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Author Topic: Rocky Pamplin book about The Beach Boys?  (Read 489792 times)
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« Reply #225 on: December 18, 2015, 03:56:39 PM »

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

I don't know about the other people who have been less than welcoming to Rocky, but in my case at least I would behave exactly the same to anyone who was bragging about beating up Mike -- or, indeed, anyone who was bragging about beating up *anyone*.

As for who he has or hasn't slept with, that's no concern of mine, partly because it's private between the people concerned, and mostly because he hasn't come on here bragging about it. And the people talking about that are being crass.
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« Reply #226 on: December 18, 2015, 04:13:00 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.

One thing seems pretty certain to me. If Denny had lived and sobered up, he'd probably be *publicly* open about being regretful for damage he caused as a result of drugs/drinking . You know, the way Brian has gone out of his way to selflessly publicly mention deep regret for his parenting and other such issues during his years when he was lost. He didn't have to do it, but he did. And I don't think a publicist was telling him to do it either. Brian seemed to do it because the feeling just came to him, and he felt like it would be a way of healing. The Wilson brothers seem/seemed to be like that. They are/were not perfect, but they seem like they owned up to stuff and had the ability to self reflect (and not JUST deflect) when they had clear heads.

Comparatively (and we are only bringing up comparisons because YOU went out of your way to do such), Mike's had every opportunity over decades to publicly express even a morsel of regret in an interview about hurting people with his own past actions, and nary a morsel has ever publicly surfaced that I know of.  That, above most everything, is THE main reason why he is so often vilified. It is NOT a negligible factor in the BB saga, despite anybody who wants to claim such. The vilification, while often grossly unfair, doesn't just simply happen for no reason. This argument you are trying to make holds little water, Sheriff.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 04:34:15 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #227 on: December 18, 2015, 04:32:33 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

This post surprised me. I'm sorry you feel that some of us are hypocritical. For me, I feel pretty sure that if someone beat up Mike Love then talked about it in a way that indicated no regret, I'd object. However, I think there's an added component that Brian and Dennis Wilson were both desperately in need of help and I think (I guess we disagree) that the actions taken were detrimental rather than beneficial.
One thing I don't understand in your post and several others, is the blame on Dennis Wilson particularly. It seems to me, from Rocky Pamplin's posts, that Brian Wilson was also supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Dennis Wilson with drugs. They both participated in the procurement and the consumption. Why is one being fingered as the pusher and the other the pusher's victim?

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« Reply #228 on: December 18, 2015, 04:57:26 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

This post surprised me. I'm sorry you feel that some of us are hypocritical. For me, I feel pretty sure that if someone beat up Mike Love then talked about it in a way that indicated no regret, I'd object. However, I think there's an added component that Brian and Dennis Wilson were both desperately in need of help and I think (I guess we disagree) that the actions taken were detrimental rather than beneficial.
One thing I don't understand in your post and several others, is the blame on Dennis Wilson particularly. It seems to me, from Rocky Pamplin's posts, that Brian Wilson was also supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Dennis Wilson with drugs. They both participated in the procurement and the consumption. Why is one being fingered as the pusher and the other the pusher's victim?


One could make the strong argument that both Wilson brothers were sadly suffering from addictions which made it that they could not help themselves. They were that far down the rabbit hole of addiction. If Mike did some action(s) where he himself was acting in a way that he could not help himself, and was causing damage to those around him, I think there'd absolutely be a level of empathy if he got beat up, particularly if that caused future repercussions to him. But of course, the circumstances are completely different. Denny and Brian get a lot of extra sympathy because of how big they showed their hearts were on many occasions, despite many instances of undeniablly not-exemplary behavior, and the brothers also have the added bonus of exhibiting heaps of selflessness and self-awareness. Others who don't particularly show such traits are going to be less popular, and it's not rocket science why that happens.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 05:06:24 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
Emily
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« Reply #229 on: December 18, 2015, 05:02:53 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

This post surprised me. I'm sorry you feel that some of us are hypocritical. For me, I feel pretty sure that if someone beat up Mike Love then talked about it in a way that indicated no regret, I'd object. However, I think there's an added component that Brian and Dennis Wilson were both desperately in need of help and I think (I guess we disagree) that the actions taken were detrimental rather than beneficial.
One thing I don't understand in your post and several others, is the blame on Dennis Wilson particularly. It seems to me, from Rocky Pamplin's posts, that Brian Wilson was also supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Dennis Wilson with drugs. They both participated in the procurement and the consumption. Why is one being fingered as the pusher and the other the pusher's victim?


