Does Mike Love realize he is despised by millions of fans?

[Jay]

I am sure that Mike feels that whatever mistakes he has made, they pale in comparison to all the horrible behavior and bad decisions made by Brian Wilson over the years.

Actually, they do.

Oh, look what I just did. 

Mike had done worse things than offering drugs to his 10 year old daughter?

The exact opposite. Take another look at what I said.

[rab2591]

What's funny is that for all we know, Brian Wilson is fine with stuff like the recent DIA remake. He's certainly fine with Mike touring as the Beach Boys, or he would withhold the licence. We all act like BW is this paragon of artistic integrity, when he's been part of a lot of dodgy projects over the years, from Spanish Kokomo and lame eighties videos to the country record and the pointless Disney album.

Brian virtually never overtly says a bad thing about another person's music. Plus, I can't see Brian making the effort to listen to an iota of what Mike would release after Mike repeatedly dissed Brian's recordings and voice.

The worst I can think of Brian saying is that Student Demonstration Time wasn't his bag and didn't feel "BBs" to him, or something to that effect. Saying Brian is "fine" with it is probably a gross oversimplification; things are surely somewhat more complicated than that. Brian's shown to take inaction as a course of measure for many, many things in his life because the alternative is far more stressful. At minimum Brian probably wasn't fine about it the day he felt like he was fired and the LA Times published his thoughts on it.

Brian has indeed been involved in some questionable endevours over the years, but at least he makes the effort to truly make sincere art as well quite often, to this day. And like clockwork, if Mike's around, Brian then has to deal with mimed shotgun blasts to the head and snarkiness as a response to Brian's sincere artistic statements; what a great thing a sensitive genius needs to deal with, right?

But see, we don't KNOW what Brian Wilson thinks about anything, because the man basically no longer gives interviews. Remember all of those crazy interviews from the sixties to the early nineties -- basically the pre-Melinda era -- where Brian Wilson, sometimes under the influence of some substance or other, would go into the craziest, most revealing, sometimes painfully honest stories and revelations about himself or his music? That man is gone. Now we have a creature of silence mixed with PR. Does he even KNOW Mike Love just released a new version of DIA? Has he even been told? Would he care anyway?

I love Summer's Gone, but Mike Love obviously thinks it's too depressing. But what does Brian Wilson think of Daybreaks Over the Ocean or the lyrics to Spring Vacation? Again, we don't know. So personally, not only do I find it more interesting to know Mike Love's opinion, I find it more normal and, well, HUMAN that he does have opinions and expresses them.

It's easy never to say anything douchy when you never say anything...

As for Kokomo, isn't it well established who wrote what? Mike Love contributed the "Aruba, Jamaica" section. It's obviously not the part that makes the song -- it's not one of the hooks -- but it's still a contribution. If Kokomo had been written by Brian Wilson it would be praised as the greatest comeback ever.

A creature of silence? The man just spent a good amount of time working on his book which is FULL of actual thoughts and introspection on things like TWGMTR or probably even his thoughts on Kokomo. The guy came here a couple years ago and did a really funny Q&A that was also mixed with some good thoughts about serious subjects. He just did an interview with the telegraph. Whenever he is asked about Mike he has nothing but praise for the guy. And Mike expresses his opinion? The guy couldn’t even listen to Brian’s single ‘The Right Time’ when asked about it in an email exchange interview - in fact he gave some passive aggressive response about autotune instead.

This “creature of silence” you are trying to convince people exists doesn’t exist.

[KDS]

That's fine, Jim, and you're entitled to your opinion. 

And I'll admit, there's plenty Mike does that I'm not a fan of (ie. the 2005 lawsuit, Pisces Brothers consistent presence in BB setlists, the new version of Do It Again). 

I consider myself to be an passionate about the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, as the next guy.  Which is why, like I told Guitarfool, I'm strictly staying with the musical side of things here, as that's what drew me to this band in the first place. 

But here's the thing KDS, how could you be passionate about the members if you don't really have an opinion? It doesn't bug you that this guy has sabotaged the fact that we could've gotten more official Beach Boys music from a willing Brian Wilson, along with Mike Love and Al Jardine, all so he could go tour in Bumfuck, USA with John Stamos and be the big star, rather than have to deal with that darned Melinda?

And you don't have an opinion on the fact that there are people on the other board who have willingly spread LIES about Brian, his wife and his family, even though the claim to be a non-biased observer? That gets me.

Trust me, the music is ultimately the thing to me, but I can not avoid the bad taste that I've gotten from the Mike Love circle. It's crude, mean spirited and childish. Do I think Mike ultimately cares about Brian? Yeah, but I think the thing is that it's not only Brian that's changed so much over the past 50 plus years. It is Mike who has as well, and I don't think that he realizes that. He's grown into quite a different person than he was, and I don't think he realizes this, yet expects Brian to be the same as he was. And lastly, if this "inside baseball" stuff bugs you so much, why comment on it? There are quite a few topics on this board that I have little interest in and therefore, I don't comment in them. However, it seems like this one does interest you, because you do bring this up a lot on this board, and a few times on the other board, which you seem to praise as "fairer" despite the presence of posters who have variously demonstrated bigoted, white nationalist, misogynistic, and other horrific behaviors. So it's weird. Just my opinion.

It's not that I don't have an opinion. 

I can understand how Mike gets your goat.  But, I'm not really sure why you seem to be concerned about everybody having the same opinions as you.

I said, I don't like everything Mike has done.   Some of the things he's done and said has ranged from childish to petty in my opinion.  But, also my opinion, I don't buy into the belief that everything Mike does in 2017 is somehow tarnishing the great legacy of The Beach Boys.  I'm more passionate about the mistakes that were made in the late 60s and 1970s, when the band still had a legit chance to be as respected as The Beatles, Stones, Who, etc etc.   In the light of those gaffs, a solo single remake with a TV star and a one hit wonder isn't a blip on the radar in my opinion.   

