiment over the issue magically "go away") has caused many people to half-jokingly (though understandably) want to make light of the sue-happy band member in order to bust the tough guy notion he's tried to create by puffing himself up all the time. It helps to laugh about it. Yes, it's gonna be at his expense, but again, there's a reason for that. Terrible actions, no public expression of regret, repeat, for decades will do that to a fanbase.

The flipside is that people like myself will also talk about the things I actually like and appreciate about Mike's contributions to the band. I think things only get toxic when people somehow cannot bring themselves to say/acknowledge Mike's good contributions. I cannot understand how disliking his behavior can translate to a frustrated fan saying that good lyrics/vocals are somehow not good. That refusal, I can agree, is toxic and nonsensical IMHO.

I hear you.  Thanks for the thoughtful reply.  We both understand each other I think.  
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« Reply #126 on: February 21, 2018, 10:39:46 AM »

May I please ask about this one more time- after my original post in this thread, a user who was offended was calling me out in other threads that I wasn't a part of, and they also for whatever reason have multiple SSMB accounts and they used 2 accounts to talk smack to me.  Is one or both against the rules?  Will anything be done about that?

I would honestly call it a gray area: while two accounts arenít allowed, OldSurferDude had an old account here that he got banned from, iirc he lost his sign-in information after a long-time ban and made the Legendary account. After that the mods let him reset his password for his original account but OSD just started using his Legendary account as well. Iíd say since heís not trying to hide his original monicker with his newer account (everyone knows theyíre both OSD as both of their names imply) and everyone knows theyíre the same poster itís not really a problem.

As for him defending himself after you called his comment toxic pollution, as someone else said, you kinda put yourself in that situation. As for him dedicating a song to you, not sure if Iíd classify that as bullying but get clarification from GF or Billy about that. I think I mentioned it before, but PMing both mods may give you a quicker response.

That's how I remember the situation and why there are two accounts in this case. The login was blocked on the original, so a new one was set up, and when all the board mechanics got sorted out, the old one was accessible too. Nothing underhanded going on, just an old issue which was preventing logins, and this account wasn't the only one which has had similar issues since.

That's how I remember it - If I'm wrong, please correct, but there were login issues if I recall.

It's not the same issue as, say, Steve or his multiple accounts coming on with aliases to bash me.

Okay, why does he continue to actively use 2 accounts then?  If there are no login issues anymore then 2 shouldn't be necessary.  They both have 1300-something posts on them.  If 2 accounts aren't allowed, then this shouldn't be allowed.  Unless the guy secretly pays the server fees for this board or something, and gets more freedom to disregard the rules that everybody else follows.

And this actually really isn't that far off from Steve.  Just that one (OSD) is overtly out in the open and the other one is marginally, but not very well, attempting to be cloaked and failing at it.  

And OSD has decided to be silent ever since his original posts, I assume because someone in leadership told him that he screwed up and he should lay low.  

Kid, I donít even think OSD would care if the mods deleted his original account. The difference between OSD and Steve (if heís really doing some alias thing) is that OSD isnít trying to hide under multiple monickers for the sake of pretending to be two or more people. OSD is clearly OSD and both account names clearly show that. There isnít anything sinister going on, its an account snafu that honestly doesnít benefit OSD in the slightest, and again I say, Iím sure he doesnít care at all if one of those accounts gets deleted.

Iíll offer the same advice to you for the third time: contact the mods via PM. Iím sure someone here will eventually address your concerns publicly, but in my time here whenever I have an issue to discuss with any mod the fastest way to get a response is by contacting them directly, privately.
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« Reply #127 on: February 21, 2018, 10:40:41 AM »

If you're trying to insinuate that I hijacked the thread, and not the string of 5 immediately preceding your original post that is ridiculous.

But isn't the fact that a brand new publication, the comic printed in 2018, went out of its way to list "Wilson/Asher"... which contradicts the "new" revised credits? That is a topic worthy of discussion, which then led to a topic of the whole issue with the credits having been revised in the 1st place, which naturally pisses some people off because Mike's name on the credits is still (and will always be) a source of debate/contention to most fans who are knowledgeable about the history.

But it's not like there's zero relation to the original topic.  Conversations (either in real life, or on message boards) will often lend themselves to other topics that are related.

If the original comic had not been a panel with WIBN, but instead had been a panel with a topic about Al Jardine's preferred brand of t-shirts, I somehow doubt it would have led his line of messages into the discussion topic of Mike Love and his crediting overreaching.

But the comic went out of its way to show a now-outdated WIBN credit. So why is it "hijacking" for that comic to lend itself naturally to a discussion about the credits for that song?  We are nerds. We know the history of that song, and the revised credit, and that is only natural to become a topic of discussion as a result.

