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Author Topic: Brian Wilson - 2018 Tour Thread  (Read 67789 times)
Lonely Summer
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« Reply #250 on: December 27, 2017, 11:34:36 PM »

I'll never get why disco was such a bad idea. I mean, the Bee Gees pulled it off, and there are a fair amount of similarities between the two groups. If anything,  the issue is 1)timing, and 2) it was a very poor attempt at disco
I think the problem was, it sounded like a generic disco track with the Beach Boys voices overdubbed on top of it. There was a way to make a disco-flavored track that still retained the unique sound of a band: the Rolling Stones had "Miss You"; the Kinks had "(Wish I Could Fly Like) Superman"; and Wings did "Goodnight Tonight", which had Latin touches to it.
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« Reply #251 on: December 27, 2017, 11:50:39 PM »

Yup...that'd fall under the second point. Finally heard the single version and it sounded hacked to death. sh*t, I'd have booed too! But yeah I keep repeating this, but those blasted monkeys summed up just how lousy the production was
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« Reply #252 on: December 28, 2017, 01:19:19 AM »

I wonder if the sales were more related to people buying anything related to disco rather than fans of the group itself? As mentioned, 60s artists such as the Bee Gees, Stones and others had success. Another was The Four Seasons. Why couldn’t the Beach Boys? Aside from the production, I have always said they missed the disco wave by 2 years.
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« Reply #253 on: December 28, 2017, 06:22:15 AM »

I wonder if the sales were more related to people buying anything related to disco rather than fans of the group itself? As mentioned, 60s artists such as the Bee Gees, Stones and others had success. Another was The Four Seasons. Why couldn’t the Beach Boys? Aside from the production, I have always said they missed the disco wave by 2 years.

I think other rock bands did the disco thing much much better.  Kiss, the Stones, Pink Floyd, Queen, etc had disco hits, but it still sounded like them.  Plus, they were new songs, not a discofied retread. 
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« Reply #254 on: December 28, 2017, 06:46:41 AM »

Regarding playing the disco version of HCTN at Radio City Music Hall in 1979, while it may not have gone over well and some may have even booed one or more of the performances (they did a four-night run at the venue as I recall), it's worth noting that at least one audience recording of one of the Radio City gigs floats around, and there are no audible boos from the audience at the end of (or during) "Here Comes the Night." I remember listening to the recording, knowing the "booing" stories, and waiting for it at the end of the song, and being surprised to hear pretty normal audience applause/cheering.

Maybe the boos were in a different part of the theater, or maybe the boos were worse at one of the other gigs (I'm not even sure if HCTN survived all four nights). But I find it interesting that the recording I've heard sounds pretty normal.

The band hadn't completely soured on the track that quickly though, apparently. They did the song a couple months later on "Midnight Special."
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« Reply #255 on: December 28, 2017, 07:13:41 AM »

Regarding playing the disco version of HCTN at Radio City Music Hall in 1979, while it may not have gone over well and some may have even booed one or more of the performances (they did a four-night run at the venue as I recall), it's worth noting that at least one audience recording of one of the Radio City gigs floats around, and there are no audible boos from the audience at the end of (or during) "Here Comes the Night." I remember listening to the recording, knowing the "booing" stories, and waiting for it at the end of the song, and being surprised to hear pretty normal audience applause/cheering.

Maybe the boos were in a different part of the theater, or maybe the boos were worse at one of the other gigs (I'm not even sure if HCTN survived all four nights). But I find it interesting that the recording I've heard sounds pretty normal.

The band hadn't completely soured on the track that quickly though, apparently. They did the song a couple months later on "Midnight Special."