[the captain]

Hey, Sugar Ray had three hits (top 15 singles). And you, sir, have permanently tarnished the legacy with your misinformation campaign! 

[KDS]

Hey, Sugar Ray had three hits (top 15 singles). And you, sir, have permanently tarnished the legacy with your misinformation campaign! 

You're right.   Sugar Ray did have three hits.  (Ugh, the 90s). 

Maybe Mark can convince Mike to appear in Sharknado 6?

[Jim V.]

I love Summer's Gone, but Mike Love obviously thinks it's too depressing. But what does Brian Wilson think of Daybreaks Over the Ocean or the lyrics to Spring Vacation?

Actually in that infamous 2012 Rolling Stone article he talks about how great he thought "Daybreak Over The Ocean" was. So....there's that.

But of course, you'll find a way to undermine this.

[HeyJude]

Brian actually wrote the lyrics to Spring Vacation.

Not all of them. "Spring Vacation" is one of the Brian/Joe songs that Mike was given in order to add additional lyrics. Mike received a co-writing credit on the song, so he wrote some of the lyrics.

And Mike almost certainly didn't write any of the music, as "Spring Vacation" was likely one of the backing tracks that was cut in Nashville before the BBs even entered into the picture.

[HeyJude]

I love Summer's Gone, but Mike Love obviously thinks it's too depressing. But what does Brian Wilson think of Daybreaks Over the Ocean or the lyrics to Spring Vacation?

Actually in that infamous 2012 Rolling Stone article he talks about how great he thought "Daybreak Over The Ocean" was. So....there's that.

But of course, you'll find a way to undermine this.

Indeed, the Rolling Stone article paints a picture where Brian seems to like "Daybreak Over the Ocean", yet objects so strenuously or is so weirded out by Al's "Waves of Love" that he almost literally runs away from Al and the control room to avoid having to work on the song.

I've often pointed out that Al had even less control and was more marginalized in most aspects of C50, including studio work and in concert, compared to Mike, yet it was *Mike* who came away from the project feeling more disenfranchised. Mike didn't feel he had enough of a hand in the writing, yet it was Al who got *no* songwriting credits on the album and who had the pleasure of enduring Brian running away screaming from his song. Yet Al sucked it up and got over it and is still working with Brian, and you don't see Al dredging up in every interview over the last five years how nobody wanted to work on "Waves of Love."

[the captain]

Per the second piece of the funniest thing in BW's biography, joe and Brian had part of a song that they gave to Mike to finish, resulting in Spring Vacation.

[the captain]

First: "The day Mike came to dinner and I was working on That Lucky Old Sun, we went out to the car. I had written a song called "Mexican Girl," probably the best song ever written about a Mexican girl. I played it for Mike and asked him if he would want to work on the lyrics. 'I could make it 25 percent better, but I don't want to,' he said. 'If we do anything, I want to start from scratch.' There were times that would have made me sad or angry, but in the car it only made me laugh a little. Mike was Mike." (p. 227) 

Then: "We had a piece of a song and Mike finished it up and turned it into "Spring Vacation." His new lyrics were great. They made the song at least 25 percent better." (p. 265)

[KDS]

Brian actually wrote the lyrics to Spring Vacation.

Not all of them. "Spring Vacation" is one of the Brian/Joe songs that Mike was given in order to add additional lyrics. Mike received a co-writing credit on the song, so he wrote some of the lyrics.

And Mike almost certainly didn't write any of the music, as "Spring Vacation" was likely one of the backing tracks that was cut in Nashville before the BBs even entered into the picture.

Lyrics like "We used to get around" and "Spring Vacation, good vibrations" can really only come from one person. 

[SMiLE Brian]

Cap, I forgot about that part!!!!

[Jim V.]

That's fine, Jim, and you're entitled to your opinion. 

And I'll admit, there's plenty Mike does that I'm not a fan of (ie. the 2005 lawsuit, Pisces Brothers consistent presence in BB setlists, the new version of Do It Again). 

I consider myself to be an passionate about the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, as the next guy.  Which is why, like I told Guitarfool, I'm strictly staying with the musical side of things here, as that's what drew me to this band in the first place. 

But here's the thing KDS, how could you be passionate about the members if you don't really have an opinion? It doesn't bug you that this guy has sabotaged the fact that we could've gotten more official Beach Boys music from a willing Brian Wilson, along with Mike Love and Al Jardine, all so he could go tour in Bumfuck, USA with John Stamos and be the big star, rather than have to deal with that darned Melinda?

And you don't have an opinion on the fact that there are people on the other board who have willingly spread LIES about Brian, his wife and his family, even though the claim to be a non-biased observer? That gets me.

Trust me, the music is ultimately the thing to me, but I can not avoid the bad taste that I've gotten from the Mike Love circle. It's crude, mean spirited and childish. Do I think Mike ultimately cares about Brian? Yeah, but I think the thing is that it's not only Brian that's changed so much over the past 50 plus years. It is Mike who has as well, and I don't think that he realizes that. He's grown into quite a different person than he was, and I don't think he realizes this, yet expects Brian to be the same as he was. And lastly, if this "inside baseball" stuff bugs you so much, why comment on it? There are quite a few topics on this board that I have little interest in and therefore, I don't comment in them. However, it seems like this one does interest you, because you do bring this up a lot on this board, and a few times on the other board, which you seem to praise as "fairer" despite the presence of posters who have variously demonstrated bigoted, white nationalist, misogynistic, and other horrific behaviors. So it's weird. Just my opinion.

It's not that I don't have an opinion. 

I can understand how Mike gets your goat.  But, I'm not really sure why you seem to be concerned about everybody having the same opinions as you.

