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Author Topic: Questions for fans who lived through the '60s  (Read 2565 times)
Miser
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« on: July 19, 2017, 07:19:47 PM »

Questions for older fans here who actually experienced the BBs as they evolved and changed in the 1960s:

1) What was the reaction among your peers/fellow BB fans/general music fans to Pet Sounds, and then Smiley Smile as it happened?

2) What genre were the Boys considered to be in the 60s/early 70s?

3) Was the fandom of The BBs (in the late 60s) a different subculture than those were listening to stuff like the Stones and whatnot? Basically my question is, were BB fans more Hippies, or more "Square"? I ask given the Boys' image as a clean-cut, All-American group.

4) Was it hard to be a BB fan after 1967; if so, why?
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« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2017, 08:24:08 PM »

Questions for older fans here who actually experienced the BBs as they evolved and changed in the 1960s:

1) What was the reaction among your peers/fellow BB fans/general music fans to Pet Sounds, and then Smiley Smile as it happened?

Pet Sounds was a wow!!!  THAT's cool reaction.  Smiley Smile was a wtf Huh...walk on/goodbye reaction.  After Smiley Smile...my friends didn't care to even check out the band anymore.  The 'boys' were generally and suddenly considered to be a passe joke.  I was left on my own to listen to subsequent releases and then to eventually find new like-minded fans again around the time of Surf's Up.

2) What genre were the Boys considered to be in the 60s/early 70s?

Progressing [66] to stalled, [67 -71] to Hmmm...this is pretty darned decent ['71-73]  to...Hey man...You were right...these guys are cool [71-73] to clowns.  [the numbers of people 'talking about them dwindling with each passing year from the summer of 1967...on...and then in retrospect as people delved into the group after the fact...back to you were right circa 66,  and then 68 - 73]

3) Was the fandom of The BBs (in the late 60s) a different subculture than those were listening to stuff like the Stones and whatnot? Basically my question is, were BB fans more Hippies, or more "Square"? I ask given the Boys' image as a clean-cut, All-American group.  

More unique.  NOT hippies for sure.  But not squares either.  Just a few folks who found the music to be really well done and not part of any trends.  The Beach Boys were an entity unto themselves...until they quit doing THAT.   And THAT was a non Wilson decision by and large.

4) Was it hard to be a BB fan after 1967; if so, why?  

It was pretty much always hard.  Even when they were impressing the sh!t outta me with Pet Sounds and then Good Vibrations...both logical progressions to my way of thinking...they were not really seen at all as part of the avante garde or as hip trail-blazers...forging a new direction for music.  THAT only garnered recognition in the UK.  And before we give those folks over 'ome too much credit...they, for the most part, didn't seem to 'get' the Moody Blues at all which was and is hogwash too.  So, then, what do [did] they know anyway?

« Last Edit: July 19, 2017, 08:30:28 PM by Add Some » Logged

"Add Some...Music...To Your Day.  I do.  It's the only way to fly.  Well...what was I gonna put here?  An apple a day keeps the doctor away?  Hum me a few bars."   Lee Marshall [2014]

Donald  TRUMP!  ...  Is TOAST.  "What a disaster."  "Overrated?"... ... ..."BIG LEAGUE."  "Lots of people are saying it"  "I will tell you that."   Collusion, Money Laundering, Treason.   B'Bye Dirty Donnie!!!  Adios!!!  Bon Voyage!!!  Toodles!!!  Move yourself...SPANKY!!!  Jail awaits.  It's NO "Witch Hunt". There IS Collusion...and worse.  The Russian Mafia!!  Conspiracies!!  Fraud!!  This racist is goin' down...and soon.  Good Riddance.  And take the kids.
The Cincinnati Kid
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« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2017, 08:54:34 PM »

Questions for older fans here who actually experienced the BBs as they evolved and changed in the 1960s:

1) What was the reaction among your peers/fellow BB fans/general music fans to Pet Sounds, and then Smiley Smile as it happened?

Pet Sounds was a wow!!!  THAT's cool reaction.  Smiley Smile was a wtf Huh...walk on/goodbye reaction.  After Smiley Smile...my friends didn't care to even check out the band anymore.  The 'boys' were generally and suddenly considered to be a passe joke.  I was left on my own to listen to subsequent releases and then to eventually find new like-minded fans again around the time of Surf's Up.

