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Author Topic: Mike's band  (Read 105171 times)
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« Reply #225 on: November 25, 2015, 01:20:27 AM »

It'd be impossible to prove the PM thing either way, for starters, not without breaking the board rules.

Smile Brian is lying. Billy, you have my permission go into my PM outbox and report back here with the exact number of these  tons of messages pushing my agenda and manipulating this board.
You can delete PMs from your Outbox so your offer is meaningless.
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« Reply #226 on: November 25, 2015, 03:06:32 AM »

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Interesting discussion.

Within the past year I’ve attended both the Brian/Alan/Blondie show and the Mike/Bruce show. Both were sold out with an average ticket price of $100+. All age groups attended both shows with a leaning toward gray-haired patrons such as myself. Both shows had everyone on their feet with clapping hands-overhead, dancing in the isles, and wild applauding for an encore.

Each show featured Beach Boy time-honored hits. Each show was devoid of overdone props, excessive lighting, or theatrical gimmicks. Both shows were no-nonsense good music without enough time to even come close to playing the many hits in The Beach Boys roster.

Both bands were made up of excellent players. Both bands were tight. All vocals were rewarding to hear. All the harmonies were present and a joy to experience live.

Brian and Alan bantered with each other and the audience. The same for Bruce and Michael. While each had its own flavor, both styles were entertaining.

In conversations with Brian and Alan at one show, and Mike and Bruce at the other show we all realized that we had one thing in common, and that is our ages are very close to each other’s. Some birth-dates within a few months. Apart from Brian’s back problems, we are all generally healthy old guys able to keep up a demanding schedule without any special wants or needs.

My observation is that Brian, Alan, Mike and Bruce are all good natured, happy, content with what they are doing, interested in continuing with entertaining, pleased with how their past lives have been and where they are going, proud of their children and content with their family life.

So what’s the problem?  Why are so many on this thread so disgruntled with their fellow fans? or with their favorite entertainers? Aren’t we all moved when we hear Beach Boy music? I know it’s in my head all the time. I walk my dog and hear Brian’s lines. I wait at a traffic light and hear Mike’s words. I wash the dishes and Bruce’s harmonies make that task easy. I pay my bills and recall Alan’s prudent ways. I long for Dennis’ company and Carl’s insights.

Are we not all Beach Boy fans here?

Wake Up !! Enjoy! Critique yes, but with respect. Anonymous posting has its pitfalls. It lets each poster be a monster behind a mask … and get away with it. It sometimes brings out the worst and not the best. We would all be better served if each poster wrote as if they were reading his or her words directly to the Beach Boy about whom they were writing. Act and write as if you were in the same room as one of them.

You would be surprised at how human and normal these guys are outside the studio or beyond the stage door. They have problems to solve, responsibilities to meet, life situations to conquer, and not enough time, just like you and I.

There will come a time when they are not on stage. When you don’t have a choice whether to attend this time they’re in town or not. Some day you will not have a band to like or think is awful. The best discussions are of superior quality and thoughtful reflection. Remember that some day you will only have the music and your memories, so make them good.

It’s all GOOD LISTENING,


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Totally agree there, Stephen! Well said.  Cool
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« Reply #227 on: November 25, 2015, 06:29:57 AM »

A relatively unexplored Beach Boy era is Mike's assumption of creative control post-Kokomo. I am however reluctant in opening a thread on the topic -- a thread that will be necessarily critical of the direction Mike took the band -- but as the board now stands, a substantive discussion on the subject would be quickly derailed by trolling.

Mike Love is central to the Beach Boys story, but on this board such a central topic cannot be discussed in a rational manner. That's a problem.
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« Reply #228 on: November 25, 2015, 06:38:11 AM »

It'd be impossible to prove the PM thing either way, for starters, not without breaking the board rules.

Smile Brian is lying. Billy, you have my permission go into my PM outbox and report back here with the exact number of these  tons of messages pushing my agenda and manipulating this board.
You can delete PMs from your Outbox so your offer is meaningless.

There is an option to have a copy sent to your private email, and that is always a good idea.  It could be incoming or outgoing.

And, Mr. Desper's words should be a good guide to taking a neutral stance on all of this.  He looks at each band member"s strengths.  Looking at the positive instead of finding negative.  We are all flawed beings. 