I said, I don't like everything Mike has done.   Some of the things he's done and said has ranged from childish to petty in my opinion.  But, also my opinion, I don't buy into the belief that everything Mike does in 2017 is somehow tarnishing the great legacy of The Beach Boys.  I'm more passionate about the mistakes that were made in the late 60s and 1970s, when the band still had a legit chance to be as respected as The Beatles, Stones, Who, etc etc.   In the light of those gaffs, a solo single remake with a TV star and a one hit wonder isn't a blip on the radar in my opinion.   

I think their legacy is set too. I don't buy it that Mike doing a shitty remake single or even a shitty remake album will tarnish much if anything. I mean, let's be honest...he actually made this and people still aren't embarrassed to be fans...



It has nothing to do with the legacy for me. What it has to do for me is that Mike Love acts like a fucking prick a whole lot. Giving more credence to Evan Landy than, say, Melinda would be a start. All I know is if my cousin, who I was in business with for over 50 years started praising and/or valuing the words of the family who almost killed me over those of my wife and I, well that would be something. Or the constant saying that he is "controlled" or "medicated" or whatever. He is the only person in the group who does stuff like this. Brian doesn't. Al doesn't, even though I have to feel that he could go after Mike big time if he really wanted to. Bruce is a pretty major douchenozzle, but you're not gonna catch him being that disrespectful. And those are just a few things. You act like everything is even, and you just can't understand why Mike gets the kinda stick he does. And you go over to the other board and talk smack about this one and it's anti-Mike viewpoints every now and then, yet I've never seen you complain that Came Molt is in intractable asshole who pushes an outright false agenda for....what? To serve some bald, paunchy egoist? Or that posters like "The Fake Surfer Girl" and "Bruce's Moustache" are by turns white nationalist and misogynist, amongst other reprehensible traits. But not a word from you. It's this joint that deserves the pile on.

And I'm not worried about anybody having the same opinions as me. And I don't think I line up with any particular group on these message boards. I would be just as likely to challenge guitarfool as I am filledthepageupwithgarbage or Came Mott. What does get my goat is you try to pull this whole I'm all about the music schtick yet, here you are. If this place ain't giving ya what you want, the door is that-a-way!

[KDS]

First: "The day Mike came to dinner and I was working on That Lucky Old Sun, we went out to the car. I had written a song called "Mexican Girl," probably the best song ever written about a Mexican girl. I played it for Mike and asked him if he would want to work on the lyrics. 'I could make it 25 percent better, but I don't want to,' he said. 'If we do anything, I want to start from scratch.' There were times that would have made me sad or angry, but in the car it only made me laugh a little. Mike was Mike." (p. 227) 

Then: "We had a piece of a song and Mike finished it up and turned it into "Spring Vacation." His new lyrics were great. They made the song at least 25 percent better." (p. 265)

Unfortunately, I think that song is the weak link on TWGMTR.  Musically, it reminds me of one of John Mayer's poppier songs for some reason.   The lyrics are pretty silly, and the "Easy Money, what's it to ya" bit always makes me chuckle.

[Jim V.]

First: "The day Mike came to dinner and I was working on That Lucky Old Sun, we went out to the car. I had written a song called "Mexican Girl," probably the best song ever written about a Mexican girl. I played it for Mike and asked him if he would want to work on the lyrics. 'I could make it 25 percent better, but I don't want to,' he said. 'If we do anything, I want to start from scratch.' There were times that would have made me sad or angry, but in the car it only made me laugh a little. Mike was Mike." (p. 227) 

Then: "We had a piece of a song and Mike finished it up and turned it into "Spring Vacation." His new lyrics were great. They made the song at least 25 percent better." (p. 265)

Unfortunately, I think that song is the weak link on TWGMTR.  Musically, it reminds me of one of John Mayer's poppier songs for some reason.   The lyrics are pretty silly, and the "Easy Money, what's it to ya" bit always makes me chuckle.

Probably reminds you of Mayer cuz of the adult contemporary bluesy type guitar on there.

I have to say though, that I like every song on the album. Every. Single. One. "Spring Vacation" and "Beaches In Mind" probably shouldn't work, but hearing Brian and Mike together on "Spring Vacation" and then to hear Brian on the harmonies, while Al shadows Mike on "Beaches In Mind" they just conjure up a good feeling for me. And "Daybreak Over The Ocean," though it obviously owes a debt to "My Bonnie," it's one of Mike's best solo compositions. And if it was a necessity to have solo Mike Love joint on TWGMTR, then we coulda done a lot worse. And hearing the groups harmonies on the intro, it's a joy.

[KDS]

First: "The day Mike came to dinner and I was working on That Lucky Old Sun, we went out to the car. I had written a song called "Mexican Girl," probably the best song ever written about a Mexican girl. I played it for Mike and asked him if he would want to work on the lyrics. 'I could make it 25 percent better, but I don't want to,' he said. 'If we do anything, I want to start from scratch.' There were times that would have made me sad or angry, but in the car it only made me laugh a little. Mike was Mike." (p. 227) 

Then: "We had a piece of a song and Mike finished it up and turned it into "Spring Vacation." His new lyrics were great. They made the song at least 25 percent better." (p. 265)

Unfortunately, I think that song is the weak link on TWGMTR.  Musically, it reminds me of one of John Mayer's poppier songs for some reason.   The lyrics are pretty silly, and the "Easy Money, what's it to ya" bit always makes me chuckle.

Probably reminds you of Mayer cuz of the adult contemporary bluesy type guitar on there.

I have to say though, that I like every song on the album. Every. Single. One. "Spring Vacation" and "Beaches In Mind" probably shouldn't work, but hearing Brian and Mike together on "Spring Vacation" and then to hear Brian on the harmonies, while Al shadows Mike on "Beaches In Mind" they just conjure up a good feeling for me. And "Daybreak Over The Ocean," though it obviously owes a debt to "My Bonnie," it's one of Mike's best solo compositions. And if it was a necessity to have solo Mike Love joint on TWGMTR, then we coulda done a lot worse. And hearing the groups harmonies on the intro, it's a joy.