It's not rocket science why it went there; Mike himself, via so, so many of his actions over the years, has done stuff that many fans find in poor taste, crass (even Al Jardine publicly stated such - imagine what he must say/think privately!) ... essentially Mike has spread his own tentacles over so much of the story of the band, that when those things he has done - which many think are bad, egocentric, narcissistic decisions - are innumerable, it's only natural that perhaps a larger percentage of topics (when compared to other members) might eventually go down that road of discussing Mike critically, even if the original topic wasn't specifically about that, but tangentially might naturally lead there.

In a nutshell, basically, you can't act the way Mike has for so many years without many things indirectly leading back to a discussion of him/his actions. It's not gonna happen every time of course. Mike has nobody to thank but himself for that unique distinction. I'm also certain that if Mike had long ago completely ceased with stoking the flames of smack-talking other members while comically trying to build himself up - people would be somewhat a little less inclined to naturally have topics veer in this direction.

I never said it was zero relation, I always maintained it as "little relation".  A writing credit whose revision most casual fans don't know about on a drawing of a 50 year old record in a frame of a comic strip that is ending.  That is "little relation".

If you step outside of this bubble for a minute, here are the most likely reasons for that cover:
1- Guy googled the WIBN single cover and drew it.
2- This was the record he had as a kid, with Wilson/Asher on it, or it's one that he picked up at a used record store as an adult.
46- He is expressing a subversive hatred of Mike by recognising that the credits were amended and going against the court decision in his drawing

What you're trying to defend isn't some sort of academic discussion about why the record appeared as it did, you're trying to defend your friends' immediate replies of "Mike is a litigous POS" or "He's gonna sue the comic strip".  You're trying to characterise that after the fact as some sort of Superfan Discourse that logically resulted from the OP.  What is telling is that in your own words here you use the reasoning of Mike being crass/in poor taste with his public behavior as grounds for these replies.  You show here, that the direction is merely "the guy sucks so obviously people will freely stick it to him whenever possible".  



The flipside is that people like myself will also talk about the things I actually like and appreciate about Mike's contributions to the band. I think things only get toxic when people somehow cannot bring themselves to say/acknowledge Mike's good contributions. I cannot understand how disliking his behavior can translate to a frustrated fan saying that good lyrics/vocals are somehow not good. That refusal, I can agree, is toxic and nonsensical IMHO.

Agreed 100% on your last point there.  

I was accused of being a troll by a poster who goes by the name of Letsgoaway on Brian Wilson's board because I pointed out Mike's contributions to the band, in particular during the early days.   For that, I get accused of being a troll and "drinking the cool aid."  

But, like the posted I just mentioned, wants to dismiss everything Mike did because of that bias, to the point where you can't even compliment his lyrics or the way he sang on California Saga.  Bias is one thing, but that's just plain silly.  
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« Reply #128 on: February 21, 2018, 10:48:07 AM »

I think the best thing posters can do is accept all the things that this band has brought us - the good, the great, the bad, the ugly. Accept that Mike contributed a whole hell of a lot to the band, totally. Accept that Brian wasnít a perfect individual at times. Accept that Mike has a penchant for sticking his foot in his mouth, but also accept he had/has a bit to gripe about.

The second best thing for posters is the willingness to change your mind about your viewpoint if the evidence yields enough to warrant such a change. Iíve been pissed at Mike for the wrong reasons before, Iíve glorified certain parts of Brianís music that he didnít even write. Be willing to accept when youíre wrong or when youíre right. This goes for anyone on both sides of the spectrum.
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« Reply #129 on: February 21, 2018, 10:56:18 AM »

I think the best thing posters can do is accept all the things that this band has brought us - the good, the great, the bad, the ugly. Accept that Mike contributed a whole hell of a lot to the band, totally. Accept that Brian wasnít a perfect individual at times. Accept that Mike has a penchant for sticking his foot in his mouth, but also accept he had/has a bit to gripe about.

The second best thing for posters is the willingness to change your mind about your viewpoint if the evidence yields enough to warrant such a change. Iíve been pissed at Mike for the wrong reasons before, Iíve glorified certain parts of Brianís music that he didnít even write. Be willing to accept when youíre wrong or when youíre right. This goes for anyone on both sides of the spectrum.

Logical and fair. 


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« Reply #130 on: February 21, 2018, 11:08:59 AM »

May I please ask about this one more time- after my original post in this thread, a user who was offended was calling me out in other threads that I wasn't a part of, and they also for whatever reason have multiple SSMB accounts and they used 2 accounts to talk smack to me.  Is one or both against the rules?  Will anything be done about that?