Happy Thanksgiving to those who celebrate and please be safe, and above all, cautious, everyone else.  Wink
« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 06:43:37 AM by filledeplage » Logged
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« Reply #229 on: November 25, 2015, 07:07:50 AM »

A relatively unexplored Beach Boy era is Mike's assumption of creative control post-Kokomo. I am however reluctant in opening a thread on the topic -- a thread that will be necessarily critical of the direction Mike took the band -- but as the board now stands, a substantive discussion on the subject would be quickly derailed by trolling.

Mike Love is central to the Beach Boys story, but on this board such a central topic cannot be discussed in a rational manner. That's a problem.

This is what I see as a main problem. Any discussion of Mike turns into name calling and choosing up sides. There are real things to discuss here. But, if you say anything positive, you're accused of being a Mike apologist. And if you say anything negative, you're accused of being a Brianista. So, actual discussion devolves and dies a nasty death.
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« Reply #230 on: November 25, 2015, 07:14:55 AM »

A relatively unexplored Beach Boy era is Mike's assumption of creative control post-Kokomo. I am however reluctant in opening a thread on the topic -- a thread that will be necessarily critical of the direction Mike took the band -- but as the board now stands, a substantive discussion on the subject would be quickly derailed by trolling.

Mike Love is central to the Beach Boys story, but on this board such a central topic cannot be discussed in a rational manner. That's a problem.

Agreed.  Like him or not, The Beach Boys would've likely ceased to exist a long time ago if not for Mike.

OK, so we might've been spared the mostly awful Summer in Paradise album.  But, a whole generation of Beach Boys fans never would've had the opportunity to hear the songs live.  And who knows if the 50th Anniversary album/tour would've even happened had The Beach Boys called it a day back in the 80s or 90s. 
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« Reply #231 on: November 25, 2015, 07:36:37 AM »

A discussion being kind of repetitive and circular, and even generally negative, is different from full-on “troll” type threads.

I’d say there are both “anti-Mike” and “pro-Mike” folks that contribute to the rather circular, predictable, and repetitive debates. And maybe those even get kind of snippy and agitated. To the degree “discussions of Mike quickly turning sour” is impacting the board, it isn’t just “anti-Mike” trolls impacting *that*. A refusal to ever acknowledge anything negative about Mike contributes to *that* as well.

But that’s not really what’s being discussed in this thread. It’s a very small group of people who, either knowingly or unknowingly (and there’s a point at which it doesn’t matter which) are posting nothing but troll-ish comments, boring, one-liner negative swipes, etc. There are a few folks on this board who probably post comments that bother *me* more than one-liner boring anti-Mike troll posts. But most of those people still follow the rules of the board, posting things other than insults and barbs and troll comments.

As has been discussed, it’s different when someone’s posting history is pretty much *literally* nothing but bouncing from thread to thread and offering nothing but anti-Mike rhetoric (and calling it “rhetoric” is probably ascribing too fancy of a word to it!). I’m just as annoyed because the anti-Mike trolls sometimes ironically make it *more* difficult for others to offer thoughtful, valid criticisms or even just comments or observations about Mike.

When I started a thread awhile back, honestly and simply asking if anyone had any more information about late 90s reports of Mike “refusing” to appear on stage with Carl, it wasn’t the “anti-Mike” trolls that led solely to that thread being derailed. It was also seemingly “pro-Mike” people looking to be offended when there was no offense, no trolling intended in any way. BUT, the random trolls throwing barbs at Mike over the years probably *did* contribute to some people so quickly jumping up and assuming such a thread was intended to cause consternation.

How many times has a non-inflammatory post simply pointing to an article about Mike been met with a bunch of “counting the minutes until this thread explodes into a trainwreck!” comments? How do we fix that? That answer isn’t to only say nice things forever about the guys in the band. I guess the general tone has to change. Eliminating troll posts would help, I hope.

There are some folks how think a thread discussing Mike allegedly refusing to appear on stage with Carl shouldn’t exist. I strongly disagree with that. But the anti-Mike trolls have contributed to an atmosphere that leads to things like that. I think those who are too quick to be offended own some of the responsibility, but a good first step towards fixing the problem would be to keep people from having an account here where nothing but trolling is occurring.

« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 07:39:47 AM by HeyJude » Logged

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« Reply #232 on: November 25, 2015, 08:43:56 AM »

I thought mods were allowed to have access to pm's? Not trying to stir the sh*t, by the way. That one post just rubbed me the wrong way.