That's probably it.  But, I also enjoy every song, though I like SV the least.  I forget where I read it, but somebody said that the verses of Daybreak sound like a slowed down version of Bluebirds Over the Mountain. 

[KDS]

That's fine, Jim, and you're entitled to your opinion. 

And I'll admit, there's plenty Mike does that I'm not a fan of (ie. the 2005 lawsuit, Pisces Brothers consistent presence in BB setlists, the new version of Do It Again). 

I consider myself to be an passionate about the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, as the next guy.  Which is why, like I told Guitarfool, I'm strictly staying with the musical side of things here, as that's what drew me to this band in the first place. 

But here's the thing KDS, how could you be passionate about the members if you don't really have an opinion? It doesn't bug you that this guy has sabotaged the fact that we could've gotten more official Beach Boys music from a willing Brian Wilson, along with Mike Love and Al Jardine, all so he could go tour in Bumfuck, USA with John Stamos and be the big star, rather than have to deal with that darned Melinda?

And you don't have an opinion on the fact that there are people on the other board who have willingly spread LIES about Brian, his wife and his family, even though the claim to be a non-biased observer? That gets me.

Trust me, the music is ultimately the thing to me, but I can not avoid the bad taste that I've gotten from the Mike Love circle. It's crude, mean spirited and childish. Do I think Mike ultimately cares about Brian? Yeah, but I think the thing is that it's not only Brian that's changed so much over the past 50 plus years. It is Mike who has as well, and I don't think that he realizes that. He's grown into quite a different person than he was, and I don't think he realizes this, yet expects Brian to be the same as he was. And lastly, if this "inside baseball" stuff bugs you so much, why comment on it? There are quite a few topics on this board that I have little interest in and therefore, I don't comment in them. However, it seems like this one does interest you, because you do bring this up a lot on this board, and a few times on the other board, which you seem to praise as "fairer" despite the presence of posters who have variously demonstrated bigoted, white nationalist, misogynistic, and other horrific behaviors. So it's weird. Just my opinion.

It's not that I don't have an opinion. 

I can understand how Mike gets your goat.  But, I'm not really sure why you seem to be concerned about everybody having the same opinions as you.

I said, I don't like everything Mike has done.   Some of the things he's done and said has ranged from childish to petty in my opinion.  But, also my opinion, I don't buy into the belief that everything Mike does in 2017 is somehow tarnishing the great legacy of The Beach Boys.  I'm more passionate about the mistakes that were made in the late 60s and 1970s, when the band still had a legit chance to be as respected as The Beatles, Stones, Who, etc etc.   In the light of those gaffs, a solo single remake with a TV star and a one hit wonder isn't a blip on the radar in my opinion.   

I think their legacy is set too. I don't buy it that Mike doing a shitty remake single or even a shitty remake album will tarnish much if anything. I mean, let's be honest...he actually made this and people still aren't embarrassed to be fans...



It has nothing to do with the legacy for me. What it has to do for me is that Mike Love acts like a fucking prick a whole lot. Giving more credence to Evan Landy than, say, Melinda would be a start. All I know is if my cousin, who I was in business with for over 50 years started praising and/or valuing the words of the family who almost killed me over those of my wife and I, well that would be something. Or the constant saying that he is "controlled" or "medicated" or whatever. He is the only person in the group who does stuff like this. Brian doesn't. Al doesn't, even though I have to feel that he could go after Mike big time if he really wanted to. Bruce is a pretty major douchenozzle, but you're not gonna catch him being that disrespectful. And those are just a few things. You act like everything is even, and you just can't understand why Mike gets the kinda stick he does. And you go over to the other board and talk smack about this one and it's anti-Mike viewpoints every now and then, yet I've never seen you complain that Came Molt is in intractable asshole who pushes an outright false agenda for....what? To serve some bald, paunchy egoist? Or that posters like "The Fake Surfer Girl" and "Bruce's Moustache" are by turns white nationalist and misogynist, amongst other reprehensible traits. But not a word from you. It's this joint that deserves the pile on.

And I'm not worried about anybody having the same opinions as me. And I don't think I line up with any particular group on these message boards. I would be just as likely to challenge guitarfool as I am filledthepageupwithgarbage or Came Mott. What does get my goat is you try to pull this whole I'm all about the music schtick yet, here you are. If this place ain't giving ya what you want, the door is that-a-way!

Frankly, I've seen little evidence of Bruce being a douche.   And I have no idea who Fake Surfer Girl or Bruce's Moustache are.  As for the "white nationalist" or "misogynist" views of some of my fellow posters on PSF, I can't say that I agree.  But, I know that you and I share completely different political views, so you might think some of my opinions are "white nationialist" for all I know. 

[Jim V.]

That's fine, Jim, and you're entitled to your opinion. 

And I'll admit, there's plenty Mike does that I'm not a fan of (ie. the 2005 lawsuit, Pisces Brothers consistent presence in BB setlists, the new version of Do It Again). 

I consider myself to be an passionate about the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, as the next guy.  Which is why, like I told Guitarfool, I'm strictly staying with the musical side of things here, as that's what drew me to this band in the first place. 

But here's the thing KDS, how could you be passionate about the members if you don't really have an opinion? It doesn't bug you that this guy has sabotaged the fact that we could've gotten more official Beach Boys music from a willing Brian Wilson, along with Mike Love and Al Jardine, all so he could go tour in Bumfuck, USA with John Stamos and be the big star, rather than have to deal with that darned Melinda?

And you don't have an opinion on the fact that there are people on the other board who have willingly spread LIES about Brian, his wife and his family, even though the claim to be a non-biased observer? That gets me.

