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Author Topic: Mike and Bruce Beach Boys 2017 Tour  (Read 15965 times)
KDS
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« Reply #150 on: September 29, 2017, 08:03:54 AM »

Any thread has the potential to get bogged down in this or that, and take some left turns. But in discussing things like Mike's band performing "Surf's Up", or Foskett joining; those are on-topic enough in my opinion. The thread is simply titled "Mike and Bruce Beach Boys 2017 Tour", and the recent discussion developed from discussing a guy who is in Mike's band, and discussing how he arrived in Mike's band and the potential implications/ramifications of same.

That's fine.  And I'm fine with agreeing to disagree. 
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« Reply #151 on: September 29, 2017, 08:09:58 AM »


To their credit, there *are" some fans who ignore all of the personal/political stuff and give everybody and everything related to the band ten thumbs up, and also stay *consistent* about that. And I do appreciate that. It doesn't make for much interesting discussion in my personal opinion, but I appreciate and respect the optimism and consistency.

I don't even know that it would be optimism. More just area of interest.

I don't count myself in that camp, anyway. I am interested in the goings-on. I just tend to be more detached about it. Keeps the blood pressure in a healthy range.  Grin
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« Reply #152 on: September 29, 2017, 08:11:46 AM »


To their credit, there *are" some fans who ignore all of the personal/political stuff and give everybody and everything related to the band ten thumbs up, and also stay *consistent* about that. And I do appreciate that. It doesn't make for much interesting discussion in my personal opinion, but I appreciate and respect the optimism and consistency.

I don't even know that it would be optimism. More just area of interest.

I don't count myself in that camp, anyway. I am interested in the goings-on. I just tend to be more detached about it. Keeps the blood pressure in a healthy range.  Grin

That's kinda where I am right now.   Three years ago, I never would've paid money to see the M&B version of The Beach Boys. 
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« Reply #153 on: September 29, 2017, 11:36:26 AM »

Hey guys, who cares that The Beatles broke up! We had four different solo artists to listen to instead of the whole group!!

Right?!?
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the captain
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« Reply #154 on: September 29, 2017, 12:02:57 PM »

I think they should have been forced to stay together despite not getting along. That makes more sense.

Right?!?!
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« Reply #155 on: September 29, 2017, 12:47:25 PM »

That's fine.  Like I said, I just don't see it that way.  And I doubt anyone in either band sees it that way. 


And the latter is verifiably wrong. How many band members have you asked about Jeff's movement from Brian to Mike's band?

They most certainly *are* aware of the political ramifications.

I would argue even if one had never heard one peep from the band members regarding the issue, it would still go far beyond straining credulity to suggest the band members aren't aware of what Jeff's move *means.* But members have discussed it, and while they may not all have precisely the same feelings about it or all give it the same precise amount of weight as an issue, they most certainly *are* well aware that Jeff leaving Brian's band and joining Mike's band is a HUGE deal in terms of BB/band/corporate politics.

Of course they're all pros and they're not going to give an interview to a local radio station and air their personal take on BB politics. The few times guys like Darian give interviews, they stay pretty diplomatic.

But behind the scenes, they all know the deal. They know Jeff jumping ship was/is more than just a standard personnel maneuver, both because of the circumstances *and* because of who the person is.

Before you dismiss my opinion as wrong, how many band members have you talked to?

Multiple, and I've talked to journalists who have talked with a number of them as well.

As I said, I'm not even getting into the precise individual feelings/opinions on the issue. I'm simply saying that it ain't rocket science to acknowledge that these guys all *are simply aware* that Jeff's move was a huge, political maneuver *by it's very nature.*

To not acknowledge this would be like witnessing a wife leaving her husband for her husband's best friend and then claiming there's nothing potentially acrimonious or messy about it.

I've not seen one member of either Brian's or Mike's band make a public statement about Jeff's departure--outside of Jeff himself. Actually, I would consider it quite unprofessional/disloyal for another member to comment on it privately or publicly. Honestly, it's between Brian and Jeff.

