Does your fandom ruin the music?

[buddhahat]

Do you ever feel that you're too into The Beach Boys to the point that it hampers your enjoyment of the music?

I'm excited about the new Star Wars movie. I visited a Star Wars message board and I notice some of the fans are griping about minutiae in the new trailer such as the sound of Kylo Ren's voice not being Star Wars enough and so forth. It occurred to me that I was similarly fussy when the Smile box was released. I was so aware of sessions, and fly in vocals, and how long pauses should be in H&V and so on that it was incredibly easy to find fault in the end product.

It's the 'I see the strings' effect when you're so savvy about the mechanics of an illusion that you're immune to the magic itself.

I'm glad I'm removed enough from Star Wars that I will be able to enjoy a lot of The Force Awakens at face value. I wish I could be the way with the BBs sometimes.

[Douchepool]

There are times when I won't listen to them for months at a time but when I put them on I still get that vibe I had when they originally clicked with me. If anything I enjoy the music more now than I did back then.

[KDS]

I can't really say I've gotten to the point where there's any bands I can't listen to or movies I can't watch due to the effect you're speaking about. 

Although I will admit that I'll be avoiding the new Ghostbusters movie like the plague when its released next summer.  Luckily, it's not part of the original franchise. 

[Lee Marshall]

I'm good.  NEVER got lost 'in the Beach Boys'...although I must admit...I do think about what a 'dick' a certain member of the band is from time to time and that interferes with the enjoyment factor but only sometimes.  I can still separate the 2 by and large.  I do take it personally when he fucks with the happiness formula though.  Takes me a while to let it go.  But I do...'til 'he' does it yet again.

No generally I enjoy all that which I loved from the get-go and for the rest I am still trying to figure out how others enjoy [what to me are obvious] substandard releases.  The level of GREATNESS is still sky-high.  With the 'iffy' stuff the level of less great is often still 'pretty' good.   [with a few exceptions]

I will never shower all things Beach Boys and then internalize that water.  Hey!!!  They aren't the Ohio Express.

[Mike's Beard]

I'm good.  NEVER got lost 'in the Beach Boys'...although I must admit...I do think about what a 'dick' a certain member of the band is from time to time and that interferes with the enjoyment factor but only sometimes.

That's no way to talk about Brian Wilson.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Without a doubt, my ludicrous degree of fandom has affected my simple enjoyment. Can't say it's actually ruined it, but l frequently long for the days when l could listen to a track and think, "yeah, like it" as opposed to " well, considering what was going on, it's not too shabby". Wish l knew less.

[LeeDempsey]

Definitely.  Back when I was more active in Endless Summer Quarterly there were three or four "incidents" that involved differences of opinions, someone being unhappy with something that was printed, etc., that just spoiled it for me.  There was a period of 18 months or so around 2001-2002 where I just couldn't bear to listen to any Beach Boys or Brian Wilson music -- which also coincided with my withdrawal from the editorial aspects of ESQ.  I had to slowly ease myself back into the music.  It was 2004, and BRIAN WILSON PRESENTS SMILE, before I fully recovered my enjoyment of the music.

Lee

[Komera]

Fandom has so far had next to no impact upon my enjoyment of the music.  Reading YouTube comments on the other hand...

[Magic Transistor Radio]

Personally, I don't think my fandom of the Beach Boys have anything to do with how I cringe at most of what occured withe band in the 80s and 90s! The 2000s have been a resurgence, thanks mostly to Brian's solo career. I know there have been other good things, but when I look back to the late 90s, I was resigned to a corn fest involving anything new by the band. Brian's backing band, the willingness to do deep cuts live, the entire Pet Sounds album, really got the ball rolling. And from what I've heard, Mike and Bruce concerts have improved since then as well.

[Rentatris]

I find the more know the more it enhances my enjoyment. I do agree that there is a limit and maybe I've just not reached it yet. Occasionally I'll have a week off from the music, and here, but it doesn't take long for me to return.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Without a doubt, my ludicrous degree of fandom has affected my simple enjoyment. Can't say it's actually ruined it, but l frequently long for the days when l could listen to a track and think, "yeah, like it" as opposed to " well, considering what was going on, it's not too shabby". Wish l knew less.