Trust me, the music is ultimately the thing to me, but I can not avoid the bad taste that I've gotten from the Mike Love circle. It's crude, mean spirited and childish. Do I think Mike ultimately cares about Brian? Yeah, but I think the thing is that it's not only Brian that's changed so much over the past 50 plus years. It is Mike who has as well, and I don't think that he realizes that. He's grown into quite a different person than he was, and I don't think he realizes this, yet expects Brian to be the same as he was. And lastly, if this "inside baseball" stuff bugs you so much, why comment on it? There are quite a few topics on this board that I have little interest in and therefore, I don't comment in them. However, it seems like this one does interest you, because you do bring this up a lot on this board, and a few times on the other board, which you seem to praise as "fairer" despite the presence of posters who have variously demonstrated bigoted, white nationalist, misogynistic, and other horrific behaviors. So it's weird. Just my opinion.

It's not that I don't have an opinion. 

I can understand how Mike gets your goat.  But, I'm not really sure why you seem to be concerned about everybody having the same opinions as you.

I said, I don't like everything Mike has done.   Some of the things he's done and said has ranged from childish to petty in my opinion.  But, also my opinion, I don't buy into the belief that everything Mike does in 2017 is somehow tarnishing the great legacy of The Beach Boys.  I'm more passionate about the mistakes that were made in the late 60s and 1970s, when the band still had a legit chance to be as respected as The Beatles, Stones, Who, etc etc.   In the light of those gaffs, a solo single remake with a TV star and a one hit wonder isn't a blip on the radar in my opinion.   

I think their legacy is set too. I don't buy it that Mike doing a shitty remake single or even a shitty remake album will tarnish much if anything. I mean, let's be honest...he actually made this and people still aren't embarrassed to be fans...



It has nothing to do with the legacy for me. What it has to do for me is that Mike Love acts like a fucking prick a whole lot. Giving more credence to Evan Landy than, say, Melinda would be a start. All I know is if my cousin, who I was in business with for over 50 years started praising and/or valuing the words of the family who almost killed me over those of my wife and I, well that would be something. Or the constant saying that he is "controlled" or "medicated" or whatever. He is the only person in the group who does stuff like this. Brian doesn't. Al doesn't, even though I have to feel that he could go after Mike big time if he really wanted to. Bruce is a pretty major douchenozzle, but you're not gonna catch him being that disrespectful. And those are just a few things. You act like everything is even, and you just can't understand why Mike gets the kinda stick he does. And you go over to the other board and talk smack about this one and it's anti-Mike viewpoints every now and then, yet I've never seen you complain that Came Molt is in intractable asshole who pushes an outright false agenda for....what? To serve some bald, paunchy egoist? Or that posters like "The Fake Surfer Girl" and "Bruce's Moustache" are by turns white nationalist and misogynist, amongst other reprehensible traits. But not a word from you. It's this joint that deserves the pile on.

And I'm not worried about anybody having the same opinions as me. And I don't think I line up with any particular group on these message boards. I would be just as likely to challenge guitarfool as I am filledthepageupwithgarbage or Came Mott. What does get my goat is you try to pull this whole I'm all about the music schtick yet, here you are. If this place ain't giving ya what you want, the door is that-a-way!

Frankly, I've seen little evidence of Bruce being a douche.   And I have no idea who Fake Surfer Girl or Bruce's Moustache are.  As for the "white nationalist" or "misogynist" views of some of my fellow posters on PSF, I can't say that I agree.  But, I know that you and I share completely different political views, so you might think some of my opinions are "white nationialist" for all I know. 

Nope, the white nationalist would be former SS moderator The Real Beach Boy. And the misogynist would be Mike's Beard. Ask Debbie Keil if she thinks he's respectful to women. Not a lot on the internet surprises me, but within the BB fan community the things these fellas said....wow.

And I guess I can see why you don't mind a lot of the horrendous things Mike has done. You've got a thing for the egotistical, paunchy, crude, rude serial adulterers who "tell it like it is."

[KDS]

That's fine, Jim, and you're entitled to your opinion. 

And I'll admit, there's plenty Mike does that I'm not a fan of (ie. the 2005 lawsuit, Pisces Brothers consistent presence in BB setlists, the new version of Do It Again). 

I consider myself to be an passionate about the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, as the next guy.  Which is why, like I told Guitarfool, I'm strictly staying with the musical side of things here, as that's what drew me to this band in the first place. 

But here's the thing KDS, how could you be passionate about the members if you don't really have an opinion? It doesn't bug you that this guy has sabotaged the fact that we could've gotten more official Beach Boys music from a willing Brian Wilson, along with Mike Love and Al Jardine, all so he could go tour in Bumfuck, USA with John Stamos and be the big star, rather than have to deal with that darned Melinda?

And you don't have an opinion on the fact that there are people on the other board who have willingly spread LIES about Brian, his wife and his family, even though the claim to be a non-biased observer? That gets me.

Trust me, the music is ultimately the thing to me, but I can not avoid the bad taste that I've gotten from the Mike Love circle. It's crude, mean spirited and childish. Do I think Mike ultimately cares about Brian? Yeah, but I think the thing is that it's not only Brian that's changed so much over the past 50 plus years. It is Mike who has as well, and I don't think that he realizes that. He's grown into quite a different person than he was, and I don't think he realizes this, yet expects Brian to be the same as he was. And lastly, if this "inside baseball" stuff bugs you so much, why comment on it? There are quite a few topics on this board that I have little interest in and therefore, I don't comment in them. However, it seems like this one does interest you, because you do bring this up a lot on this board, and a few times on the other board, which you seem to praise as "fairer" despite the presence of posters who have variously demonstrated bigoted, white nationalist, misogynistic, and other horrific behaviors. So it's weird. Just my opinion.

It's not that I don't have an opinion. 

I can understand how Mike gets your goat.  But, I'm not really sure why you seem to be concerned about everybody having the same opinions as you.