Too be clear, I'm not saying it wasn't political. But based on the minimal information provided publicly, it basically comes down to "trust me, I've talked to people in the know and they say it was a big f*** you to Brian." If I'm missed the sourcing, please send me in the right direction.
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« Reply #156 on: September 29, 2017, 01:28:12 PM »

That's fine.  Like I said, I just don't see it that way.  And I doubt anyone in either band sees it that way.  


And the latter is verifiably wrong. How many band members have you asked about Jeff's movement from Brian to Mike's band?

They most certainly *are* aware of the political ramifications.

I would argue even if one had never heard one peep from the band members regarding the issue, it would still go far beyond straining credulity to suggest the band members aren't aware of what Jeff's move *means.* But members have discussed it, and while they may not all have precisely the same feelings about it or all give it the same precise amount of weight as an issue, they most certainly *are* well aware that Jeff leaving Brian's band and joining Mike's band is a HUGE deal in terms of BB/band/corporate politics.

Of course they're all pros and they're not going to give an interview to a local radio station and air their personal take on BB politics. The few times guys like Darian give interviews, they stay pretty diplomatic.

But behind the scenes, they all know the deal. They know Jeff jumping ship was/is more than just a standard personnel maneuver, both because of the circumstances *and* because of who the person is.

Before you dismiss my opinion as wrong, how many band members have you talked to?

Multiple, and I've talked to journalists who have talked with a number of them as well.

As I said, I'm not even getting into the precise individual feelings/opinions on the issue. I'm simply saying that it ain't rocket science to acknowledge that these guys all *are simply aware* that Jeff's move was a huge, political maneuver *by it's very nature.*

To not acknowledge this would be like witnessing a wife leaving her husband for her husband's best friend and then claiming there's nothing potentially acrimonious or messy about it.

I've not seen one member of either Brian's or Mike's band make a public statement about Jeff's departure--outside of Jeff himself. Actually, I would consider it quite unprofessional/disloyal for another member to comment on it privately or publicly. Honestly, it's between Brian and Jeff.

Too be clear, I'm not saying it wasn't political. But based on the minimal information provided publicly, it basically comes down to "trust me, I've talked to people in the know and they say it was a big f*** you to Brian." If I'm missed the sourcing, please send me in the right direction.

Not quite. More something like "Everybody in the know and everybody not in the know would agree that Jeff's move *has the appearance of* and *is unavoidably by its very nature* a giant f**k you to Melinda and thus Brian."

I'm not arguing what the actual motives in the moves were, nor am I even arguing how any members of the organizations actually feel about it. Rather, I'm simply pointing out that the (admittedly not huge) selection of people who in the past have seemed to claim there is nothing either in practice or implicit in Jeff's move that is the slightly bit political, are ignoring the painfully obvious (or for some other reason are refusing the admit the obvious).

Trying to guess (or analyze based on actual comments from people "in the know") about whether any element of Jeff's move actually *was* motivated by trying to inflict a political/personal wound "on the other camp" is a whole other ball of wax. I personally think there's no way at least part of the motivation on Mike and/or Jeff's part *wasn't* to offer a big F-you to Melinda. But that element of it isn't what I was getting at in my previous posts.
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« Reply #157 on: September 29, 2017, 02:50:11 PM »

That's fine.  Like I said, I just don't see it that way.  And I doubt anyone in either band sees it that way.  


And the latter is verifiably wrong. How many band members have you asked about Jeff's movement from Brian to Mike's band?

They most certainly *are* aware of the political ramifications.

I would argue even if one had never heard one peep from the band members regarding the issue, it would still go far beyond straining credulity to suggest the band members aren't aware of what Jeff's move *means.* But members have discussed it, and while they may not all have precisely the same feelings about it or all give it the same precise amount of weight as an issue, they most certainly *are* well aware that Jeff leaving Brian's band and joining Mike's band is a HUGE deal in terms of BB/band/corporate politics.