One could make the strong argument that both Wilson brothers were sadly suffering from addictions which made it that they could not help themselves. They were that far down the rabbit hole of addiction. If Mike did some action(s) where he himself was acting in a way that he could not help himself, and was causing damage to those around him, I think there'd be a level of empathy if he got beat up, particularly if that caused future repercussions to him. But of course, the circumstances are completely different. Denny and Brian get a lot of extra sympathy because of how big they showed their hearts were on many occasions, despite many instances of undeniablly not-exemplary behavior, and the added bonus of selflessness and self-awareness. Others who don't particularly show such traits are going to be less popular, and it's not rocket science why that happens.
I agree. There are definitely times that Mike Love seemed to be struggling with great personal difficulties (in the late 60s or early 70s stands out), and if his family, friends, and colleagues had responded in a like manner I can't imagine I would be less critical.


Edit to remove a redundancy and to say I definitely agree with the first part of your post. I have to think about the second.
- OK - regarding the second part, I think I would be equally critical of the battering of a person in need of help whether or not I felt that that person was generally a "good" person. I think the battery would disgust me equally either way. 
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 05:18:53 PM by Emily » Logged
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« Reply #230 on: December 18, 2015, 05:39:59 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

This post surprised me. I'm sorry you feel that some of us are hypocritical. For me, I feel pretty sure that if someone beat up Mike Love then talked about it in a way that indicated no regret, I'd object. However, I think there's an added component that Brian and Dennis Wilson were both desperately in need of help and I think (I guess we disagree) that the actions taken were detrimental rather than beneficial.
One thing I don't understand in your post and several others, is the blame on Dennis Wilson particularly. It seems to me, from Rocky Pamplin's posts, that Brian Wilson was also supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Dennis Wilson with drugs. They both participated in the procurement and the consumption. Why is one being fingered as the pusher and the other the pusher's victim?


One could make the strong argument that both Wilson brothers were sadly suffering from addictions which made it that they could not help themselves. They were that far down the rabbit hole of addiction. If Mike did some action(s) where he himself was acting in a way that he could not help himself, and was causing damage to those around him, I think there'd be a level of empathy if he got beat up, particularly if that caused future repercussions to him. But of course, the circumstances are completely different. Denny and Brian get a lot of extra sympathy because of how big they showed their hearts were on many occasions, despite many instances of undeniablly not-exemplary behavior, and the added bonus of selflessness and self-awareness. Others who don't particularly show such traits are going to be less popular, and it's not rocket science why that happens.
I agree. There are definitely times that Mike Love seemed to be struggling with great personal difficulties (in the late 60s or early 70s stands out), and if his family, friends, and colleagues had responded in a like manner I can't imagine I would be less critical.


Edit to remove a redundancy and to say I definitely agree with the first part of your post. I have to think about the second.
- OK - regarding the second part, I think I would be equally critical of the battering of a person in need of help whether or not I felt that that person was generally a "good" person. I think the battery would disgust me equally either way.  

Without condoning any violence, I can understand how it must have been near impossible to know of what to do to solve a critical circumstance such as what went down, if there was a lack of knowledge of proper resources that would work. But premeditated battery is f*cked any way one slices it.  Nobody should have gotten severely beaten up, whether it's a member who is loved, or a member who you don't care for.  However, if Shawn punched Mike after he refused to recognize her as his daughter, that's an instance where I think people on the whole would have less empathy for the recipient of violence, if Sheriff wants to be proven right. It's all about the circumstance and specifics - nobody, as far I see it, has magically attained sympathy (or lack thereof) for arbitrary, random reasons.
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« Reply #231 on: December 18, 2015, 05:41:45 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.

One thing seems pretty certain to me. If Denny had lived and sobered up, he'd probably be *publicly* open about being regretful for damage he caused as a result of drugs/drinking . You know, the way Brian has gone out of his way to selflessly publicly mention deep regret for his parenting and other such issues during his years when he was lost. He didn't have to do it, but he did. And I don't think a publicist was telling him to do it either. Brian seemed to do it because the feeling just came to him, and he felt like it would be a way of healing. The Wilson brothers seem/seemed to be like that. They are/were not perfect, but they seem like they owned up to stuff and had the ability to self reflect (and not JUST deflect) when they had clear heads.