Thanks for the insight. The "booing" story varies a little from book to book, so I've wondered how severe the booing actually was. Also worth considering is that disco HCTN had only just been released at the time of the Radio City Music Hall shows (entered the charts at #83 on 3/3), meanwhile the song had peaked at #44 just a week or two prior to the Midnight Special TV show.
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« Reply #256 on: December 28, 2017, 08:06:25 AM »

I was lucky enough to have attended 2 of the Radio City shows back in 79...I think they did 3, but might have been only the 2. I don't recall serious booing during or after HCTN Disco song, but I do remember more of a collective groan from the crowd....more like an "ugh" Regardless, they were greats shows, and I vividly remember a crocked Dennis knocking over a tray of beer very close to, and perhaps onto, Mike Love! I remember Dennis laughing...seemed to be the only member of the band who was! Typical Dennis.
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« Reply #257 on: December 28, 2017, 08:39:49 AM »

I was lucky enough to have attended 2 of the Radio City shows back in 79...I think they did 3, but might have been only the 2. I don't recall serious booing during or after HCTN Disco song, but I do remember more of a collective groan from the crowd....more like an "ugh" Regardless, they were greats shows, and I vividly remember a crocked Dennis knocking over a tray of beer very close to, and perhaps onto, Mike Love! I remember Dennis laughing...seemed to be the only member of the band who was! Typical Dennis.

Very cool, Tony S! Thanks for sharing. I never tire of hearing fan recollections, particularly of '70s concerts! I notice Dennis sang You Are So Beautiful at two of (or all ?) the shows. Since we don't have a studio recording of YASB, I'm always interested in finding that definitive live version.
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« Reply #258 on: December 28, 2017, 09:28:48 AM »

Weirdly, while it has been kind of implied by some over the years (or maybe it's just how *I* interpreted it) that "Here Comes the Night" was dropped from live setlists after the Radio City Music Hall run, it appears the song lasted into April and possibly May.
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« Reply #259 on: December 28, 2017, 09:44:55 AM »

Weirdly, while it has been kind of implied by some over the years (or maybe it's just how *I* interpreted it) that "Here Comes the Night" was dropped from live setlists after the Radio City Music Hall run, it appears the song lasted into April and possibly May.

I misread some previous info the same way. Glad to have the record straight on this. It's a tad more puzzling that Al would be that put off by Brian mentioning the disco version (even jokingly so), but I guess he's probably just got not the most positive recollections and associations with that song. I wonder if Al would recall the 1992 Surfin' in the same way, if he's ever even heard it all the way through.
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« Reply #260 on: December 28, 2017, 10:12:49 AM »

Weirdly, while it has been kind of implied by some over the years (or maybe it's just how *I* interpreted it) that "Here Comes the Night" was dropped from live setlists after the Radio City Music Hall run, it appears the song lasted into April and possibly May.

In some cases, more than implied. Yeah, there are a few setlists that suggest the song was still being performed, at least sporadically. It certainly wasn't history after one show. Not a big deal, just interesting.
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« Reply #261 on: December 28, 2017, 10:35:12 AM »

Al's comments (the error regarding only performing it once notwithstanding) on the disco HCTN from his 2000 Goldmine interview are interesting:

Tell me about the band's 10-minute disco rendition of "Here Comes The Night" that appeared on the record.

We performed it once and we were booed. We actually received such criticism that we never played it again. I hated that track. It was one of the worst experiences of my life recording anywhere, but Bruce has this idea to do the perfect disco record, which of course none of our fans wanted us to do. I like the original song, but this pandering to disco did not work. Curt Becher, who was really quite a producer and musician in his own right, it was really a labor of love for those guys. They wanted every note perfect, and it had to be right on the right beats per minute, mathematically created for disco. But that disco sound didn't suit the Beach Boys at all.

If I put it on right now would you leave the room?

First I would probably burst out laughing because it was so unlike anything we'd ever done. It was a good lesson for us that pandering after fads does not make for a successful recording, no matter how good it is. And I have to say that it was technically damn good, [laughs] but you just have to follow your heart and not the fad.
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« Reply #262 on: December 28, 2017, 10:37:55 AM »

Al's comments (the error regarding only performing it once notwithstanding) on the disco HCTN from his 2000 Goldmine interview are interesting:

Tell me about the band's 10-minute disco rendition of "Here Comes The Night" that appeared on the record.