Of course they're all pros and they're not going to give an interview to a local radio station and air their personal take on BB politics. The few times guys like Darian give interviews, they stay pretty diplomatic.

But behind the scenes, they all know the deal. They know Jeff jumping ship was/is more than just a standard personnel maneuver, both because of the circumstances *and* because of who the person is.

Before you dismiss my opinion as wrong, how many band members have you talked to?

Multiple, and I've talked to journalists who have talked with a number of them as well.

As I said, I'm not even getting into the precise individual feelings/opinions on the issue. I'm simply saying that it ain't rocket science to acknowledge that these guys all *are simply aware* that Jeff's move was a huge, political maneuver *by it's very nature.*

To not acknowledge this would be like witnessing a wife leaving her husband for her husband's best friend and then claiming there's nothing potentially acrimonious or messy about it.

I've not seen one member of either Brian's or Mike's band make a public statement about Jeff's departure--outside of Jeff himself. Actually, I would consider it quite unprofessional/disloyal for another member to comment on it privately or publicly. Honestly, it's between Brian and Jeff.

Too be clear, I'm not saying it wasn't political. But based on the minimal information provided publicly, it basically comes down to "trust me, I've talked to people in the know and they say it was a big f*** you to Brian." If I'm missed the sourcing, please send me in the right direction.

Not quite. More something like "Everybody in the know and everybody not in the know would agree that Jeff's move *has the appearance of* and *is unavoidably by its very nature* a giant f**k you to Melinda and thus Brian."

I'm not arguing what the actual movies in the moves were, nor am I even arguing how any members of the organizations actually feel about it. Rather, I'm simply pointing out that the (admittedly not huge) selection of people who in the past have seemed to claim there is nothing either in practice or implicit in Jeff's move that is the slightly bit political, are ignoring the painfully obvious (or for some other reason are refusing the admit the obvious).

Trying to guess (or analyze based on actual comments from people "in the know") about whether any element of Jeff's move actually *was* motivated by trying to inflict a political/personal wound "on the other camp" is a whole other ball of wax. I personally think there's no way at least part of the motivation on Mike and/or Jeff's part *wasn't* to offer a big F-you to Melinda. But that element of it isn't what I was getting at in my previous posts.

All good points.

And for anyone who somehow doesn't want to admit the Jeff bandmate switch was some kind of F-you thing... does anyone - even those people who somehow think that - honestly think that Mike doesn't truly desire to give an F-you to Melinda? It should be quite obvious from his interviews that he is chomping at the bit to make that clear.

Mike clearly doesn't like her (to put it mildly), but cannot outright publicly say the specifics of his feelings about her, because even Mike, who lacks self-awareness big-time, knows that you can't specifically go trash-talking a relative's spouse by name and specifically say directly bad things about them in public... And OF COURSE, the resulting passive aggressive behavior will leak out, and political maneuvers will manifest as a result of that pissed-offness.  So it becomes a slightly indirect thing, where Mike calls out "others" as opposed to stating those people by name, and then things like Jeff getting a gig in Mike's band.

I'm also not gonna pretend that adding more original BBs members to Brian's tours wasn't at least partially motivated by simliar F-you (towards Mike) instincts on Melinda's part. As HeyJude stated above, at minimum, we have people doing things which give particular appearances. These people KNOW what the appearance is, and aren't just going to do these things while everything is magically hunky-dory. No fan of this band is possibly dense enough to not realize this, amiright?

Again, there are surely other factors at play. Getting more original BB members in Brian's band also helped beef up the legitimacy in many peoples' eyes, especially after having been spoiled with C50. Mike did the next best thing he could do, other than getting another original member in his band... get the longest-term almost-member who's the closest thing to an original member without being one... and getting someone who is politically neutered and cannot throw their weight around or rock Mike's precious boat of having total control over the brand name. Plus, of course, Jeff brings legit talent and tons of experience.   Makes perfect sense. The F-You thing to Melinda is at minimum an added bonus in the equation. 
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« Reply #158 on: September 29, 2017, 03:27:08 PM »

Mike cannot be controlled since he “is” the BBs.... Roll Eyes
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« Reply #159 on: October 01, 2017, 10:07:55 AM »

If I'm remembering correctly, Jeff joined Mike & Bruce in May of 2014. This was seven months in to Brian not touring at all. In the year after Jeff joined Mike & Bruce (May 2014-May 2015), I think Brian played less than 20 shows. In fairness, Brian was working on No Pier Pressure during this time, but this wasn't exactly a period of steady work.