A small addendum: whilst the degree of my fandom hasn't ruined the music for me (yet...), the faux fandom of others has come damn close on occasions. And if you think you know what l'm talking about - you don't. 

[ontor pertawst]

God no. No amount of self-appointed expert blowharding, family squabbles, soap opera drama, humorless right-wing Hawaiian shirt sh*t, or grueling glimpses into the sausage-making process can ever touch those harmonies or emotions they invoke. When BW and his crew go into Our Prayer, all is right with the universe.

[Michael Edward Osbourne]

No. Nothing ever ruins the good music. Fandom only ruins my opinions of some of the people directly involved and many times fans and historians.

[The Cincinnati Kid]

The only thing that bums me out sometimes is listening to songs that didn't chart or were very low on the charts.  It makes me think what could have been if it were released at a different time or promoted properly.   Sometimes it also gives me the feeling of being the only one to like a particular song aside from the more hardcore fans. A lonely feeling, if that makes sense.  Breakaway is a good example of what I'm talking about.

[Emily]

I'm excited about the new Star Wars movie. I visited a Star Wars message board and I notice some of the fans are griping about minutiae in the new trailer such as the sound of Kylo Ren's voice not being Star Wars enough and so forth.

Funnily enough, for me it's reversed. I have the problem with Star Wars but not Beach Boys. I think it has to do with timing. I started listening to the BBs from my dad's records when I was a kid but by then their record was already spotty, so I learned from the beginning that we just hope for the best and, sorry to say, I meet good stuff with pleasant surprise and not-so-good with a shrug. With Star Wars, I'd seen all 3 originals well before the second three came out, so my disappointment with the latter ones was huge. I anticipate anything new regarding Star Wars with cynical dread. It's really bad.

[the captain]

It's a self-inflicted wound if it does. For me personally, the key is keeping perspective. If the Beach Boys, or a Beach Boy, has a release I don't like, oh well. If one says something stupid, oh well. The greats remain great: no subsequent release or bad behavior affects great recordings.

[Sheriff John Stone]

Without a doubt, my ludicrous degree of fandom has affected my simple enjoyment. Can't say it's actually ruined it, but l frequently long for the days when l could listen to a track and think, "yeah, like it" as opposed to " well, considering what was going on, it's not too shabby". Wish l knew less.

I fall into this category. My happiest time as a Beach Boys' fan was when I was a relative newbie. In 1974-75-76, all I owned was Endless Summer and an import comp called The Beach Boys Best 40 Greatest Hits which filled in the gaps. I read one book by Ken Barnes, there was no internet, and my favorite publication was the TV Guide which I scoured weekly for any TV appearances. But most importantly, all I knew was the prevailing stereotypes. Brian was the shy, sensitive genius who wrote all the songs; Mike was flashy, outgoing "front man", Dennis was the athletic, rowdy "real Beach Boy", Carl was the quiet Beach Boy with the tender voice, and Al was the gentleman farmer who liked folk music. And that was all I needed to know - for a little while at least. But, that was the simplest, purest, happiest time I ever had as a Beach Boys fan!

Seriously, it was 99% about the music on those records. That was about to change with the "Brian's Back" campaign, David Leaf's book, and all the other drama - actually tragedy - from 1977-1983. But even with all of that soap opera stuff, the music won out. I did get to know more about the individual Beach Boys. I did get to know about the genesis of the songs I was listening to. I did get to see the original group in concert. And, I did live and die with each crazy thing that I read in a magazine or saw on TV. It was quite a fascinating ride. And, up until Dennis' death and Brian's second stint with Landy, the fandom didn't ruin my enjoyment of the music, and in some instances, it actually added to the depth. Then things started to change, slowly but surely.

Starting with The Beach Boys 1985, things just "felt" different. Things in the Beach Boys' world  seemed contrived. Who was really calling the shots, who was really writing and producing the songs, do these guys even like each other, do they even care, why are they still a group, WHO ARE THESE GUYS? The purity of the Beach Boys started to fade for me. As crazy as that 1974-1982 period was - and it was crazy - it still felt like the real Beach Boys, warts and all. And maybe because of those warts you knew it was real. I mean, what other group could possibly come up with the stuff that was coming out of The Beach Boys. You couldn't dream this stuff up if you tried. Maybe I was starting to know too much. Maybe, no, I WAS becoming jaded. Skeptical. But, I mean, how many "Brian Is Really Back This Time" campaigns can one fan endure?