I said, I don't like everything Mike has done.   Some of the things he's done and said has ranged from childish to petty in my opinion.  But, also my opinion, I don't buy into the belief that everything Mike does in 2017 is somehow tarnishing the great legacy of The Beach Boys.  I'm more passionate about the mistakes that were made in the late 60s and 1970s, when the band still had a legit chance to be as respected as The Beatles, Stones, Who, etc etc.   In the light of those gaffs, a solo single remake with a TV star and a one hit wonder isn't a blip on the radar in my opinion.   

I think their legacy is set too. I don't buy it that Mike doing a shitty remake single or even a shitty remake album will tarnish much if anything. I mean, let's be honest...he actually made this and people still aren't embarrassed to be fans...



It has nothing to do with the legacy for me. What it has to do for me is that Mike Love acts like a fucking prick a whole lot. Giving more credence to Evan Landy than, say, Melinda would be a start. All I know is if my cousin, who I was in business with for over 50 years started praising and/or valuing the words of the family who almost killed me over those of my wife and I, well that would be something. Or the constant saying that he is "controlled" or "medicated" or whatever. He is the only person in the group who does stuff like this. Brian doesn't. Al doesn't, even though I have to feel that he could go after Mike big time if he really wanted to. Bruce is a pretty major douchenozzle, but you're not gonna catch him being that disrespectful. And those are just a few things. You act like everything is even, and you just can't understand why Mike gets the kinda stick he does. And you go over to the other board and talk smack about this one and it's anti-Mike viewpoints every now and then, yet I've never seen you complain that Came Molt is in intractable asshole who pushes an outright false agenda for....what? To serve some bald, paunchy egoist? Or that posters like "The Fake Surfer Girl" and "Bruce's Moustache" are by turns white nationalist and misogynist, amongst other reprehensible traits. But not a word from you. It's this joint that deserves the pile on.

And I'm not worried about anybody having the same opinions as me. And I don't think I line up with any particular group on these message boards. I would be just as likely to challenge guitarfool as I am filledthepageupwithgarbage or Came Mott. What does get my goat is you try to pull this whole I'm all about the music schtick yet, here you are. If this place ain't giving ya what you want, the door is that-a-way!

Frankly, I've seen little evidence of Bruce being a douche.   And I have no idea who Fake Surfer Girl or Bruce's Moustache are.  As for the "white nationalist" or "misogynist" views of some of my fellow posters on PSF, I can't say that I agree.  But, I know that you and I share completely different political views, so you might think some of my opinions are "white nationialist" for all I know. 

Nope, the white nationalist would be former SS moderator The Real Beach Boy. And the misogynist would be Mike's Beard. Ask Debbie Keil if she thinks he's respectful to women. Not a lot on the internet surprises me, but within the BB fan community the things these fellas said....wow.

And I guess I can see why you don't mind a lot of the horrendous things Mike has done. You've got a thing for the egotistical, paunchy, crude, rude serial adulterers who "tell it like it is."

I'm pretty sure I said in some post way back when that I thought fake profile used to demean Debbie was out of line. 

If I had any interest is making this about politics, I'd make a post in the Sandbox. 

[Jim V.]

That's fine, Jim, and you're entitled to your opinion. 

And I'll admit, there's plenty Mike does that I'm not a fan of (ie. the 2005 lawsuit, Pisces Brothers consistent presence in BB setlists, the new version of Do It Again). 

I consider myself to be an passionate about the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, as the next guy.  Which is why, like I told Guitarfool, I'm strictly staying with the musical side of things here, as that's what drew me to this band in the first place. 

But here's the thing KDS, how could you be passionate about the members if you don't really have an opinion? It doesn't bug you that this guy has sabotaged the fact that we could've gotten more official Beach Boys music from a willing Brian Wilson, along with Mike Love and Al Jardine, all so he could go tour in Bumfuck, USA with John Stamos and be the big star, rather than have to deal with that darned Melinda?

And you don't have an opinion on the fact that there are people on the other board who have willingly spread LIES about Brian, his wife and his family, even though the claim to be a non-biased observer? That gets me.

Trust me, the music is ultimately the thing to me, but I can not avoid the bad taste that I've gotten from the Mike Love circle. It's crude, mean spirited and childish. Do I think Mike ultimately cares about Brian? Yeah, but I think the thing is that it's not only Brian that's changed so much over the past 50 plus years. It is Mike who has as well, and I don't think that he realizes that. He's grown into quite a different person than he was, and I don't think he realizes this, yet expects Brian to be the same as he was. And lastly, if this "inside baseball" stuff bugs you so much, why comment on it? There are quite a few topics on this board that I have little interest in and therefore, I don't comment in them. However, it seems like this one does interest you, because you do bring this up a lot on this board, and a few times on the other board, which you seem to praise as "fairer" despite the presence of posters who have variously demonstrated bigoted, white nationalist, misogynistic, and other horrific behaviors. So it's weird. Just my opinion.

It's not that I don't have an opinion. 

I can understand how Mike gets your goat.  But, I'm not really sure why you seem to be concerned about everybody having the same opinions as you.

I said, I don't like everything Mike has done.   Some of the things he's done and said has ranged from childish to petty in my opinion.  But, also my opinion, I don't buy into the belief that everything Mike does in 2017 is somehow tarnishing the great legacy of The Beach Boys.  I'm more passionate about the mistakes that were made in the late 60s and 1970s, when the band still had a legit chance to be as respected as The Beatles, Stones, Who, etc etc.   In the light of those gaffs, a solo single remake with a TV star and a one hit wonder isn't a blip on the radar in my opinion.   

I think their legacy is set too. I don't buy it that Mike doing a shitty remake single or even a shitty remake album will tarnish much if anything. I mean, let's be honest...he actually made this and people still aren't embarrassed to be fans...