2) What genre were the Boys considered to be in the 60s/early 70s?

Progressing [66] to stalled, [67 -71] to Hmmm...this is pretty darned decent ['71-73]  to...Hey man...You were right...these guys are cool [71-73] to clowns.  [the numbers of people 'talking about them dwindling with each passing year from the summer of 1967...on...and then in retrospect as people delved into the group after the fact...back to you were right circa 66,  and then 68 - 73]

3) Was the fandom of The BBs (in the late 60s) a different subculture than those were listening to stuff like the Stones and whatnot? Basically my question is, were BB fans more Hippies, or more "Square"? I ask given the Boys' image as a clean-cut, All-American group.  

More unique.  NOT hippies for sure.  But not squares either.  Just a few folks who found the music to be really well done and not part of any trends.  The Beach Boys were an entity unto themselves...until they quit doing THAT.   And THAT was a non Wilson decision by and large.

4) Was it hard to be a BB fan after 1967; if so, why?  

It was pretty much always hard.  Even when they were impressing the sh!t outta me with Pet Sounds and then Good Vibrations...both logical progressions to my way of thinking...they were not really seen at all as part of the avante garde or as hip trail-blazers...forging a new direction for music.  THAT only garnered recognition in the UK.  And before we give those folks over 'ome too much credit...they, for the most part, didn't seem to 'get' the Moody Blues at all which was and is hogwash too.  So, then, what do [did] they know anyway?


Do you recall people being excited about the next Beach Boys single after Good Vibrations?  The quick rise and fall of Heroes and Villains suggested to me that people were ready to embrace whatever the band had next, but H&V didn't hit the sweet spot.  Of course the long delay between releases and SS threw a wet blanket on everything as you mentioned.
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Aum Bop Diddit
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« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2017, 09:31:36 PM »

I was 11 years old in 1967, and a huge beach Boys fan since I first heard Surfin' USA and got the Surfin' Safari LP Christmas 1963.  Today was the 1st album I bought with my own money.  I was stymied by the "slow" side and then Pet Sounds but I still bought and loved the singles.  You gotta remember there was really only AM "Top 40" then with the occasional Ed Sullivan or Hollywood Palace or Shindig deal.  It was a different world -- no Rolling Stone, no internet or cable -- you only could read about the band in like 16 magazine (a teenybopper rag that focused on groups like the Monkees).  Good Vibrations was the zenith -- hearing that played several times a day was amazing.  I remember being at summer camp in '67 and wondering why there had been no new music since the previous fall -- a lifetime in that era.  I bought Heroes and Villains and liked it, but was curious about the Brother thing.  Smiley Smile was too much.  But I still loved the singles -- Wild Honey, Darlin', Do it Again, I Can Hear Music...but it was an unnerving time and my connection to the band was challenged.  They became hard to find and were replaced by the heavier music.  Prior to that things weren't so classified -- you heard Motown, the Beatles, Sinatra -- Frank or Nancy -- the Byrds, James Brown, Henry Mancini, Motown, Sgt. Barry Sadler...it was all on the same station.

Eventually FM became the bandwidth, things got even heavier, but the Jack Rieley trip put the BBs back into view.  I heard feel Flows and Student Demonstration Time on the local "underground" station and bought Surf's Up -- been on board since and rediscovered all that great music I had overlooked.

As documented often here, being a Beach Boys fan always carried the chance of being heavily dissed for being uncool.  Before the internet if you ran into another fanatic it was big deal -- I remember my buddy getting me my 1st Smile boot -- on like a 3rd or 4th generation cassette.  But then it meant something to hold that music close to your soul.

The past 25 years or so have been absolutely amazing, with the release of so much mind blowing  lost brilliance, along with the rediscovery of what was already there, and the formation of communities like this.  Along with Brian making new music, touring, Love and Mercy and so on.   Remembering what it was like in the wilderness years -- we are blessed!
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« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2017, 10:31:31 PM »

Became close in 1967 and never stopped for 44 years. Over 100 shows in 17 states. Most were 70's through 90's. Esp. 1968 through 2004. Had my fill. Many up and close. I've told all the stories here. At least most of them. Yes, I have BB cred. Big-time!
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« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2017, 02:55:28 AM »

1) What was the reaction among your peers/fellow BB fans/general music fans to Pet Sounds, and then Smiley Smile as it happened?