We performed it once and we were booed. We actually received such criticism that we never played it again. I hated that track. It was one of the worst experiences of my life recording anywhere, but Bruce has this idea to do the perfect disco record, which of course none of our fans wanted us to do. I like the original song, but this pandering to disco did not work. Curt Becher, who was really quite a producer and musician in his own right, it was really a labor of love for those guys. They wanted every note perfect, and it had to be right on the right beats per minute, mathematically created for disco. But that disco sound didn't suit the Beach Boys at all.

If I put it on right now would you leave the room?

First I would probably burst out laughing because it was so unlike anything we'd ever done. It was a good lesson for us that pandering after fads does not make for a successful recording, no matter how good it is. And I have to say that it was technically damn good, [laughs] but you just have to follow your heart and not the fad.


A lesson the Beach Boys, and their members, learned a few times. 
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« Reply #263 on: December 28, 2017, 10:59:35 AM »

I wonder if some of the booing was from Dennis?  LOL
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« Reply #264 on: December 28, 2017, 11:59:15 AM »

Al's comments (the error regarding only performing it once notwithstanding) on the disco HCTN from his 2000 Goldmine interview are interesting:

Tell me about the band's 10-minute disco rendition of "Here Comes The Night" that appeared on the record.

We performed it once and we were booed. We actually received such criticism that we never played it again. I hated that track. It was one of the worst experiences of my life recording anywhere, but Bruce has this idea to do the perfect disco record, which of course none of our fans wanted us to do. I like the original song, but this pandering to disco did not work. Curt Becher, who was really quite a producer and musician in his own right, it was really a labor of love for those guys. They wanted every note perfect, and it had to be right on the right beats per minute, mathematically created for disco. But that disco sound didn't suit the Beach Boys at all.

If I put it on right now would you leave the room?

First I would probably burst out laughing because it was so unlike anything we'd ever done. It was a good lesson for us that pandering after fads does not make for a successful recording, no matter how good it is. And I have to say that it was technically damn good, [laughs] but you just have to follow your heart and not the fad.


A lesson the Beach Boys, and their members, learned a few times. 

I wonder if Al just outright hated disco in general, or if this particular track done by this particular band (his own) was simply not to his liking. Mike might have been a disco fan (of ABBA), but that also might just be due to the fact that it tipped the hat to Mike (and Brian's) own song, Do It Again, and less about actually really liking ABBA or disco.
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« Reply #265 on: December 28, 2017, 12:02:07 PM »

Al's comments (the error regarding only performing it once notwithstanding) on the disco HCTN from his 2000 Goldmine interview are interesting:

Tell me about the band's 10-minute disco rendition of "Here Comes The Night" that appeared on the record.

We performed it once and we were booed. We actually received such criticism that we never played it again. I hated that track. It was one of the worst experiences of my life recording anywhere, but Bruce has this idea to do the perfect disco record, which of course none of our fans wanted us to do. I like the original song, but this pandering to disco did not work. Curt Becher, who was really quite a producer and musician in his own right, it was really a labor of love for those guys. They wanted every note perfect, and it had to be right on the right beats per minute, mathematically created for disco. But that disco sound didn't suit the Beach Boys at all.

If I put it on right now would you leave the room?

First I would probably burst out laughing because it was so unlike anything we'd ever done. It was a good lesson for us that pandering after fads does not make for a successful recording, no matter how good it is. And I have to say that it was technically damn good, [laughs] but you just have to follow your heart and not the fad.


A lesson the Beach Boys, and their members, learned a few times. 

I wonder if Al just outright hated disco in general, or if this particular track done by this particular band (his own) was simply not to his liking. Mike might have been a disco fan (of ABBA), but that also might just be due to the fact that it tipped the hat to Mike (and Brian's) own song, Do It Again, and less about actually really liking ABBA or disco.