It has nothing to do with the legacy for me. What it has to do for me is that Mike Love acts like a fucking prick a whole lot. Giving more credence to Evan Landy than, say, Melinda would be a start. All I know is if my cousin, who I was in business with for over 50 years started praising and/or valuing the words of the family who almost killed me over those of my wife and I, well that would be something. Or the constant saying that he is "controlled" or "medicated" or whatever. He is the only person in the group who does stuff like this. Brian doesn't. Al doesn't, even though I have to feel that he could go after Mike big time if he really wanted to. Bruce is a pretty major douchenozzle, but you're not gonna catch him being that disrespectful. And those are just a few things. You act like everything is even, and you just can't understand why Mike gets the kinda stick he does. And you go over to the other board and talk smack about this one and it's anti-Mike viewpoints every now and then, yet I've never seen you complain that Came Molt is in intractable asshole who pushes an outright false agenda for....what? To serve some bald, paunchy egoist? Or that posters like "The Fake Surfer Girl" and "Bruce's Moustache" are by turns white nationalist and misogynist, amongst other reprehensible traits. But not a word from you. It's this joint that deserves the pile on.

And I'm not worried about anybody having the same opinions as me. And I don't think I line up with any particular group on these message boards. I would be just as likely to challenge guitarfool as I am filledthepageupwithgarbage or Came Mott. What does get my goat is you try to pull this whole I'm all about the music schtick yet, here you are. If this place ain't giving ya what you want, the door is that-a-way!

Frankly, I've seen little evidence of Bruce being a douche.   And I have no idea who Fake Surfer Girl or Bruce's Moustache are.  As for the "white nationalist" or "misogynist" views of some of my fellow posters on PSF, I can't say that I agree.  But, I know that you and I share completely different political views, so you might think some of my opinions are "white nationialist" for all I know. 

Nope, the white nationalist would be former SS moderator The Real Beach Boy. And the misogynist would be Mike's Beard. Ask Debbie Keil if she thinks he's respectful to women. Not a lot on the internet surprises me, but within the BB fan community the things these fellas said....wow.

And I guess I can see why you don't mind a lot of the horrendous things Mike has done. You've got a thing for the egotistical, paunchy, crude, rude serial adulterers who "tell it like it is."

I'm pretty sure I said in some post way back when that I thought fake profile used to demean Debbie was out of line. 

If I had any interest is making this about politics, I'd make a post in the Sandbox. 

So that's "out of line" but not worth bringing up on it's own. But guitarfool being a bit over the line on "Runaway Dancer" (which I don't like all that much either, though I kinda did like the ska type live arrangement), that warrants a calling out.

Kinda reminds me of the GOP assholes who will go on the cable news shows defending their prez when it comes to p*ssy grabbing or meeting with Russians. They'll say, "oh, it's just horrible, horrible" but then proceed as if nothing happened and that the behavior is totally acceptable.

[KDS]

That's fine, Jim, and you're entitled to your opinion. 

And I'll admit, there's plenty Mike does that I'm not a fan of (ie. the 2005 lawsuit, Pisces Brothers consistent presence in BB setlists, the new version of Do It Again). 

I consider myself to be an passionate about the music of The Beach Boys, and their members, as the next guy.  Which is why, like I told Guitarfool, I'm strictly staying with the musical side of things here, as that's what drew me to this band in the first place. 

But here's the thing KDS, how could you be passionate about the members if you don't really have an opinion? It doesn't bug you that this guy has sabotaged the fact that we could've gotten more official Beach Boys music from a willing Brian Wilson, along with Mike Love and Al Jardine, all so he could go tour in Bumfuck, USA with John Stamos and be the big star, rather than have to deal with that darned Melinda?

And you don't have an opinion on the fact that there are people on the other board who have willingly spread LIES about Brian, his wife and his family, even though the claim to be a non-biased observer? That gets me.

Trust me, the music is ultimately the thing to me, but I can not avoid the bad taste that I've gotten from the Mike Love circle. It's crude, mean spirited and childish. Do I think Mike ultimately cares about Brian? Yeah, but I think the thing is that it's not only Brian that's changed so much over the past 50 plus years. It is Mike who has as well, and I don't think that he realizes that. He's grown into quite a different person than he was, and I don't think he realizes this, yet expects Brian to be the same as he was. And lastly, if this "inside baseball" stuff bugs you so much, why comment on it? There are quite a few topics on this board that I have little interest in and therefore, I don't comment in them. However, it seems like this one does interest you, because you do bring this up a lot on this board, and a few times on the other board, which you seem to praise as "fairer" despite the presence of posters who have variously demonstrated bigoted, white nationalist, misogynistic, and other horrific behaviors. So it's weird. Just my opinion.

It's not that I don't have an opinion. 

I can understand how Mike gets your goat.  But, I'm not really sure why you seem to be concerned about everybody having the same opinions as you.

I said, I don't like everything Mike has done.   Some of the things he's done and said has ranged from childish to petty in my opinion.  But, also my opinion, I don't buy into the belief that everything Mike does in 2017 is somehow tarnishing the great legacy of The Beach Boys.  I'm more passionate about the mistakes that were made in the late 60s and 1970s, when the band still had a legit chance to be as respected as The Beatles, Stones, Who, etc etc.   In the light of those gaffs, a solo single remake with a TV star and a one hit wonder isn't a blip on the radar in my opinion.   

I think their legacy is set too. I don't buy it that Mike doing a shitty remake single or even a shitty remake album will tarnish much if anything. I mean, let's be honest...he actually made this and people still aren't embarrassed to be fans...



It has nothing to do with the legacy for me. What it has to do for me is that Mike Love acts like a fucking prick a whole lot. Giving more credence to Evan Landy than, say, Melinda would be a start. All I know is if my cousin, who I was in business with for over 50 years started praising and/or valuing the words of the family who almost killed me over those of my wife and I, well that would be something. Or the constant saying that he is "controlled" or "medicated" or whatever. He is the only person in the group who does stuff like this. Brian doesn't. Al doesn't, even though I have to feel that he could go after Mike big time if he really wanted to. Bruce is a pretty major douchenozzle, but you're not gonna catch him being that disrespectful. And those are just a few things. You act like everything is even, and you just can't understand why Mike gets the kinda stick he does. And you go over to the other board and talk smack about this one and it's anti-Mike viewpoints every now and then, yet I've never seen you complain that Came Molt is in intractable asshole who pushes an outright false agenda for....what? To serve some bald, paunchy egoist? Or that posters like "The Fake Surfer Girl" and "Bruce's Moustache" are by turns white nationalist and misogynist, amongst other reprehensible traits. But not a word from you. It's this joint that deserves the pile on.