Comparatively (and we are only bringing up comparisons because YOU went out of your way to do such), Mike's had every opportunity over decades to publicly express even a morsel of regret in an interview about hurting people with his own past actions, and nary a morsel has ever publicly surfaced that I know of.  That, above most everything, is THE main reason why he is so often vilified. It is NOT a negligible factor in the BB saga, despite anybody who wants to claim such. The vilification, while often grossly unfair, doesn't just simply happen for no reason. This argument you are trying to make holds little water, Sheriff.

Well said.
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« Reply #232 on: December 18, 2015, 05:47:17 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.
Merry Christmas Mike and Jackie Love!
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« Reply #233 on: December 18, 2015, 05:52:35 PM »


One could make the strong argument that both Wilson brothers were sadly suffering from addictions which made it that they could not help themselves. They were that far down the rabbit hole of addiction. If Mike did some action(s) where he himself was acting in a way that he could not help himself, and was causing damage to those around him, I think there'd be a level of empathy if he got beat up, particularly if that caused future repercussions to him. But of course, the circumstances are completely different. Denny and Brian get a lot of extra sympathy because of how big they showed their hearts were on many occasions, despite many instances of undeniablly not-exemplary behavior, and the added bonus of selflessness and self-awareness. Others who don't particularly show such traits are going to be less popular, and it's not rocket science why that happens.
I agree. There are definitely times that Mike Love seemed to be struggling with great personal difficulties (in the late 60s or early 70s stands out), and if his family, friends, and colleagues had responded in a like manner I can't imagine I would be less critical.


Edit to remove a redundancy and to say I definitely agree with the first part of your post. I have to think about the second.
- OK - regarding the second part, I think I would be equally critical of the battering of a person in need of help whether or not I felt that that person was generally a "good" person. I think the battery would disgust me equally either way.  

Without condoning any violence, I can understand how it must have been near impossible to know of what to do to solve a critical circumstance such as what went down, if there was a lack of knowledge of proper resources that would work. But premeditated battery is f*cked any way one slices it.  Nobody should have gotten severely beaten up, whether it's a member who is loved, or a member who you don't care for.  However, if Shawn punched Mike after he refused to recognize her as his daughter, that's an instance where I think people on the whole would have less empathy for the recipient of violence, if Sheriff wants to be proven right. It's all about the circumstance and specifics - nobody, as far I see it, has magically attained sympathy (or lack thereof) for arbitrary, random reasons.
I can see where you're going. And I agree about the Shawn scenario if Mike was healthy and sound at the time (which I think he was). If Mike was mentally ill, drug addicted and vulnerable at the time he was punched, my hackles would be raised at the punching even if he was being a jerk while being mentally ill, drug addicted and vulnerable.
I mean, Jim Morrison seems like one of the grossest people ever, but if a couple of people set out to smash his head in, not because he had assaulted them but because they were mad he did drugs with someone else, I think I'd have a similar reaction to the one I have regarding the Dennis Wilson story.
I think we're essentially agreeing, though, just I think you're imagining Mike Love being as he is, while I'm imagining him being a vulnerable mess (as a hypothetical).
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« Reply #234 on: December 18, 2015, 06:04:15 PM »

I mean, Jim Morrison seems like one of the grossest people ever, but if a couple of people set out to smash his head in, not because he had assaulted them but because they were mad he did drugs with someone else, I think I'd have a similar reaction to the one I have regarding the Dennis Wilson story.

Ha, well you know: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,10392.msg189526.html#msg189526
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« Reply #235 on: December 18, 2015, 06:20:25 PM »

I mean, Jim Morrison seems like one of the grossest people ever, but if a couple of people set out to smash his head in, not because he had assaulted them but because they were mad he did drugs with someone else, I think I'd have a similar reaction to the one I have regarding the Dennis Wilson story.