Which leads to Brian's solo career. I won't get too much into that because I'm familiar with many of the posters on this board; they won't get it (my perspective) anyway, they won't allow themselves to get it. They would rather sling insults and name call. Their love of Brian Wilson, or who they think he is, and because his music has given them so much happiness, I think - I THINK - makes people very defensive of him. I'm curious to see or read their perspectives as the years go by and they learn even more about Brian and The Beach Boys. One thing we've all learned on this board is that over time, myths are dispelled and truths will come out. That knowledge (if you want to call it that) has to change one's perspective.

On a recent thread (I don't recall the exact thread or the exact poster), somebody posted and I paraphrase, "I'm tired of all the smoke and mirrors with Brian's solo career." Again, I'm not going to elaborate because I don't need any War And Peace-length lectures/responses, but Brian's "career" has worn me down, not out but down. It is difficult for me to get full enjoyment from Brian's solo music starting way back with Imagination in 1998 because I will find myself, sometimes subconsciously, asking, "I wonder who wrote that part?", "I wonder who really produced that track/album?", "Does Brian really care about this project?", "Who's idea was this to begin with?", and the most asked question, "If Brian was left to his own devices, would he have really done this song/album/concert/etc." There was a time when it wasn't necessary to ask those questions. But, when that time came, yeah, things changed...

[Mujan, 8@$+@Rc| of a Blue Wizard]

Absolutely. I know I can get pretty anal about what I believe SMiLE should be, which hampers my enjoyment of BWPS/TSS. Regarding the latter, I have trouble enjoying the extra discs considering how much was left off in favor of a disc of GV as well. Not that Im not grateful for what we got, but my total enjoyment is definitely hampered by how much I love even the more obscure pieces and want more of those.

Conversely, as much as they have nostalgia for me and get my head bobbing...the old songs kinda make me cringe. I hate how people assume thats what I must be talking about when I fawn over Brian Wilson or recommend SMiLE or Pet Sounds("who's the artist?" "the beach boys" "...oh.") Similarly, I now think of the older songs as "glimpses of what was to come" so to speak instead of great works in their own right. That kinda thing

[JakeH]

For me, I think the question is not so much fandom as the accumulation of background facts and general BB knowledge. It's possible to be a "fan" and at the same time not know too much of the various goings-on. For the most part, being familiar with long-accepted BB facts has enhanced my enjoyment and appreciation of the music. Love You might be a good example of this; Leaf wrote that Love You was a tough listen "unless you are involved in Brian Wilson’s musical and personal psychodramas," and I think that's more or less true for lots of people. I had to spend a little extra one-on-one time with this album before I got it. There are also a number of older Brian/BB songs and more recent ones that become more engaging and interesting if you can follow the back story.  Gotta also say that "Never Learn Not To Love" is more interesting (if not more enjoyable musically) the more you know about that song's origins. By the same token, while I recognize that "Break Away" is a darn good track, I have a hard time with it, considering who co-wrote the song and what he was very likely planning on doing (and of course did ) not long after the song was released to less than resounding success.

While you don't need to know a thing about Brian/Beach Boys to appreciate Smile, a listener's appreciation can only increase the more he knows about Brian's story, and what had been going on in Beach Boys land going back to at least the end of 1964.  And BWPS is inseparable from the personal story; musical content aside, there's so much going on there just with the completion of the project itself.

[lostbeachboy]

I can't really say I've gotten to the point where there's any bands I can't listen to or movies I can't watch due to the effect you're speaking about. 

Although I will admit that I'll be avoiding the new Ghostbusters movie like the plague when its released next summer.  Luckily, it's not part of the original franchise. 

I'll be really really surprised if that movie doesn't blow. They ruin every other franchise, why not this one.

[Moon Dawg]

  My fandom makes me wonder if I sometimes overrate The Beach Boys.

