Mike's Book Discussion Thread (and how it relates to the SS board)

[HeyJude]

Let's not blame individual people for not being Brian Wilson;

Who is doing that?

Saying Mike and Terry Melcher put out a sub-par album is a criticism of *them*, not a criticism of who they're not.

Saying someone "isn't Brian Wilson", especially members of the BBs, does a disservice to them. There was enough non-Brian material in the BRI vaults in 1992 that they could have just pulled 10 or 12 outtakes with no Brian input from the 80s and put together a better album than SIP.

SIP was a ill-conceived choice when there were other options at their disposal. The same thing happened with "Stars and Stripes" versus working on the Andy Paley material.

Whether it was ill-conceived or not, it was an attempt to stay in the market.  They could not work with Brian because he was controlled by Landy.  Don't contort what I said.  Melcher did great work but was not Brian.  No it does not do a disservice.  It is like saying someone who is writing for The Beatles is not Lennon or McCartney. It is ridiculous.

I guess I'll bite and point out that you're contorting what I said, not the other way around.

Melcher may have done great work on other projects; SIP is not one of his shining moments. That has nothing to do with him "not being Brian" anymore than it does with him "not being Mozart."

Your Beatles comparison doesn't apply to anything I said, and doesn't make any sense to me regardless. If Ringo wrote some sucky songs, as he himself admits he did (his oft-cited story of re-writing Jerry Lee Lewis songs and everybody cracking up), they would suck because they suck, not because he's not Lennon or McCartney.

Back to the Landy point, Brian's non-appearance on SIP was caused by MORE than just the Landy factor, as I outlined in detail in a previous post. The timelines don't match up. The lingering effects of Landy were certainly a factor, but there were others.

We can agree to disagree.  It was my perception of the era, having lived through it.  I saw Brian for the first time in 1987, with Landy in the wings so I am in tune with that era.

There is likely overlap with this era as to actual dates.  But, I think it is a valid analogy.  Melcher (however close to the band he was and gifted he was) was not a BB.  He was not Brian Wilson. Brian Wilson makes BB albums.  Brian looks through a different lens that is unique to that band.  Unique is unique.  And not unlike the Beatles who have a unique sound, themselves. The 30th album.  The first 29 had Brian.  Just sayin'.   

Again, we can agree to disagree.

Missed every point. Oh well.......

[HeyJude]

Also something I didn't know-when Yetnikoff of Columbia Records told the BBs that he had been f--ked, it was said at the Columbia office in New York. To which Brian allegedly raised his hand and said "I think I have some good ideas for [L.A.}, let me record at Criteria in Miami."

Back to the actual topic of the thread, so is the assertion here that Yetnikoff responded in this fashion to recordings made *prior* to any sessions at Criteria in Miami?

In a recent post ( http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,4151.msg559026.html#msg559026 ), the reel Yetnikoff listened to was reportedly as follows:

California Feelin'
Santa Ana Winds (1st mix)
Love Surrounds Me (early mix)
Baby Blue (early Mix/Carl vocal)
I'm Beggin' You Please (Brian demo)
Lookin Down the Coast
Brian's Back
Calendar Girl (Criteria version - not the later, polished and unheard Bruce Johnston production)
Good Timin' (1974 with Carl scratch vocal)
Shortnin' Bread (I believe this was a new instrumental track... basic track for the released version without vocals - not the Adult Child version)

This included some things recorded in Miami I believe.

[Ed Roach]

Also something I didn't know-when Yetnikoff of Columbia Records told the BBs that he had been f--ked, it was said at the Columbia office in New York. To which Brian allegedly raised his hand and said "I think I have some good ideas for [L.A.}, let me record at Criteria in Miami."

Back to the actual topic of the thread, so is the assertion here that Yetnikoff responded in this fashion to recordings made *prior* to any sessions at Criteria in Miami?

In a recent post ( http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,4151.msg559026.html#msg559026 ), the reel Yetnikoff listened to was reportedly as follows:

California Feelin'
Santa Ana Winds (1st mix)
Love Surrounds Me (early mix)
Baby Blue (early Mix/Carl vocal)
I'm Beggin' You Please (Brian demo)
Lookin Down the Coast
Brian's Back
Calendar Girl (Criteria version - not the later, polished and unheard Bruce Johnston production)
Good Timin' (1974 with Carl scratch vocal)
Shortnin' Bread (I believe this was a new instrumental track... basic track for the released version without vocals - not the Adult Child version)

This included some things recorded in Miami I believe.