And I'm not worried about anybody having the same opinions as me. And I don't think I line up with any particular group on these message boards. I would be just as likely to challenge guitarfool as I am filledthepageupwithgarbage or Came Mott. What does get my goat is you try to pull this whole I'm all about the music schtick yet, here you are. If this place ain't giving ya what you want, the door is that-a-way!

Frankly, I've seen little evidence of Bruce being a douche.   And I have no idea who Fake Surfer Girl or Bruce's Moustache are.  As for the "white nationalist" or "misogynist" views of some of my fellow posters on PSF, I can't say that I agree.  But, I know that you and I share completely different political views, so you might think some of my opinions are "white nationialist" for all I know. 

Nope, the white nationalist would be former SS moderator The Real Beach Boy. And the misogynist would be Mike's Beard. Ask Debbie Keil if she thinks he's respectful to women. Not a lot on the internet surprises me, but within the BB fan community the things these fellas said....wow.

And I guess I can see why you don't mind a lot of the horrendous things Mike has done. You've got a thing for the egotistical, paunchy, crude, rude serial adulterers who "tell it like it is."

I'm pretty sure I said in some post way back when that I thought fake profile used to demean Debbie was out of line. 

If I had any interest is making this about politics, I'd make a post in the Sandbox. 

So that's "out of line" but not worth bringing up on it's own. But guitarfool being a bit over the line on "Runaway Dancer" (which I don't like all that much either, though I kinda did like the ska type live arrangement), that warrants a calling out.

Kinda reminds me of the GOP assholes who will go on the cable news shows defending their prez when it comes to p*ssy grabbing or meeting with Russians. They'll say, "oh, it's just horrible, horrible" but then proceed as if nothing happened and that the behavior is totally acceptable.

Because a discussion of the merits (or lack thereof) of Runaway Dancer makes sense in the context of this portion of the SSMB.

My supporting Trump and your not supporting him is Sandbox material.  And after some of the nastiness that I encountered here, and other nonBB boards I sometimes participate in, back in January I don't feel like getting into politics. 

[HeyJude]

Frankly, I've seen little evidence of Bruce being a douche.   

I guess it's difficult to quantify what being a "douche" entails, but Bruce has said plenty of objectionable things to fans and in public forums.

In fact, a number of fans have described how Bruce has more of a "Jekyll and Hyde" thing going on than *anyone* in the band.

I've long maintained based on plenty of specific and anecdotal information, Bruce may be the weirdest guy in the band personality-wise.

Bruce has even done his Jekyll and Hyde thing online in the past. He praises Brian (almost overly-praising him in a creepy way, similar to how David Marks described Bruce's attitude towards him in his book with Stebbins), and then says negative stuff. I still feel bad for the poor guy that *clearly innocently* referred to Bruce as "BJ" only to have Bruce tear him a new one. Then there's the other poor slob that just posted a link to a YouTube video of Bruce, and Bruce tore *that* person a new one as if every fan that watched the video had personally come into Bruce's home and stole money out of his Scrooge McDuck vault.

And that's not even getting into the other more innocuous but arguably annoying stuff, like going *on and on* about how awesome and successful his kids are, or how he lives down the street from Oprah, and so on.

I'm not trying to excessively criticize the guy. Sometimes he's as nice as can be. But other times not. And those "not" times tend to be more negative than just about any fan encounters I've heard with *any* of the other members.

[Jim V.]

My supporting Trump and your not supporting him is Sandbox material.  And after some of the nastiness that I encountered here, and other nonBB boards I sometimes participate in, back in January I don't feel like getting into politics. 

Yep, that's for the mods to decide. However, it's great to see you support a man whose sole purpose in the earlier part of this decade was to "prove" that our first African-American president was actually not a natural born citizen and thusly an illegitimate president. Also I must say I'm sure you're a big supporter of the military, though you probably only like the ones who haven't been captured right?

And by the way, did you that when you're famous women will let you do anything? Just kiss. You don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it! You can grab them by the p*ssy! It's great!

[HeyJude]

My supporting Trump and your not supporting him is Sandbox material.  And after some of the nastiness that I encountered here, and other nonBB boards I sometimes participate in, back in January I don't feel like getting into politics. 

To be fair (and clear for the historical record, such that exists and matters), a lot of the Trump stuff from last year and early this year *was* intertwined into on-topic band-related discussions. From Mike's infamous s**t-eating grin photo op from last year, to the inauguration speculation, to the weird post favorably comparing Trump's rally operations to BB tours of the past, a lot of the stuff was intermingled with on-topic discussion, with no clear delineation point for where to break it off.

I felt that an *objective* conversation about the PR problems with the trademark/brand having that association could be had (e.g. even someone who personally favors Trump could and should be able to realize the PR problems with the BB brand being associated with him), but obviously that didn't much occur.

[KDS]

My supporting Trump and your not supporting him is Sandbox material.  And after some of the nastiness that I encountered here, and other nonBB boards I sometimes participate in, back in January I don't feel like getting into politics. 

Yep, that's for the mods to decide. However, it's great to see you support a man whose sole purpose in the earlier part of this decade was to "prove" that our first African-American president was actually not a natural born citizen and thusly an illegitimate president. Also I must say I'm sure you're a big supporter of the military, though you probably only like the ones who haven't been captured right?

And by the way, did you that when you're famous women will let you do anything? Just kiss. You don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it! You can grab them by the p*ssy! It's great!

Like I said, I'm not getting into a political argument.