I worked in the record department of a UK store at the time and PS, Revolver and Blonde on Blonde were the three top sellers. PS had been given massive radio coverage (by the offshore pirate stations) and by then I'd heard "SJB", "GOK" "WIBN", "Here Today" and "Caroline, No". Even then, the album was regarded as a masterpiece in the UK. I'd bought it in early '67 by which time there was talk of Smile, which was to be a sort of a continuation of "GV". I was bewildered as much as anyone else when I bought SS later that year. It took several months before I came to terms with it and then actually got to like it!   

2) What genre were the Boys considered to be in the 60s/early 70s?

I'd say they were always pop. Although until "GV" they were regarded as really pushing the envelope. But even after that, every new BB 45 was an event. Sunflower went unnoticed but Surf's Up might have been considered a foray into "progressive" music, mainly on the strength of side 2.   

3) Was the fandom of The BBs (in the late 60s) a different subculture than those were listening to stuff like the Stones and whatnot? Basically my question is, were BB fans more Hippies, or more "Square"? I ask given the Boys' image as a clean-cut, All-American group.

I don't know. I only really knew one other fan. I wouldn't put them in either camp. They seemed to defy those categories, in my experience.   

4) Was it hard to be a BB fan after 1967; if so, why?

Not for me, as I didn't mix with any particular musical crowd. I didn't mix, period.  Grin 
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« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2017, 06:06:05 AM »

Questions for older fans here who actually experienced the BBs as they evolved and changed in the 1960s:

1) What was the reaction among your peers/fellow BB fans/general music fans to Pet Sounds, and then Smiley Smile as it happened?

Pet Sounds was a wow!!!  THAT's cool reaction.  Smiley Smile was a wtf Huh...walk on/goodbye reaction.  After Smiley Smile...my friends didn't care to even check out the band anymore.  The 'boys' were generally and suddenly considered to be a passe joke.  I was left on my own to listen to subsequent releases and then to eventually find new like-minded fans again around the time of Surf's Up.

2) What genre were the Boys considered to be in the 60s/early 70s?

Progressing [66] to stalled, [67 -71] to Hmmm...this is pretty darned decent ['71-73]  to...Hey man...You were right...these guys are cool [71-73] to clowns.  [the numbers of people 'talking about them dwindling with each passing year from the summer of 1967...on...and then in retrospect as people delved into the group after the fact...back to you were right circa 66,  and then 68 - 73]

3) Was the fandom of The BBs (in the late 60s) a different subculture than those were listening to stuff like the Stones and whatnot? Basically my question is, were BB fans more Hippies, or more "Square"? I ask given the Boys' image as a clean-cut, All-American group.  

More unique.  NOT hippies for sure.  But not squares either.  Just a few folks who found the music to be really well done and not part of any trends.  The Beach Boys were an entity unto themselves...until they quit doing THAT.   And THAT was a non Wilson decision by and large.

4) Was it hard to be a BB fan after 1967; if so, why?  

It was pretty much always hard.  Even when they were impressing the sh!t outta me with Pet Sounds and then Good Vibrations...both logical progressions to my way of thinking...they were not really seen at all as part of the avante garde or as hip trail-blazers...forging a new direction for music.  THAT only garnered recognition in the UK.  And before we give those folks over 'ome too much credit...they, for the most part, didn't seem to 'get' the Moody Blues at all which was and is hogwash too.  So, then, what do [did] they know anyway?


I know it has it's fans, but IMO Smiley Smile might take the prize for worst follow-up to a classic album in rock history.   How in the world could a band release that after Pet Sounds?   
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Cabinessenceking
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« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2017, 06:48:45 AM »

SS is a really cool, weird album in it's own right. But yes that direct continuation from PS to SS was a mindblowingly stupid decision on Brian's part, but Brian was ill at the time and overworked.

The label also bears some responsibility for allowing it to be released. The band were making a ton of money for them still so they should've focused on getting a Smile-lite album out using what pieces they could paste together. Unfortunately nobody else in the band were competent at the time to slip into Brian's shoes. No Brian, no Smile (in any other form than SS).