I was there when this happened, (in fact, I think I was the first one ever quoted on this), and it most definitely took place at Criteria in Miami.

[HeyJude]

Also something I didn't know-when Yetnikoff of Columbia Records told the BBs that he had been f--ked, it was said at the Columbia office in New York. To which Brian allegedly raised his hand and said "I think I have some good ideas for [L.A.}, let me record at Criteria in Miami."

Back to the actual topic of the thread, so is the assertion here that Yetnikoff responded in this fashion to recordings made *prior* to any sessions at Criteria in Miami?

In a recent post ( http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,4151.msg559026.html#msg559026 ), the reel Yetnikoff listened to was reportedly as follows:

California Feelin'
Santa Ana Winds (1st mix)
Love Surrounds Me (early mix)
Baby Blue (early Mix/Carl vocal)
I'm Beggin' You Please (Brian demo)
Lookin Down the Coast
Brian's Back
Calendar Girl (Criteria version - not the later, polished and unheard Bruce Johnston production)
Good Timin' (1974 with Carl scratch vocal)
Shortnin' Bread (I believe this was a new instrumental track... basic track for the released version without vocals - not the Adult Child version)

This included some things recorded in Miami I believe.

I was there when this happened, (in fact, I think I was the first one ever quoted on this), and it most definitely took place at Criteria in Miami.

That's what I thought. I recalled that you had commented a number of times over the years about that time period, and it didn't make any sense to me that he would be listening to recordings made prior to Miami.

Not a huge deal if it's portrayed incorrectly in Mike's book, but it's something worth clarifying and looking at.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

To be honest...I would've much preferred that to what we got instead!

[HeyJude]

If they really played Yetnikoff the demo of "I'm Begging You Please" that circulates, I can understand how he'd have a lot of misgivings though. Yikes. I don't think the song is anything spectacular, but even if one loves the song, it's the very definition of a rough demo, with Brian hitting some pretty sketchy notes.

I wonder how much Yetnikoff's reaction wasn't down solely to the pure musical quality of the material, but to the idea that they would choose to put such a rough demo on the tape that's supposed to impress him. I realize if he comes down in the middle of sessions, he's invariably going to get some rough mixes and partial backing tracks and whatnot.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

In all fairness, it's pretty dire, but my remix of it made it sound a little better....

[HeyJude]

The situation with "LA" reminds me a little bit of George Harrison's back and forth with Warner over his "Somewhere in England" album. They rejected his first version in 1980, and he removed four songs and added four different songs in their place. However, I would guess that the songs Warner wanted him to drop were the two weird, slightly self-indulgent Hoagy Carmichael covers ("Baltimore Oriole" and "Hong Kong Blues"), but instead he dropped some of his own tracks that were arguably better and kept the covers. Most likely because the revised version had the new "All Those Years Ago" Lennon tribute, Warner released it anyway. 

[Robbie Mac]

This depressed me when I did this yesterday.  I found out my local library was getting both the Mike and Brian books, so I decided to place holds on them both. Turns out, Mike's book already has more holds than Brian's.

Ugh.

[CenturyDeprived]

This depressed me when I did this yesterday.  I found out my local library was getting both the Mike and Brian books, so I decided to place holds on them both. Turns out, Mike's book already has more holds than Brian's.

Ugh.

One thing Mike's book does have going for it above Brian's is that Mike's never released an autobio under his name, nor has Mike had a biopic about himself (let alone one last year). Not to say Mike hasn't given more than his two cents in interviews, but at least I can understand from the aspect of fans clamoring for something new, that there may be more of a "new" angle or ideas to come from Mike's over Brian's.

[HeyJude]

This depressed me when I did this yesterday.  I found out my local library was getting both the Mike and Brian books, so I decided to place holds on them both. Turns out, Mike's book already has more holds than Brian's.

Ugh.

Mike's book is coming out first, and has had a far greater promo push up to this point, because of its earlier release date. Plus, the Manson stuff hit the news.

I don't know what will sell what, but I would imagine books are like music and movies now to some degree in that the interest and sales and everything are all pretty front-loaded and concentrated pretty strongly on the week leading up to and after the release.

Assuming the publisher of Brian's book is going to put some effort and money into promotion, I think visibility and discussion of Brian's book will be heavier at the end of this month leading into early October.

[urbanite]

I'm surprised cooler heads did not prevail, which would have caused the BB's to shelve Summer In Paradise.

The inclusion of the song Summer in Paradise on Made in California could only be because Mike Love wanted it.  It certainly did not deserve to be on a collection honoring the history of the Beach Boys. 