I would honestly call it a gray area: while two accounts arenít allowed, OldSurferDude had an old account here that he got banned from, iirc he lost his sign-in information after a long-time ban and made the Legendary account. After that the mods let him reset his password for his original account but OSD just started using his Legendary account as well. Iíd say since heís not trying to hide his original monicker with his newer account (everyone knows theyíre both OSD as both of their names imply) and everyone knows theyíre the same poster itís not really a problem.

As for him defending himself after you called his comment toxic pollution, as someone else said, you kinda put yourself in that situation. As for him dedicating a song to you, not sure if Iíd classify that as bullying but get clarification from GF or Billy about that. I think I mentioned it before, but PMing both mods may give you a quicker response.

That's how I remember the situation and why there are two accounts in this case. The login was blocked on the original, so a new one was set up, and when all the board mechanics got sorted out, the old one was accessible too. Nothing underhanded going on, just an old issue which was preventing logins, and this account wasn't the only one which has had similar issues since.

That's how I remember it - If I'm wrong, please correct, but there were login issues if I recall.

It's not the same issue as, say, Steve or his multiple accounts coming on with aliases to bash me.

Okay, why does he continue to actively use 2 accounts then?  If there are no login issues anymore then 2 shouldn't be necessary.  They both have 1300-something posts on them.  If 2 accounts aren't allowed, then this shouldn't be allowed.  Unless the guy secretly pays the server fees for this board or something, and gets more freedom to disregard the rules that everybody else follows.

And this actually really isn't that far off from Steve.  Just that one (OSD) is overtly out in the open and the other one is marginally, but not very well, attempting to be cloaked and failing at it.  

And OSD has decided to be silent ever since his original posts, I assume because someone in leadership told him that he screwed up and he should lay low.  

Kid, I donít even think OSD would care if the mods deleted his original account. The difference between OSD and Steve (if heís really doing some alias thing) is that OSD isnít trying to hide under multiple monickers for the sake of pretending to be two or more people. OSD is clearly OSD and both account names clearly show that. There isnít anything sinister going on, its an account snafu that honestly doesnít benefit OSD in the slightest, and again I say, Iím sure he doesnít care at all if one of those accounts gets deleted.

Iíll offer the same advice to you for the third time: contact the mods via PM. Iím sure someone here will eventually address your concerns publicly, but in my time here whenever I have an issue to discuss with any mod the fastest way to get a response is by contacting them directly, privately.

I've explained what happened in this thread, and privately too at this point to someone who asked last night in a PM. There have been other issues in the past few years that Billy and I have discussed and tried to fix where members were denied a log-in, for no reason. Some thought they had been banned, and I personally contacted several off the board to try to explain and fix the issues, which we did or tried to do in those cases. But there has been an issue with the board's mechanics that sometimes a trigger or block gets applied to accounts accidentally, or in error, through nothing anyone did.

Again I'm going on memory, but the account everyone is upset about had those same issues in the past to where another account had to be set up to bypass it, and that's exactly what happened here. Eventually I guess whatever blocks were being put on got worked out, and the other account was active again. There is nothing malicious, nothing sneaky, and no attempts to mask identities or log-in credentials. And the tighter blocking standards were put in place to help deflect both spammer accounts and overt attempts to evade bans and troll the board, as happened with Mike's Beard and a few others who created fake aliases and masked their identities after they had been banned, and then used the alias accounts to insult and attack, and criticize, other posters or simply act like fools instead of coming back on to post normally.

I hope that clears it up.
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« Reply #131 on: February 21, 2018, 11:11:40 AM »

Two OSD's are better than one! Grin

But seriously, all OSD does is post his opinions without attacking anyone on the SSMB. Yet people pile him with insults and somehow its his fault.... Roll Eyes
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« Reply #132 on: February 21, 2018, 11:12:44 AM »

I think the best thing posters can do is accept all the things that this band has brought us - the good, the great, the bad, the ugly. Accept that Mike contributed a whole hell of a lot to the band, totally. Accept that Brian wasnít a perfect individual at times. Accept that Mike has a penchant for sticking his foot in his mouth, but also accept he had/has a bit to gripe about.

The second best thing for posters is the willingness to change your mind about your viewpoint if the evidence yields enough to warrant such a change. Iíve been pissed at Mike for the wrong reasons before, Iíve glorified certain parts of Brianís music that he didn’t even write. Be willing to accept when youíre wrong or when youíre right. This goes for anyone on both sides of the spectrum.

Very well stated.

As for the rest...where to begin? Ok here goes...