It had me scratching my head too. I mean, how on Earth would SB know what PMs AGD might have been sending? As he's not a mod, I'd have to assume a mod or perhaps an admin (do we have admins as well as mods?) had mentioned it to him/her, and that would have involved divulging the contents of a PM, which I understand is not allowed between sender/recipient, let alone non-involved parties, and no matter how things might appear to have deteriorated, I don't see any of our mods doing such a thing, especially with a poster as much in the sights of the mob's fury as SB. His allegations, assuming the above, have to be false. Otherwise, if PMs – Personal Messages – are being read then we might as well rename them Postcard Messages, which, as everyone is aware and therefore couldn't be shocked, can be read by the postman. LOL

Huge kudos to Mr Desper for his post btw; I hope this moderation issue can be resolved to everyone's satisfaction so the music can once more be first and foremost here. Great to see Billy and GF back among us and monitoring traffic.

Only person who could see PMs to my knowledge is the board owner Charles LePage.  And even if I was able to to do it, ORR is right in that the outbox could be deleted at anytime...and more germane, they aren't saved be default anyway.

In any case, with all that said, I do have some specific PMs to send a few specific people...
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« Reply #233 on: November 25, 2015, 09:49:02 AM »

I thought mods were allowed to have access to pm's? Not trying to stir the sh*t, by the way. That one post just rubbed me the wrong way.

It had me scratching my head too. I mean, how on Earth would SB know what PMs AGD might have been sending? As he's not a mod, I'd have to assume a mod or perhaps an admin (do we have admins as well as mods?) had mentioned it to him/her, and that would have involved divulging the contents of a PM, which I understand is not allowed between sender/recipient, let alone non-involved parties, and no matter how things might appear to have deteriorated, I don't see any of our mods doing such a thing, especially with a poster as much in the sights of the mob's fury as SB. His allegations, assuming the above, have to be false. Otherwise, if PMs – Personal Messages – are being read then we might as well rename them Postcard Messages, which, as everyone is aware and therefore couldn't be shocked, can be read by the postman. LOL

Huge kudos to Mr Desper for his post btw; I hope this moderation issue can be resolved to everyone's satisfaction so the music can once more be first and foremost here. Great to see Billy and GF back among us and monitoring traffic.

Only person who could see PMs to my knowledge is the board owner Charles LePage.  And even if I was able to to do it, ORR is right in that the outbox could be deleted at anytime...and more germane, they aren't saved be default anyway.

In any case, with all that said, I do have some specific PMs to send a few specific people...

Thanks Billy… so SB was winding us up! And we fell for it! Ho ho ho!

Good to see things look to be on track to be getting back on track…
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« Reply #234 on: November 25, 2015, 09:54:40 AM »

Thanks Billy… so SB was winding us up! And we fell for it! Ho ho ho!

Or as I prefer to call it, lying.  Grin
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« Reply #235 on: November 25, 2015, 10:17:37 AM »

Few pages back, Micha uttered at the end of his post "I have an idea, but stating openly it may get ME banned". If it's not a bait, I dunno what is.

Bait for what? I remember a poster called Pinder who used to get insulted and bullied by SB and OSD over and over for not acknowdging Mike's detestableness, and got no backing from the mods back then either. Unfortunately at some point he got so boiled that he unwisely and against given advice applied the same troll tactics as SB and OSD. He ended up getting banned for life, SB and OSD were allowed to go on. I don't want to suffer his fate. And it was Pinder who voted for OSD to be allowed back!

Expecting to find a PM in the morning, logging off for the night now...
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« Reply #236 on: November 25, 2015, 10:33:14 AM »

I hope one or two lifetime bans will be reconsidered. A few intelligent posters are missed here, and their absence combined with the behaviour of one or two or more who remain make the board a poorer place. But as said I'm optimistic now that there's mod activity afoot.
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« Reply #237 on: November 25, 2015, 12:27:53 PM »

Gonna respond to several of these in one shot.

Quote
Bait for what? I remember a poster called Pinder who used to get insulted and bullied by SB and OSD over and over for not acknowdging Mike's detestableness, and got no backing from the mods back then either. Unfortunately at some point he got so boiled that he unwisely and against given advice applied the same troll tactics as SB and OSD. He ended up getting banned for life, SB and OSD were allowed to go on. I don't want to suffer his fate. And it was Pinder who voted for OSD to be allowed back!

Expecting to find a PM in the morning, logging off for the night now...