I don't begrudge anyone looking for steady work. Why don't people claim Darian has abandoned Brian? Again, the dude was looking for steady work with Disney and the Zombies--no hard feelings, even though the band is better with Darian IMO.
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« Reply #160 on: October 01, 2017, 11:16:36 AM »

If I'm remembering correctly, Jeff joined Mike & Bruce in May of 2014. This was seven months in to Brian not touring at all. In the year after Jeff joined Mike & Bruce (May 2014-May 2015), I think Brian played less than 20 shows. In fairness, Brian was working on No Pier Pressure during this time, but this wasn't exactly a period of steady work.

I don't begrudge anyone looking for steady work. Why don't people claim Darian has abandoned Brian? Again, the dude was looking for steady work with Disney and the Zombies--no hard feelings, even though the band is better with Darian IMO.

Darian is still a member of Brian's band, though.
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« Reply #161 on: October 01, 2017, 11:42:55 AM »

If I'm remembering correctly, Jeff joined Mike & Bruce in May of 2014. This was seven months in to Brian not touring at all. In the year after Jeff joined Mike & Bruce (May 2014-May 2015), I think Brian played less than 20 shows. In fairness, Brian was working on No Pier Pressure during this time, but this wasn't exactly a period of steady work.

I don't begrudge anyone looking for steady work. Why don't people claim Darian has abandoned Brian? Again, the dude was looking for steady work with Disney and the Zombies--no hard feelings, even though the band is better with Darian IMO.

Darian is still a member of Brian's band, though.
I guess, but Brian has not been his main priority in the past 18 months. If the Zombies and Brian Wilson are playing the same night, where is Darian's loyalty? Again, not begrudging him, but all of these guys need to make a living.
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« Reply #162 on: October 01, 2017, 12:04:16 PM »

Priority and contractual obligations might be two different things. I have no idea but it’s entirely possible that doing Zombies shows when they overlap is because of business obligations, not loyalty.
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« Reply #163 on: October 01, 2017, 12:16:18 PM »

If I'm remembering correctly, Jeff joined Mike & Bruce in May of 2014. This was seven months in to Brian not touring at all. In the year after Jeff joined Mike & Bruce (May 2014-May 2015), I think Brian played less than 20 shows. In fairness, Brian was working on No Pier Pressure during this time, but this wasn't exactly a period of steady work.

I don't begrudge anyone looking for steady work. Why don't people claim Darian has abandoned Brian? Again, the dude was looking for steady work with Disney and the Zombies--no hard feelings, even though the band is better with Darian IMO.

Darian is still a member of Brian's band, though.
I guess, but Brian has not been his main priority in the past 18 months. If the Zombies and Brian Wilson are playing the same night, where is Darian's loyalty? Again, not begrudging him, but all of these guys need to make a living.

Your scenario would only make sense if The Zombies and Disney repeatedly made public statements sh*t-talking about Brian's wife. Over and over again.

Nope, that didn't happen.

Jeff's current employer, on the other hand...

That's why people aren't questioning Darian for doing some outside work. Your argument doesn't really hold water.
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« Reply #164 on: October 01, 2017, 12:29:22 PM »

Yeah Jeff’s intent was clear since BW has been touring steadily since 2015...
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« Reply #165 on: October 01, 2017, 12:38:20 PM »

Look, I appreciate the (mostly) respectful debate on this topic.

My belief (and I welcome opposing views) is that Jeff would have been less likely to leave if Brian had been in the midst of a two year non-stop touring streak like he is currently on. The fact are that in the seven months prior to Jeff joining Mike & Bruce and for the following year after the move, Brian wasn't playing very many shows.