Ha, well you know: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,10392.msg189526.html#msg189526
Well, there you go... the whole "let's take it outside" thing is really meat-headed and degenerate. And I'd read that Dennis Wilson beat up Carl not infrequently, and not only when they were kids, and that really bothers me, too.
One of the things that makes me so curious about the BB story is that such beautiful and gentle music (yes, full of love) was made by people who were often so sordid. And I kind of think they all were, in different ways (except Al and please if you have dirt on Al, just don't tell me about it. I don't want to know). Some I end up feeling more empathy for than others; some I think were, as CenturyDeprived indicates, more generous of spirit and made more effort to be good to others. I think Century Deprived is right that Dennis and Brian Wilson had a lot of heart. I think Carl Wilson tried really hard to keep peace.
But yeah, I think Dennis could be really brutal at times, and if his ghost came on this board and started yakking about how he kicked Morrison's *ss that time and he just had to do it because whatever, I'd be thinking Dennis Wilson is a cretin. (Particularly if Dennis was sober/straight and Morrison was not, and Dennis was clearly the instigator of the violence).

Also:  Dennis' wife dated Jim Morrison? Yuck.
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« Reply #236 on: December 18, 2015, 06:50:24 PM »

Regarding SJS's post: Nobody ever said fandom was logical.
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« Reply #237 on: December 18, 2015, 08:21:46 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.

Well put.
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« Reply #238 on: December 18, 2015, 11:39:39 PM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.

This might be the most bizarre post I've ever read on here and that's saying something.
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« Reply #239 on: December 18, 2015, 11:47:17 PM »

If he shows his face again, this thread is going to get very weird.  Grin
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« Reply #240 on: December 19, 2015, 12:12:09 AM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.

This might be the most bizarre post I've ever read on here and that's saying something.
That's probably the most animosity I've ever seen directed towards Brian. I think Mike Love himself might shake his head over that one.

I think a majority  of us don't gloss over the mistakes Brian and Dennis made. Brian himself sure doesn't. The percentage of posters who feel Brian could do no wrong is exceedingly small. And being able to look past that and dig the amazing work he put out is a bad thing?

I'm sorry. I just don't get it.

« Last Edit: December 19, 2015, 12:17:41 AM by ♩♬ Fear 2 Stop ♯♫♩ » Logged

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« Reply #241 on: December 19, 2015, 12:19:24 AM »

Are these few incidents the sum total of Rocky's life highlights? Is this an autobiography or just a heavy volume about a light number of months when he hung out with some famous people? Has he done nothing else for the best part of half a century?

Seems to me that all the other characters in his story moved on, continued to live their lives, and the only ripples that Rocky caused in those lives were toxic ones.

I had a quick look back through this thread and note that his initial post seems to have been written by another, possibly cut and pasted from some flannel sheet about the book and it contains none of the CAPS and … DOTS that … characterise later posts, and far fewer grammatical missteps.

Someone said we shouldn't criticise his spelling or grammatical errors but this is an author we're dealing with, one who is presumably here to publicise his book written, when? At least nine years ago according to one source. I'd expect an author to be able to wield the language with some ability.

One person I really feel for is Marilyn. She had the toughest task possible in dealing with Brian back then, and yes, as a young rock star wife with kids to raise, she might have made some errors in an impossible situation. And now one of those errors has written a book about his heroics. So (assuming some seedy publisher picks it up) it's all going to be raked up again. Nearly half a century after the fact. When she has her own life to live.

Being a part of the Beach Boys world can't be easy. Ever.
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« Reply #242 on: December 19, 2015, 12:48:19 AM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.

This might be the most bizarre post I've ever read on here and that's saying something.
That's probably the most animosity I've ever seen directed towards Brian. I think Mike Love himself might shake his head over that one.

I think a majority  of us don't gloss over the mistakes Brian and Dennis made. Brian himself sure doesn't. The percentage of posters who feel Brian could do no wrong is exceedingly small. And being able to look past that and dig the amazing work he put out is a bad thing?

I'm sorry. I just don't get it.



I get it Billy. This was such a bad time, and no one really comes out of it well. As fans we're transparently more willing to accept some people's mistakes than others, mental issues aside. There's no real logic to it.

My option of Dennis changed a lot after reading Scott's book, and not for the better, I have to say, and I'm not sure that the vibe I got from it was what Scott was trying to get across.