Quote
This is what I see as a main problem. Any discussion of Mike turns into name calling and choosing up sides. There are real things to discuss here. But, if you say anything positive, you're accused of being a Mike apologist. And if you say anything negative, you're accused of being a Brianista. So, actual discussion devolves and dies a nasty death.


I hope one or two lifetime bans will be reconsidered. A few intelligent posters are missed here, and their absence combined with the behaviour of one or two or more who remain make the board a poorer place. But as said I'm optimistic now that there's mod activity afoot.




I take responsibility for some of this being like it is right now...not everything is addressed on the board, but rather, privately. That said, it was mentioned that Pinder was banned for life yet OSD and SB were allowed to go on. Pinder wasn't banned for life , at least not directly. It was indefinite. One of his secondary accounts was, however, and when that happened it did affect the initial ban. SB had been suspended for something else, and as mentioned, OSD had been as well. Hell, his suspension lasted a year, and I'd been inundated with constant requests to reinstate him!  There's only one member currently banned that I would reinstate if I had my druthers, but even he admitted the lifetime ban was justified. Likewise, there is one member here (two, actually) who I would ban the living f*** out of if they actually WOULD break a board rule with no kind of gray area, and actually doing so would give me immense pleasure (not proud to admit that, either). Just like those who were banned for life were banned for a good reason, I would need a better reason than me just not liking this person/people for being a bigoted asshole. So, no, Micha, you are not going to be banned for your post, and the fact that you think that you would be actually hurts me. I'm not like that. If I can ban someone I actually dig and have a lot in common with yet someone I despise can roam freely around here, well, I think that proves I can be objective.

As for the overall board itself...honestly, I'm getting tired of getting PMs complaining that so-and-so is 'annoying', or telling me how to do my job, basically trying to play mod.  If you think someone is annoying, put on your big boy/girl pants and ignore them. It's one of the reasons why I avoid the political threads on the Sandbox like the plague, especially some of the more bigoted ones.

Now as far as making allegations about each other, well, that is going to be addressed separately and privately.

Quote
This is what I see as a main problem. Any discussion of Mike turns into name calling and choosing up sides. There are real things to discuss here. But, if you say anything positive, you're accused of being a Mike apologist. And if you say anything negative, you're accused of being a Brianista. So, actual discussion devolves and dies a nasty death.

Exactly, and it's getting pretty damn old.
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« Reply #238 on: November 25, 2015, 01:34:18 PM »

Few pages back, Micha uttered at the end of his post "I have an idea, but stating openly it may get ME banned". If it's not a bait, I dunno what is.

Bait for what? I remember a poster called Pinder who used to get insulted and bullied by SB and OSD over and over for not acknowdging Mike's detestableness, and got no backing from the mods back then either. Unfortunately at some point he got so boiled that he unwisely and against given advice applied the same troll tactics as SB and OSD. He ended up getting banned for life, SB and OSD were allowed to go on. I don't want to suffer his fate. And it was Pinder who voted for OSD to be allowed back!

Expecting to find a PM in the morning, logging off for the night now...

Yeah, and I was insulted by Pinder, Nikos, and some others on the board. Like Billy says, it goes both ways.

Debate is great, but when you  go personal, like calling someone childish, troll, or other insult, you have dropped the gauntlet.  As I said before, OSD and SB didn't start the name calling in this thread.
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« Reply #239 on: November 25, 2015, 02:25:09 PM »

I thought mods were allowed to have access to pm's? Not trying to stir the sh*t, by the way. That one post just rubbed me the wrong way.

It had me scratching my head too. I mean, how on Earth would SB know what PMs AGD might have been sending? As he's not a mod, I'd have to assume a mod or perhaps an admin (do we have admins as well as mods?) had mentioned it to him/her, and that would have involved divulging the contents of a PM, which I understand is not allowed between sender/recipient, let alone non-involved parties, and no matter how things might appear to have deteriorated, I don't see any of our mods doing such a thing, especially with a poster as much in the sights of the mob's fury as SB. His allegations, assuming the above, have to be false. Otherwise, if PMs – Personal Messages – are being read then we might as well rename them Postcard Messages, which, as everyone is aware and therefore couldn't be shocked, can be read by the postman. LOL

Huge kudos to Mr Desper for his post btw; I hope this moderation issue can be resolved to everyone's satisfaction so the music can once more be first and foremost here. Great to see Billy and GF back among us and monitoring traffic.