Considering Al was opting to sing covers of old rock and roll songs around this time, I'm thinking he wasn't a fan of disco (and I can't really say I blame him).  I could see any guitarist in a rock band taking issues with his band taking their music into the disco / club.
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« Reply #266 on: December 28, 2017, 01:53:35 PM »

Oddly - bear with me - I'm trying to remember when I THINK Brian first heard the disco version HCTN. I remember when they invited him into the studio first to hear the final mix of "Good Timin'."  I enjoyed it but he showed no interest in it.  Whenever he was around the BBs as a band then, he didn't seem to want to be around.  If his brothers visited socially, he seemed fine, but....he loved them.

As I remember things after that, he was shortly out of the hospital and staying at a hotel/condo (nice but weird) place in Westwood before they found him a house in Santa Monica Canyon. I remember a copy of the record appearing - I'm pretty certain it was pre-release.  They (meaning Korthof or some of the other employees) played it for Brian. I was horrified when it came to the disco version to HCTN, so I'm afraid to project my sense of it onto him.  Let's just say he showed no interest in any of it.  That I feel certain of.  He was pretty much stuck in the room, but he had tuned out.  I do feel comfortable saying he never wanted to hear it again, so...
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« Reply #267 on: December 28, 2017, 03:17:35 PM »

Thank you for that recollection. ... considering how the original song was one of his best songs, productions,  and vocals after Pet Sounds (actually it's my top 10 of any period) I'd feel insulted if I was him. I LOVE HCTN, personally.

With this perspective,  seeing him in this clip becomes even more endearing
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« Reply #268 on: December 28, 2017, 03:22:19 PM »

Oddly - bear with me - I'm trying to remember when I THINK Brian first heard the disco version HCTN. I remember when they invited him into the studio first to hear the final mix of "Good Timin'."  I enjoyed it but he showed no interest in it.  Whenever he was around the BBs as a band then, he didn't seem to want to be around.  If his brothers visited socially, he seemed fine, but....he loved them.

As I remember things after that, he was shortly out of the hospital and staying at a hotel/condo (nice but weird) place in Westwood before they found him a house in Santa Monica Canyon. I remember a copy of the record appearing - I'm pretty certain it was pre-release.  They (meaning Korthof or some of the other employees) played it for Brian. I was horrified when it came to the disco version to HCTN, so I'm afraid to project my sense of it onto him.  Let's just say he showed no interest in any of it.  That I feel certain of.  He was pretty much stuck in the room, but he had tuned out.  I do feel comfortable saying he never wanted to hear it again, so...

That's an amazing recollection to hear, thanks Debbie. I can understand how it must have been a total shock and outside of his comfort zone in terms of genre.
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« Reply #269 on: December 29, 2017, 01:35:08 PM »

Weirdly, while it has been kind of implied by some over the years (or maybe it's just how *I* interpreted it) that "Here Comes the Night" was dropped from live setlists after the Radio City Music Hall run, it appears the song lasted into April and possibly May.

I misread some previous info the same way. Glad to have the record straight on this. It's a tad more puzzling that Al would be that put off by Brian mentioning the disco version (even jokingly so), but I guess he's probably just got not the most positive recollections and associations with that song. I wonder if Al would recall the 1992 Surfin' in the same way, if he's ever even heard it all the way through.

I am sure he has heard '92 Surfin', I saw them play it live with him.
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« Reply #270 on: December 29, 2017, 01:37:38 PM »

Al's comments (the error regarding only performing it once notwithstanding) on the disco HCTN from his 2000 Goldmine interview are interesting:

Tell me about the band's 10-minute disco rendition of "Here Comes The Night" that appeared on the record.

We performed it once and we were booed. We actually received such criticism that we never played it again. I hated that track. It was one of the worst experiences of my life recording anywhere, but Bruce has this idea to do the perfect disco record, which of course none of our fans wanted us to do. I like the original song, but this pandering to disco did not work. Curt Becher, who was really quite a producer and musician in his own right, it was really a labor of love for those guys. They wanted every note perfect, and it had to be right on the right beats per minute, mathematically created for disco. But that disco sound didn't suit the Beach Boys at all.

If I put it on right now would you leave the room?