Not sure this Rocky tome is one I want to read though. It's such a small, twisted view on such a brief period that I think it'd be better being woven into a book with a far wider remit. Oh yeah, the Gaines book…
« Last Edit: December 19, 2015, 12:51:15 AM by John Manning » Logged

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« Reply #243 on: December 19, 2015, 01:58:36 AM »

Oh, I don't know, SJS, Dario was driven off and his main thesis was what a sh*t Mike was. And Marilyn. And Murry.
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« Reply #244 on: December 19, 2015, 04:56:25 AM »

Maybe what SJS means is we shouldn't be condemn-y or insulting and confronting of ANY of our guests over our opinion of what we think we know about any of their past mistakes. 
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« Reply #245 on: December 19, 2015, 05:05:16 AM »

Oh, I don't know, SJS, Dario was driven off and his main thesis was what a sh*t Mike was. And Marilyn. And Murry.

In this thread was encouragement for Rocky to dish dirt on Mike.  Hopefully we will allow Rocky to tell his whole story.
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« Reply #246 on: December 19, 2015, 05:33:50 AM »

Hopefully we will allow Rocky to tell his whole story.

Hear, hear. It's at moments like these that the phrase "I wasn't there" comes readily to mind...
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« Reply #247 on: December 19, 2015, 06:11:21 AM »

One person I really feel for is Marilyn. She had the toughest task possible in dealing with Brian back then, and yes, as a young rock star wife with kids to raise, she might have made some errors in an impossible situation.

John, this summarizes dozens of conversations that I've had with Marilyn in one sentence -- something I couldn't (and wouldn't) have done myself.  Well done mate!

Lee
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« Reply #248 on: December 19, 2015, 06:41:11 AM »

Have you had enough yet, Rocky?

Your first mistake, other than coming on this board, was...you roughed up the wrong Beach Boy! If you would've slugged Mike Love, you could've guaranteed at least a 75 page thread, been declared the conquering hero, and asked back anytime. Instead, you went after somebody supplying a mentally ill, drug addicted, vulnerable Brian Wilson with drugs, his brother no less. Leave Dennis alone. But, somebody who was, um, insensitive to Brian Wilson? Now dem's fightin' words!

Somebody mentioned you sleeping with Marilyn Wilson. You can't get away with that, Rocky. What songs did you write? Look, Brian Wilson can have an affair with his wife's sister - while he's still married - because he didn't really know what he was doing (wink, wink) and, hey, he had a God-given talent for writing beautiful music. And Dennis, The Golden Penetrator! He supposedly slept with ALL the Beach Boys' wives. Yep, Dennis was the man. But, hey, isn't "Cuddle Up" a beautiful song, and Pacific Ocean Blue, wow... That's right, Rocky, come back when YOU'VE written some beautiful music.

Finally, Rocky, thank you for your efforts in keeping drugs away from Brian Wilson. Your story about Brian Wilson offering drugs to his two young daughters was harrowing. I have this terrible picture of Carnie and Wendy dead, and Brian Wilson arrested for double manslaughter, spending the rest of his life institutionalized, and Marilyn's life, and many other lives shattered. But, we don't want to go there. It's too painful. I have a confession to make. If some thirty-four year-old man offered drugs to my young daughters, I think I'd either go after him physically - or have him arrested. I don't care what songs he wrote. But, let's focus on right crosses and left hooks instead. Remember, Rock, there's a lot of love in Pet Sounds, and that trumps everything.

Well, at least now we know which faction turns every thread into a Brian v Mike thread, and it isn't the faction that contains Smile Brian and OSD.  Just when those two began to behave SJS comes out of the shadows and, as per usual, is shortly thereafter supported by Mike's Beard and Cam Mott.

As has been stated as nauseum on this board, Mike doesn't get a pass because he never admits guilt and never shoulders any of the blame.  Brian, on the other hand, never makes his drug use or mental problems an excuse and instead admits he was wrong.  In this regard Mike is the worst kind of arrogant and by his own actions makes Brian look like the good guy in comparison.  Ironic, isn't it?

EoL
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« Reply #249 on: December 19, 2015, 06:49:47 AM »

Not really. SJS made some valid points. Do we really want to just give Rocky crap 'cos he slugged a Wilson or two  or can we hold back on the moralizing and judgement long enough to listen to what the guy has to say?
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