The decision wasn't made in a vacuum and I personally appreciate Jeff's contributions to Brian's career (again, you can feel free to disagree).
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« Reply #166 on: October 01, 2017, 12:49:55 PM »

Look, I appreciate the (mostly) respectful debate on this topic.

My belief (and I welcome opposing views) is that Jeff would have been less likely to leave if Brian had been in the midst of a two year non-stop touring streak like he is currently on. The fact are that in the seven months prior to Jeff joining Mike & Bruce and for the following year after the move, Brian wasn't playing very many shows.

The decision wasn't made in a vacuum and I personally appreciate Jeff's contributions to Brian's career (again, you can feel free to disagree).

Definitely… If Jeff had left in the middle of Brian's tour, that would've been much worse, and indicative of some really bad blood going on. Perhaps Jeff was just ready to move on, and I can understand that he was perhaps in a position that could've been emotionally draining for many years.  He wasn't just a musician, but he had lots of other duties.

But none of that negates the fact that he moved on to work for a person who had been smack talking his previous employer's wife in the media repeatedly. And who continues to do so. You can't make that not the case. It's the truth.  Either that doesn't bother him, or perhaps he shares those same gripes.  Either way, there's no way that this type of the defection doesn't send some sort of message, even indirectly. No way. He knows it. Mike knows it. Melinda knows it. Everyone knows it.
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« Reply #167 on: October 02, 2017, 06:51:57 AM »

Look, I appreciate the (mostly) respectful debate on this topic.

My belief (and I welcome opposing views) is that Jeff would have been less likely to leave if Brian had been in the midst of a two year non-stop touring streak like he is currently on. The fact are that in the seven months prior to Jeff joining Mike & Bruce and for the following year after the move, Brian wasn't playing very many shows.

The decision wasn't made in a vacuum and I personally appreciate Jeff's contributions to Brian's career (again, you can feel free to disagree).

Based on what I've heard and what I've observed, I don't think Brian's light touring schedule in 2014 was a major factor in Jeff no longer being in Brian's band. Did it play any role at all? It's not impossible. Certainly, if a number of *other* factors are at play (and are the primary motivators behind the change), then *also* not having much work to look forward to in 2014 would make it easier for that employee separation to take place.

Strangely, if you go back and read Foskett's one interview on the subject from 2014, he doesn't describe *lack of work* as a reason at all. Rather, he cites feeling overworked and stressed out.
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« Reply #168 on: October 02, 2017, 06:58:34 AM »

I guess, but Brian has not been his main priority in the past 18 months. If the Zombies and Brian Wilson are playing the same night, where is Darian's loyalty? Again, not begrudging him, but all of these guys need to make a living.

If you don't have access to the contracts involved in either situation (or other agreements however they were made), then it's impossible for you to say where his loyalties are. The evidence strongly suggests he's still Brian's guy, and is one of the only people in the orb of any BB-related touring act who has straddled multiple tour gigs *and* other outside job commitments.

If anything, the fact that Darian has been one of the only members ever in Brian's band to keep *other* commitments yet not be permanently replaced shows how much both Darian and Brian appreciate each other on a personal and musical/business level.

2014 wasn't the first "light" touring year for Brian. It has always been a sporadic gig; outside of 2016 and 2017, Brian has never done a Mike-level all-year touring schedule (and even Brian's '16/'17 schedule is lighter than Mike's). I think Darian has done in the last few years what a variety of the guys have done since joining Brian's band. They do other outside gigs (musical and otherwise) and do their best to schedule around Brian tours. I'm guessing Darian simply had more work scheduled *farther* in advance as of 2015/2016 than the other members typically do. So, whereas say Probyn has been able to forego "California Surf Inc." gigs for the Brian tour (ironically his replacement in *that* band being former guys from Mike's touring band!), Darian has had some commitments that can't be broken.   
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« Reply #169 on: October 02, 2017, 07:03:27 AM »

Look, I appreciate the (mostly) respectful debate on this topic.