[Ron]

Do you ever feel that you're too into The Beach Boys to the point that it hampers your enjoyment of the music?

I'm excited about the new Star Wars movie. I visited a Star Wars message board and I notice some of the fans are griping about minutiae in the new trailer such as the sound of Kylo Ren's voice not being Star Wars enough and so forth. It occurred to me that I was similarly fussy when the Smile box was released. I was so aware of sessions, and fly in vocals, and how long pauses should be in H&V and so on that it was incredibly easy to find fault in the end product.

It's the 'I see the strings' effect when you're so savvy about the mechanics of an illusion that you're immune to the magic itself.

I'm glad I'm removed enough from Star Wars that I will be able to enjoy a lot of The Force Awakens at face value. I wish I could be the way with the BBs sometimes.

Very intelligent post.  I find myself doing this all the time, I think however since you're realizing the phenomena you've already won the battle.  

One thing I've noticed over the years is that it's hard to see anything with fresh eyes.  I can remember how the Beach Boys sounded to me the first time I heard them in any depth (not just on the radio)... I can remember the first time I listened to Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band, and my friend explaining to me how this does this, and that's Ringo singing, etc.

It's really hard to go outside of your own fandom though, and see something the way a casual fan would see it.  

Another thing I've often thought about too, is how knowing all the minutiae, if your mind is right, really makes you appreciate it that much more.   I think it's because if you know, or think you know, Brian better, then you enjoy his music.  His family, and ultimately his mother was likely his biggest fan.  Why?  ... because she knew him better than anybody.  Today, Melinda is his biggest fan.  She knows him better than anybody on the earth, and is his biggest cheerleader.

So ultimately, yes the fandom can ruin it sometimes, but if you're conscious of it like you are, and if you try to just let it go, the fandom really makes you appreciate the music so much more.  There may be a happy medium, not sure... For instance I was talking on the other forum about how I don't know anything about ELO except that their music is great, and I really like the few songs I know of theirs... if I go listen to their greatest album, it'll probably blow me away!  Will I be an even bigger fan if I learn every little thing about ELO?  Not sure, I may be in the 'happy medium' right now; interested, but not obsessed.  

[bonnie bella]

No, not yet!  I'm only at the beginning and just starting to gather the songs into their actual albums, apart from the obvious ones.  Everybody says that it's a pretty special time for me.  I'm lucky, I really got clobbered with the Brian Wilson Musical Appreciation Stick 

The funny thing about TBB and BW fandom is it's wonderful intensity.  I have often mused that mentioning Brian Wilson can barely raise an eyebrow (who?), when other artists that are much less successful or talented are household names.  Now, I like that he is quite unknown, it's like he's a secret from all the numbskulls out there who aren't tuned in.  This feeling was particularly strong when the movie came out, I felt a little weird just giving him up to the public like that.

Are we a 'normal' fan base?  For example, do Rolling Stones fans get together like this to talk about stuff, extol the intricacies of each song, and moan about Mike Love?

[Senator Blutarsky]

Not yet, Ive only been into the group seriously since earlier this year.

However, some other groups this has happened to me. I got that way with Guns N Roses and Led Zeppelin.

[Andrew G. Doe]

No, not yet!  I'm only at the beginning and just starting to gather the songs into their actual albums, apart from the obvious ones.  Everybody says that it's a pretty special time for me.  I'm lucky, I really got clobbered with the Brian Wilson Musical Appreciation Stick 

The funny thing about TBB and BW fandom is it's wonderful intensity.  I have often mused that mentioning Brian Wilson can barely raise an eyebrow (who?), when other artists that are much less successful or talented are household names.  Now, I like that he is quite unknown, it's like he's a secret from all the numbskulls out there who aren't tuned in.  This feeling was particularly strong when the movie came out, I felt a little weird just giving him up to the public like that.

Are we a 'normal' fan base?  For example, do Rolling Stones fans get together like this to talk about stuff, extol the intricacies of each song, and moan about Mike Love?

Beatles fans can make this place look like a kindergarten. That said, l doubt any other band is so accessible to their fans.

Also, l'd question that Brian is quite as unknown as you think...