First I would probably burst out laughing because it was so unlike anything we'd ever done. It was a good lesson for us that pandering after fads does not make for a successful recording, no matter how good it is. And I have to say that it was technically damn good, [laughs] but you just have to follow your heart and not the fad.


A lesson the Beach Boys, and their members, learned a few times. 

I wonder if Al just outright hated disco in general, or if this particular track done by this particular band (his own) was simply not to his liking. Mike might have been a disco fan (of ABBA), but that also might just be due to the fact that it tipped the hat to Mike (and Brian's) own song, Do It Again, and less about actually really liking ABBA or disco.

Don't forget that Disco Celebration was recorded.
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« Reply #271 on: December 29, 2017, 01:58:28 PM »

I'm not sure a ton of music lovers even back then loved disco because of its inherent "disco" style. Rather, people liked a lot of disco stuff because it was a hunk of "pop" music at the time.

I think older bands from the 60s tended to appreciate music that maintained some hallmarks of the band and/or were melodic while utilizing some disco elements. So stuff like "Miss You", or McCartney's "Goodnight Tonight", or ELO's "Discovery" album. Those were all cases of the songwriters writing a song, and the resulting arrangement and production having some arguably "disco" element.

None of those cases were like what the BBs did, where it was an uber-calculated decision, made almost outside of the band (remember Bruce had just come back into the fold), and entirely devised and mostly even recorded without much group input. The resulting recording sounded zero like anything the band had been doing recently, and stuck out like as sore thumb even on its own album.

As for why Al (and others) would dislike the track, I think in part it has to do with the song being both more or less outside of his hands, and also the track tanking. I think most of the BBs, even Mike or Brian, tended to put up with one or the other. If a single tanked but they got to do what they wanted to do, they weren't too upset about it. Or, if some outside influence was the main starter behind a song and they had little input, they were still okay to go along with something if it was successful. (Though Mike contradicted this to some degree with TWGMTR).

I would guess someone like Al was already skeptical of HCTN, and then when it not only didn't do well on the charts, but resulted in adverse reactions from audiences (even if grumbling/groaning more than outright booing), it was much easier to be wholly dismissive of the entire thing.

It's also probably part of why Al stayed away from much of "Summer in Paradise", and even later on when doing SIP stuff in concert, Al didn't exactly seem extra enthused performing it.

Note that Al seemed to even try to stay away from doing "Kokomo" with his "Family & Friends" band after he was out of the touring BBs, seeming to only do the song when the venue/audience/event seemed to necessitate it. When he's talked about the song in interviews, he seems happy to point out it was a great shot in the arm for the band, but doesn't exactly jump to saying the song itself is an all-time classic.
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« Reply #272 on: December 29, 2017, 02:12:02 PM »

Note that during the BBs 1979 "Midnight Special" appearance, where all six BBs were present, Brian is nowhere to be seen when they do "Here Comes the Night", and Dennis also jumps off the drums and tries to hide next to Carli Munoz doing a little percussion (I recall reading Dennis often completely left the stage when the did the song at actual concerts):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fANVUu5NiTo
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« Reply #273 on: December 29, 2017, 04:40:15 PM »

Weirdly, while it has been kind of implied by some over the years (or maybe it's just how *I* interpreted it) that "Here Comes the Night" was dropped from live setlists after the Radio City Music Hall run, it appears the song lasted into April and possibly May.

I misread some previous info the same way. Glad to have the record straight on this. It's a tad more puzzling that Al would be that put off by Brian mentioning the disco version (even jokingly so), but I guess he's probably just got not the most positive recollections and associations with that song. I wonder if Al would recall the 1992 Surfin' in the same way, if he's ever even heard it all the way through.

I am sure he has heard '92 Surfin', I saw them play it live with him.

Right on. I forgot from reading some setlists online long ago that they did play it live a few times. I wonder if it was augmented with some modern early 90s backing track?
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« Reply #274 on: December 30, 2017, 02:18:19 PM »

I'm definitely going to see the Pet Sounds show in D.C. in May. I will not miss it this time!
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