My belief (and I welcome opposing views) is that Jeff would have been less likely to leave if Brian had been in the midst of a two year non-stop touring streak like he is currently on. The fact are that in the seven months prior to Jeff joining Mike & Bruce and for the following year after the move, Brian wasn't playing very many shows.

The decision wasn't made in a vacuum and I personally appreciate Jeff's contributions to Brian's career (again, you can feel free to disagree).

Definitely… If Jeff had left in the middle of Brian's tour, that would've been much worse, and indicative of some really bad blood going on. Perhaps Jeff was just ready to move on, and I can understand that he was perhaps in a position that could've been emotionally draining for many years.  He wasn't just a musician, but he had lots of other duties.

But none of that negates the fact that he moved on to work for a person who had been smack talking his previous employer's wife in the media repeatedly. And who continues to do so. You can't make that not the case. It's the truth.  Either that doesn't bother him, or perhaps he shares those same gripes.  Either way, there's no way that this type of the defection doesn't send some sort of message, even indirectly. No way. He knows it. Mike knows it. Melinda knows it. Everyone knows it.

I'd actually say that Mike's "smack talk" on Brian *increased* after Jeff joined Mike's band. Mike's super negative talk in that regard saw a pretty big uptick in later 2014 and then 2015 especially.

My personal hunch based on my gut feeling is that those two things may not wholly unrelated. To be clear, it's just my gut/hunch, nothing more. I do believe Jeff is pretty big player in the whole orb/organization now, at least on Mike's side. I also have had a hunch for awhile that Foskett could be angling to take over the BB license when Mike is no longer able to tour.

And also perhaps related (or maybe not), I have a hunch that as much as Jeff mentioned that he's still friends with Brian, they haven't spoken or seen each other since late 2013.
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« Reply #170 on: October 02, 2017, 01:31:16 PM »

It had been a while since I had read the Foskett post-Brian Wilson interview. It can be found here: http://www.desertsun.com/story/life/entertainment/music/2014/09/22/beach-boys-brian-wilson-jeffrey-foskett/16070181/

If you believe Jeff's timeline, he had left Brian's band before fielding offers from Mike. Again, you can either believe his version, the only person who has gone on the record, or you can believe the chatter.

The other thing that struck me was how Brian describes Jeff's role: "The right-hand man, helps you with the medication, watches you and makes sure (things get done)."

So, if you are to believe Brian, Jeff wasn't replaced as much by Matt Jardine, but Jerry Weiss.

It really does seem like Jeff's professional relationship with Brian had run its course. I personally would extend some grace to a man who had a very difficult job and helped Brian get back on the road.

Again, just my .02
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« Reply #171 on: October 02, 2017, 01:49:20 PM »

It had been a while since I had read the Foskett post-Brian Wilson interview. It can be found here: http://www.desertsun.com/story/life/entertainment/music/2014/09/22/beach-boys-brian-wilson-jeffrey-foskett/16070181/

If you believe Jeff's timeline, he had left Brian's band before fielding offers from Mike. Again, you can either believe his version, the only person who has gone on the record, or you can believe the chatter.

The other thing that struck me was how Brian describes Jeff's role: "The right-hand man, helps you with the medication, watches you and makes sure (things get done)."

So, if you are to believe Brian, Jeff wasn't replaced as much by Matt Jardine, but Jerry Weiss.

It really does seem like Jeff's professional relationship with Brian had run its course. I personally would extend some grace to a man who had a very difficult job and helped Brian get back on the road.

Again, just my .02

Characterizing Jeff's role with Brian (and the "meaning" of it, the import of it, etc.) is not easy. He no doubt had a difficult job. He was both Matt Jardine and Brian's off-stage right-hand man in some cases (read some of Ray Lawlor's old posts for more background on this).