OSD having two accounts was addressed earlier. I am going to talk to him about which account he wants deleted. I remembered him having log in issues but wasn't 100%; thanks for refreshing my memory!  This is a completely different thing than a situation where one poster creates a completely different account in order to pretend to be someone else in order to troll the board, and/or cause issues. I resent the statement that OSD "pays the board's bills" for many reasons. 1) He doesn't.  2) Even if he did (which he doesn't), well, how would that affect me or GF in any way? It's not like we would see any of that money, so what benefit would that be? The insinuation is insulting, and quite frankly full of crap.

I also find it rich that the thread was jacked by the same people who complained about the thread getting hijacked in the first place by the Mike comments. Really?! Pot, meet kettle.

So here's the thing. Speaking for myself, I am sick to death of seeing this crap on the main board, regardless of who started it. There is/was a thread in the Sandbox to discuss moderation and comments/concerns.  I'd rather see this discussion there.  Just my personal feelings.

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« Reply #133 on: February 21, 2018, 11:14:14 AM »

Quote
And OSD has decided to be silent ever since his original posts, I assume because someone in leadership told him that he screwed up and he should lay low. 

Nope. Haven't talked to him yet
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« Reply #134 on: February 21, 2018, 11:16:35 AM »

Quote
And OSD has decided to be silent ever since his original posts, I assume because someone in leadership told him that he screwed up and he should lay low. 

Nope. Haven't talked to him yet

I also have not had any contact at all.

Now both Billy and I have explained this publicly. That's it. No trickery, deception, or maliciousness. No underhanded, clandestine activities.
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« Reply #135 on: February 21, 2018, 11:21:38 AM »

I think the best thing posters can do is accept all the things that this band has brought us - the good, the great, the bad, the ugly. Accept that Mike contributed a whole hell of a lot to the band, totally. Accept that Brian wasnít a perfect individual at times. Accept that Mike has a penchant for sticking his foot in his mouth, but also accept he had/has a bit to gripe about.

The second best thing for posters is the willingness to change your mind about your viewpoint if the evidence yields enough to warrant such a change. Iíve been pissed at Mike for the wrong reasons before, Iíve glorified certain parts of Brianís music that he didnít even write. Be willing to accept when youíre wrong or when youíre right. This goes for anyone on both sides of the spectrum.

Very well stated.

As for the rest...where to begin? Ok here goes...

OSD having two accounts was addressed earlier. I am going to talk to him about which account he wants deleted. I remembered him having log in issues but wasn't 100%; thanks for refreshing my memory!  This is a completely different thing than a situation where one poster creates a completely different account in order to pretend to be someone else in order to troll the board, and/or cause issues. I resent the statement that OSD "pays the board's bills" for many reasons. 1) He doesn't.  2) Even if he did (which he doesn't), well, how would that affect me or GF in any way? It's not like we would see any of that money, so what benefit would that be? The insinuation is insulting, and quite frankly full of crap.

I also find it rich that the thread was jacked by the same people who complained about the thread getting hijacked in the first place by the Mike comments. Really?! Pot, meet kettle.

So here's the thing. Speaking for myself, I am sick to death of seeing this crap on the main board, regardless of who started it. There is/was a thread in the Sandbox to discuss moderation and comments/concerns.  I'd rather see this discussion there.  Just my personal feelings.



Yeah the sarcasm of the "bill paying" comment didn't come through.  My fault on that. 
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« Reply #136 on: February 21, 2018, 11:24:08 AM »

Ok, no worries.
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« Reply #137 on: February 21, 2018, 07:37:34 PM »


What GF and Billy have said about my accounts is exactly what happened.
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« Reply #138 on: May 08, 2018, 04:11:40 PM »

I didn't know this comic hero before. Nancy's cute. Smiley :D
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« Reply #139 on: May 09, 2018, 11:51:16 AM »

Monday's "One Big Happy" strip has a BB gag, but nothing even remotely original:
https://www.arcamax.com/thefunnies/onebighappy/s-2075818
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« Reply #140 on: May 09, 2018, 04:03:35 PM »

It's generally very lame to see anything-BBs feature in comics. It's useless, doesn't add new popularity to band. Let's wish nobody in comic world features BBs in the strips. group hug
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Short notice: the cat you see to the left is the best. Not counting your indoor cat who might have habit sitting at your left side when you post at SmileySmile.

Boy dislikes girl. The girl dislikes that boy. People dislike the boy AND girl. Question - WHO dislikes these people?

Pom pom generation thinks The Baby boomers can't hopscotch into admitting that they're ANYthing BUT cool & the boom they represent is archaic thing by now.
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