Really a big shame, but history is what it is.
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« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2017, 07:05:26 AM »

SS is a really cool, weird album in it's own right. But yes that direct continuation from PS to SS was a mindblowingly stupid decision on Brian's part, but Brian was ill at the time and overworked.

The label also bears some responsibility for allowing it to be released. The band were making a ton of money for them still so they should've focused on getting a Smile-lite album out using what pieces they could paste together. Unfortunately nobody else in the band were competent at the time to slip into Brian's shoes. No Brian, no Smile (in any other form than SS).

Really a big shame, but history is what it is.

Shows how different times were.  The album as an artform was still somewhat in its infancy in rock and roll.  Had this occurred in the 1970s, The Beach Boys would've been allowing to tour for another tour while Brian finished putting Smile together. 

Look at Pink Floyd.   After Dark Side of the Moon, they had nothing on the shelf to the point where they almost released an album of ambient household noises.  Instead, they went back on the road and crafted what would become Wish You Were Here. 
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Lee Marshall
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« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2017, 08:50:45 AM »



Do you recall people being excited about the next Beach Boys single after Good Vibrations?  The quick rise and fall of Heroes and Villains suggested to me that people were ready to embrace whatever the band had next, but H&V didn't hit the sweet spot.  Of course the long delay between releases and SS threw a wet blanket on everything as you mentioned.

No...Not really.  Maybe a bit...as there was some buzz about Smile.  But then it didn't happen...and it didn't happen...and it didn't happen.  Good Vibes followed hot on the heels of Pet Sounds/Sloop John B/Caroline No/Wouldn't It Be Nice/God Only Knows.  What a run...and then nothing more from the fall of '66 until well into the summer of '67...and then nothing 'til the tail end of the year. ['cept for that 'gawd-dammed' "bunt" album.  The album which killed them off.  You follow Pet Sounds, Good Vibrations and... to a lesser extent...Heroes and Villains with THAT?!?!?  Shocked]

By then?  People had forgotten about the 'Boys'  The inroads they made in '66 were cast aside by the radio listening/record buying public.  In spite of a couple of last gasps from Wild Honey which was really a short...odd...muddy little release.  Then came 'Friends'.  Crickets.  20/20.  A minor hit single and little more and the sensational Sunflower which was met with a resounding  Y A W N.  3 really excellent albums which saw the band back on the road to new tomorrows and they got pretty close to dick-all in response.  The Beach Boys were pretty much too strange for top 40 AM radio and too freakin' square for free form FM.  They were, in essence, sh!t outta luck.

Before the internet and my coming into the online community in the early 90s...I thought that I was one of a handful of fans left.  It was a lonely existence.  I was aware that 'love' had been a really negative influence and an out and out downer in terms of  Brian's creativity.  It had been well documented.  I was also aware that the reason why MANY didn't like the Beach Boys was ALL about that nose sound.  For many it was just too grating and off-putting.  They weren't aware of the fact that 'love' had been moved into a far less prominent position.  T'was, at any rate, too late.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2017, 08:59:43 AM by Add Some » Logged

"Add Some...Music...To Your Day.  I do.  It's the only way to fly.  Well...what was I gonna put here?  An apple a day keeps the doctor away?  Hum me a few bars."   Lee Marshall [2014]

Donald  TRUMP!  ...  Is TOAST.  "What a disaster."  "Overrated?"... ... ..."BIG LEAGUE."  "Lots of people are saying it"  "I will tell you that."   Collusion, Money Laundering, Treason.   B'Bye Dirty Donnie!!!  Adios!!!  Bon Voyage!!!  Toodles!!!  Move yourself...SPANKY!!!  Jail awaits.  It's NO "Witch Hunt". There IS Collusion...and worse.  The Russian Mafia!!  Conspiracies!!  Fraud!!  This racist is goin' down...and soon.  Good Riddance.  And take the kids.
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« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2017, 10:59:07 AM »

Of course the long delay between releases and SS threw a wet blanket on everything as you mentioned.

One of the biggest and most absurd wet blankets was to release "Then I Kissed Her" as a 45...
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You're Grass and I'm a Power Mower: A Beach Boys Orchestration Web Series
the Carbon Freeze | Eclectic Essays & Art
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