At the same time, he *sought out* that role. He wanted to be the guy you had to go through to get to Brian. He wanted to be the guy next to Brian. Just like now, he is almost in the "Bruce" role now with Mike. Check Facebook out, there are more off-stage, off-site photos of Mike and Jeff doing BB-related appearances than there are of Mike and Bruce.

I also think (based both on common sense as well as other info/sources) that there's more to the story than Jeff being too stressed out on the 2013 tour. It wasn't a long tour, and recording sessions weren't too torturous around that time.

I do think his "I want to look at castles and walk the streets of cities on tour" sort of thing makes total sense. In Mike's band, it surely is a cushier job, with more steady work.

But as I've often said about that 2014 Foskett interview, I think that while he is under *no obligation* to tell the "full story" or even *any* of the story, I'm also not comfortable characterizing that one interview as the "full story." It certainly, and understandably so, ignores the inter-group political ramifications of his move.

I also think as Howie Edelson pointed out way back then, it's a bummer *for* Jeff that he won't be with Brian as Brian rounds out his career. For all those years Jeff spent with Brian, he *should* be there for the final victory laps, but he won't.
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #172 on: October 02, 2017, 02:13:22 PM »


It really does seem like Jeff's professional relationship with Brian had run its course. I personally would extend some grace to a man who had a very difficult job and helped Brian get back on the road.

Again, just my .02

I think this is a perfectly fair thing to say, and I agree.

I also say that jumping to an employer who publicly smack-talks his former employer's wife is an unfortunately icky thing. At best, it's an unfortunate fact that he's now with someone who repeatedly publicly does this. If that doesn't bother him whatsoever, I happen to find that a bit odd.  If he shares those feelings, it would make perfect sense. That's his prerogative, but sad if true.

Marty, do you not see how this is an unfortunate thing, especially after so many years with Brian? It doesn't take away from us appreciating Jeff's contributions to Brian's solo career, and what must have been a difficult job at many times. I mean, I feel pretty confident that privately, Brian's other bandmates would feel that Mike's repeated public comments (especially the totality of steady stream of them) are simply not cool and unfortunate. Jeff, it would seem, crossed the picket line and joined the team making those comments, and to do that means that being surrounded by a boss with that mindset is at best not a dealbreaker to Jeff, or at worst, he is perhaps in silent agreement with some/all of them.

I just think that if he felt those comments were reprehensible and unacceptable, that there's no way he'd work with that employer - even if he wanted to step down from Brian's side for unrelated reasons. Working with Mike was/is apparently more of an important priority than any sort of loyalty to the guy he worked with for so many years - and by loyalty, I don't mean Jeff is disloyal for simply stepping down from Brian's band, but by taking the additional step of quickly becoming the right hand man to the guy who continually sh*t-talks Brian's wife.

To work with Mike in his current capacity means that this is not an unacceptable thing to Jeff, and that's why some people think that's kinda questionable. One can't have it both ways. And yes, I know that Jeff's gotta eat and pay his bills.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2017, 04:47:11 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
tpesky
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« Reply #173 on: October 02, 2017, 05:06:07 PM »

In some ways it's not surprising. Jeff was a Mike guy originally when he was brought into the band.  He always did those side gigs with Mike in the 80s and 90s. He did choose to work with Brian ( Jeff stated he had offers from all 3 camps when the BB broke up) and that is admirable. I can see where the job with Mike has much less stress.  Less prestige but less stress. When Jeff was younger, perhaps he wanted that prestige and control being with Brian but simply needed a change.  Jeff has always liked and worked well with Mike so it's not a surprise. I am sure there is more political stuff but certainly thats a part of it.

As for filling Jeff's role, Matt does it on stage vocally, there are support people I'm sure who do some of it off stage, and Al fills the friend/buffer role in a different way than Jeff, maybe even more genuine in some respects.  Perhaps and this is just a supposition: maybe Jeff felt with Al there to be with Brian, he could more easily step away and didn't feel as much guilt.
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All Summer Long
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« Reply #174 on: October 02, 2017, 05:19:10 PM »

I'm assuming the third camp before 2012 was Al?
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