Only person who could see PMs to my knowledge is the board owner Charles LePage.  And even if I was able to to do it, ORR is right in that the outbox could be deleted at anytime...and more germane, they aren't saved be default anyway.

In any case, with all that said, I do have some specific PMs to send a few specific people...

Thanks Billy… so SB was winding us up! And we fell for it! Ho ho ho!

No, YOU came to the irrational conclusion that the only way SB knew about the PMs was because he was getting that information from a mod. I'll go with Doe's often touted Occam's Razor and say that the simplest conclusion is that people have spoken about those PMs elsewhere, whether by PM or, as Woodstock pointed out, on the board itself. As for the agenda PMs....I won't even get into it...but people aren't as stupid as some of you think they are. Take that however you'd like, I'll leave it at that.

But I don't expect any logical thought to come from the crowd that in just this thread have lied about reasons why OSD got banned in the past, claimed that Billy was "bullied" into reinstating OSD, claimed that there was a oh so vocal campaign to get OSD back on the board (oh we're real proud of ourselves for the two threads (one of which was started by Pinder ffs) and 3 pages of posts of a few people wanting OSD back on the board).

Great job guys, really LOL
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« Reply #240 on: November 25, 2015, 02:44:48 PM »

Fair enough, though it seems I wasn't the only one arriving at a similar conclusion. Swept away in a tide of conspiracy theories! Understandably common.

Can someon post a link to the thread(s) demanding OSD's reinstatement? My quick search has turned up nothing and I'm curious to see where I stood on the issue back then (if indeed I posted at all…)
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« Reply #241 on: November 25, 2015, 02:49:33 PM »

They are both linked in this post of mine from page 3 of this thread:

Quote
What's hilarious is that one of the threads that was made to bring OSD back was made by the self-admitted Mike apologist Pinder Goes To Kokomo.

And, the "vocal" campaign to reinstate him? Really? It was two threads, totaling barely a few pages of actual half-hearted (mostly comical) protests to bring back OSD, such as this:



OH THE HUMANITY! The bullying is just outrageous!! Oh wait, The Real Beach Boy, here in reality, Billy reinstated him during the Christmas season and didn't seem to harbor any resentment doing so. But ya know, let's leave that part out because it doesn't jive with the bullshit you want to spout.
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« Reply #242 on: November 25, 2015, 03:02:11 PM »

Many thanks Rab2591.
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« Reply #243 on: November 25, 2015, 10:33:24 PM »

Sometimes we get so far up our own collective ass that we forget, this isn't real. The false accusations, the name calling, the anger, the stupidity, the paranoia... it's transient. No-one really gets hurt. Out there, in the real world, people are hurting all the time, and I'm not talking about those whose lives are irrevocably altered - or ended - by murdering zealots from across the entire religious and political spectrum, though (insert your deity of choice) knows, that's horrific enough. I mean those individuals to whom bad things just seem to keep happening: good, good people who deserve far better from this life.

I woke to some deeply upsetting news from someone I consider a good friend who is really hurting right now, will be for some good time and for a reason that makes the intra-mural squabbles here look as utterly pathetic as they truly are. As someone said to me yesterday, "it's just a pop band, that's all". Then, I bristled and explained why that was nonsense. Now, I realise the nonsense was on my side of the fence.

Have a nice day. Not everyone will.
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« Reply #244 on: November 26, 2015, 12:29:08 AM »

I don't really know what to say, but your post, Andrew, deserves acknowledgment. I'm saddened by it. By your friend's pain; by the pain in your own "voice;" simultaneously, I'm glad for the posted reminder to us all to keep perspective.
Take care.
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« Reply #245 on: November 26, 2015, 01:43:27 AM »

I mean those individuals to whom bad things just seem to keep happening: good, good people who deserve far better from this life.

Well said. I'm sure everybody knows of someone or has a friend that this applies to----I certainly do.

Very sorry to hear your bad news, Andrew. I echo Emily's sentiments.
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« Reply #246 on: November 26, 2015, 01:52:19 AM »

But the thing is, people here do get hurt. It was your good name, Andrew, that was being dragged through the mud. Of course, at the end of the day it doesn't compare to the level of pain and heartbreak going on out there in the real world. But pain is still pain, no matter how small or insignificant. I'm sorry for your friend. I, too, received  some terrible news from a friend.
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« Reply #247 on: November 26, 2015, 01:58:59 AM »

So, no, Micha, you are not going to be banned for your post, and the fact that you think that you would be actually hurts me. I'm not like that. If I can ban someone I actually dig and have a lot in common with yet someone I despise can roam freely around here, well, I think that proves I can be objective.