[Jim V.]

So I just wanted to share this.

As a long time Beach Boys fan, I was very disappointed by the unclean, disgusting message that the song "Summer of Love" sends out. I was teaching in '93 when I had my new copy of Summer in Paradise playing in the boombox while the kids were doing a coloring exercise. And while most of the album was inoffensive, I mistakenly let "Summer of Love" play on, not knowing what was coming...

And unfortunately, days later I had many of my students singing about gettin' it "in the swimming pool" and how "doing it with you would be so very cool."

Soon I had parents calling into the school complaining saying that their kindergarteners were being disgustingly sexualized.


I felt horrible and I was soon fired.

All this due to Mike Love's disgusting lyrics. If only we had the PMRC to stop such filth.

[CenturyDeprived]

So I just wanted to share this.

As a long time Beach Boys fan, I was very disappointed by the unclean, disgusting message that the song "Summer of Love" sends out. I was teaching in '93 when I had my new copy of Summer in Paradise playing in the boombox while the kids were doing a coloring exercise. And while most of the album was inoffensive, I mistakenly let "Summer of Love" play on, not knowing what was coming...

And unfortunately, days later I had many of my students singing about gettin' it "in the swimming pool" and how "doing it with you would be so very cool."

Soon I had parents calling into the school complaining saying that their kindergarteners were being disgustingly sexualized.


I felt horrible and I was soon fired.

All this due to Mike Love's disgusting lyrics. If only we had the PMRC to stop such filth.

Crickets from you-know-who!  

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

So I just wanted to share this.

As a long time Beach Boys fan, I was very disappointed by the unclean, disgusting message that the song "Summer of Love" sends out. I was teaching in '93 when I had my new copy of Summer in Paradise playing in the boombox while the kids were doing a coloring exercise. And while most of the album was inoffensive, I mistakenly let "Summer of Love" play on, not knowing what was coming...

And unfortunately, days later I had many of my students singing about gettin' it "in the swimming pool" and how "doing it with you would be so very cool."

Soon I had parents calling into the school complaining saying that their kindergarteners were being disgustingly sexualized.


I felt horrible and I was soon fired.

All this due to Mike Love's disgusting lyrics. If only we had the PMRC to stop such filth.

Oh sh*t,  man...that's jacked up

[SMiLE Brian]

Its a tough break for sweetdudejim....

[Juice Brohnston]

So I just wanted to share this.

As a long time Beach Boys fan, I was very disappointed by the unclean, disgusting message that the song "Summer of Love" sends out. I was teaching in '93 when I had my new copy of Summer in Paradise playing in the boombox while the kids were doing a coloring exercise. And while most of the album was inoffensive, I mistakenly let "Summer of Love" play on, not knowing what was coming...

And unfortunately, days later I had many of my students singing about gettin' it "in the swimming pool" and how "doing it with you would be so very cool."

Soon I had parents calling into the school complaining saying that their kindergarteners were being disgustingly sexualized.


I felt horrible and I was soon fired.

All this due to Mike Love's disgusting lyrics. If only we had the PMRC to stop such filth.

This is classic 

[Jay]

A man lost his fucking job, and you idiots can't see past your hatred of Mike to see the bigger issue.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Actually whole thing was a joke

[Jay]

Some people put their foot in their mouth. I use the whole leg. 

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

welcome to my  world!

[Debbie KL]

I was actually unhappy that my internet was down today.  Then I read the last 3 page of this thread.  So glad it wasn't me dealing with all of this.

Thanks for taking on the usual" thread de-railer."  I don't have the stomach for it anymore.  I guess I should be grateful if my life isn't being threatened by some creep who is then "glorified" by a Mike Love interview.  Welcome to tabloid BBs.  Those of you who enjoy it, have fun. Those of us who don't will be ignoring the rejects, whether they're from the BBC, or MB's, or both.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Glad your internet is back up...I work in tech support and it's not something I can just "shut off" in my head.

Yeah, I've lost the patience for it myself.  I've realized that no matter how many times I try to "make nice" there are some people whose sole purpose is to stir up sh*t and would do it regardless of what I do.

[Debbie KL]

Glad your internet is back up...I work in tech support and it's not something I can just "shut off" in my head.

Yeah, I've lost the patience for it myself.  I've realized that no matter how many times I try to "make nice" there are some people whose sole purpose is to stir up sh*t and would do it regardless of what I do.

Twisting your words, possibly?  Nah... That would never happen.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I know, right? As likely as Guns and Roses's Chinese Democracy being released., or the sun rising/setting every day.