gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
618840 Posts in 24939 Topics by 3548 Members - Latest Member: leafy October 21, 2017, 06:00:45 PM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
gfxgfx
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.       « previous next »
Pages: [1] 2 Go Down Print
Author Topic: Rock and Rock Hall of Fame - 2018 Ballot  (Read 561 times)
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« on: October 06, 2017, 06:09:49 AM »

https://www.rockhall.com/fan-vote/2018-fan-vote

OK, so there are still a much of deserving artists who were left off....again (cough Grand Funk....cough Iron Maiden), but The Moody Blues and The Zombies are on the ballot. 

Judging by the fact that Deep Purple and Journey finally got in (Jan and his merry band of hipsters would NEVER let Journey in willfully), they are listening to fan votes

VOTE VOTE VOTE

I'm not afraid to hide who I voted for:

The Moody Blues
The Zombies
The Cars
Judas Priest
Bon Jovi
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2017, 07:22:37 AM »

I have to quibble with your word choice: while Wenner / RS might have been hipster 50 years ago, there's been nothing more boringly dad-rock over the past 20+ years. Whatever is actually hipster these days, odds are the likes of you and I don't even know what it is.

That said, as always, I won't bother voting because the RnR HoF is already long-since fatally flawed, and a kind of dumb idea in the first place. (I do like your votes though. Not a Moody Blues fan, but they would warrant inclusion along with the others.)
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2017, 07:33:14 AM »

I have to quibble with your word choice: while Wenner / RS might have been hipster 50 years ago, there's been nothing more boringly dad-rock over the past 20+ years. Whatever is actually hipster these days, odds are the likes of you and I don't even know what it is.

That said, as always, I won't bother voting because the RnR HoF is already long-since fatally flawed, and a kind of dumb idea in the first place. (I do like your votes though. Not a Moody Blues fan, but they would warrant inclusion along with the others.)


Maybe music elitists is a better term?  For years, they've filled the Hall with critical favorites over fan favorites, and they seem to turn their nose at most arena rock, prog, and metal bands. 

I know the Hall is flawed, but the HOF does provide some great moments.  The Anniversary concert back in 2009 is a great show.  Plus, seeing Steve Perry and Neal Schon on the same stage together last year was a real treat, even if Perry chose not to perform.  Same with seeing David Coverdale and Glenn Hughes with Ian Paice from Purple.  For all the BS involved, that part is cool.  And while they don't admit it, it means a lot to the artists. 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2017, 07:44:35 AM »

Elitists works. Those come in every shape and color, whereas I think hipsterism really does require some kind of "the newest thing" dimension that RS/Wenner haven't had in a looooooonnnnggggg time. I think RS would have been hipster when our first-generation BB fans were around, but not really since. But yeah, the elitism/narrow-mindedness of the HoF has been shameful.

What's worse is, they have arguably justifiably expanded the definition of RnR to include some great legacy artists (Miles Davis) as well as the "rock and roll" of the past generation or so, which is hip-hop-influenced RnB or rap...yet failed to expand their taste into those kinds of actual rock n roll that you mentioned. So hard rock, heavy metal, prog, arena rock are largely left on the outside looking in at non-rock and roll bands or artists. And that's hard to justify. It could be call The Middle Aged Critics' Self-Conscious Attempt at Open-Minded Praise of Pop Music Hall of Fame or something.

I absolutely agree about the HoF providing some great live performance moments.
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2017, 07:54:58 AM »

Elitists works. Those come in every shape and color, whereas I think hipsterism really does require some kind of "the newest thing" dimension that RS/Wenner haven't had in a looooooonnnnggggg time. I think RS would have been hipster when our first-generation BB fans were around, but not really since. But yeah, the elitism/narrow-mindedness of the HoF has been shameful.

What's worse is, they have arguably justifiably expanded the definition of RnR to include some great legacy artists (Miles Davis) as well as the "rock and roll" of the past generation or so, which is hip-hop-influenced RnB or rap...yet failed to expand their taste into those kinds of actual rock n roll that you mentioned. So hard rock, heavy metal, prog, arena rock are largely left on the outside looking in at non-rock and roll bands or artists. And that's hard to justify. It could be call The Middle Aged Critics' Self-Conscious Attempt at Open-Minded Praise of Pop Music Hall of Fame or something.

I absolutely agree about the HoF providing some great live performance moments.

That's one of the reasons fans of hard rock and heavy metal tend to have a chip on their shoulders in regards to other genres.  As a fan of Judas Priest and Iron Maiden, it makes me shake my head that they get passed over for the likes of RUN DMC and Tupak. 

And seeing bands like The Moody Blues and The Zombies passed over for the likes of Pearl Jam and Green Day??  I think they need to try to clean the backlog of 60s and 70s artists before letting in the 90s bands. 

Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2017, 08:01:00 AM »

I can understand that. I do think it's arguably justifiable to expand from more pure rock n roll to pop in general, but as long as you're leapfrogging other rock n roll subgenres first, it's no longer even arguably justifiable.