...

Likewise, there is one member here (two, actually) who I would ban the living f*** out of if they actually WOULD break a board rule with no kind of gray area, and actually doing so would give me immense pleasure (not proud to admit that, either).

Billy, first of all, I want to publicly apologize for having hurt your feelings. That wasn't my intention, I am sorry for that, and do feel no threat from YOU. Everybody thinks you're a great guy, I know Pinder does. I hope your health has become better lately. But to tell you the truth, I was shocked when Pinder instead of OSD and SB was banned. It gave me a creepy feeling of being here in some kind of dictatorship where it is dangerous to voice certain opinions and perceptions. There have been some off-board conversations that showed me that the perception that I fear to voice is shared by some people. In fact I think now more than back then that Pinder was right. That's why I fear to get banned when siding with Pinder. But maybe I just don't know enough about the reason he was banned.

I wonder who that someone is you like and still banned? And I of course would like to know who the two are you would like to ban, but it is objectively inappropriate to tell who they are, so I perfectly understand the discretion/confidentiality (whichever English word applies here).

Happy Thanksgiving to you.
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Ceterum censeo SMiLEBrianum OSDumque esse excludendos banno.
Andrew G. Doe
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« Reply #248 on: November 26, 2015, 02:16:01 AM »

But the thing is, people here do get hurt. It was your good name, Andrew, that was being dragged through the mud. Of course, at the end of the day it doesn't compare to the level of pain and heartbreak going on out there in the real world. But pain is still pain, no matter how small or insignificant. I'm sorry for your friend. I, too, received  some terrible news from a friend.

You seem to rate  my "good name" more highly than l do. As for any damage to it... well, considering who was doing the dragging... Grin

Good news seems to be a scarce commodity today.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2015, 02:17:09 AM by Andrew G. Doe » Logged

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« Reply #249 on: November 26, 2015, 07:19:26 AM »

There are issues raised in this discussion which need to be addressed. First, the specific board rules covering private messages listed in the "Welcome" thread:

Thanks for visiting the Smiley Smile message board. Here are a few guidelines to help everything run smoothly:

5) If you feel the need to discuss a PM you received with a third party, then don't expect your PMs to be very private, either. If you don't want someone sending you a PM, or someone doing anything in particular, tell them. Don't wait for or expect someone to speak up for you. If the party in question doesn't listen, go to a moderator about it.   Private messages will not be read by a moderator unless warranted by the behavior of a board member.  Anyone who becomes a cause for concern due to rude or abusive behavior may have their accounts temporarily frozen and their private and public messages examined to see what final actions should be taken.  Said action may be anything from a warning to a temporary or permanent ban.  The moderators will discuss and announce the action that is taken.  Any unwanted or improper private messages should be immediately reported to one of the moderators.

5.5)  Do not post contents of private messages on the board without permission from the sender. 'Private' means exactly that.



Those are and have been the standing rules covering private messages.

Despite some comments and assumptions made in this thread, no moderator can access private messages from anyone at any time. Period. There is simply no way to do this in any form, and the messages are and remain private to the sender and the receiver.

What the quote above outlines is the process that happens if and when a board member receives a private message that they consider inappropriate, offensive, or unwelcome in any way.

If such a message is received, private messages can be reported to the moderators just as a public board post can be reported. The moderators at that point will review and discuss the situation at hand. The private message in question, when warranted and as outlined above, can be requested to be forwarded to the moderators so the situation can be discussed, along with potential actions to be taken. But there is no way, in fact no mechanism in the board's design at all, to allow the moderators to go into anyone's account on their own and read any private messages. If there is a reported post or a dispute, the message is forwarded to the moderators by the recipients who are reporting it. That's it.

The rules are very clearly spelled out, as are the follow-up procedures and potential actions. Whatever else is being suggested by those trying to imply misconduct or abuse of this policy regarding PM's and the reporting process is simply wrong as it applies to the situations mentioned in this thread.

Bottom line: If any board member receives such a PM, the best advice taken from the rules above is and shall remain as such - "Any unwanted or improper private messages should be immediately reported to one of the moderators." Then, the process in place will start among the moderators. No moderator can or will access or read private messages unless such a message is reported by a board member.

Those are the rules. I will follow up with the facts of how all of that relates to the situations being discussed here.

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"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
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