As for the backlog, the other way to look at it could be like this: there are too many artists being admitted. Maybe there aren't enough acts to fill the show every year, so they've watered down the HoF (just as I think they do in the NBA, for example, where it's to the point that anyone who was ever an all-star or who was a solid starting player on a good team seems to get in). Maybe some of these still-omitted older bands shouldn't be in, and neither should their modern equivalents. Maybe it really should be the likes of Chuck Berry, Elvis, Buddy Holly, the Beatles, the Beach Boys, Led Zeppelin, Queen, U2 (NOT intended to be exhaustive so no calling me out on omissions). Not the second- or third-tier bands.
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2017, 08:11:11 AM »

I can understand that. I do think it's arguably justifiable to expand from more pure rock n roll to pop in general, but as long as you're leapfrogging other rock n roll subgenres first, it's no longer even arguably justifiable.

As for the backlog, the other way to look at it could be like this: there are too many artists being admitted. Maybe there aren't enough acts to fill the show every year, so they've watered down the HoF (just as I think they do in the NBA, for example, where it's to the point that anyone who was ever an all-star or who was a solid starting player on a good team seems to get in). Maybe some of these still-omitted older bands shouldn't be in, and neither should their modern equivalents. Maybe it really should be the likes of Chuck Berry, Elvis, Buddy Holly, the Beatles, the Beach Boys, Led Zeppelin, Queen, U2 (NOT intended to be exhaustive so no calling me out on omissions). Not the second- or third-tier bands.


I think if the RNRHOF were to be that exclusive, then they'd have to make the criteria much more clear.  At least with sports, you have stats and championship rings (which often get a little overrated by voters of HOFs for individual achievements) to quantify. 

The RNRHOF has one qualifier - your debut album needs to be 25 years old. 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2017, 08:18:27 AM »


I think if the RNRHOF were to be that exclusive, then they'd have to make the criteria much more clear.  

Oh I wasn't actually suggesting that. It's too late, that cat is long-since out of the bag.
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2017, 08:20:33 AM »


I think if the RNRHOF were to be that exclusive, then they'd have to make the criteria much more clear.  

Oh I wasn't actually suggesting that. It's too late, that cat is long-since out of the bag.

True, and frankly, I wouldn't consider U2 to be a "first tier" band, but that's part of the problem with a HOF based on something so subjective. 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2017, 08:22:26 AM »

I was just using them as an example of a band that had huge success in their time (unquestionable) and influence on later bands (Radiohead, Coldplay, etc). Obviously personal taste is a whole other thing: there are plenty of hugely successful bands I hate. (One of them has been named in this very post!)
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2017, 08:26:39 AM »

I was just using them as an example of a band that had huge success in their time (unquestionable) and influence on later bands (Radiohead, Coldplay, etc). Obviously personal taste is a whole other thing: there are plenty of hugely successful bands I hate. (One of them has been named in this very post!)

Right, I get where you're coming from.  They might be the most successful rock band to emerge from the 80s.  Had their career ended in 1992, I just consider them first tier.  I think most of their 80s music is great. 

Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2017, 08:27:54 AM »

I was just using them as an example of a band that had huge success in their time (unquestionable) and influence on later bands (Radiohead, Coldplay, etc). Obviously personal taste is a whole other thing: there are plenty of hugely successful bands I hate. (One of them has been named in this very post!)

Right, I get where you're coming from.  They might be the most successful rock band to emerge from the 80s.  Had their career ended in 1992, I just consider them first tier.  I think most of their 80s music is great. 



If we're going to take into account the tripe most acts put out after their heydays, the HoF would empty out in a hurry!
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2017, 08:32:07 AM »

I was just using them as an example of a band that had huge success in their time (unquestionable) and influence on later bands (Radiohead, Coldplay, etc). Obviously personal taste is a whole other thing: there are plenty of hugely successful bands I hate. (One of them has been named in this very post!)

Right, I get where you're coming from.  They might be the most successful rock band to emerge from the 80s.  Had their career ended in 1992, I just consider them first tier.  I think most of their 80s music is great. 





If we're going to take into account the tripe most acts put out after their heydays, the HoF would empty out in a hurry!

I think there's some truth to that, but to me, possibly more than any other band, U2 changed their sound so much that, other than Bono's vocals, they became unrecognizable. 

Even with their questionable last 25 years, I'd still consider them HOF worthy for their first ten or so.......sounds kinda like the band this forum is dedicated to. 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2017, 08:37:56 AM »

They changed it, returned to it, changed it, returned to it. Not unlike a lot of legacy acts who try to evolve, experiment, get lambasted for going too far or selling out, try to make a comeback, get mocked for imitating themselves, and on and on. Thomas Jefferson said something about how maybe a country needed a revolution every generation? Maybe every band should have a lifespan of 10 years and then call it quits. Avoid the whole phenomenon.

(Before examples are pointed out to me of bands that did good work over longer periods of time, I'm just musing. I don't believe that.)

Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #14 on: October 06, 2017, 08:43:16 AM »

They changed it, returned to it, changed it, returned to it. Not unlike a lot of legacy acts who try to evolve, experiment, get lambasted for going too far or selling out, try to make a comeback, get mocked for imitating themselves, and on and on. Thomas Jefferson said something about how maybe a country needed a revolution every generation? Maybe every band should have a lifespan of 10 years and then call it quits. Avoid the whole phenomenon.

(Before examples are pointed out to me of bands that did good work over longer periods of time, I'm just musing. I don't believe that.)



There's definitely a trend, with hard rock & metal bands who had their hey days in the 80s.   Your Maidens, Priests, Dios, etc.  A string of great releases in the 80s, followed by a lull in the 90s (sometimes due to key personnel leaving, sometimes due to chasing modern trends) followed by return to form albums in the 2000s. 

Or bands could just do what Poison did.  Other than a covers album, they just decided to stop putting out new music and tour on their hits. 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #15 on: October 06, 2017, 08:59:08 AM »

It's not even just hard rock bands. Think about the 60s and 70s artists who tried their hand at synth-heavy music, hairspray and headbands, and embarrassing music videos in the 80s only to realize youth, while wasted on, is best left to the young and returned to something more like their classic sounds in the 90s ... and of course touring solely on their hits again.
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #16 on: October 06, 2017, 09:07:59 AM »

It's not even just hard rock bands. Think about the 60s and 70s artists who tried their hand at synth-heavy music, hairspray and headbands, and embarrassing music videos in the 80s only to realize youth, while wasted on, is best left to the young and returned to something more like their classic sounds in the 90s ... and of course touring solely on their hits again.

That's true too.  The hard rock bands were just the first that came to mind.  Funny how much better some artists' music got again when they stopped chasing relevancy (whatever that is). 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2017, 09:11:46 AM »

I think it's just hard for anyone to admit they're getting older, they're not the new, hot thing, etc. Everyone (almost) wants to stay at the top of their game, even if they think suddenly trying their hand at a different game entirely is the way to do it.
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7569


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #18 on: October 06, 2017, 09:12:56 AM »

The Monkees.

(drops mic...)
Logged

"Every single person who criticized Brian for having She & Him, Kacey Musgraves, Sebu and Nate Ruess guesting on his solo album can now officially go heartily f*** themselves." - Wirestone

"I will never change with what I think happened in here and you will never convince me otherwise." - Dr. Beach Boy.
"There was no up front fees, period. swedishfrog  and I paid for the domain name. As of June 19, 2016 at 4:32pm edt, that is all I was charged for." - Dr. Beach Boy
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #19 on: October 06, 2017, 09:19:21 AM »

Sir? Sir? I think you forgot your mic. (He forgot his mic. I think it's dented, too. Shame. That was a nice mic.)
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #20 on: October 06, 2017, 09:28:08 AM »

The Monkees.

(drops mic...)

To be 100% honest, I didn't realize that The Monkees weren't in. 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7133


View Profile
« Reply #21 on: October 06, 2017, 09:31:32 AM »

Yeah I wasn't actually sure what his point was. I thought it was based on our conversation about bands going out of their comfort zones or trying to stay modern, like the Monkees did in the 80s.
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius, Patronizing Twaddler, Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick, and Sensationalist Dullard, and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
KDS
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3541


View Profile
« Reply #22 on: October 06, 2017, 09:45:47 AM »

Yeah I wasn't actually sure what his point was. I thought it was based on our conversation about bands going out of their comfort zones or trying to stay modern, like the Monkees did in the 80s.

I can't say I'm 100% surprised that The Monkees aren't in the RNRHOF.  What does surprise me is that I honestly can't recall them appearing on any recent ballot.  Hey, who knew, there's something The Monkees, Blue Oyster Cult, and Iron Maiden have in common. 
Logged

Any opinions posted by me regarding the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, is in no way a show of disrespect towards any member of The Beach Boys, past or present.
Unreconstructed Wilsonite
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2868



View Profile
« Reply #23 on: October 06, 2017, 05:48:17 PM »

Agreed with your list KDS, though Iíd replace The Cars and Bon Jovi with Sister Rosetta Tharpe and Link Wray. Iíd also be happy if MC5 gets in.

As a matter of fact, I seriously hope Bon Jovi doesnít get in this year, given the strength of the other acts and Bon Joviís overall mediocrity (IMO)
Logged

http://apffnredux.boards.net/

If you're into all things Pink Floyd, check out this forum I created with a few mates. Be sure to spread the word while you're at it!
♩♬☮ Billy C ♯♫♩☮
The Dr. of Wilsonomics
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 9541


🍦🍦 Not Dead and Not For Sale ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2017, 06:15:00 PM »

Mine: THE CARS
DEPECHE MODE
 J. GEILS BAND
THE METERS
THE ZOMBIES
Logged

Hi there. I am Billy. I am Smiley Smile's  resident left-wing ambassador. A snowflake if you will.
gfx
Pages: [1] 2 Go Up Print 
gfx
Jump to:  
gfx gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!